Request to Yoshi P: Hire more staff

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Originally Posted by Azper

This. There's plenty to do in the game. It's just a lot of it, for whatever reason, is unappealing to a majority of the players. They don't necessarily need to churn out more per patch, but definitely focus on creating stuff that has some longevity and isn't immediately outdated in 3-6 months or gated behind some weekly cap/awful grind.

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Based on what I gathered, some people don't bother with content where they can't progress or get some profit out of it. You know, playing a videogame to have fun. However, I think it's truly hard to achieve the creation of long term content without implying certain degree of grind or a lockout, because that way you play with people's energy and time, at the same time you create barriers around it. Is it cheap? Yes, but I can't think of a better way to do it. I have yet to read a balanced suggestion that could change that. If SE didn't figured it out, I really don't know what to say.

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Originally Posted by Maikeru

Based on what I gathered, some people don't bother with content where they can't progress or get some profit out of it. You know, playing a videogame to have fun. However, I think it's truly hard to achieve the creation of long term content without implying certain degree of grind or a lockout, because that way you play with people's energy and time, at the same time you create barriers around it. Is it cheap? Yes, but I can't think of a better way to do it. I have yet to read a balanced suggestion that could change that. If SE didn't figured it out, I really don't know what to say.

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Well, lets looks at gathering and crafting.

As the system is now, it's far too grindy for the majority of the playerbase to enjoy, while at the same time not having any good equipment to craft for endgame. So, the current paradigm is for gathering and crafting to be far too time-consuming and unrewarding.

A definite improvement to the system would be to bring the grind back down to reasonable levels while also adding new recipees to craft competitive gear (albeit perhaps not the most powerful gear). To prevent people from just using the MB to gear themselves, the gear produced from these recipees would require untradable dungeon drops / token mats and the gear itself would be untradable. This will also help people to use other classes since they'd have an extra method of gearing them up. This surely wouldn't get everyone into crafting, but it would certainly open up a big chunk of content to a lot more players.

Of course this would require SE to stop listening to the hardcore gatherers and crafters that want to drive off everyone else so they can make more gil.

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Originally Posted by LunaHoshino

This. Large companies, even profitable ones, are frequently very stingy with their hiring.

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I must be getting old because I remember when SE or Squaresoft and Enix (before the merger) was in the business of making games, not making games to run a business. I agree with the op +1.

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Originally Posted by Marxam

I must be getting old because I remember when SE or Squaresoft and Enix (before the merger) was in the business of making games, not making games to run a business. I agree with the op +1.

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Lol, Squaresoft and Enix were always about making money.

It's also the nature of software development. "Hiring more people to help a late project will only serve to make the project later."

Getting a software developer up to speed on your methods and design can take three or four months. And even then you don't know how really good that person is. Programmers class the very best of themselves as the 10x programmers - capable of producing good code ten times faster than a regular coder. Not because they're writing code faster, they're just writing much less code that is also far more efficient. (I'm a designer, not a programmer, so I'm on day four of the job and already writing code spec. Talk about trial by fire.)

Anyway, I'd rather they have fewer high quality guys like they do today than farm out large chunks of the game to China. The last time they did that, we ended up with 1.0.

I also supported the game even more spent about $50 on the mogstation buying additional items. Hoping they make the game better.

While this was a different game entirely, the number one reason the development team of FFXIII cited for the game's jarring pacing/ideas/themes/etc. was a large staff and a lack of communication. Given the long development periods of SE's most recent key titles, I don't think that this issue was localized to FFXIII. I think it spread among all their projects, and they're only now working the kinks out. I'd rather they waited until then before enlarging FFXIV's staff.

The team that Yoshi P has is small. I believe once FFXV and KH3 are complete some people might transition to work on FFXIV with Yoshi P should the opportunity present itself and SE recruits from within.

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Originally Posted by Madjames

Hmm I will go out on a limb here and say that after doing the Alex raid, it was lackluster at best compared to Ulduar, ICC, Naxxramas, and almost every other raid from BC- WOD in world of warcraft. The raids were longer, required more time, had way more trash mobs that sometimes dropped end game gear and crafting materials, and had giant legendary quests for legendary gear.

I am sorry but the raids in this game IS a lack, a severe Lack when compared to other mmorpgs that are much older then this.

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You are still focusing on one thing.

