so whens Alphinaud gonna die or sent offscreen for a long time?

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

why does she always stay behind just because[*]shes a healer[*]?

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You answered your own question.

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Originally Posted by Charisma

Mr. Annoying brat who doesn't learn from mistakes and have no character development at all"

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I think you missed the end of ARR and all of Heavensward. . . Anyways, I've said before that Alphinaud represents the Warrior of Light, that is, if you think of it as a concept, and not a personal title.

Think about it, while he hasn't been there for everything, he HAS been there for most major things, and as of Heavensward, often right beside you for it too. You both represent the concept of the WoL; you are the adventurer, the explorer, and the fighting hero who steps up to all challenges and threats to the realm. He is the diplomat, the strategist, and leader of men who holds influence where you would otherwise be incapable because of the nature of your life. You are what he can't be, and he is what you can't be.

Besides, every hero needs a partner/sidekick/best friend. Like it or not, regardless of your own personal head canons, it's him.

More importantly, Alphinaud is basically the player's voice. Being the silent protagonist we are, we're basically just the muscle, the gopher, the rube sent out for busy work while the important people get shit done.

Seriously, if it weren't for Alphinaud (and even with him around), most of the time we're just standing around with a vacant expression as everyone talks around us.

Without a consistent character acting as our voice, the rest of the NPCs might start to wonder why they keep us around.

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Originally Posted by Hasrat

More importantly, Alphinaud is basically the player's voice. Being the silent protagonist we are, we're basically just the muscle, the gopher, the rube sent out for busy work while the important people get shit done.

Seriously, if it weren't for Alphinaud (and even with him around), most of the time we're just standing around with a vacant expression as everyone talks around us.

Without a consistent character acting as our voice, the rest of the NPCs might start to wonder why they keep us around.

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I rather be silent than have that ass be my voice.

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Originally Posted by LittleChickenNugget

Lyse is way more annoying than Alphanerd to me. She is driving me CRAZY in this expansion. They gave her too much of a try-hard, gung-go, hot head personality.

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At least as Lyse the woman actually seems to have a brain. If you look at her whole story arc it makes you wonder if it's really meant to be the same person. Or did she purposely act like an idiot before? I certainly couldn't stand living every day like that.

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Originally Posted by Terrini

At least as Lyse the woman actually seems to have a brain. If you look at her whole story arc it makes you wonder if it's really meant to be the same person. Or did she purposely act like an idiot before? I certainly couldn't stand living every day like that.

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She also allowed the tempered Ananta into Ala Mhigo in spite of knowing full well that tempered individuals cannot be trusted and will always work towards furthering their Primal's goals. She was there during the portion of the story where Ramuh talks explicitly about this and doubtlessly was there when Thancred expressed his sadness over the executions of the Flame's soldiers due to their tempering by Ifrit. There has never been a stated cure for it either and as a Scion regardless of these two incidents she should have known better. Hell they all should have. Which brings me to my point, the intelligence of the characters in this game varies solely depending upon how lazy the writers are being and how badly they want the plot to move a certain way. It ebbed a little in HW but then it went right back to being the central writing issue in SB with these last two patches.

Yda was an idiot because that's what the writers needed her to be. She had no character beyond being the dimmer, chipper half of the 'idiot and the genius' trope along with Papalymo - who himself was in similar straights. When they turned her into Lyse and gave her more of a consistent role they had to suddenly come up with a lot more personality for her than was previously shown, which causes the disconnect. Said disconnect is reinforced again and again however when they forget that Lyse actually is supposed to be somewhat intelligent but they make her actions anything but.

I'm slowly but surely coming to the point where I have less hatred towards individual characters and more hatred towards the writing that makes them so inconsistently awful. Alphinaud at his base has an good story arc, so does Lyse. They're both perfectly serviceable characters that keep on getting undermined by nothing more than poor writing.

Can't stand him, I really just want him gone forever. Alisaie is so much better.

I'll take Alphinaud over any of the (remaining) scions any day of the week.

I'm gonna do it! I an going to do the one thing people on this forum hate! I'm going to bring up Final Fantasy XI! Dun Dun DUUUUUUUUUUN!!!

I liked XI's expansions always having new storylines and introducing you to a slew of new characters. New companions, new villains, new governments, new cultures, etc. In XIV its A: Garleans B: Ascians or C: Allagan, and it has been since 2010. For cryin out loud just give us something new, this story, these chars and villains....there is only so much you can do before everything just becomes redundant and boring. I could see the carry over of everything from v1 to ARR, but seriously this Garlean and Ascian conflict needs a conclusion and we need other characters to be central instead of the same ones over and over. I know someone is going to bring up HW being not focused on Garlemald or Ascians, but they were there, always present, always around manipulating things in the background and the Allagan plot device was out in full force. Heck we even got an entire Allagan zone...

