EXP Parties as an option please!

Grab 1-7 friends. Goto an appropriate area for your level range (keep it tight), and accept battle leves. All of theme. Do the ones that you all have, turn it in accept everything again, wash rinse repeat. Crazy fast exp, with friends, in a grindy sort of way. This is a version of an exp party. Leve-chaining is really underestimated.

So what you were seeing in chat was not necessary more conversation, it was also macros.

I get that having a perfect SATA + Distortion + Magic Burst combo was beautiful and elegant in a way that XIV's individual weapon skills were not. Oddly enough, that kind of coordination rarely translated over to the {sky}/{sea} era endgame fights in XI, where maybe 2 people out of an 18 man alliance are the Chosen DDs who got to perform a weapon skill, the black mage is relegated to Blizzard IV constantly, and the THF was allowed to tag the monster once and then kicked out the alliance to make room for another healer.

4-man seal farming parties in Abyssea brought back some of that elegance, too. One THF/DNC tank or WAR/NIN, one WHM/RDM, one BLM/BRD, and one BLU/NIN or BLU/RDM if there was a WAR/NIN. Of course, the number of jobs THAT setup locked out was depressing, but it was brutally efficient and quite lovely to see in action.

There's a lot of fun stuff from FFXI that I would love to see translate over, but exp parties isn't on the list. Limbus/Dynamis, open world enemies that you run around because they can do worse than hit you with heavy, gear that remains relevant for years, convoluted maze zones where noobs get lost on the way to fighting big monsters, people committing suicide to get a tractor/raise rather than navigate through those maze zones...

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Originally Posted by Bluevann

http://cdn.guildwork.net/albums/imag...6e57d92eda.jpg

At the first times, I think it was uh... 2008, maybe? Not sure.. SE introduced Level Sync to try and ease that. And for a while, it did work well.

http://cdn.guildwork.net/albums/imag...6e57d92ee5.jpg

But alas, it was only a temporary bandaid.

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Nobody said "Looking for Group" in FFXI

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Originally Posted by Cutie_McSnuggles

Not to be rude, but to me this still sounds like a FATE party. It seems like you are looking for certain types of players rather then certain types of activities.

To clarify, I never got to play XI so I'm genuinely interested in what it is that makes EXP parties something different then what we have in the game. So far the only real difference I've seen anyone use is "People talked more". (I can't say this without sounding offensive, sorry about that.) It kinda makes FFXI sound like a really fancy chat room with a combat mini game for when people run out of things to say.

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To give an example of how it would work in XIV: The regular open world mobs would be similar strength to lets say trash in coil. To kill them you would need to form a balanced party that would stand still in certain places in the area (camps) near to a spot where a group of these mobs would be. Somebody in the party (usually with a ranged ability) would run and "pull" one of these mobs back to the party for them to kill and the puller would then drop off to pull the next mob before the previous one dies in order to speed up the process and create exp chains.

The main difference was that you all had to pay attention and play your class properly, otherwise it could end up in a wipe.

(Ahhh how I do miss the dangerous open world.)

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Originally Posted by Quesse

Nobody said "Looking for Group" in FFXI

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Those drawings (and their translation to English) were made by SE's artists themselves. I guess in japanese, it translates best as "LFG" than "LFP".

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Originally Posted by Cutie_McSnuggles

Not to be rude, but to me this still sounds like a FATE party. It seems like you are looking for certain types of players rather then certain types of activities.

To clarify, I never got to play XI so I'm genuinely interested in what it is that makes EXP parties something different then what we have in the game. So far the only real difference I've seen anyone use is "People talked more". (I can't say this without sounding offensive, sorry about that.) It kinda makes FFXI sound like a really fancy chat room with a combat mini game for when people run out of things to say.

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Absolutely no offense taken- I always appreciate a well thought out response.

It would be unfair and dismissive for me to say 'Well, you just should have been there.' ...nostalgia is always funny like that. I'll do my best to explain: It's very different from FATEs in that FATEs have very limited time limits and parameters, where as xp party levelling was very freeform and there were no game mechanics that introduced artificial time/area/level constraints. You were also accompanied by much smaller groups- there were no 24+ player group zerg hordes running from time limited event to time limited event.
Enemies were also much more threatening to lone adventurers. Most of the time currently, a single character can solo a large amount of a FATE all by her/himself. Back then, any more than two or three mobs(or just 1 in XI!) was a death sentence. You actually needed your group to survive in the world. That also helped knit the community together.
I know these things seem small compared to the sweeping changes even after 2.0 landed-the small differences I've detailed really changed the entire feel of early to mid game play.

