Why does everyone abuse the warrior of light?

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Originally Posted by Omskahn

You do all these favours for your "friends" but how often do they do any for you?

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Like, constantly?

Do you understand what logistics are? Do you get that you wouldn't be able to fight primals without Cid figuring out the science, without Urianger figuring out where they are and what they're doing, without Minfilia organizing all of the city states behind you and getting you ins with all of them, without Alphinaud making in roads in Ishgardian diplomacy, without Haurchefaunt backing Aymeric, and Alphinaud on getting you in, without Tataru managing the accounts, wit--I'm not going to keep going.

Wars aren't won or lost through soldiers, not even really good ones like the WoL. They're most often won and lost on logistics. And that's what the other Scions do. They gather and disseminate information, get you allies, get you money, get you equipment.

Without the Scions you're just a random adventurer doing random dungeons. Maybe you have a name for yourself, but that's it.

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Originally Posted by Omskahn

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CHAINSAW! PART 1!

"maybe he has better things to do" - Do you? Ignoring side quests, DO you got anything better to do at that point of the story? Break into Azys Lla? how? Aetheric Ram? how? Oh wait, our only hope is another scion! usually these 'quests' come at a complete downtime in the story wherein there's nothing happening or you need to collect info/etc and wait for it to come in.

"How often do they do any for you?" - Quite a bit behind the scenes. And some NPCs make active notice of themselves doing 'chores' that benefit you. Collecting info on primals behind the scenes, enabling you retainers, Estinien jumped into a tree for fruit for a MSQ, Alphinaud and *Spoiler* help shut down Golems in Idyllshire. List goes on and on. Just cause you ignore it don't mean it's not there. Edit: Oh, and let's not forget: it was Alphanaud who fought the Rogue Golem, we got it clean and both were non-Aggressive types!

"Superman Analogy" - Superman don't live in a world wherein outside of Metropolis there's man eating monsters galore in endless volumes, some of which are demons hellbent on destroying reality. Political intrigue isn't fostered by beings wielding the power of Gods on a COMMON basis (the president of most comic universes is usually a NORMAL human unless plot calls for it... or at least until the super-beings take office). Dragons aren't bombarding a town constantly.

And going on "Superman" is a huge outlier. Your proper example would be Spiderman or Batman, both of whom go out of the way to deal with normal crooks too.

In a world wherein monsters exist in gusto, as well as superpowerful humanoids (IE: Gaius Van Balsar), you would preferably want your chores handled by a super being as, in that reality, it's safer with an adventurer who's hyper powered than yourself who's likely to get mugged by those Star Marmots outside of the town gate.

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And Krylo said it best, without the other Scions, you wouldn't really be that well equipped for MOST primal incidents, god forbid KNOW about most of them - took YEARS for the scions to find out about Ravana and Bismark and BARELY stumbled upon Shiva in time for her summoning! And most of all: Malestrom handled ALL the work for the Whorleater ship. EVERYTHING. Something I swore to god they were gonna make you do.

You are so caught up in your hubris of wanting to feel like you're doing everything and the other chars do nothing you fail to realize just how much behind the scenes tape the Scions and other chars do for you. You wouldn't have half your rights without the adventurer's guild. You wouldn't have have the privaleges without the Scions. The Scions footed the knowledge that helped you safely stop the first 2 primals, and you relied on the help of Ishgard to reach the Airship to stop garuda.

I wouldn't call it abuse, techinally they are friends, or at least coworkers. Perhaps its more like we overwork ourselves, and they need to invent chores to keep us busy/around for the next time something bad happens.

(That said, im not the biggest fan of the Scions either...)

A lot of legwork to get around things is handled by your compatriots. Do i have the time to look into magitek technobabble to get through said shield barring my way? No, but i know someone who does, and i just happen to be borrowing his airship to get there, which would likely normally cost an arm and a leg to do.

This isn't a rare occurance for soldiers and fighters, for their vaunted ability to kill things, to be bogged down or even thwarted by more mundane concerns.