But XIV suffers from a severe lack of creativity in all aspects, from lore to dungeons to "endgame". Patch to patch, story to story, its always just the same thing with different paint. As much as I loved v1 into ARR, this is just getting boring. I swear if this game didn't have the shiny "final fantasy" title it would be an afterthought going down in flames.

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Originally Posted by LittleChickenNugget

Lyse is way more annoying than Alphanerd to me. She is driving me CRAZY in this expansion. They gave her too much of a try-hard, gung-go, hot head personality.

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I dunno, I'm sure I'd be pretty try-hard, gung-ho, and hot headed if I were going to war for my homeland.

You know, like Estinien, Fordola, the Warriors of Darkness, Raubahn, Illberd, Yugiri, and anyone else who had a deeper reason to even pick up a weapon for a cause in this story.

I really liked him in HW, he changed completely..and then with SB he went back to his old annoying self. Makes no sense. And Alisae I can stand even much less than him. Please send both to a faraway place. I'd much rather have Thancred or Y'shtola near (or Tataru, but she's too busy with other things), but it seems instead the WoL is the official babysitter of the twins.

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Originally Posted by Enla

She also allowed the tempered Ananta into Ala Mhigo in spite of knowing full well that tempered individuals cannot be trusted and will always work towards furthering their Primal's goals.

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We worked with Ysayle, who by Hraesvelgr's admission, essentially tempered/brainwashed herself.

Also starting peace talks with saying that everyone can come and then immediately turning around and saying "but not you" is not the greatest way to start peace talks.

This might be derailing, but as a male who has a twin sister irl, Alphinaud and Alisae looking exactly alike bothers the hell out of me. Male/female twins don't look like that.

I really wish we could get rid of him, he's been an annoyance since the end of ARR. It really annoys me how much he bosses my character around when he's just an arrogant child.

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Originally Posted by Dortharl

I really wish we could get rid of him, he's been an annoyance since the end of ARR. It really annoys me how much he bosses my character around when he's just an arrogant child.

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Him constantly telling my character what to do, (and my character blindly obeying without question) bothers me as well, but I don't see Alphinaud as a bad person. Hence why he felt so strongly about the events that unfolded with the Crystal Braves. Alphinaud's intentions are pure, but the way he goes about things makes him seem like a snobby privileged jerk.

Hating on Alphinaud has pretty much become a meme at this point. All the people hating on him are just jumping on the bandwagon and don't understand how Storytelling and character development work.


They aren't going to replace or kill off the character that's been with us from the beginning and is the driving force for the story, get real.

While he's been arrogant, I've never gotten that sense of being ordered around by him one bit. Keep in mind, the WoL effectively just goes with the flow of things, and does what they feel is right in the moment. Not as a Scion, not as a hero, just simply as an adventurer. But again, I point out that our nature as an adventurer is a limitation where he otherwise is able to perform, and vice versa. You're two sides of the same coin, but can never be counted as one. You'd just be too powerful that way.

While I don't care for his demeanor sometimes, I do love the fact that he likes being a part of the action. I actually enjoyed every solo instance where I fought alongside him.

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Originally Posted by Enla

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they allowed her whit the requirement what she went inside whit no cristals or weapon at all, they didn't expected what they had tempered soldiers(if they act as usual and do not pray to a primal, you can tell they are primal thralls?) who hid cristals on the chamber the meeting was going to happen, by no way they expected what that ananta could be able to summon a primal right there because they deprived of the cristals she had on herself

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Originally Posted by basketofseals

We worked with Ysayle, who by Hraesvelgr's admission, essentially tempered/brainwashed herself.

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I'm not sure how you reached that conclusion, she could be pretty delusional but that's very different to being tempered.

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Originally Posted by basketofseals

Also starting peace talks with saying that everyone can come and then immediately turning around and saying "but not you" is not the greatest way to start peace talks.

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"Everyone can come except for the mind controlled minions of a demi-god that would slowly suck the planet dry," seems perfectly reasonable to me, the tempered cannot be trusted. We learn that by level 20.

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Originally Posted by Selova

Hating on Alphinaud has pretty much become a meme at this point. All the people hating on him are just jumping on the bandwagon and don't understand how Storytelling and character development work.


They aren't going to replace or kill off the character that's been with us from the beginning and is the driving force for the story, get real.

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Just FYI this is incredibly condescending and a little insulting, minimalising the views of others just because they don't agree with you is not an effective way of proving your point. I have a firm grasp on storytelling and character development, I simply do not like the character I know he drives a portion of the story and he is key component of the narrative but I would prefer another character to take his place, I find his arrogance particularly grating.

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Originally Posted by Jandor

I'm not sure how you reached that conclusion, she could be pretty delusional but that's very different to being tempered.