What many people don't realize is that maybe there are not so many active subscribers for a larger development team to be financially profitable. Square Enix has never released any official numbers, only '5 millions adventurers worldwide' which means nothing because it includes bots, gilspammers, twinks, alts and non active accounts. Officially less than 300k have completed Alexander Normal so that's the closest number of active subscribers with lv.60 chars we can get. And 300k is not that much in terms of MMOs.

I would not fully count Alexander NM clears as a guestimate for active subscribers. There's still a lot of people who haven't even hit level 60 and probably just as many who are at that level but have not done Alexander for whatever reason.

It pointless to argue over the number of the active subscribers. You don't need to see official numbers to understand the game is going well and it's healthy. I think ffxiv needs to ramp up the production speed. They can hire a few more people that's for sure. There is no need to hire an army of people just a few more. We need more varied and rich end game content. And more end game gear variety. 3.1 supposedly will introduce new kind of end game content but how effective this will be remains to be seen. Many times they content simply does not deliver. Also something must be done with all those "memory limitations" that stresses the servers and it's being used by Yoshi an excuse when we ask for something to be added in game like inventory space, more character customization options etc. I feel they definitely need to ramp up the development of they want this game to further succeed and attract more players.

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Originally Posted by Madjames

Hmm I will go out on a limb here and say that after doing the Alex raid, it was lackluster at best compared to Ulduar, ICC, Naxxramas, and almost every other raid from BC- WOD in world of warcraft. The raids were longer, required more time, had way more trash mobs that sometimes dropped end game gear and crafting materials, and had giant legendary quests for legendary gear.

I am sorry but the raids in this game IS a lack, a severe Lack when compared to other mmorpgs that are much older then this.

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Breaking News:

Final Fantasy XIV is NOT a MMO around Raids. Unlike WoW, that is majory a Raid centered MMO.

Problem with getting new staff is that they cant just jump in and start helping. They have to read code that is already there and understand whats going on and what needs to be done or improved. Be nice if production speed were higher but they dont really get anything out of it from a business standpoint. You get content faster and they lose money on labor with the same amount of subscribers. Saying more ppl would subscribe is just a theory same as ppl unsubing because of slow content.

What a lol topic. And people wonder why mods are more active/take more seriously the threads in the jap forums than this one.....

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Originally Posted by Mature

What a lol topic. And people wonder why mods are more active/take more seriously the threads in the jap forums than this one.....

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The only joke I see here is this post.

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Originally Posted by Mature

What a lol topic. And people wonder why mods are more active/taken more seriously in the threads of the jp forums than this one.....

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Fixed for you.

Although this thread was created I guess in the best interest of the game, it is unrealistic to just hire people. Bigger staff doesn't always mean a better game. Small groups are easier to manage than large groups. I just wish they change focus and make content that lasts more than a major patch..

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Originally Posted by Cheraa

Breaking News:

Final Fantasy XIV is NOT a MMO around Raids. Unlike WoW, that is majory a Raid centered MMO.

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Who are you to say what it is and what it isn't? Who are you to say what it could be if given better resources?

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Originally Posted by Sparktacus

Who are you to say what it is and what it isn't? Who are you to say what it could be if given better resources?

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I'm more incline to agree that XIV is not a Raid Heavy MMO.

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Originally Posted by JibeMalkieri

FFXI ARR surpassed all expectations SE and the Devs could have held for it , 2 years and an expansion later, it is still going strong. .

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There has been a significant less amount of players in the game since heavensward released. One of the reasons being that the next update won't be here for another month, but the other reason is that heavensward is just ARR in a new jacket. Nothing new, nothing special. It's just repetitive content. The only interesting thing that has been released for the past 2-3 years is the gold saucer.

Am I the only one who thinks that this post is offensive? Asking someone like Naoki to hire more staff are you actually cereal?
The rest probably supported the idea because they don't really care as it is to "improve their gaming experience" anyways.

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Originally Posted by JibeMalkieri

I know that some people will say that it would cost money but I would argue with as far as this game has come beyond all expectations they had for it not to mention the addition of the cash shop which was promised to be used to further the game, it should be financially feasible for them to hire more people to their team. In theory additional staff would "pay for themselves" by helping to increase the amount of relevant content per patch, not to mention bringing fresh ideas to the table. If there was more relevant content in each patch, the number of people unsubbing between patches would drop and help pay for the extra staff.

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It's not so much about the cost of money per employee but things get held back due to delegation between different branches of management. There isn't just a Yoshi-P division, it's comprised of multiple divisions, with multiple heads attempting to make sure certain (not all) decisions are made with everyone feeling content, not happy that doesn't happen. You have bottlenecks in terms of production, not just on the ground level but as you go up that all trickles down. Having more staff might get some things take care of quicker, but in the long run you might see a week or two earlier but that's about it.