Also, I agree with you completely that the playerbase I'm interacting with now is very different. I'm lucky enough, however, to have a great group of people within a linkshell that I'm a part of. It's modestly sized, but the people are close and we do most, if not all, new content together. If not for them, I admit that I'd have stopped playing long ago. It's strange to me that lots of people go through the entire game essentially solo by relying only on DF and PF. Why would people like that even bother with an MMO, I wonder?

It does sound like one of those, "you had to be there" type of things. My current opinion is it doesn't matter one way or the other if they put it in or not. But I'm not sure I'll ever really understand it. The way most people are describing XI in this thread it sounds like a terrible game that I'd hate. But I know I'm not getting the whole picture. It would be like me trying to explain to someone why I love Dark Souls so much if all they ever hear me talk about is those times I had 500K souls and got one shot by a boss and then fell off a cliff on the way to pick them back up.

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Originally Posted by Cutie_McSnuggles

It does sound like one of those, "you had to be there" type of things. My current opinion is it doesn't matter one way or the other if they put it in or not. But I'm not sure I'll ever really understand it. The way most people are describing XI in this thread it sounds like a terrible game that I'd hate. But I know I'm not getting the whole picture. It would be like me trying to explain to someone why I love Dark Souls so much if all they ever hear me talk about is those times I had 500K souls and got one shot by a boss and then fell off a cliff on the way to pick them back up.

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Oh, Dark Souls, the game that had me simultaneously throwing my controller and singing it's praises.... You've pretty much nailed it with the analogy- it's a lot like that, I think.

XI and XIV 1.0 were both slow, methodical games that required a ton of patience that more modern gamers wouldn't tolerate. However, the things I loved about them had nothing to do with their slow battle systems- I love the faster pace/feel of ARR combat! Just not the hordes of faceless, mute players piled on top of every wimpy, toothless, nil-threat mob in the game.

I agree with the OP and what Maikal is saying/asking. A lot of ffxiv feels like a solo game.

Nostalgia aside, FFXI, hate however much some ppl here obviously do, it got one thing right in its vanilla years and up to Abysses: it found ways to force strangers to build chemistry. You had to rely on other ppl, a progression linkshell was a big deal, and just something as simple a EXP parties played a large part in that euphoria.

Now, for ppl against this, the common disdain will be:

- this isn't ffxi <-(no shit sherlock: this also isn't WoW but SE obviously copied a lot from WoW)
- you can already do that in FFXIV: not really, what's being requested here is that open world be made a bit more dangerous (which tbh might actually happen in new 50+ zones), also the reason for the danger increase is due to making open world mobs tougher (ai,skill, and hp wise) and give more exp on death. This is one of many methods to get ppl travelling in groups (which the game does need IMHO)

Leves suck, dungeons got old because you always knew what to expect, and fates are just derp. <- these are just my opinions so don't waste your time flaming me for them, I won't care.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WiXdeDM1_hE

This is a video I took of me killing robber crabs in kufta but I was over leveled. I was doing relic great sword trail kill 3000 crabs with a ws. I used my healer npc to help kill. See how there is a camp of crabs and you pull them one at a time. Also notice the combat. It takes me several auto attack swings to get 100 tp to use my WS.

A exp party was bascially this with 6 people.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cutie_McSnuggles

Not to be rude, but to me this still sounds like a FATE party. It seems like you are looking for certain types of players rather then certain types of activities.

To clarify, I never got to play XI so I'm genuinely interested in what it is that makes EXP parties something different then what we have in the game. So far the only real difference I've seen anyone use is "People talked more". (I can't say this without sounding offensive, sorry about that.) It kinda makes FFXI sound like a really fancy chat room with a combat mini game for when people run out of things to say.

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Hi Cutie,

To add to what Galliano and Stouter mentioned, a few things different from FATE Parties:

1. FATEs basically allow anyone to just join in. As a result of this, people don't really have to form parties (they can solo or just duo w/ their Chocobo). There's a sense of "isolation" or not needing to ever party w/ anyone to clear the FATEs (but of course you can if you want to).


2. FATEs are randomly spawned in the zone. While it keeps it interesting (to keep you looking at the map), it also means it's basically a wait-and-see game: See a FATE pop? Mad dash to get to it in time.