Does this mean we aren't the chosen one? That our own value is a lie? No, we've certainly done enough, even with the help, to be considered legendary. Primal killing used to take whole armies, or technology many years away. Imagine G.I Joe, or Chuck Norris's Karate Kommandos actually being a thing in real life winning us the War on Terror and squashing terror cells before they phone in the apocalyse, and that's kinda what us and our connections are doing in Eorzea.

And even outside of primal killing, our martial skills are damn impressive. Some seasons adventurers get their careers ended by fighting morbols, while we take cleaves from swords than can dice a horse, punches from rock monsters, the most skilled military combatants, magical explosions from the latest pieces of Allagan cookingware...you get the idea.

The disconnect many make is that this makes us superman. I don't think it does. We appear to be, but --im not sure i can explain it that well, maybe I neither see it nor want to see it.

Our characters are not invincible, truly fighting in these situations and can falter. The closest i can come up with is that batman villain with the ability to rewind and replay stuff till he gets it right, but i don't think our deaths are canon. Im honestly not sure what it truly makes all of our characters. Which, as long as Kallera as more person than puppet, im okay with.

you wanna know what abuse is? HW Moogle quests.

I agree most of the quests are insulting for a guy that is suppose to be the warrior of light. But the game isn't designed to reflect our personalities. Basically the warrior of light is portrayed like a reincarnated Jesus, All powerful yet washes peoples feet every chance he gets. Hydalyn like God of course, watching all the suffering going on but doing fk all about it save a blessing here and there.

We play a role and a character in the story. As far as this character being or representing ourselves? It doesnt; All we did was create what it looked like.

Its not like Fallout where if you didn't like someone you could just slit their throat. This is probabky due to the fact that there wouldn't be any npcs left in ff and a large part of the community are crazy and would be lighting whole towns on fire and doing God knows what.

Wait this would make an awesome expansion pack though .

We do come up with their thoughts and actions, who they choose to associate with, and thats not even going into the roleplay aspects, which i think everyone does to at least some extent.

No one follows the unending journey by the letter.

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Originally Posted by Bishop81

Welcome to a WoW-style themepark MMO.

Warrior of light or not, you are an errand boy who just does what the plot demands you do.

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I'm pretty sure this is present in every MMO, or is at least a Square Enix thing because FFXI made you does the exact same thing, except there you have to spend 40 minutes to complete a single fetch quest because transportation is non existent compared to XIV's.

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Originally Posted by BloodPact

I'm pretty sure this is present in every MMO, or is at least a Square Enix thing because FFXI made you does the exact same thing, except there you have to spend 40 minutes to complete a single fetch quest because transportation is non existent compared to XIV's.

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/sigh

At times like this I wish WoW wasn't as successful as it was. It cast a long shadow on the genre as it somehow became gospel that WoW-style MMOs are the only kind of MMO.

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Originally Posted by Bishop81

/sigh

At times like this I wish WoW wasn't as successful as it was. It cast a long shadow on the genre as it somehow became gospel that WoW-style MMOs are the only kind of MMO.

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That's odd, cause both wow and everquest allowed players to kill people that other mmos wouldn't let you, plot be damned.

Round up an alliance, and you too can overthrow a city's eternal ruler for a time, you might even get an achievement for it!

Imagine folks being able to take out yellowjackets to get quests and hang out with the serpent reavers, and you have part of the idea.

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Originally Posted by Bishop81

/sigh

At times like this I wish WoW wasn't as successful as it was. It cast a long shadow on the genre as it somehow became gospel that WoW-style MMOs are the only kind of MMO.

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Don't know or care about World of Warcraft. Never played it. But if it was an influence for eliminating running to a (???) spot for 20 minutes, getting a one line message of collecting an item and then making the trip back to the NPC for another twenty minute run then it's okay in my book. It's cool if people consider auto-run to be part of the content of a game; I don't.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

That's odd, cause both wow and everquest allowed players to kill people that other mmos wouldn't let you, plot be damned.

Round up an alliance, and you too can overthrow a city's eternal ruler for a time, you might even get an achievement for it!

Imagine folks being able to take out yellowjackets to get quests and hang out with the serpent reavers, and you have part of the idea.

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HA! Within 15 mins the said leader will respawn and nothing changes.

Anyway, the point I'm trying to make is, with themepark MMOs the plot is predetermined. You have zero say in your overall destiny.

