Help I've been Nerfed and can't get my damage back up :(

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Originally Posted by Jonnycbad

You now cast the strongest spell of its tier.

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The issue is when they're not direct upgrades, or previously were not (carried additional effects and/or had reduced cast times or mana cost).

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Originally Posted by LeeraSorlan

This game has no freedom of customization.

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-mumbles to self- Don't get sarcastic.... just get ready for bed.....

Sorry bout that.... Uh. Glamours? Gear upgrades with ability to glamour? Yea, there's customizations for style. But sure, your character is now static, skill wise, based on what the Devs want it to be. ((Thanks alot devs......))

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Originally Posted by LeeraSorlan

Cross classes were a relic that they finally decided to fix.

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But that relic is the only way to get bonus buffs on a character that might not make it through certain areas

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Originally Posted by Suki_Pursia

I'm under 30 on all of them except crafting, gathering and two of my combat related classes.... so it kinda does matter to me? O.o

As for the reiteration... Drain only works in combat on enemies. So.... fall damage...... Yea.

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I mean to say, to get after 30 is so fast it is mostly a mildly incovinience. I'm curious though, what sort of content did you go duo/solo. You duo the whole lvling dungeons?

I'm not paying for a game where I'm worrying about what other people think. I was paying for my own play style. They messed it up. End of story. Sure 2 people dropping subs may just be a drop in the bucket vs the millions of other players.... But what happens when more people quit because they can't quit tweaking classes? It's JUST like WoW all over again.

The thing is, what you are calling a nerf, is a buff for everyone else that does play party content. Or, instead of saying everyone else how about I call that a majority.

You and your partner are 1 person, with one way to play, that was suboptimal (not bad, but it wasn't optimal) and the devs took the optimal way to play and made that better for those who play end game.

The problem you're having is you want to play an MMO not for the end game, but the way you want to play it, and I honestly suggest a different genre or MMO altogether. I am absolutely happy with the BLM changes, a lot of people love the new AOE thunder, which is why fire 2 got nerfed fyi. To put it bluntly you're a minority and you quitting for playing differently isn't going to effect anyone else since you already play relatively solo anyway. What everyone has been saying is that the changes ARE better for everyone else, and we're not changing our buff back for you to be happy.

So sure, they keep tweaking classes, but BLM is literally better, Ninja is literally smoother (since that was brought up), PAL was buffed like crazy. Tweaking is necessary for ever changing content and it's extremely mind baffling you find one of the best things about an MMO to be a bad thing, so again, an MMO is not for you.

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Originally Posted by Hagen

I mean to say, to get after 30 is so fast it is mostly a mildly incovinience. I'm curious though, what sort of content did you go duo/solo. You duo the whole lvling dungeons?

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Was getting about 7k exp on fates in drybone on my lower levels... got them all 2 levels in a day, but still at level 23, it's hard to solo stuff. Especially since they revamped how fates work too.

We had duo-ed Sastasha, Tam-Tara, Copperbell, Halatali, Thousand Maws, Haukke, Brayflox, Stone Vigil, Cutters cry and Dzemael. I was unsynched and on BLM. We tore them up! It was super awesome.... at least until the update -sighs-

The focus of the devs for the game is party play on lvl cap (70 now), so that is why they made those changes. It works on Lvl 70 but a little lower lvl flexibility was lost. If you manage to do this much duo, these changes are mostly managable since stuff just got moved. Break applies Heavy now, Drain can heal mid fight, Thunder is actually better because Thunder 3 has the Thunder 1 cast time. Ironically, I think you might have loved the 1.0 version of the game that was scraped years ago because it was so bad since it allowed for even more of these costumizations. In fact the little costumization we had before SB was all left overs from the 1.0 system.

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Originally Posted by Riranor

The problem you're having is you want to play an MMO not for the end game, but the way you want to play it, and I honestly suggest a different genre or MMO altogether. I am absolutely happy with the BLM changes, a lot of people love the new AOE thunder, which is why fire 2 got nerfed fyi. To put it bluntly you're a minority and you quitting for playing differently isn't going to effect anyone else since you already play relatively solo anyway. What everyone has been saying is that the changes ARE better for everyone else, and we're not changing our buff back for you to be happy.

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So you're saying that people who role play in MMOs and casual players who only want to experience the game and the community and don't really care for the endgame carrot chasing don't matter? That only endgamers and content runners are the only ones who deserve to be listened to? That's the kind of attitude that kept me away from MMOs for a long time.

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Originally Posted by Joven

So you're saying that people who role play in MMOs and casual players who only want to experience the game and the community and don't really care for the endgame carrot chasing don't matter? That only endgamers and content runners are the only ones who deserve to be listened to? That's the kind of attitude that kept me away from MMOs for a long time.