When FATEs were really popular early in 2.0, you probably remember seeing mad hordes of players just dashing from 1 FATE to another, slaughtering everything (face roll) and then waiting for the next one to pop. You never really settle in anywhere: Just be ready to run to the next FATE. (It also can be frustrating if you're in a large zone (like Coerthas), doing a FATE in the upper NE area only to see the next FATE spawn in Behemoth's Dominion, LOL. (Groan.))


3. Related to the above is that FATEs are timed. You have to run over and get to a FATE in time, or else it ends, and you have to wait. There's also downtime, when sometimes no FATE spawns for a while, or it's a lower level one in a zone that covers multiple level ranges (I know level sync helps, but it's still less EXP).


XI's Exp Parties were essentially finding a "camp" (area), where there were monsters that were appropriate level to yours and you'd be able to get great Exp off of them. The respawn rate was usually pretty high, so you'd be able to replenish and repeat.

The world mobs in XI were also tougher than current world mobs at your level, so it required a traditional party (Tank, Healer and DPS). I'd say it's kinda like fighting "Go! Go! Gorgimera" FATE (that Chimera clone) in Northern Thanalan (in terms of difficulty), but with a bit less HP. In other words, it wasn't just anyone can face-roll / kill Exp Camp mobs solo (death was a real possibility). You had to have a party to focus.

With "camping," it could get boring, sure, but it also meant more time in the social aspect (being able to chat with the party members), but also XI had a Party Combo System called "Skillchains" where you can coordinate and link certain Weaponskills sequentially, to cause various Elemental Bonus Damage, and then Mages could tack on a well-timed Magic spell to get a Magic Burst.

I can only speak for my server, but Skillchains added a lot of fun and coordination, and kept the interest level up for Exp Parties (you could mix and match various Skillchains / Magic Bursts, etc.). It's more player agency / freedom to engage vs. just the simple individual stuff we do now.

Also, Exp Parties were cool to utilize most areas in the world: FATEs are spread out, but they are always in the same circular spot in fixed parts of the map. With Exp Parties, if there are mobs that are viable all over the map, then any of those areas could be viable to camp in. And it's cool just being out in a certain area (feel like you're exploring a zone).

The social aspect: Perhaps it's a combination of the speed of leveling up now (fast), and anyone being able to Duty Finder / solo queue up for whatever they want to, but with that, there's no real need to get to know many players on your own server beyond your FC / LS. Compared with Exp parties because of the need to get Exp and hunker down in a steady camp spot, you got to start knowing more players (on your own server) and get to build friendships.

Lastly, to those who mention you can just do that now via Party Finder: It's true, but the rewards are awful. The Exp you get from Open World monsters are paltry compared to Dungeon leveling and FATEs, but it was done on purpose (since SE wanted players to experience those aspects over traditional Exp Parties).

Also, Party Finder Dungeon Parties are different because they pull from Cross-Server, and it's all about efficiency (get in and get out). You probably will never see them again, and thus have no reason or feeling to want to socialize.

Going forward, I think it's perfectly reasonable to have all 3 (FATE, Dungeon DF, Open World Exp Parties). I agree that I wouldn't want to see the return of XI's Exp Parties *Only* as the means to level up.

But as *another option* / viable way to level up? Sure, why not? It's all about choices, and SE took the time to make these beautiful zones and fill it with mobs. But currently outside of FATE spawned Mobs, these zones are just "window dressing": Worthless mobs that give you a tiny bit of Exp that make them more of a hindrance than anything.

Amazing post Kiara.

You hit the nail on the head. XIV needs this, back in the day it was what made logging in so fun, you never knew who you would meet, or what craziness would happen. Made a lot of friends just lvling jobs.

XIV is already a step ahead in that we already have lvl sync mechanic in place. All SE has to do is tweak mob density, location, HP(increase), and EXP(increase).

Even though I have everything 50, I'd even lvl sync to help others lvl if it meant zones being more exciting and camps were a thing. Otherwise its back to shout convos in mor dhona and DF groups full of mimes and bots repeating the same stuff ad infinitum.

It would be a well worth it additional option to pre existing lvling options.

I miss exp partys,but people on this game don't have the attention span to pull it off in this game. The lvling in this game is dull and requires very little focus it would be cool if ffxi style pts were a option,but i think itd be hard to fine the people whod be able to keep up at that pace in this game.