Nothing wrong with a linear narrative, especially when well done with a good story line, but you do end up as an errand boy with no will of his own.

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Originally Posted by Krylo

I've always figured people who make these complaints must be really fun to hang out with in person.

"Hey, man, could you grab me a soda while you're up?"
"AM I YOUR SLAVE!? STOP ABUSING ME! I DON'T HAVE TO DO EVERYTHING YOU TELL ME TO DO!"

"Hey, here's 40 bucks, could you run out and get me some nails so I can finish up this porch?"
"GO TO HELL, I'M NOT YOUR SERVANT!"

"Hey, could you pick up this stuff for the party while I finish setting up here?"
"I HAVE MORE IMPORTANT THINGS TO DO THAN PICK UP YOUR PARTY SUPPLIES, LIKE SIT HERE AND WAIT FOR IT TO START!"

She's a friend asking you to do a favor while she put on some finishing touches on the bit she had. And she paid you for it.

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To be fair most people probably don't get asked for favours multiple times in one day. I'm not even her friend i could care less for lalas.

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Originally Posted by Krylo

I've always figured people who make these complaints must be really fun to hang out with in person.

"Hey, man, could you grab me a soda while you're up?"
"AM I YOUR SLAVE!? STOP ABUSING ME! I DON'T HAVE TO DO EVERYTHING YOU TELL ME TO DO!"

"Hey, here's 40 bucks, could you run out and get me some nails so I can finish up this porch?"
"GO TO HELL, I'M NOT YOUR SERVANT!"

"Hey, could you pick up this stuff for the party while I finish setting up here?"
"I HAVE MORE IMPORTANT THINGS TO DO THAN PICK UP YOUR PARTY SUPPLIES, LIKE SIT HERE AND WAIT FOR IT TO START!"...

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Actually I had a real life occurence of this. The resentment usually doesn't come at being given chores at all, a lot of us would repeayedly go out of our way for friends and family. it comes when you see someone as ONLY a source of chores, particularly the same chore again and again.

Some people warm up to doing things for certain npcs, others see them as mini Minfillias, a !-shaped lever you pull for your gil pellets.

It seems like for the most part the other characters in the story do a lot of behind the scenes or logistics work like others have said. However, it's very nice when there are story characters that aid you in some sort of combat. Sadly, it seems like the ones who actually stick their necks out for you in the thick of battle don't seem to live very long. I have a feeling poor Alphinaud's days are numbered....

I wish games took cues from more than just WoW. The Secret World, for instance, let you turn in quests in the field, making for much less running back and forth.

Not to mention the mission variety in that game blows other MMOs away. You have your typical kill quests, sure, but also investigation quests where you have to use your brain and sabotage missions which are more about stealth and strategy. Why more games don't follow suit is beyond me. I guess because it would take more work to make a nice variety of fun quests than it would to make the same type of quests over and over.

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Originally Posted by Xanikk999

Ok I am level 57

and halfway through with the heavensward quests (or further) and we just found Y'shtola alive. Tataru is happy about it and says she has a suprise prepared for her and she tells ME to go grab the items from two guilds in Gridania. Why am I compelled to do this work? It's HER surprise why can't she do it herself.

I just want to tell all these people who tell me to fetch stuff that they can perfectly do themselves go do it yourself! What upset me about that quest is that she is supposed to be one of my fellow scions so why am I doing her chores?

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You can't tell them anything because The Warrior Of Light is mute. Maybe you could write them a letter?

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Originally Posted by Sandpark

You can't tell them anything because The Warrior Of Light is mute. Maybe you could write them a letter?

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You are not mute. :p

There are some points where people wanted some agency. They brought up a similar question in the live letter, and square notes that while its putting in more choices for HW, knowing when and how is not the easiest process, especially since these are cutscenes that may or may not be replayable.

I do get the sentiment of wanting choices though, I voiced the same in 2.55, and appreciate forming Kallera's responses and attitude much more than reading how i supposedly felt in The Unending Journey.

Oboro get's abused lol...

Some of this actually reaches a boiling point for those who did the Dork Knight job quests.

