So what's the purpose of making i95 crafted weapons so hard to make?

In FFXIV vanity gear is super duper rare and pricey.....

In other MMOs... they hand it out like candy.....

That's SE for you... they just have to be different, even if it makes no real sense.

Since its usually the casuals/RP'ers who want most of the vanity stuff, SE sure is telling them to take a hike by making it so hard to get that only hardcore/ultra rich players will ever see a Coeurl Bikini or sleepset, etc.

Sort of confused just what they really expect to happen long term when casual players get tired of not being able to get "casual" aka "noncombat" gear and move elsewhere......

The weapons aren't worth the price at all. Maybe if they made their power comparable to the other iLvl.95 Tidal Wave weapons (not the same, but comparable), then it'd be worth.

In other words, it's the price of glamour, which is the dev's methodology of making stuff not obsolete.

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Originally Posted by Jasiwel

The weapons aren't worth the price at all. Maybe if they made their power comparable to the other iLvl.95 Tidal Wave weapons (not the same, but comparable), then it'd be worth.

In other words, it's the price of glamour, which is the dev's methodology of making stuff not obsolete.

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They're stronger than Tidal weapons i95 if you meld them. Vanity is for the rich and vain, as it should be.

Because Yoshi hates crafters/gatherers.

Same reason you need to blow milions for vanity armors or the iLevel 95 gathering weapon requires you to blow 3m at least.

They need the crafters to have something to do without being active in the end-game scene.

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Originally Posted by WeiShan

ilv110 is the candy.
Lol...what happened to this game,

They just killed XI, now they come to kill XIV

If it keeps going in this direction,the game will be a joke

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You remind me of Akiza. Doom and gloom all day.

I kind of like the ridiculousness of it. Gil sinks and long-term buyable/sellable item goals have been few and far between in this game. In XI, Adaman Hauberk was the grail for heavy melees, but there was a lot of satisfaction with saving up and buying a Hauberk/Haubergeon +1 for yourself as well; for smiths, making and selling one was great as well. Not saying these primal weapons are an exact corollary to the Haub in my example, but there are some favorable similarities.

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Originally Posted by RegnumMagik

- Primal weapons takes either too much time or too much money to make.

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They are not meant to be equipped, same as with "Elite" GC Equipment. 1700 seals is an equivalent of 2 sands for ilvl*70* weapon. But many of them looks rather nice.

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Originally Posted by TheRogueX

Hence why vanity items from fishing are almost impossible to get. Hence why the glamour system in general favors the rich and can't even be used until you have a level 50 character anyway.

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SE turned glamour system into fashion system. There are cheap items, and there are expensive ones. Some of them *very* expensive. It keeps people busy and economy alive.

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Originally Posted by Caraway

Despite making an engaging crafting system, SE does not like crafters.

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"Relevant battle-crafting" leads to abuse as we saw in 2.0. This is why "battle-oriented" crafting is nerfed with each phase, people just tends to abuse system to get early advantage in raids. And overall it's not good when you can "pay 2 win" through content.

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Originally Posted by Xatsh

Issue is it is all for vanity.

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And vanity is a huge market. People like good-looking stuff. And some of them have a lot of money to spend.

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Originally Posted by Xatsh

They need to release these new weapons at the start of patches and make the HQ ones for example in patch 2.2 I105 with materia equivalent to the 110 ones. Make crafting have a reason to exist, make the money have some real value outside of getting a pillow to sit on or having a fancy glowing glamour.

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Crafting of battle gear was nerfed in 2.2-2.3 and it have nothing to do with RMT and such. People just abuse crafting to get overgear as soon after the patch as possible to roll-over content. And this have nothing to do with "skill-based" progression which Yoshi-P tries to establish.

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Originally Posted by Alx789

So, i have no reason to buy it.

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I'm rather poor - I only have 15 mil gil. But I like to spent my gil on fashion items occasionally. For example I bought elite maelstrom bow even though it have insane pricetag of 1700 seals.
The problem here in lack of understanding that some items are not meant for everyone. Bugatti Veyron is not you usual budget class car. But these super-expensive items keep downflow of money and thus preventing raising in-game gini coef too high and also liven up economy.

15 mil is not rather poor. Talk to me when you're still stuck @ 300k.

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Originally Posted by Exstal

4 pages and people didn't say the reason; it's supposed to be rare.

You don't use the weapon for actual use, you use it to look pretty. Which is why the ability to HQ was comical to me.

