Make 'Mentor' status reportable

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Originally Posted by AlphaFox

However it should be noted that just cus a person is a Mentor, they won't know the ins and outs of every single dungeon/trial. You can ask but they may just say "I don't recall this at all"

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And the system should detect that and kick the person right away. I don't care if the mentor roulette gives out a mount, it could give out a ilvl 500 weapon I still wouldn't care, but the moment I am stuck with 5 morons in 1 party and 3 of them are mentors that paid for a clear or bought the account, that's when it becomes a problem and I can't be bothered to drag those people through the roulette.

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And the system should detect that and kick the person right away.

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Not going to happen. Mentors are just people, they aren't machines. If the mentor roulette threw me into Ultima HM tomorrow, I can pretty much guarantee you I wouldn't remember the fight. The last time I did it synced was probably over a year ago. If you think I'm gonna remember every mechanic of that fight, you're nuts.

You need to adjust your expectations a little bit, otherwise you're going to continue to be disappointed.

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Originally Posted by AlphaFox

Whenever you put a reward at the end of something people will flock to it regardless.PvP Glamour? Expect bad or uncaring people to flock to PVP just to get it. Same with mentor, some people have zero interest in helping, they just want the shiny reward at the end. However it should be noted that just cus a person is a Mentor, they won't know the ins and outs of every single dungeon/trial. You can ask but they may just say "I don't recall this at all"

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Making it easier to get the PvP gear as a glam and adding other PvP related rewards helped PvP by making the queue time shorter since more ppl were actually interested in doing it, just like with mentor roulette. Adding a long term reward helps reduce wait times. After that, it's all about who you get. And while not all mechanics can be easily remembered if not seen often, a mentor is expected to be able deal with whatever comes at them with at least some competency. If you encounter a mentor who lacks the will to be helpful and provides no efficiency to the run, then you should kick them. But just because you have a mentor who is stone silent, you can at least expect them to understand their job.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

Are you asking for tips in your dungeons? Or are you expecting unsolicited advice?
Even new players sometimes like to learn as they go.

... you expect mentors to know everything and that they must supply this information to you in advance.

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This. If you don't speak up, I will assume you've watched a video, read a guide, or just want to try facerolling it and see what happens. I don't want to be up in your face telling you what to do unless you specifically ask for it. Maybe that's just the kind of person I am. I'm not doing it for the mount or the roulette. I think I've only done the roulette a couple of times. I genuinely want to help people, but I get that others aren't in it for that. Things end up that way sometimes.

Tbh, I find more people berating me for explaining mechanics because they think they know it right even after I've copied and pasted off the wiki or something. There are pros and cons to giving advice.

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Originally Posted by Sil3ntxR3qui3m

Tbh, I find more people berating me for explaining mechanics because they think they know it right even after I've copied and pasted off the wiki or something. There are pros and cons to giving advice.

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This this this. And if being a Mentor becomes reportable for not giving advice off the bat? I'll gladly hand in my Mentor status. I love to help, but I won't be treated like crap either.

I've recently became a Mentor right when I got DRK to 60. I've always wanted to be a Mentor as I really enjoy helping people in general. Now, being that I'm very new to the whole endgame content as a Tank, I know I will have my slip ups. I'm only human after all. But the crown next to my name makes people expect I know what I'm doing.

Yesterday's Mentor Roulette was the Odin Fight for me. I know everything there is to know about the Urth's Fount fight as a healer and as a DPS. (And I actually mentioned this while in the fight.) But still being a bit new to tanking old content, I knew jack squat on what I'm supposed to do as a Dark Knight. I was only trying to learn and get comfortable tanking. Well, long story short, it didn't end well for the 4 first timers, either. Even after explaining the mechanics to them.

Because of this experience, I feel that the Mentor system could have had more prerequisites in order to become an actual Mentor. For example: complete some of the more important dungeons, raids, and trials as each role. Each instance must be Synced as you'll be doing them anyway in the Mentor Roulette. It would prepare you to what's to come.