If you want to socialize, you will find ways to socialize. This is a personal issue and not something solved via any ingame system. The only reason it sorta worked in XI is it was such a slow game in all aspects. You had time to converse as you waited for the auto attack to build up your skillchain. Even if there was an area like the dunes in FFXIV, if people are training enemies to make this method efficient for leveling purposes (which is what you guys are asking for) then when would you have time to type and talk between using skills and pulling new mobs?

This game does not lend to this and even if it did, the people that would chose this method over all other methods of leveling will not be the kinds of people you are hoping to attract. it will be like hunt parties when they were "the best method" or FATE parties when it was "the best method". I know you guys have a soft spot for the archaic methods of leveling but the landscape has changed as well as its participants. There are some really well worded posts here explaining how to do it and reasons why but they are not taking a realistic approach and have some heavily tinted glasses on.

As it's said, If you want people of a like mindset to do this, they will do it for the social aspect, not necessarily for the exp gain because that is in effect the golden egg of this system you are holding up. Just go out, find a good FC and make some friends and play together. This was a HUGE thread way early on in ARR beta and at launch, SE replied then and I don't think the stance has changed. I'm terribly sorry about your luck but to make this work as you want it to would require many fundamentals of the game to be changed to accommodate it. FFXI is still going and if this is the system you hold above all others in this game, feel free to play FFXI or hold out for EQN (if that is even still coming) or some other company to make a more hardcore style of game where this is the system of choice.

EDIT:

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Originally Posted by Kiara

Going forward, I think it's perfectly reasonable to have all 3 (FATE, Dungeon DF, Open World Exp Parties). I agree that I wouldn't want to see the return of XI's Exp Parties *Only* as the means to level up.

But as *another option* / viable way to level up? Sure, why not? It's all about choices, and SE took the time to make these beautiful zones and fill it with mobs. But currently outside of FATE spawned Mobs, these zones are just "window dressing": Worthless mobs that give you a tiny bit of Exp that make them more of a hindrance than anything.

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This is a prime example of not understanding how todays landscape has changed. As i mentioned earlier about Hunts, once it was decided as the "best method" EVERYONE flocked to it, not because they liked the system but because it was the "best one". Players are always seeking the path of least resistance to getting what they want regardless of the fun factor. The go so far as to google the best cookie cutter way to do something and if you do it any other way you get ridiculed for doing it wrong. I'm not one of those people but the ones that do this drive the game. I wanted to do PvP or Dungeons during that time but I could not do any of that stuff until it was nerfed. I was reduced to doing solo content. It would take so much effort to balance out exp per hour based on levels, based on speed of killing, on an average party, then one party will come along and kill the system by having a party of all WHM's (or something) where they just roam through the whole zone steamrolling everything with Holy spam. Open world content is a lot harder to regulate then you think.

Your logic, black mage, also works against the current system implemented.

You state that the social aspect is a choice, not inherent in design. However this is false in a sense and easily proven by the argument you use in defense of players doing the "best" content.

The flaw in this logic is that the "best content" doesn't inherently create social experiences by its own design at the games current state, nor does it foster a social experience. Now to make a choice in most situations a human is presented a stimulus with conditions. If the existing conditions can be done solo (everyone having all crafts at 50 for example) then the social implications are not enforced.

Yes anyone can look at a stick and RP that its a boat amidst a devastating storm, etc. But to actually insert that situation into reality rather than relying on players imagination is a different thing altogether.

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Originally Posted by AreeyaJaidee

Your logic, black mage, also works against the current system implemented.

You state that the social aspect is a choice, not inherent in design. However this is false in a sense and easily proven by the argument you use in defense of players doing the "best" content.

The flaw in this logic is that the "best content" doesn't inherently create social experiences by its own design at the games current state, nor does it foster a social experience. Now to make a choice in most situations a human is presented a stimulus with conditions. If the existing conditions can be done solo (everyone having all crafts at 50 for example) then the social implications are not enforced.

Yes anyone can look at a stick and RP that its a boat amidst a devastating storm, etc. But to actually insert that situation into reality rather than relying on players imagination is a different thing altogether.