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No. This isn't an acceptable reason. It's like the lame costs of GC iLvl 70 Allied Seals gear. If it's just meant to "look pretty," they shouldn't even bother giving it stats if it's not going to be equivalent to the best items in the game. Especially if it going to be this pointlessly hard to get.

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Originally Posted by Caraway

It's honestly disappointing because while SE's crafted a rather fun and well designed crafting system (not just click and win, hurrah!) they made it so that crafting is only relevant as a means of making vanity.

I'm not sure if it is entirely Yoshi-P or because of the "hardcore elite snowflakes" but this game refuses to make crafting even a viable progression alternative. Crafting is *useful* (outside of fluff) for leveling a new job and giving them HQ gear. But once you're 50? Everything you can make as a crafter can be acquired with less effort as an adventurer. And I for one think that's wrong.

I have an armoursmith to 50, got my HQ 55 gear and then just stopped. I saw how much work goes into the new gear and what the value of that gear was and I just washed my hands of it.

I get the most enjoyment out of crafting things that people use. I crafted stuff for myself and stuff for my friends. But once we got to 50? Why bother? It'll cost so much to make something actually usable (again, outside of glamour) when we can just do some really easy dungeons for equivalent or better gear.

Despite making an engaging crafting system, SE does not like crafters.

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^This. I'm not sure where the end-game crafter hate comes from, but it's stupid.

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Originally Posted by axemtitanium

People are mistaking vanity for "easy to get". Look at the rich and famous people in real life. They spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on cosmetics and vanity products. When was the last time a diamond necklace was useful for something other than looking pretty? Vanity items in this game are expensive and hard to get BECAUSE they're useless, not the other way around.

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Except for the fact that, your entire argument falls apart when you compare the game to the real world. Vanity systems in games aren't just used for rare, otherwise useless trinkets. Look at the cost of the Spring Dress, the Sailor clothes, etc. Explain to me why there are no LOWER QUALITY, LOWER RARITY dresses, clothes, etc. You know, like in the real world.

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Originally Posted by Buff_Archer

I get that vanity should be rare.

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Why? There should be instances of rare and hard to get vanity items, sure. But not ALL vanity should be rare and expensive.

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Originally Posted by axemtitanium

They're stronger than Tidal weapons i95 if you meld them. Vanity is for the rich and vain, as it should be.

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See above.

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Originally Posted by Felessan

They are not meant to be equipped, same as with "Elite" GC Equipment.

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So why bother giving them stats and an iLvl at all?

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Originally Posted by Felessan

SE turned glamour system into fashion system. There are cheap items, and there are expensive ones. Some of them *very* expensive. It keeps people busy and economy alive.

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This is a laughable attempt to justify SE's ridiculously bad vanity system. Oh, and there are no 'cheap' vanity-specific items.

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Originally Posted by Felessan

I'm rather poor - I only have 15 mil gil. But I like to spent my gil on fashion items occasionally. For example I bought elite maelstrom bow even though it have insane pricetag of 1700 seals.
The problem here in lack of understanding that some items are not meant for everyone. Bugatti Veyron is not you usual budget class car. But these super-expensive items keep downflow of money and thus preventing raising in-game gini coef too high and also liven up economy.

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lol! 15mil is poor? What!? That's the lamest thing I've heard for quite some time! I've never even broken 1mil! Anyway, there is no "lack of understanding" here. The Bugatti Veyron is definitely not your usual budget class car. However, this game doesn't have a budget-class of vanity gear. Therein lies the problem.

There was one of these threads that came up that an SE rep actually responded to. I don't remember the exact wording but basically... their game design decision is that the best gear will be a reward for completing content. ie, dungeon drops, coil drops, etc.

Personally, I 100% support this. I hate games where being geared depends on being rich.

Right now, to be geared, all you have to do is be reasonably skilled at killing stuff. How it should be IMO.

And, anyway, before this crafters complained everything was too easy...

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

There was one of these threads that came up that an SE rep actually responded to. I don't remember the exact wording but basically... their game design decision is that the best gear will be a reward for completing content. ie, dungeon drops, coil drops, etc.

Personally, I 100% support this. I hate games where being geared depends on being rich.

Right now, to be geared, all you have to do is be reasonably skilled at killing stuff. How it should be IMO.

And, anyway, before this crafters complained everything was too easy...

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It takes no skill to be decked out in i110 atm, the only thing you can argue is the i115 weapon in t9. These primal weapons are useless and its a joke to even call it vanity. I pay 1/5 of that for my Novus.