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These buffs dont effect unsynced dungeons runs, you can still play non end game content (the buffs do help that too), RPer's shouldn't be affected? I RP and headcanon how I want spells to work anyway for RP so that doesn't apply. I'm saying a majority o players play end game, so content WILL be balanced around it, honestly tho you can still do anything BUT solo at low levels, the game is not designed around that and wanting it to be for the sake of a very small handful of payers is selfish.

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Originally Posted by Riranor

These buffs dont effect unsynced dungeons runs, you can still play non end game content (the buffs do help that too), RPer's shouldn't be affected? I RP and headcanon how I want spells to work anyway for RP so that doesn't apply. I'm saying a majority o players play end game, so content WILL be balanced around it, honestly tho you can still do anything BUT solo at low levels, the game is not designed around that and wanting it to be for the sake of a very small handful of payers is selfish.

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It's not selfish to want things to be a certain way if you're paying for a product. The fact is that people get used to playing a certain way over the years, sudden changes that disrupt that will cause dissatisfaction. Regardless of whether or not we are a 'small handful' we are still paying customers.

I do want to add that while it is irritating that the skills I used for years have been taken away for a generic DPS loadout, I haven't had a chance to play with the new system much. My arguments here are about the people who disregard other players thoughts and feelings on the issue and just treat them as whiners who don't matter.

the game developers wanted to make each class stand out, so they consolidated the role specific mandatory crossclass skills and some crossclass skills didn't become role skills. and even then, the only reason the Arcanist learned Physic in the first place is for level 29 and lower level synched dungeons as a Scholar where they needed a lower level healing skill. because they made a class who splits into two jobs with different roles. if summoner and scholar had separate base classes and didn't both branch off Arcanist, they would have had completely different weapons and summoner wouldn't have been able to heal or raise. but the base class with 2 paths to take was an experimental gimmick.

Like, here's the thing. Your feelings are valid and they do clearly matter to you, at the very least. What I'm having trouble with is that the OP is having some negative reactions to changes and seems to not expect or want changes in a growing MMO 2 expansions in (or further.)

I get they were enjoying solo/duo'ing their own stuff with their own play style. It is unfortunate that what they had learned and relied on has changed. The thing I absolutely do not understand is what they honestly expect. For the vast majority of players, these changes were beneficial. Even some of the changes for the OP are beneficial to them if they take the time to learn and adjust to them. Feel free to air your grievances, and I personally won't disregard your concerns, but I cannot however understand why you would expect an MMO that is built for the majority not to change to benefit the majority.

You recognize that you have a play style that is in the minority and is not how the game is "meant" to be played (in regards to endgame and group content, which is what they balance around.) They are tuning and tweaking and balancing things (or attempting to) for the majority and for endgame full party content. So how can you be surprised or upset when SE changes things to suit that majority or majority "play style"? You really can't honestly expect them to cater to such a small group of people vs. the majority in an MMO like this.

I'm sorry that things have changed for you and I hope that you're able to continue playing more or less as you were by adjusting to these changes. But to expect no changes in an MMO that has been out for four years now (even more if you count 1.0) or to cater to a minority at the sacrifice of the majority is simply unrealistic and lacking perspective imo.

It's kind of wrong for them to assume that these skills are 'mandatory' cross class skills. Players have been getting by just fine for years leveling a single class to 50 without ANY cross class skills. I don't want to start an argument on the subject, I just think it's a little stupid.

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Originally Posted by Dipasca

You recognize that you have a play style that is in the minority and is not how the game is "meant" to be played (in regards to endgame and group content, which is what they balance around.) They are tuning and tweaking and balancing things (or attempting to) for the majority and for endgame full party content. So how can you be surprised or upset when SE changes things to suit that majority or majority "play style"? You really can't honestly expect them to cater to such a small group of people vs. the majority in an MMO like this.

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From what I understood when I first signed on to this game 4 years ago was that this game was a 'Casual MMO' with endgame content. People complained constantly about how it was 'too easy' to reach endgame. Now it seems like they are totally changing gears and focusing solely on endgame which may drive away the more casual players. As to how a game is 'meant' to be played is up to the player.

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Originally Posted by Dipasca

I get they were enjoying solo/duo'ing their own stuff with their own play style. It is unfortunate that what they had learned and relied on has changed. The thing I absolutely do not understand is what they honestly expect. For the vast majority of players, these changes were beneficial. Even some of the changes for the OP are beneficial to them if they take the time to learn and adjust to them. Feel free to air your grievances, and I personally won't disregard your concerns, but I cannot however understand why you would expect an MMO that is built for the majority not to change to benefit the majority.

