BLU for Duty Finder and Raids! Show your support!

what i don't get is why can't they just have a tank/healer/dps set of slots where certain abilities are only able to be placed into suitable roles and they can slot the skills/rotation they want to do? it would solve all these issues... also all raid bosses would be immune to death. duh.

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

BLU doesn't work for party content, don't pretend that it does. What we would get is this, or a watered-down imitation of BLU, which would generate backlash regardless. This is BLU exactly as BLU should be, and putting it in a party scenario wouldn't work because it can't be balanced against other jobs. This is how the backlash looks:

Community: "We are bored of the predictable formula, give us something we have never seen before"

Devs: "Here is a brand new concept for how jobs are played, and here is BLU exactly as it is in other games"

Community: "Nooo, we never asked for that"

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Then make it so that BLU can learn/set skills that allow them to be a tank, healer or DPS and only allow them to party with other BLU's in Extreme Trials/Raids.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

They don't even need to change the system they presented, they simply need to create a parallel one, sort of like PVP. You're in PVP, boom, you have all these other actions and things you can add. You're a BLU going into DF? Congratulations, your skills are now this predetermined set which you've gained through level up and job quests and can therefore be balanced.
The BLU solo experience actually sounds fascinating and like it'd make for good time filler in the luls between patches. But I'm a lot less motivated if I can't even play it in regular content. More than anything, it's more of the same worriesome state of mind they have where they think they know better than us what we want. On one hand I appreciate being this loyal to the job, on the other hand, I find it misplaced and in bad taste.

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This is exactly my thinking. I sincerely hope SE makes BLU a real Job, and not just a minigame, in the future. My dream is to join my static against current raid content as a balanced BLU.

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Originally Posted by Nestama

Then make it so that BLU can learn/set skills that allow them to be a tank, healer or DPS and only allow them to party with other BLU's in Extreme Trials/Raids.

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Can you imagine if Blue Mage had been able to learn different skills that allowed him to perform Tank, Healer or DPS roles. Put them a limit on how many skills can the class use at the same time in combat and balanced it around the other classes. Our first class that can perform the 3 roles (but with the actions restriced for balance reasons) it seems that was too much effort. But making a whole new special class catered to single player in a MMORPG is less effort.

It should not be forgotten that BLU has the caster role actions (among others Break and Drain).

They already stated once a high enough lvl you can join a pre-formed party so you can do raids you can do dungeons you just can't pug that and pvp/deep dungeon so you won't miss out on the dungeons or raids just join groups the old fashioned way for that matter use party finder easy peezy

Well, there goes dreams about maining BLU...Starts to feel like Diablo Immortal. Here's hoping another DPS Job is introduced in the expansion instead.

They only need to make a mandatory Stone, Sky, Sea style dummy that must be beaten before Duty Finder unlocks. If a DPS player can reach the proper DPS for their level, there is no reason to lock them out of matchmaking. There will already be a solo challenge arena specifically for the job, so just build it into that.

So.. we gotta find 23 other people willing to wait around to try and do one of the 24 man duties? I'm sure that will be fun! There was so many ways to implement BLU while still keeping true to it's identity, It definitely screams that they added this version to be filler and to have people around in old zones, I wouldn't be surprised if the 80 cap wasn't removed until the END of 5.X at this rate.

I feel like people don't understand what duty finder is.

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Originally Posted by AlphaSonic

Can you imagine if Blue Mage had been able to learn different skills that allowed him to perform Tank, Healer or DPS roles. Put them a limit on how many skills can the class use at the same time in combat and balanced it around the other classes. Our first class that can perform the 3 roles (but with the actions restriced for balance reasons) it seems that was too much effort. But making a whole new special class catered to single player in a MMORPG is less effort.

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So then what is the point? What is the end-game for BLU? What's my motivation to keep playing BLU once I've gotten everything?
With raiding, part of that motivation is playing with my friends and we have a good time. Can't exactly have that in a solo setting.