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I reached that conclusion by being told that explicitly by a very old and wise character.

To follow that up, when you're asked about your opinion on the tempered and say you wish to give them a chance, your party member also name drops Ysayle and compares them.

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Originally Posted by Dortharl

snip.

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You can take it however you want to honestly. It's just getting rather old hearing all the over-dramatic hate for his character. I personally find it more insulting that people are constantly demanding the death/removal of one of my favorite characters. To each their own.

Alphinaud was annoying as hell back in 2.XX days. 3.XX and up, he's grown up so much that I like having him around. I just hate when he teases me with his "Taste the Rainbow" Carbuncles.

Only other traveling buddy I would want, is Yugiri. You don't how stoked I was when me and her went on a Assassination Mission at night.

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Originally Posted by Selova

You can take it however you want to honestly. It's just getting rather old hearing all the over-dramatic hate for his character. I personally find it more insulting that people are constantly demanding the death/removal of one of my favorite characters. To each their own.

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Given you views it's surprising that you choose to open a thread with this title then, since it's bound to full of things you choose to find insulting.

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Originally Posted by WilhelmWhite

This might be derailing, but as a male who has a twin sister irl, Alphinaud and Alisae looking exactly alike bothers the hell out of me. Male/female twins don't look like that.

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Not entirely true. While it maybe true in your case, but there are plenty of instances where male/female twins do look alike.

OT

I'm sorry, but if people are claiming that Alphinauld does not have character development then they don't know what character development is or have not been paying attention to the story.

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Originally Posted by basketofseals

I reached that conclusion by being told that explicitly by a very old and wise character.

To follow that up, when you're asked about your opinion on the tempered and say you wish to give them a chance, your party member also name drops Ysayle and compares them.

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Hraesvelgr calls her delusional and says that the Shiva she's created is not the actual Shiva. He doesn't say she's tempered herself.

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Originally Posted by WilhelmWhite

This might be derailing, but as a male who has a twin sister irl, Alphinaud and Alisae looking exactly alike bothers the hell out of me. Male/female twins don't look like that.

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They are a different type of twins than you and your sister. They are identical types and you two are fraternal.

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Originally Posted by Rasikko

They are a different type of twins than you and your sister. They are identical types and you two are fraternal.

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You cannot have identical twins of different genders on earth, but it's eorzea so maybe it's possible there.

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Originally Posted by Jandor

"Everyone can come except for the mind controlled minions of a demi-god that would slowly suck the planet dry," seems perfectly reasonable to me, the tempered cannot be trusted. We learn that by level 20.

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Except... I mean, the reason Beast Tribes summon primals in the first place is because they feel like they have no control over their fates, are not being represented or listened to fairly, and are being threatened by the governments of other people, so deliberately excluding them would mean actively perpetuating the mindset that produced said primals and tempered tribes in the first place... Like, Lyse's entire point in that situation was that she wants to break that specific cycle in order to create genuine peace, not just "peace for some people."

As for Alphinaud (speaking in general here, not to the person I quoted above), I can't help but feel that some people are just kind of tone deaf? Alphinaud went through major character development with the failure of the Crystal Braves, spent the beginning of Heavensward essentially blue-screening, rededicated himself to the cause, came to idealize a totally different type of role model (Estinien), and moved on from a Minfillia-esque non-combat character to someone who is willing to jump into the fray with us, even if it's clear it's not his primary talent. Not sure how you miss that kind of on-screen growth except by just not reading any of his lines at all because you're already predisposed against him.

More than that, his "arrogance" has been the butt of so many jokes up to this point that it's obviously not meant to be taken remotely seriously. He's an extremely sheltered rich kid who came straight from a famous high-class magic school into the real world and keeps getting harsh doses of reality everywhere he goes. Even the recent escapades with spending money in Kugane aren't meant to imply that he's careless, but that he genuinely doesn't know how things work outside his little bubble of the upper-class. If you can't tell the difference between a jerkass character who is arrogant by choice and a character who's arrogant because he just hasn't had to deal with real-life hardships yet, I don't know what to tell you, man.

I mean, let's be real; people just hate him to have some character to hate. Especially now that Minfillia's gone, there's got to be someone as the target of the players' ire. If Alphinaud was removed from the plot, the hate would just jump to the next character down the line.

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Originally Posted by Rasikko

They are a different type of twins than you and your sister. They are identical types and you two are fraternal.

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That's also not accurate. :p

Identical implies they are the same, can't be the same while being different genders. It's purely happen stance that fraternal twins look alike.

I don't know man.

As a Protagonist we are insufferable as well. Always willing to take the next mission.
I bet the NPCs talk behind our backs when we leave the room after saying yes to go kill a god or two.