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Interesting way to interpret what I said. I was not in any way saying any systems are geared towards generating a social atmosphere. In fact, it looks like we agree that no content can force people to be social. That is entirely on the shoulders of the players and todays landscape of players does not lend itself to the kind of social community that was present in older games. My example of Hunts was not to show a good example of social systems at work but the opposite and to show what would happen to this system if it was implemented. If i was to hold ANY system up as a way to make people be more social it would be the FC system and all the stuff associated with that but even then, you will get lurkers and leeches. I don't think English is your first language or i am failing at communicating (most likely the latter) so I dont mind explaining things for you :)

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Originally Posted by MageBlack

If you want to socialize, you will find ways to socialize. This is a personal issue and not something solved via any ingame system. -snip- Even if there was an area like the dunes in FFXIV, people training enemies to make this method efficient for leveling purposes (which is what you guys are asking for) then when would you have time to type and talk between using skills and pulling new mobs?

-snip- [if added] it will be like hunt parties when they were "the best method" or FATE parties when it was "the best method" [turned into a hive of anger and resintment for the system because of how players chose to do it].

-snip- If you want people of a like mindset to do this, they will do it for the social aspect, not necessarily for the exp gain because that is in effect the golden egg of this system you are holding up. Just go out, find a good FC and make some friends and play together. This was a HUGE thread way early on in ARR beta and at launch, SE replied then and I don't think the stance has changed. I'm terribly sorry about your luck but to make this work as you want it to would require many fundamentals of the game to be changed to accommodate it [more than just more hp or more exp per mob].

-snip- As i mentioned earlier about Hunts, once it was decided as the "best method" EVERYONE flocked to it, not because they liked the system but because it was the "best one". Players are always seeking the path of least resistance to getting what they want regardless of the fun factor. -snip- It would take so much effort to balance out exp per hour based on levels, based on speed of killing, on an average party, then one party will come along and kill the system by having a party of all WHM's (or something equally stupid and out of the norm) where they just roam through the whole zone steamrolling everything with Holy spam. Open world content is a lot harder to regulate then you think.

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This was argued heavily when 2.0 launched. Yoshida does not want people leveling up doing things that are "Not Content" which were defined as Fates, Quest, and Dungeons. Aka this is a themepark you must do what the devs want you to in this game.

It would be a simple fix to make xp partys a thing, just raise the XP per mob kill cap, keep it the same as it is now for mobs = to you or slightly higher but increase it on mobs 7+levels higher up to a max of 800-1200xp per kill per player on mobs say 15-20+ levels above you and partys would be able to kill them for xp.

There is so much resistance in this and I really cannot understand how having this as an option is a bad thing even until this day. It promotes grouping and community... a hell of a lot more then fates which I feel are disliked by about the same majority of the community that dislikes party based leveling.

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Originally Posted by MageBlack

snippy snip

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Actually. I think reading comprehension is the culprit here. I am not in agreement with you, and my post firmly states that. (Although I believe you were actually being cynical/mocking in your post out of spite or prejudice to an opposing voice to your opinion (Which is base and uneeded).)

To simplify, FFXIV exists on the premise of a theme park as Xatsh has so nicely noted YoshiP for in her/his above post: As with anything regarding business, marketing is a largely contributing factor. Advertising is a good example of what I am referencing in defence to your stance on game content. Advertising knows very well what it takes to sell someone something for X price and make them like it or believe they liked spending their money on it. An MMO is no different.

Now let's add those two analogies together, a theme park and marketing/advertising:

FFXIV serves main attractions/themes to its player base. Some players are not asking for those rides to be torn down, rather more interesting concession stands to be added alongside the main attractions. Concession stands with appetizing food, which will make them feel like they have spent their time/money in an appropriate way. Now let's broaden that concession stand into the form of what is being requested in this thread. Instead of merely a concession stand, some ppl want a restaurant, complete with more options and a nice theme which enhances the social aspect of dining. <--- Dining can be done solo, however, incorporating elements that allow strangers to socialize over a meal, is more appealing to some than others.

This is the premise of EXP Camps. Players want the freedom to use the landscape in an adventurous way instead of viewing it as some static landscape with inherited functional yet unused aspects. They want to feel "alive" due to braving "danger" when journeying from one point of interest to another. Such an element creates its own meta game if implemented correctly.

So I do NOT agree that social engagement is purely on the players. I am of the opinion that it is more so a combination of content with the correct advertisement/mechanics which allow/enforce social interactions. As in commercialism, it is by design. We humans are simple in some things, and our attraction to entertainment devices are one of those areas in which we are easily attracted to if the design is very well done/thought out.