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Originally Posted by Saradain

Well, there goes dreams about maining BLU...Starts to feel like Diablo Immortal. Here's hoping another DPS Job is introduced in the expansion instead.

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I'm still not sure Dancer is even going to be a job at this rate. I mean, wouldn't it be more faithful to have a Dancer limited job where you can use the /emotes you've collected as well as Sword Dance and Jitterbug and whatever to do special Dancer content locked at level 30, instead of just having the same heal/physick/benefic clone? God forbid Dancer gets a succor/aspected benefic/medica ability.

Isn't that what players want, for a job to be so incredibly pure and literally translated that we need to create another separate game-within-a-game that is incompatible with the larger game?

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Originally Posted by Nestama

So then what is the point? What is the end-game for BLU? What's my motivation to keep playing BLU once I've gotten everything?
With raiding, part of that motivation is playing with my friends and we have a good time. Can't exactly have that in a solo setting.

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I'm complaining about this too.

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Originally Posted by Minsue

I feel like people don't understand what duty finder is.

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They literally told us BLU can't use any duties that require matchmaking i.e. duty finder.
...So your point is?

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

BLU is a bit different, and always has been. Collecting abilities has been a major side activity in games in a way that no other job has had, which is exactly what XIV has emulated. And by the sounds of it, they did try to put BLU into the traditional job formula and it didn't work as a BLU (which is understandable, it has no identifiable theme other than collecting enemy abilities), so the main gameplay that they took is the side activity that makes up the identity of BLU

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But you can still have that "side activity" and place the job in a party role (it's mostly a DPS anyway). All they need to do is balance the spells BLU learns inside duty content. And giving Death as an example of a spell is silly. Just don't give it to BLU. Way overpowered anyway for a solo job.

Even the excuse of "you'll get kicked from party if you don't have X spell" is an easy fix. Cap the BLU's exp at each 5 level increment, and then require the BLU to learn spells as part of their job quests. By the time they reach level 15, they should have 3 "sets" of required spells. Plenty for the first dungeon. Then continue that trend all the way to 80. It's no more convoluted than what they have planned anyway. We're looking at 49 spells right now and level 50 cap. That's 1 spell a level. Very easy to break those down into 4-5 spells per job quest. The quests themselves can be a series of going out and learning spells.

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Originally Posted by Luxyn

They literally told us BLU can't use any duties that require matchmaking i.e. duty finder.
...So your point is?

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They stated you can play in dungeon's etc. with a pre formed party duty finder is just a que system not content. Like I said people think duty finder=content it's not it's a matchmaking system my dude.

Couldn't they have solved the balance issues entirely by making it so that only a certain set of iconic BLU abilities are allowed in endgame content, and in order to participate in any level-cap DF content, the BLU has to have all of those set abilities? Then BLU could learn all the enemy skills they want for solo play, but still be balanced like a normal class for DF. Especially if job quests specifically send the BLUs out to farm certain enemies for their skills, the feeling of "acquiring all skills from enemies" would still be present, even if there are limits on what skills can be used in endgame content.

This... isn't that hard to figure out, SE...

I am so angry about this new "limited job" joke. All the resources used to create a "limited job" only playable for solo content really SE ?

I'd rather have seen these resources used to create another new real job that you could use in the whole FFXIV content, I am not playing a MMO to play solo content.

If you don't like this too, you really need to let SE hearing your voice because if not then it's the open door to get more jobs like this (they even quick mentioned about beastmaster for this kind of "limited job" in the live letter, but eh no thanks if it's gonna be another "limited job" only usable for segregated content).

I really hope they will think about a way to transform this BLU joke into something good able to join all the FFXIV content.

It's almost as if the party finder ceases to exist when BLU is released.