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While I can't speak for the OP (honestly I don't know why I'm still replying myself) I do understand where she's coming from. I don't think she is against changes in general, just that the changes were sudden and totally messed up the flow that they had. Having to relearn rotations and buffs is a real pain.

You still get cross class abilities... they're just more focused for the roles now. They're called Role abilities.

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Originally Posted by Suki_Pursia

It appears that no one understands, nor cares about our losses. I too did notice the loss of the Rogue mutilate... and as a lvl 23ish rogue, can say I now have no dots on that class. :( sad day for us.

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Except he only lost mutilate, you like you he was also horribly mistaken.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

The issue is when they're not direct upgrades, or previously were not (carried additional effects and/or had reduced cast times or mana cost).

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Is an upgrade now thats the point. People purposefully not using their tools to alleviate the mp cost on BLM pf all classes who never have to worry about mp is absurd.

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Originally Posted by Joven

From what I understood when I first signed on to this game 4 years ago was that this game was a 'Casual MMO' with endgame content. People complained constantly about how it was 'too easy' to reach endgame. Now it seems like they are totally changing gears and focusing solely on endgame which may drive away the more casual players. As to how a game is 'meant' to be played is up to the player.

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You can play however you want, but it is certainly designed with specific mechanics in mind. And yes, it will be harder to go against the flow.
Other MMOs cater to the open wold, do as you want crowd. They suffer when it comes to the structured content that FF14 is good at.

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Originally Posted by Joven

From what I understood when I first signed on to this game 4 years ago was that this game was a 'Casual MMO' with endgame content. People complained constantly about how it was 'too easy' to reach endgame. As to how a game is 'meant' to be played is up to the player.

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It was never catered as a casual mmo, if it were things like pre nerf steps of fate, Crystalis etc wouldnt have had to be nerfed. This mmo, like all other mmos, are subject to change which everyone agrees to in the EULA. What the player base says is easy and hard is entirely subjective. The Darkest Dungeon was easy for me but 90% of people that play it cant beat it or let alone get halfway through it.

You can play the game as you wish, no one said otherwise, but that doesnt mean youll be remotely optima. But the devs will adjust the game for the masses with their idea in mind not the minority. Such is any mmo.

But regardless im not telling anyone how to play their game but TC and her partner were going to hit a wall regardless. Physick would end up completely useless in the face of the damage they were about to start taking, unsync runs wont help if they are locked out of the gear they need to survive and since they cant win they cant get to said gear to over gear the fight theyll get stuck on.

Thats the price you pay for Duoing everything.

This all started with a thunder 1 complaint anyway, BLM should NEVER worry about mp regardless of what its doing. A BLM at level 47 fighting equivalent mobs with a chocobo should never get over ran if played properly.

The play style they are using is about to wall them, theyll get floored in the later dungeons and they not wanting to use duty finder to party up out of fear of being criticized means theyll get stuck.

Im trying to prevent this.

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Originally Posted by Jonnycbad

Lots of spells and potencies for BLM have been buffed in damage to account for losing out on Raging Strikes.

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If by buffed you mean nerfed, then yes. F2 and F4 nerf and Flare scaling were the only potency changes from the top of my head. I guess you can count T1>T3 a buff? Mana costs though.

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Originally Posted by Psycofang

Yes it got traded for a stronger version with tge exact same cast time as r1 and slightly high mp cost which is neutralized by casting it during your ice phase. Which you should be doing. Casting thunder during ice phase.

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It's just that T3 costs more than B4, which was not the case with T1. Ice feels kinda clunky now at times during leveling with B1 being the only real filler. At least T3 has the same PPS as F4 now.

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Originally Posted by Waliel

If by buffed you mean nerfed, then yes. F2 and F4 nerf and Flare scaling were the only potency changes from the top of my head. I guess you can count T1>T3 a buff? Mana costs though.



It's just that T3 costs more than B4, which was not the case with T1. Ice feels kinda clunky now at times during leveling with B1 being the only real filler. At least T3 has the same PPS as F4 now.

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True but blm need to get the feel for starting in ice phase anyway especially if they ready need to wait till almost full to start casting fire 3 to meet the mp cap on cast. Going into ui 1 casting t3 and using a filler during ice phase makes this a non issue. I loved t1 as well but it changed and we need to adapt with it or stick to low level content.

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Originally Posted by Suki_Pursia

It's those lower skills I/we depended on. Thunder for the low cost, fire 1 for low cost and the level 3 versions of each only used on a proc. So how is changing this a benefit to us?