Not saying the current systems don't have issues, but ilvl isn't everything. You can still only get high allagan gear through second coil, etc. And for soldiery gear, at least they're killing dungeon and open world bosses... instead of this much worse scenario: farming for stuff to sell so they can buy the next level of gear.

My main point: I support the design of a system that depends on players actually playing their class (basically, adventuring) to get gear.

Sure, throw the crafters some things to work on long term (like this), but I hope it's never relevant for hard content like ex primals and SCoB...

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Originally Posted by TheRogueX

Why? There should be instances of rare and hard to get vanity items, sure. But not ALL vanity should be rare and expensive.

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http://xivdb.com/?item/8563/Oval-Spectacles
lv 1 item, purely vanity, made from easy to acquire mats

http://xivdb.com/?item/8534/Lord%27s-Yukata-(Blueflame)
seasonal event quest reward, purely vanity, everyone gets one

http://xivdb.com/?item/8541/Straw-Capeline
fieldcraft demimateria I is about 5k a pop on my server. ~30k tops to acquire this lv 1 purely vanity item

http://xivdb.com/?recipe/1909/Glacial-Coat
chinchilla hide is ~500g per on my server.

http://xivdb.com/?recipe/1935/Light-Steel-Galerus
light steel plate is ~1k per on my server, coke is ~7k per. 80k tops for this vanity piece.

http://xivdb.com/?recipe/1926/Sailor-Shirt
mariner cloth is ~5k on my server.

There is vanity for all price ranges, you're just not looking for them (or conveniently ignoring them).

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

Not saying the current systems don't have issues, but ilvl isn't everything. You can still only get high allagan gear through second coil, etc. And for soldiery gear, at least they're killing dungeon and open world bosses... instead of this much worse scenario: farming for stuff to sell so they can buy the next level of gear.

My main point: I support the design of a system that depends on players actually playing their class (basically, adventuring) to get gear.

Sure, throw the crafters some things to work on long term (like this), but I hope it's never relevant for hard content like ex primals and SCoB...

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Except, there are many classes that has shit stats on their High Allagan gear. And how is facerolling hunt any better than farming for items to sell/craft?
Hardmode and Extreme Primals are still a big gate to a good amount of people. You're telling me it's good that people can just spam click 1 2 3 and get i110 and people who farm countless hours on fights that people still sucks at and gets i95? Surely you can't be serious.

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Originally Posted by RegnumMagik

Except, there are many classes that has shit stats on their High Allagan gear. And how is facerolling hunt any better than farming for items to sell/craft?
Hardmode and Extreme Primals are still a big gate to a good amount of people. You're telling me it's good that people can just spam click 1 2 3 and get i110 and people who farm countless hours on fights that people still sucks at and gets i95? Surely you can't be serious.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

Not saying the current systems don't have issues [...]

My main point: I support the design of a system that depends on players actually playing their class (basically, adventuring) to get gear.

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All that said, yeah, you need a mix of high allagan and soldiery gear for BiS.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

All that said, yeah, you need a mix of high allagan and soldiery gear for BiS.

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Except, BIS isnt set in stones. For my case I only need two pieces of High Allagan Gear, which can easily be swapped out to soldiery gear. The stat difference isn't that huge unless you're a min-maxer, which is definitely not the majority of this game.

The biggest thing that SCoB provide is challenge, gear is just a side-grade.

Re: an earilier point, if there were no rarity to vanity items if would kind of defeat the purpose of distinguishing yourself from other people.

Ooh that looks cool, let me go get one off the marketboard for 1250 Gil!

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Originally Posted by RegnumMagik

Except, BIS isnt set in stones. For my case I only need two pieces of High Allagan Gear, which can easily be swapped out to soldiery gear. The stat difference isn't that huge unless you're a min-maxer, which is definitely not the majority of this game.

The biggest thing that SCoB provide is challenge, gear is just a side-grade.

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It's a good point, but that's a detail. I agree, hunts need to be adjusted, there are other things that could be much better, etc etc. But step back from that for a second and look at the big picture. Some games, mostly older titles these days, you need to grind (or lets be honest... a lot of people buy) gold/gil/whatever to get the best gear.

Having played some of those games, I am very very thankful SE made the decision where we get gear directly from playing an adventuring class.

Hopefully the specifics will get better but I hope they don't change the model; I don't want crafting to ever provide top tier gear for noncrafting classes.

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Originally Posted by Buff_Archer

Re: an earilier point, if there were no rarity to vanity items if would kind of defeat the purpose of distinguishing yourself from other people.

Ooh that looks cool, let me go get one off the marketboard for 1250 Gil!

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Uhm... what?