Hey, I need to get that bow attack from Shiva, anyone wanna help?
*sets up PF*

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

BLU doesn't work for party content, don't pretend that it does. What we would get is this, or a watered-down imitation of BLU, which would generate backlash regardless. This is BLU exactly as BLU should be, and putting it in a party scenario wouldn't work because it can't be balanced against other jobs. This is how the backlash looks:

Community: "We are bored of the predictable formula, give us something we have never seen before"

Devs: "Here is a brand new concept for how jobs are played, and here is BLU exactly as it is in other games"

Community: "Nooo, we never asked for that"

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When people say they want new content, they typically want things they in enjoy. In the case of Blue Mage, people wanted to main the job not dick around in brain dead casual content. This is a complete waste of time and resources.

So basically what we have ladies and gentlemen is a job that is gonna be fun until you learn all the abilities and level cap it then just tuck it away until they release new skills to obtain, so in conclusion a job that is gonna die at end content. I dun even care really, I am still hoping for Dancer XD but I thought I might just recap what they did.

Tbh, I wouldn't be nearly as disappointed if I could still use the duty roulette with a premade. This would have made me okay with the 50 cap and not being able to solo queue, simply because then I can use it toward actual progress on my main. It wouldn't even have been a big deal because of PF. But, to my understanding even with a premade I still can't use the duty roulette.

I also would have been 100% okay with them requiring me to learn all of my skills before using the DF and having a set of "core" spells that are always set, making it a dps for queue purposes and only letting me customize like 5-10 of my skills rather than 24.

For clarity, I'm not mad, I'm disappointed that I'm getting half a job rather than a full job on what is my favorite FF class.

I didn't even want BLU, but I'm still disappointed because we got this instead of another job that can actually be used.

I can't believe there are people who still say Yoshida isn't out of touch.

In my opinion, BLU in this state is pretty worthless. I’m sad resources were wasted on this. I would’ve rather seen another ultimate fight added.

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Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

I didn't even want BLU, but I'm still disappointed because we got this instead of another job that can actually be used.

I can't believe there are people who still say Yoshida isn't out of touch.

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I agree it's like here's a job that everyone wanted and was looking forward to and then it's treated like a time share where the lvl cap increases when you get new abilities and is regulated to solo content unless premaded, good job SE that's what was needed a class to level in the open world through FATEs and mobs alone! Totally not out of touch.

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Originally Posted by Awful

I agree it's like here's a job that everyone wanted and was looking forward to and then it's treated like a time share where the lvl cap increases when you get new abilities and is regulated to solo content unless premaded, good job SE that's what was needed a class to level in the open world through FATEs and mobs alone! Totally not out of touch.

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To be fair a lot of end game content can be premade anyway

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Originally Posted by Minsue

They stated you can play in dungeon's etc. with a pre formed party duty finder is just a que system not content. Like I said people think duty finder=content it's not it's a matchmaking system my dude.

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Yes, and only being able to go in with preformed parties is EXTREMELY limiting. It's unacceptable.

We still don't know if they'll be allowed in endgame raids even with premades or if they'll have additional restrictions when in premade parties or if the cap for BLU will eventually catch up to the main cap for everyone else. They make it sound like they don't want it in endgame at all. And if they are allowed in everything and just need a premade, what is the point of it being restricted out of the duty finder in the first place?

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Originally Posted by BubblyBoar

We still don't know if they'll be allowed in endgame raids even with premades or if they'll have additional restrictions when in premade parties or if the cap for BLU will eventually catch up to the main cap for everyone else. They make it sound like they don't want it in endgame at all. And if they are allowed in everything and just need a premade, what is the point of it being restricted out of the duty finder in the first place?

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So you don't get a dick Blue who sets bad abilities to use in queing, with premade there is some level of trust.

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Originally Posted by LadyAveria

So you don't get a dick Blue who sets bad abilities to use in queing, with premade there is some level of trust.

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That can literally be any person on any job though. It's no different with BLU.

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Originally Posted by BubblyBoar

That can literally be any person on any job though. It's no different with BLU.

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Yeah but Blu will have more flexibility, look I don't know how it is gonna be haha no one does, we might get it and be surprised what we can and can't do.

Adding my support, please enable this. I don’t think premades will work as only BLU have incentive to do them and rewards are absent.