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You didn't lose fire 1. They didn't do the "forced upgrade" on skills that actually mattered, only on skills where the lower level skill became literally useless once you got the higher tier version of it. The only exception to this is Thunder, but frankly, that's not nearly as big a deal as you're making it out to be. Also, Physick on Black MAge after about lv30 was completely useless anyway, and we only ran it because there was literally nothing else to bother putting on there. As someone who's been playing since 1.0, I'm honestly finding this whole rant of yours completely offensive. You've put months into the game? I've put years into the game. This update is golden. I'm not happy with 100% of it (they took away my poledance skill from drg ; ; ), but the shit you're complaining about is a joke, and I'm pretty sure you're lying about most of what you're claiming you and your fiance are doing and how this expansion has impacted that.

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Originally Posted by Joven

just that the changes were sudden and totally messed up the flow that they had. Having to relearn rotations and buffs is a real pain.

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Don't panic bout the gameprogress... if known things are outdated just find a new flow - easy. If you can't do it yourself or are to lazy to do so keep calm and let the theorycrafter/worlds firsts do the work and wait for their shared experiences but please don't cry like a baby who lost his lollipop... guides will come. flow will come as well.

Every mmo has to evolve from time to time or it will die slowly...

Edit: I have to apologize for being harsh at you Joven but I can't stand all the crys and whining bout nerfs and changes in generell since the last three days... nearly every thread is bout mimimi - I can't understand why nobody even trys to see anything positiv bout the update... SB is not bad, it's just different than before.

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Originally Posted by Suki_Pursia

Or say using flash on a lancer or pugilist to try and save the healer? No more.

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What? I've been a drg since 2.0 launch no dps ever takes flash at the early levels. Even the other tanks rarely would take it (sometimes war would take it, one less overpower to save tp) if your taking flash to peel mobs off the healer your better off using a stun instead.

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Originally Posted by Neela

Don't panic bout the gameprogress... if known things are outdated just find a new flow - easy. If you can't do it yourself or are to lazy to do so keep calm and let the theorycrafter/worlds firsts do the work and wait for their shared experiences but please don't cry like a baby who lost his lollipop... guides will come. flow will come as well.

Every mmo has to evolve from time to time or it will die slowly...

Edit: I have to apologize for being harsh at you Joven but I can't stand all the crys and whining bout nerfs and changes in generell since the last three days... nearly every thread is bout mimimi - I can't understand why nobody even trys to see anything positiv bout the update... SB is not bad, it's just different than before.

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Personally I'm not against the change. If you had read my earlier posts I only said it was somewhat irritating. And if you had actually read the comment you replied to then you would see that I wasn't complaining.

That's why I apologized in my edit - it's just people got mad without even getting their whole toolkit yet. Every cls will find a fluent rota sooner or later. We all just have to adapt things we were used to.

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Originally Posted by Neela

That's why I apologized in my edit - it's just people got mad without even getting their whole toolkit yet. Every cls will find a fluent rota sooner or later. We all just have to adapt things we were used to.

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It's all good

Direct hit.

To be blunt, if you're weaker then you're probably playing wrong....unless you are a tank, healer or 60 SMN, who were actually nerfed damage wise a little bit. I have every class at 60 and tested them pre patch and post patch, they all do almost exactly the same damage(except NIN who actually gained 1-200 dps)....probably bc of direct hit being added. Even BRD and MCH somehow. Although BRD was slightly nerfed probably do to the new utilities.

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Originally Posted by RLofOBFL

Direct hit.

To be blunt, if you're weaker then you're probably playing wrong....unless you are a tank, healer or 60 SMN, who were actually nerfed damage wise a little bit. I have every class at 60 and tested them pre patch and post patch, they all do almost exactly the same damage(except NIN who actually gained 1-200 dps)....probably bc of direct hit being added. Even BRD and MCH somehow. Although BRD was slightly nerfed probably do to the new utilities.

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uuh... i see the quickshitstorm coming... ^^'
Just for personal interesst - what does "a little bit" mean for smn/whm? :0

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Originally Posted by Neela

uuh... i see the quickshitstorm coming... ^^'
Just for personal interesst - what does "a little bit" mean for smn/whm? :0

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It's very small on SMN, like 50 to 100 dps weaker tops but it does have party utility with its pets actions changing. WHM is actually about the same I think. I didn't really test much for healers but I'm doing pretty good numbers, almost 1600 at 260. I thought itd be worse due to clerics 10% buff being removed.

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Originally Posted by RLofOBFL

It's very small on SMN, like 50 to 100 dps weaker tops but it does have party utility with its pets actions changing. WHM is actually about the same I think. I didn't really test much for healers but I'm doing pretty good numbers, almost 1600 at 260. I thought itd be worse due to clerics 10% buff being removed.

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Oh thats actually less loss than i expected - thx for your results :)