I love your idea as I really enjoyed farm parties in Lineage II, where you met lot of strangers and exped together for hours. Unfortunately it isn't possible I think, FATEs are really viable and no mob killing will be on par with it even if they improved it, I guess.

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Originally Posted by AreeyaJaidee

-snip-

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I see. Can you picture a exp grind party in FFXIV? When would you have an opportunity to talk with a 3sec global cooldown if you wish to maintain exp gain at a consistent rate?

I'm not against EXP grind parties, I just dont see them fostering an environment that will lend itself to social exchange. What I am worried about is players abusing the system (like they do with any other system they find loopholes in) taking away from the enjoyment of other content. The other rides in FFXIV are controlled and easy to adjust, open world free for all is a bit trickier.

EDIT:
Also, I do now understand better what you were trying to say about systems and social aspects. You are correct that it is not entirely on the players to do this, they do need an avenue that allows people to be social. Like the FC, Linkpearl, and Party Finder systems. These are great for social networking in game. i also get that lots of people dont bother talking or become abusive in dungeons because of the fact you will probably never see them again. It hasnt stopped me from being social in dungeons, cracking wise, and communicating with my fellow adventurers. Sometimes it is sad that I cant group up with them outside the dungeon or do more dungeon runs with them but I like this system rather than having queue times even longer cause they are strictly server based. If i want that, i can create a party finder party for this purpose.

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Originally Posted by AreeyaJaidee

Snip!(But all still very relevant!)
So I do NOT agree that social engagement is purely on the players. I am of the opinion that it is more so a combination of content with the correct advertisement/mechanics which allow/enforce social interactions.

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So much this.

What we need is party bonus on Leves again. Something like +10% exp for every linked Leve.
Linked Leve is if 2 or more in a party have the same Leve and start them together as one. So if now all 8 have the same Leve that would be +80% exp bonus.

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Originally Posted by MageBlack

snip.

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Do I picture it? Yes I do. What else do I picture? The reality that there is time between pulls and surely some ppl will want to pace things or take breaks. Also, many players use VoIP and are more than happy to let strangers hop into a temporary voice chat just to grind out exp if the want arises.

Loop holes? Worry? <- A theme park exists with many rides, because ppl like choice. You can't just oppose the addition of future rides because you personally love your Super Slide Mega Ride of Doom. LMAO (tangent there, sorry).

Main Story cements dungeons. Relics cement dungeons, fates, and leves, and hunts(kinda for seals). There are game elements in place that make all content required. EXP camp can in no way detract from these or make them irrelevant because they are all REQUIRED to complete the story Arch and Relic progression. I mean if were going to go this route this lets take the golden saucer out of FFXIV since its not essential to main story elements and detracts from DF Que times.

What some people are saying is that leveling in DF and Fates and Leves is bullshit. It's crap, all of it in my personal opinion. If I wanna level then I don't care about dungeon mechanics when I'm leveling. I care about leveling.

So the next logical question is, how does this effect skill advancement amongst the community? I can tell you one thing from personal experience of running ALOT of content for relic/zodiac weapons... dungeons are NOT making better players, nor better skilled players. You can faceroll Brayflox Longstop and Aurum Vale ALL DAY if you want, and still wipe like a newbcake on T5.

However, IT IS possible to make mobs more engaging with the right AI. All you need to practice a rotation is a mob to hit with AoEs to dodge. That's about the same amount of learning you will get in all these derpy dungeons ppl are having to spam.

People already have implemented a form of EXP camping IN dungeons via PF: Darkhold first room pulls. (This is what people want, EXP at a pace they decide).

People want more open world. Players of previous MMOs all came from a Open World environment, it's what we know and love/hate.

We are in a different generation of players. The era of FFXI has passed.

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Originally Posted by AreeyaJaidee

-snip-

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I'm not against it, just bringing a different perspective to the conversation. Sorry if i seem aggressive, angry, or completely against it, that is not the case. I just foresee more issues than solutions with this. That and the director of the game said they werent going to do it and this horse has already been beaten to death many times over. Good luck in your fight for this system though.

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Originally Posted by Twilite

We are in a different generation of players. The era of FFXI has passed.

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And what generation would that be? COD? WoW?

FFXIV isn't either of those. No one is asking for FFXI either, only making suggestions of implementations. SE has already made it apparent that they aren't above implementing gameplay elements from other successful games within the MMO genre.