That way, when you do become a Mentor, you have very little room for error to happen. But then again, we are human, so we're prone to make mistakes here and there. It's unavoidable.

Going on topic here, I don't want people to think make the assumption that I'm in the Mentor system for a Mount based on how I'm screwing up in something. But I rather have SE tweak the prerequisites so there would be even less crappy players.

I personally feel that if a Mentor has mentor status but there are certain things that they might not know/are not very good with, then that's fine they're only human not perfect machines. We all have things we might not be good at and no one said a Mentor has to be 100% perfect.

I think that what's not okay however, is when a Mentor will outright refuse a newbie any help/advice simply because they feel it's a waste or are throwing the "gitgud m8" mentality at you.

It's so scary how the community thinks we mentors must know everything 1000% or " kill the mentor! Remove their status!!" Don't know the cd of a boss attack? REPORT THIS FAKE MENTOR! -_-

Seriously, is the community so hell bent on a witch hunt? Granted there are black sheeps in the mentors ranks, but to tar every single of them with the same brush is just being judgemental. IMO? There's seriously no reason for mentor system to exist outside of a shiny crown. SE should have never initiated this to begin with. Intentions were good, but implementation has gone horridly wrong. Might be time to scrap this. As many have said before, you don't need a crown to teach newbies.

I kinda want to suggest that instead of making it so Mentors can be reported, maybe have a Feedback option instead. Granted that people could still try to turn that into a "Let's badmouth the mentor in every way possible because they didn't follow our possibly crazy expectations". So it might be broken...but maybe someone else has ideas for that?

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Originally Posted by LunaFaye

And the system should detect that and kick the person right away. I don't care if the mentor roulette gives out a mount, it could give out a ilvl 500 weapon I still wouldn't care, but the moment I am stuck with 5 morons in 1 party and 3 of them are mentors that paid for a clear or bought the account, that's when it becomes a problem and I can't be bothered to drag those people through the roulette.

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That is not even close to what I was talking about. What I mean is we are human, we forget or some of us may have only done the dungeon/trial once. I cleared Levi Ex a few time and that was unsync'd, had no real reason to do it again after I got my mount. Fast forward months later and my first Mentor is Levi Ex sync'd. I had a vague memory of it but tried anyway. Basically, we can't expect mentors to be people who know every single thing. They are normal people just like you.

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Originally Posted by Drkdays

Making it easier to get the PvP gear as a glam and adding other PvP related rewards helped PvP by making the queue time shorter since more ppl were actually interested in doing it, just like with mentor roulette. Adding a long term reward helps reduce wait times. After that, it's all about who you get. And while not all mechanics can be easily remembered if not seen often, a mentor is expected to be able deal with whatever comes at them with at least some competency. If you encounter a mentor who lacks the will to be helpful and provides no efficiency to the run, then you should kick them. But just because you have a mentor who is stone silent, you can at least expect them to understand their job.

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The point I am trying to make is just because you have a reward at the end your going to attract all kinds of people, some who are willing to help fulfill what the main point of the roulette is for and those who could care less about the status and only want the reward. People complain about the wait times for PvP, yet throw in rewards and suddenly its "Were getting newbs who don't care and are just here for the reward!" Which I admit I fall into the category myself PvP wise, I do try but I am not gonna be as hardcore as the rest who actually enjoy it so I know I am bringing them down. Same goes for mentors who run the roulette but have zero interest in helping and will even kick the newbies or ditch if it means speeding it up. I will admit I think if your going to wear the Mentor crown you do need to compose yourself a bit better and set a good example but again falling into the "Some do it for X, some do it for Y"

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Originally Posted by AlphaFox

That is not even close to what I was talking about. What I mean is we are human, we forget or some of us may have only done the dungeon/trial once. I cleared Levi Ex a few time and that was unsync'd, had no real reason to do it again after I got my mount. Fast forward months later and my first Mentor is Levi Ex sync'd. I had a vague memory of it but tried anyway. Basically, we can't expect mentors to be people who know every single thing. They are normal people just like you.