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Originally Posted by sarehptar

Except... I mean, the reason Beast Tribes summon primals in the first place is because they feel like they have no control over their fates, are not being represented or listened to fairly, and are being threatened by the governments of other people, so deliberately excluding them would mean actively perpetuating the mindset that produced said primals and tempered tribes in the first place... Like, Lyse's entire point in that situation was that she wants to break that specific cycle in order to create genuine peace, not just "peace for some people."

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Inviting the Ananta is a great idea, letting the tempered Ananta attend is not only pointless, but dumb and risky, and allowing it very predictably blew up in their faces.

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Originally Posted by Rasikko

They are a different type of twins than you and your sister. They are identical types and you two are fraternal.

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........... Male and female twins cannot be identical............. Why do you not know this?

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Originally Posted by Bobs

I don't know man.

As a Protagonist we are insufferable as well. Always willing to take the next mission.
I bet the NPCs talk behind our backs when we leave the room after saying yes to go kill a god or two.

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That's the life of adventure. Can't imagine an expansion or trial where we just chill on the beach.

Hmm. . . Costa Del Sol (Extreme). "Hot Sand" aoes, beach bunny add phase, swimming "DPS" race. Rewards are beach themed weapon glams and new, dyeable swimwear. Possible giant crab mount. Skip shore or disband.

^ SE! Next Moonfire event right there. Please look forward to it.

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Originally Posted by Jandor

Inviting the Ananta is a great idea, letting the tempered Ananta attend is not only pointless, but dumb and risky, and allowing it very predictably blew up in their faces.

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You realize that the tempered Ananta don't feel like the non-tempered Ananta speak for them, right? That they're two distinct groups? That's like inviting one half of a neighborhood and then claiming that you've fairly represented the whole neighborhood.

Furthermore, did Lyse have any choice? She was a victim of the "idiot ball" plot line--Square needed a dramatic instance to end their patch, so a dramatic instance they were going to add, regardless of any and all precautions the characters could have taken. Were stupid decisions made? Sure. Why did no one sweep every part of the room looking for any potential hazards just in case? Why did Thancred and Y'shtola who have performed nigh-miracles in battle before suddenly struggle with some run-of-the-mill tempered guards? But blaming Lyse for trying to target the root cause of primal summonings in the first place is hardly any more fair than blaming your own player character for stupidly going along with it without bothering to even survey the area for random crystals... (Of course, I should say this tongue-in-cheek: I think this was just an example of bad writing, which can happen when the events of the plot are dictated by a need to add interactive elements for player characters.)

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Originally Posted by Kyuuen

Not entirely true. While it maybe true in your case, but there are plenty of instances where male/female twins do look alike.

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What I said was true. I never said fraternal twins couldn't look alike, I just said they couldn't EXACTLY alike. Look at Alphinaud and Alisae's face and body before they changed costumes in HW. Literally the only difference is Alisae's lips are a tiny bit darker than her brother's. Everything else is exactly the same. As male and female, their face and body shapes should not look like a mirror image, but it does. Even male/female twins irl that look similar at least have different bodies/jaw lines etc.

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Originally Posted by ThirdChild_ZKI

That's the life of adventure. Can't imagine an expansion or trial where we just chill on the beach.

Hmm. . . Costa Del Sol (Extreme). "Hot Sand" aoes, beach bunny add phase, swimming "DPS" race. Rewards are beach themed weapon glams and new, dyeable swimwear. Possible giant crab mount. Skip shore or disband.

^ SE! Next Moonfire event right there. Please look forward to it.

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Well ya, we are going to say Yes because it's the game. Fourth wall reasons.

When we have a "Vision." It's like 10 min long or more. I can just imagine all the NPCs looking at us "Is he done yet, nope."

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Originally Posted by WilhelmWhite

What I said was true. I never said fraternal twins couldn't look alike, I just said they couldn't EXACTLY alike. Look at Alphinaud and Alisae's face and body before they changed costumes in HW. Literally the only difference is Alisae's lips are a tiny bit darker than her brother's. Everything else is exactly the same. As male and female, their face and body shapes should not look like a mirror image, but it does. Even male/female twins irl that look similar at least have different bodies/jaw lines etc.

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Fair enough. But personally Alisae's facial features seem a bit more rounded while Alphinauld's seem more sharper, but perhaps that's me trying to see a difference that isn't there.

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Originally Posted by sarehptar

You realize that the tempered Ananta don't feel like the non-tempered Ananta speak for them, right? That they're two distinct groups? That's like inviting one half of a neighborhood and then claiming that you've fairly represented the whole neighborhood.

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Why should we care what the tempered Ananta feel like? They're thralls, they can't stop being thralls, and their devotion to a primal means their goals are fundamentally incompatible with ours.