You're comment is absurd. FFXI is being used as a reference. Others posting here have also referenced Lineage II, and Everquest. yet you decided to explicitly write "The era of FFXI has passed."

Seems to me that YOU are the one with a bias here. A bias against FFXI lmao, which is a very successful MMO product by SE.

When SEs next MMO product comes out, will you play that and go on their forums and deny any improvements because you believe it to be "outdated ways of doing things from a bygone era"? I doubt it. Hope off the band wagon man, stretch your legs and walk on your own it feels good.

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Originally Posted by MageBlack

I'm not against it, just bringing a different perspective to the conversation. Sorry if i seem aggressive, angry, or completely against it, that is not the case. I just foresee more issues than solutions with this. That and the director of the game said they werent going to do it and this horse has already been beaten to death many times over. Good luck in your fight for this system though.

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I'm not really fighting for this system. I'm just jumping in to help because I know the gratification that can come from EXP Camping.

The thing I AM fighting against though, is people who have always been on this forum jumping into threads and saying NO to every new implementation request for things that don't even inherently have any bad qualities about them. It's arguing for arguing sake.

It isn't as if the OP is asking for something absurd. That's what I don't understand about the opposition to this. It isn't an absurd request. It's a time tested game element that could be implemented easily with a new flair.

But as usual, some one is going to disagree, it's only natural. Can't have order without chaos.

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Originally Posted by Bluevann

Those drawings (and their translation to English) were made by SE's artists themselves. I guess in japanese, it translates best as "LFG" than "LFP".

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I think the drawings were actually commissioned to the guy who does VG Cats.

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Originally Posted by Nanaho

im not asking for it to be popular i just want the option. if you try to do an EXP PArty these days you get like 100 EXP per mob, it's not viable, i just want it to be viable as something to do when youre tired of Fates and dungeons. running a scripted line pattern for EXP over and over isnt fun to me. running around smashing face of all the mobs in an area appeals to me

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Try spiritbonding. It's exactly what you're looking for.
Remember that even if they added it as an option, you'd come back here complaining that no one is doing it.
Players like having goals, and achieving those goals. People keep talking about FFXI's Records of Eminence being a massive boost to exp, but really miss the point of what it ACTUALLY tempts you to do:
See, those RoEs ARE repeatable, but you only get the sizeable prize of EXP once every few in-game days or so, much longer than it takes to actually do them. However, there are MANY different RoEs, and you get a big bonus the first time you complete them.
Does this sound familiar? It should. It's basically the Soldiery bonus we have.
And again, I am speaking as someone who has played some of the grindiest of games that followed FFXI and EQ1's exp gain models.
Yes, being able to shoot the breeze and enjoy time with friends is a plus, but you can already do that via the party finder. Just set a goal and throw it into the PF. You'll probably be LFM as long as you were in FFXI.
Which brings me to my next point: The MAJOR downside of exp parties and the precise reason why the very idea of a game not having a DF or PF system in this day and age is as foreign as not having WASD movement is the wait times.
Please don't kid yourself and think most people WANTED to sit in one spot for hours and hours waiting for the chance to spend hours and hours killing the exact same mobs for exp. I remember back in those days the massive amount of complaining going around that dungeons felt like actual dungeons intended to trap players, not something you explored and battled your way to the end to defeat a strong enemy. No, dungeons back then consisted of finding a safe spot in some corner and pulling enemies to kill over and over. The only dude who got to do anything resembling exploring was the guy pulling.
In addition, people seem to have selective memory. Sure, you got parties full of talkative people, but you were equally likely to get parties full of elitist pricks who never said a word and left parties without warning. Kinda like FATE parties. We just see the past with rose-colored glasses.
See, players like actually *doing* things when they play a game. Sitting around LFG is a very unattractive option, and if they add mob EXP groups, unless it is WAY more efficient than FATEs, then the only people who would do it are the same people you can, right now, convince to join you on a few dungeons/trials/etc. by putting up a PF and advertising.
And again if you WANT to camp things for hours on end and shoot the breeze with fellow like-minded players, there's always spiritbonding.

Make it happen again, SE. Bring back the old glory of leve parties ^^
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKbREpsGN-s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHxKHkF6wf0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EyoMaeV9hG4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Img3a-T0Sb8

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

way back during ARR's development Yoshi-P specifically stated he wanted to avoid old style FFXI exp parties and move players over to what he termed 'content based exp'. So, it's pretty clear SE considers the old FFXI style of exp parties an outdated relic from an old age.