The issues you are talking about, while they're very good points, could benefit from being looked at from another point of view. Instead of so much content, why not content that is implemented and lingers for a bit. By this I mean the famous horizontal progression. This wouldn't mean running the same dungeon 100 times, it would expand to gear and other types of play content such as crafting, spirit bonding, customization and the combat system in a way. This of course is a major step and is just as unlikely it would happen. I don't think the resolution is throw more employees at it but rather rearrange things and make it so what the employees are able to put out is more active in the game than say a few months. Fresh ideas are already there at the table, they just get stomped out by someone who says no. Now whether that person who says no is a producer or someone else who has more business than video game experience is another thing.

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Originally Posted by NoahArks

There has been a significant less amount of players in the game since heavensward released. One of the reasons being that the next update won't be here for another month, but the other reason is that heavensward is just ARR in a new jacket. Nothing new, nothing special. It's just repetitive content. The only interesting thing that has been released for the past 2-3 years is the gold saucer.

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That is true too, this would of been a wonderful time to bring in an expansion to material system, to add in and focus more on environmental reactions in certain fights rather than high DPS checks that would still mean coordinating with the team in order for you to win, expansion to traits via a system like merit points. I still adore the person who mentioned using FF9 as traits and trait slots on gear. There was a post about old material I forgot all about. If you make gear something users want not just because of glamour, but for what it can do for your job then you don't mind running a dungeon a few times. I never got tired of Sea or Sky, Dynamis. It was because I was thinking "Man I could use that perpetuation - X" instead of now where its "Well I get 4 more INT..lets roll baby."

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Originally Posted by Reinth

Am I the only one who thinks that this post is offensive? Asking someone like Naoki to hire more staff are you actually cereal?
The rest probably supported the idea because they don't really care as it is to "improve their gaming experience" anyways.

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You are not the only one.
People, who do not understand software development in depth, always come up with simple solutions that work for simple problems. "Just hire more stuff! doh!" But I saw so called producers and managers do the same mistake, so who's to blame?

I'm not here to explain to you guys how software- and especially game-development works, maybe just read this:
http://www.sitepoint.com/larger-team...evelop-faster/
or
http://blog.patchspace.co.uk/why-you...ore-developers
to help you understand.

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Originally Posted by Reinth

Am I the only one who thinks that this post is offensive? Asking someone like Naoki to hire more staff are you actually cereal?
The rest probably supported the idea because they don't really care as it is to "improve their gaming experience" anyways.

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Nothing wrong with asking things in a game you are paying for monthly. As a customer, you have all rights to do it.

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Originally Posted by SuperZay

Nothing wrong with asking things in a game you are paying for monthly. As a customer, you have all rights to do it.

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No. You have the right to own the copy on your PC and to get a subscription and that's it.
You don't own anything besides the account and the right to run FF+Xpack if you got an active subscription.

People here don't seem to understand that, but it's nothing new really. Been like this since the beginning of online services.

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Originally Posted by kazeandi

No. You have the right to own the copy on your PC and to get a subscription and that's it.
You don't own anything besides the account and the right to run FF+Xpack if you got an active subscription.

People here don't seem to understand that, but it's nothing new really. Been like this since the beginning of online services.

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SuperZay didn't say we had a right to more content, he said we had a right to ask for more content.

Doesn't mean the developers have to listen, and perhaps "right" is too strong of a word, but we are certainly afforded the opportunity to make such requests.

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Originally Posted by kazeandi

No. You have the right to own the copy on your PC and to get a subscription and that's it.
You don't own anything besides the account and the right to run FF+Xpack if you got an active subscription.

People here don't seem to understand that, but it's nothing new really. Been like this since the beginning of online services.

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So what would you like? People being complete sheep swallowing everything and never providing negative feedback?
We are fortunate to play this game, but SE is fortunate to have us paying for it.

So yeah, I have right to criticise and SE has right not to listen to me. But don't come to me with this "you have no rights beside paying and playing", such attitude will never serve any product well. ,)

EDIT: Plus even Yoshi himself said that he appreciates the negative and positive feedback of players. :)
"For Yoshida, listening to feedback from both designers and players has been key. Where many of Square-Enix's other high profile directors have, in recent times, forged their own creative path with long-running series, often to the dismay of fans, Yoshida became obsessed with what players wanted. He visited the game's online forums every day and ordered one staff member to prepare a weekly report that listed each player request on the forums and allocated it a priority rating for implementation. "Regardless of what game designers say, it is always great to receive feedback on your games," he tells me. "Of course I appreciate people who just say how much fun the game is but I feel the same about criticisms too. If we stop getting feedback it pretty much means that people have stopped playing the game, so good or bad, I am always glad to hear a response."