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Oh I know what you're talking about, hence my comment and you've proven just to be the candidate I was talking about when entering a mentor roulette. And I have to disagree, sure now we have the option to unsync the content, in fact most of the old ARR trials can be solo'd, but the point is, that if you join a mentor roulette and want that mount, I should assume you know the fights. Everybody makes mistakes, not talking about that, however if you join that roulette with the excuse that you've done it unsync'd and you're human then im sorry to say, that mount should have been removed from your inventory. A Mentor should know the OLD ARR content or turn on your green little leaf and join it as newbie, but don't join it as mentor trying to find some excuse why you lack the knowledge of the trial.

That's a lot of content to expect someone to know all of it

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if you join a mentor roulette and want that mount, I should assume you know the fights.

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There's literally over a hundred duties on the mentor roulette. Granted, many of them are faceroll status, but if you think everyone is going to know them all just because they may have cleared some of these fights literally 1-2 or even more years ago... again, you're nuts.

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

There's literally over a hundred duties on the mentor roulette. Granted, many of them are faceroll status, but if you think everyone is going to know them all just because they may have cleared some of these fights literally 1-2 or even more years ago... again, you're nuts.

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Sadly, some people think mentors should be able to remember how to do every duty perfectly, as I've gathered from reading a few threads.

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

There's literally over a hundred duties on the mentor roulette. Granted, many of them are faceroll status, but if you think everyone is going to know them all just because they may have cleared some of these fights literally 1-2 or even more years ago... again, you're nuts.

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That's like saying that you can't remember how to multiply 2x4, i am pretty sure you learned that nearly 10+ years ago. I've played this game since beta and sure some of the trials you run more than once when they are new in min ilvl etc, some trials/dungeons you don't run for 2+ years and yet I still remember them.

It's not difficult to dodge orange shit on the floor, yet some mentors think because they have not run an trial/dungeon for couple of years, that they can just stand in it. Those are also the people that die first and if they have that mentor crown displayed they should be slapping themselves.

No matter if you played this game a month ago or 3 years ago, there was never a dungeon/trial where you could stand in every orange circle on the floor and not be dead. Again not an excuse but keep listing them, pretty sure by the time we reach page 100, we find one that makes tunnel vision ok and acceptable.

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That's like saying that you can't remember how to multiply 2x4, i am pretty sure you learned that nearly 10+ years ago. I've played this game since beta and sure some of the trials you run more than once when they are new in min ilvl etc, some trials/dungeons you don't run for 2+ years and yet I still remember them.

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Good for you. Not everyone does. Mentors don't necessarily mean they're stellar players that never get hit, either.

If that's what you expect out of someone just because they're a mentor, you're going to continue being disappointed.

I have no intention of debating with you to even page 10, let alone 100, because that's really all there is to the matter.

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Originally Posted by Rhyku

Sadly, some people think mentors should be able to remember how to do every duty perfectly, as I've gathered from reading a few threads.

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It is good that you bring this forth....in truth, nobody expect everybody to know everything about everything BUT, when you undertake a job you should know that job and know it well..otherwise you shouldnt undertake it and this is again why I am against the Mentor system, someone mentioned is alot of content to know everything..and I agree you cant remember all.


There is a VERY basic thing that I would find normal though ..is that people that dont know DO SAY SO rather then display that crown, be total jerks, and in the end is visible they know nothing but still act almighty and allow themselves to slap on the face those that really dont know with total dumb comments, when they are the first ones to die on an AOE.

Want an example of how bad this system is ? Satasha NM (yeah the basically first dungeon in the list) player with crown on the head to leaf player ( that obviously had no clues at all)...guess what was the first words Mentor (because well if you display yourself as a Mentor you are one right ?) said (I wish I had kept that script)

Go read a guide, get good and he poofed

Yeah? right....you heard it well...how is that even acceptable ? and more important what image is given of the game, and of the community, you think is a exception and it doesnt happen often ? well guess what ? wrong it happens on a daily basis on any and all places.