In the dark knight quest the wrong person won. Also yes the the warrior of light is an abused mute. And yes the people in eorzea are useless as box fan against Garuda...

NPC: "Please do my laundry, and I'll give you an item that will save the world."
Player: "Ye."
Player: *does laundry*
NPC: "Good, now pair up each sock, then do my taxes."
Player: "Ye."
[Eventually, the Warrior of Light realized that he (or she) got so wrapped up in doing errands, the developers had to hire a new one.]

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Originally Posted by LaurelinKementari

Good to know that after killing a few primals you consider yourself too good to help a friend make something nice for another friend who just basically came back from death. Arrogant much? Stay humble and help your fellow man even with menial daily tasks, you didn't suddenly become too good for that just because you can kill primals without risk of being tempered.

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Well we would join the Empire if they let us, but no we're stuck doing meaningless tasks for all the idiots in the world.

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Originally Posted by Krylo

Snip

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That's not them helping us, that's them making sure we have resources to do shit they asked us to do in first place.

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Originally Posted by ReclusiveMage

NPC: "Please do my laundry, and I'll give you an item that will save the world."
Player: "Ye."
Player: *does laundry*
NPC: "Good, now pair up each sock, then do my taxes."
Player: "Ye."
[Eventually, the Warrior of Light realized that he (or she) got so wrapped up in doing errands, the developers had to hire a new one.]

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That explains why there are so many warriors of light when the story makes it seem like there's only one.

All the warriors of light are doomed to fall into an endless pit of fetch quests that they don't have the ability to refuse, and doomed to being replaced. It's a never ending cycle.

The ascians could win the war against the light if only they'd give fetch quests to the warriors of light!

Ascian: "Go bring me 100 boar leathers while I kill off your friends!"
Warrior of Light: ......*nod*
Ascian: "Good....now go kill 50 dodos while we kill Hydaelyn"
Warrior of Light: .....*nod*

Ascians win.

For want of a nail the shoe was lost
For want of a shoe the horse was lost
For want of a horse the rider was lost
For want of a rider the message was lost
For want of a message the battle was lost
For want of a battle the kingdom was lost
And all for the want of a nail.

It's because the WoL touches themselves at night.

It's been like that since 1.X. I don't like how my character never had a real spotlight as a protagonist. NPCs keep treating me like a servant and always take credits from my hard works. The problem is our character cannot talk so they have other NPCs to talk for us but they actually took the spotlights from our characters.

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Originally Posted by dice137

It's because the WoL touches themselves at night.

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*sob*

The constant errands and abuse and being used is a reoccurring theme in this expansion if you pay attention. It is how your character is able tap into the power to become a Dark Knight and Thordan VII also, quite early on, tells you he knows you are used by people.


I really do think part of Haurchefant's popularity stems from the fact that he's the only NPC that doesn't do this to you. You go on what...two quests for him? One is basically the over arching quest of an entire zone and the other is to help him help you help Revenant's Toll. Otherwise he just likes you as a person. And speaking of him liking you...and Tataru...

I will never forget toppling Shiva for the first time then having him rave about how worried he was for me then going back to Revenant's Toll where Tataru is all "Oh, I guess you're back, will you hand out these uniforms to the new recruits? They are doing taff-all in town and we don't have a linkpearl or any of several practical ways to get them to pick up the uniforms. You're not busy, right?"

Not that I dislike Tataru, mind you. She's growing into one of my favorite characters. But my golly her quests....

Anyway I really am hoping this theme of "you are being used" ends up being a real story point. I just want to see our Warriors almost lose it.

It's about time we just...lost it, man.

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The constant errands and abuse and being used is a reoccurring theme in this expansion if you pay attention. It is how your character is able tap into the power to become a Dark Knight and Thordan VII also, quite early on, tells you he knows you are used by people.

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Damn it, now I have to play DRK just to see how that idea plays out. I wish DRK was DPS, because I don't enjoy tanking that much. ><

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Originally Posted by Kikoten

Damn it, now I have to play DRK just to see how that idea plays out. I wish DRK was DPS, because I don't enjoy tanking that much. ><

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Yeah this has got me really intrigued now. It might just be the thing I am looking for.