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Originally Posted by LadyAveria

So you don't get a dick Blue who sets bad abilities to use in queing, with premade there is some level of trust.

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Again, easy fix. Give spells tiers of damage, and balance them accordingly in content. For instance, say 4 tier I spells, 4 tier II spells, 2 tier III spells, and 2-3 buff spells must be set. Balanced within those tiers, and required to have the spells learned, the BLU could pick and choose favorites, but still be in a defined role. There would be a certain degree of choice for the BLU, but it wouldn't be able to troll by setting a bunch of crap spells. Regardless of duty content, the BLU should be balanced in the overworld anyway. It shouldn't be able to run around killing Hunt marks with Death, for example. The entire system they have conjured up is convoluted and makes BLU a sideshow act.

How about setting a BLU option in duty finder (have the community vote on if it's on/off by default) that will group you with a BLU in roulette and require a certain number of role specific skills for a blue mage to queue for a roulette. No restrictions for manual parties.

I support this completely, because as things stand now you're telling me that even though my Savage Raid group is cool with me playing BLU, I've got to play ANOTHER JOB through the Dungeon, Trial, and Normal Raid content in order to earn gear for BLU. I know the option is there, and use it, but if I want to play BLU in said content and not PLD, SAM, SMN, BLM, etc then I should have the option to do so without having to find 7 other people willing to run with me. If the reason is skills like lvl 5 Death, then you can make bosses immune, like you did in Eureka Pyros (yeah, NMs are immune to Death, so I know you can do it). Just because a job is aimed at Solo content, doesn't mean you should handicap it to ONLY play that content. Saying "if you don't have X, you'll get kicked" is something that happens to other Jobs as well, "if you can't do X, you'll get kicked" its nothing new.

I get not adding it to SB content, it'd upset the balance already established in Raids, but give us Duty Finder so I don't have to play another Job to earn gear for BLU. I know I can craft, or buy off the MB, or get them from Sidequests, but I want to play BLU as my main, and the current system prevents me from actively doing so in the way the game is designed to be played.

You could stick a blue eye mask on a broom handle and it could go through any DF content currently. Another SE storm in a teacup.

I want BLU in party content as much as the next person. But I saw this coming a mile away. FFXIV has heavily streamlined Jobs (In which I mean there's very little theorycrafting needed to be done for an optimal rotation, as the skills are given to you). BLU, because of it's very design, literally can not work with this game at all. They would have to go to each and every single skill you could learn now and in the future and balance it because of BLU. Not to mention, BLU is only as good as the monster skills they learned. So they can be under powered or completely overpowered.

Yes, it sucks. But there was no way BLU was going to work with the way FFXIV is designed. If it was something like XI, or maybe even 1.x, then yeah it can. But this is the best compromise they can do without completely butchering the Job.

The fact that this thread has to exist makes me laugh. It feels as ridiculous as saying "Show your support for guns in this FPS!" Petitioning a developer running an MMORPG to allow a class/job into group content, what a world.

I 100% feel like everything they said about BLU was slippery slope argument.

“They’ll get kicked for not having spells”. Yes, they will, the answer is to go get their spells, no different to if someone showed up to raid with no melds on their gear, they’d get kicked til they sort that out.

“Level 5 death will kill the boss!”. Are you kidding me? This is no different to any other move that doesn’t work on bosses. I guess we should delete all stuns from the game cause bosses have to be immune to those!

Fact is there are a million and one ways they could have made BLU work without compromising the learning process.

E.G. make BLU a role fluid job that can tank, heal or DD, but to take on a role it has to set specific spells to unlock that role. These would be the basics to perform the job adequately (like enmity tools and strong mitigation tools to be a tank) and then the rest of the spells would be fluff on top of that (your dps/utility type spells).

Honestly they could have given Blue a base rotation and move set
And make Blue magic like Ogcd skills similar to Role skills you learn them and can mix and match them how you like for what sorta support you wanted for Blue.