So please, tell me that I or anyone else doesn't have the right to ask for anything when even director of this game encourages us to do that. :)

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Originally Posted by Ibi

SuperZay didn't say we had a right to more content, he said we had a right to ask for more content.

Doesn't mean the developers have to listen, and perhaps "right" is too strong of a word, but we are certainly afforded the opportunity to make such requests.

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Don't bother with those kind of posters, they're going to argue technicalities and cite the ToS on and on until you give up.

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Originally Posted by Colorful

Don't bother with those kind of posters, they're going to argue technicalities and cite the ToS on and on until you give up.

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Well, even the past actions of Yoshi have shown that he actually likes and reacts to feedback (and asking in my opinion is a type of feedback).
So no matter what he/she posts or cites, he/she would have hard time convincing me that we have no right to ask anything. :))

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Originally Posted by StrejdaTom

Well, even the past actions of Yoshi have shown that he actually likes and reacts to feedback (and asking in my opinion is a type of feedback).
So no matter what he/she posts or cites, he/she would have hard time convincing me that we have no right to ask anything. :))

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I didn't mean give up on suggesting your idea, just give up on arguing with them. Better to not bother to begin with then to go back and forth, it's like talking to a brick wall. :p

Personally, I think growing the team strategically, especially so vacation downtime isn't a thing, is very possible. We're not asking for a new guy to sit on the laps of each of the old like they're doing with WoW, but for example they've obviously known their plans for Void Ark since HW release and probably had some groundwork done by then, but if everyone was on vacation then all the assets, etc. remained untouched for that time, whereas if they had a few more people developing over that time then we'd be much closer to 3.1 than we are now, and the Void Ark screenshots may have had some more substance to them than what we've seen.

All these people complaining about grinding in this game have clearly never played Runescape when they were young

Lets build a wall.
1 person takes a week.
2 people take 4 days.
3 people take 3 days.
100 people take a week. ( Because now you need to tell everyone where to be. Also the project gets bigger and bigger( taller and taller)

Sadly as a developer myself Project creep can kill a project. I want this this this and maybe that. With project Creep it's I want this this this, and that and this and oo maybe some of that. Then release date comes and nothing works.

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Originally Posted by Fjaere

All these people complaining about grinding in this game have clearly never played Runescape when they were young

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Grinding being worse in other games doesn't mean that people are wrong for not liking the lesser grind that currently exists in this game.

The grind that has been adding to gathering and crafting since launch has certainly killed the enjoyment I had with FFXIV.

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Originally Posted by StrejdaTom

So what would you like? People being complete sheep swallowing everything and never providing negative feedback?
We are fortunate to play this game, but SE is fortunate to have us paying for it.

So yeah, I have right to criticise and SE has right not to listen to me. But don't come to me with this "you have no rights beside paying and playing", such attitude will never serve any product well. ,)

EDIT: Plus even Yoshi himself said that he appreciates the negative and positive feedback of players. :)


So please, tell me that I or anyone else doesn't have the right to ask for anything when even director of this game encourages us to do that. :)

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A huge thumbs up!! :o

I believe the developers have earned a well deserve rest if i am honest, FFXIV is special, if anything the wait is making me more excited, there's still content to be done.

In reply to the few constructive criticisms to this post:

To those who say that adding more developers will not speed things up, I'm not asking for faster patches. My hope is that with additional employees they could increase the amount of meaningful and unique new content in each patch. Also with the staffing in place when the time comes for people to take time off, it would be less detrimental to the existing development cycle.

To those who say adding too much staff would create unnecessary chaos (too many chefs spoil the pot). FFXIV has admitted that their team is much smaller than industry standards and while this can be a good thing in many respects, it also lessens the amount they can accomplish in a given period of time. I wouldn't argue with what the current team can accomplish given its size is anything short of amazing. but adding a few people to the various teams who's sole purpose is to code and model content that has been agreed upon would free up more time for the core team to create and realize more content.

The fact we're still getting 4 endgame bosses every six months should be indication enough that FFXIV is understaffed. I wouldn't be surprised many of the profits from this game go to FFXV either.