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Well, since the hundred of trash quests and fate are worse than the xp pt of old, it would have been better if he didn't say anything.

Old exp parties: go to a place, kill lots of mobs for exp, move to a different place, kill different mobs for exp.

FATE parties: go to a place, kill lots of mobs for exp, move to a different place, kill different mobs for exp.

What exactly are you asking for again?

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Originally Posted by Cabalabob

Old exp parties: go to a place, kill lots of mobs for exp, move to a different place, kill different mobs for exp.

FATE parties: go to a place, kill lots of mobs for exp, move to a different place, kill different mobs for exp.

What exactly are you asking for again?

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Old exp parties didn't involve going to a different place.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Ignoring the fact that was the main thing I hated about FFXI (goddess I still have nightmares about 'dooms parties' - hells FFXIV even makes fun of the time wasted exp grinding in parties in FFXI (in the description for the Smallshell minion)!), way back during ARR's development Yoshi-P specifically stated he wanted to avoid old style FFXI exp parties and move players over to what he termed 'content based exp'. So, it's pretty clear SE considers the old FFXI style of exp parties an outdated relic from an old age.

Of course, nothing is stopping you preforming a party for a dungeon in Party Finder, or gathering up people and doing FATE parties, but you probably won't get much interest for a full FFXI style exp party system I'm afraid.

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Let me show y'all why EXP parties shouldn't exist:
http://i60.tinypic.com/2585wsp.jpg
http://i60.tinypic.com/besepw.jpg

Those lalafells are ALL bots in the same party-chain

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Originally Posted by Cabalabob

Old exp parties: go to a place, kill lots of mobs for exp, move to a different place, kill different mobs for exp.

FATE parties: go to a place, kill lots of mobs for exp, move to a different place, kill different mobs for exp.

What exactly are you asking for again?

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The difference is the frequency of movement. FATEs have you moving all the time, and while it's usually the same 4 tasks or so with different names, it's still different than sitting in one place killing the exact same mobs for hours.
Plus that's sort of the point I've been trying to make: We already have "old style" EXP parties, they just use game mechanics to make them more interesting than sitting in one place beating down the EXACT same mobs over and ove. Everyone's moving, everyone's taking action.

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Originally Posted by KisaiTenshi

Let me show y'all why EXP parties shouldn't exist:

Those lalafells are ALL bots in the same party-chain

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And here's the practical reason why they don't exist.
Give them the option, and RMTers will exploit it for all it's worth.

And legions of lalafel bots aren't currently farming away as we speak? It's a whole different conversation, admittedly, but saying 'botters might abuse the system' isn't exactly a valid excuse to not implement a new system or offer more varied choices- considering the already overwhelming issues this game has with RMT.

The truth is, I absolutely do not expect open world exp parties to make a comeback in XIV anytime soon, if ever. Popular gaming trends have changed. That doesn't mean it isn't a great idea and that the people that value that kind of gameplay don't have valid input. Just because a thing isn't popular, doesn't mean that it isn't worthy.

I would love to see EXP parties to make a triumphant return. Open world is useless after hitting level cap, why even bother rendering beautiful landscapes with varied mob species if they're just something you run aggro from?

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Originally Posted by Maikal

And legions of lalafel bots aren't currently farming away as we speak? It's a whole different conversation, admittedly, but saying 'botters might abuse the system' isn't exactly a valid excuse to not implement a new system or offer more varied choices- considering the already overwhelming issues this game has with RMT.

The truth is, I absolutely do not expect open world exp parties to make a comeback in XIV anytime soon, if ever. Popular gaming trends have changed. That doesn't mean it isn't a great idea and that the people that value that kind of gameplay don't have valid input. Just because a thing isn't popular, doesn't mean that it isn't worthy.

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The open-world exp parties are exactly the thing RMT bots would, and did in V1.0. In fact someone found what I think was an exploit in V1.0 that allowed unlimited party size on one levequest, and that's exactly what you're seeing in the screenshot... and not the first MMORPG that has had that kind of bug.

The existing mechanics in FFXIV work fine, and the only thing it could really use is a Dynamic "Raid Party" which you select a target, hit "raid invite" and it invites everyone targeting the same enemy into a 24 person raid.

Areeya err calm down. My comment wasn't intended to induce a heart attack.

People asked for that in Alpha - and their answer was FATEs.