As long as these attitudes are promoted /allowed, Mentor system should be removed, there is no space to threat others with such display.

There could be a way to change for the best this, possibly, although I am not a tech

Have the dungeons/trials that pertain to the Mentor roulette visibly listed under Mentor Roulette and let the Mentors check/choose what they know/want to mentor and make Mentor roulette be available only for leaf barers & Mentors, that way Mentors will land with new players only and if truely a mentor is reported for acting porly with this system, harsh sanctions could be applied since mentor choose what he wanted /could teach.

Might cut short on a few things but might also reduce sensibly the access to Mentor Roulette for lack of people.

As is today, I will say it again, is a bad and poor system.

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Originally Posted by Seig345

I'm disappointed to see this is such an issue. I recently came back to the game and learned about the mentor system by spotting that crown, and then finding the mentor npc and learning about the requirements.

I typically find myself too nervous to tank higher level content, and would intentionally queue for early content in order to help new players and potentially replace a missing tank, and seeing that there was a system with a roulette specifically to help sprouts appealed to me.

Then I see on the forums that there is a mount reward and that people are flouting the spirit behind the mentor system just to get it. I may not be surprised, but I'm still disappointed, and perhaps a little concerned that the abuse will lead to the system's abolishment.

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I was a bit like that at first. Lately I decided to progress from 50 WAR having not done endgame with it since 2.2. I suggest that you take a tank job into Deep Palace it really does help you learn the job and give you confidence.

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Originally Posted by Masekase_Hurricane

I was a bit like that at first. Lately I decided to progress from 50 WAR having not done endgame with it since 2.2. I suggest that you take a tank job into Deep Palace it really does help you learn the job and give you confidence.

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I probably should do that myself since I'm still a bit afraid when it comes to tanking. But I'm slowly gaining confidence.

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Originally Posted by Rhyku

It's so scary how the community thinks we mentors must know everything 1000% or " kill the mentor! Remove their status!!" Don't know the cd of a boss attack? REPORT THIS FAKE MENTOR! -_-

Seriously, is the community so hell bent on a witch hunt? Granted there are black sheeps in the mentors ranks, but to tar every single of them with the same brush is just being judgemental. IMO? There's seriously no reason for mentor system to exist outside of a shiny crown. SE should have never initiated this to begin with. Intentions were good, but implementation has gone horridly wrong. Might be time to scrap this. As many have said before, you don't need a crown to teach newbies.

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Well, what did you expect from a community that want to burn people at the stake for early hunt pulls?

IME, mobs die too fast in PotD to teach anything about role.

Well I'm a PvP mentor and you can't report me in PvE anyway.

I'm a mentor, and I take my mentor status very seriously. I pretty much dedicate all of my time online helping people (offline too if need be).

If you get in a duty with me and ask questions on fights or anything bout the game, I will try to explain to the best of my ability. If you don't ask for information, I will just assume you don't need help. Granted, I watch certain classes closely to check on rotations and will give advice on those certain classes (mainly ones I have a lot of experience with and have done research on). I try to be kind and helpful. I find myself going above and beyond for some people. I go as far as to offer to share my own house with people, give Gil to new players and give my help outside of duties if they wish (if they are on my server/world). I love being a mentor, more than anything, so please do not assume all mentors don't care and are just in it for the mount when you run into bad ones.

Dragon Monocle>Mount for me :D

But I'll never get either one so w/e. On the rare occassion I do do mentor roulette I always get some dungeon that doesn't have a single new person so I never have to explain anything anyway.

Though if there actually was someone new I would help as much as I could, it just never happens with my luck.

Take away the rewards for mentors. Plain and simple. The helpful players are always willing to help others without getting anything in return. The reward is hopefully a smooth run of whatever and maybe a thank you.