Mix and match (even battle gear counts), dye, change hair style and color. Really, you don't need to have items gated behind a massive grind to have a look you're comfortable with.

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Originally Posted by Alukah

Uhm... what?

Mix and match (even battle gear counts), dye, change hair style and color. Really, you don't need to have items gated behind a massive grind to have a look you're comfortable with.

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There's varying degrees of rarity, and there are plenty of common, uncommon, and somewhat-rare items available for glamour. Just about anything in your armory chest can be used for glamour really, my Scholar's glamour has gotten quite a bit of attention with the main element distinguishing it being a very creative dying of a certain garment that any lvl 50 healer has probably had pass through their inventory at one time or another. That doesn't mean I agree with how retarded-rare they've made these i95 weapons though, it seems like a waste of development resources putting this and the dyable AF gear in the game when you look at the ratio of people that will be able to obtain it vs. not.

Real life example: I paid more for a luxury convertible because I wanted something fun and enjoyable that stands out- call me vain. If there were a $30k car that sold in high volume and looked identical to it, I would have picked something different. And some people have the means to buy $300k+ sports cars (I'm not one of them) and that's all well and good. Problem is, relatively speaking the cost of these i95 weapons is akin to paying as much as it would cost for a jumbo jet to get a roadster.

My money is placed on somebody high up in SE having access to a gil farm and are selling gil while having their competition get banned.

Almost every aspect of the new stuff is gated behind huge time-sinks and can only be obtained through weeks of grinding or burning through millions of gil.

I miss the old umbral rock days when if you wanted something nice you had to grind for it.

FFXIV is a MMORPG. Which means you can, and should, acquire gear through cooperation with other players - and more specifically your friends.

In order to get our Garuda weapons, my FC leveled separated desynth jobs to cover all possible drops (BSM, ALC, GSM, CRP), which takes about two hours to get at a decent level if you can spare ~200k (and the server I'm on is rather expensive). Then, we made a party and farmed a few dozen weapons: Garuda can be done in about 3 minutes per run, counting the loading times and stuff.

Result : 6 vortex demimaterias, 3 battlecraft III and a few other items worth 100k+. Sure, you can't make weapons for everyone in an evening of farming, but point is you don't need weeks to get your shiny if you're going to work towards it seriously.

Conclusion : it's rather easy to obtain if you're actually willing to organize, cooperate with your FC and not play a MMORPG solo.

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Originally Posted by Bellandy

FFXIV is a MMORPG. Which means you can, and should, acquire gear through cooperation with other players - and more specifically your friends.

In order to get our Garuda weapons, my FC leveled separated desynth jobs to cover all possible drops (BSM, ALC, GSM, CRP), which takes about two hours to get at a decent level if you can spare ~200k (and the server I'm on is rather expensive). Then, we made a party and farmed a few dozen weapons: Garuda can be done in about 3 minutes per run, counting the loading times and stuff.

Result : 6 vortex demimaterias, 3 battlecraft III and a few other items worth 100k+. Sure, you can't make weapons for everyone in an evening of farming, but point is you don't need weeks to get your shiny if you're going to work towards it seriously.

Conclusion : it's rather easy to obtain if you're actually willing to organize, cooperate with your FC and not play a MMORPG solo.

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My FC is created with a group of friends, when we do have time we're tackling t9 together. I'm not gonna waste our practice time or take away their work time just so I can get a weapon for myself.

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Originally Posted by Bellandy

FFXIV is a MMORPG.

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... Is it?

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Originally Posted by RegnumMagik

My FC is created with a group of friends, when we do have time we're tackling t9 together. I'm not gonna waste our practice time or take away their work time just so I can get a weapon for myself.

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So you have three solutions:

- Work as a team: less effort, guaranteed rewards, no monetary investment required
- Work as a half-team (4+ people): a bit more luck-based but with same advantages as above
- PUG everything: still doable, but will require a significant amount of time

So I don't see what the problem is here. It's just glamour, why do you need to have it RIGHT NOW?

I, for one, am quite happy that there's not a bunch of people running around with their primal weapons and complaining that there's nothing to do since 2.3 wasn't exactly a high-end content patch.

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Originally Posted by Taruranto

... Is it?

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Judging from most posts on this forum, I wonder as well sometimes.

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Originally Posted by Bellandy

So you have three solutions:

- Work as a team: less effort, guaranteed rewards, no monetary investment required
- Work as a half-team (4+ people): a bit more luck-based but with same advantages as above
- PUG everything: still doable, but will require a significant amount of time

So I don't see what the problem is here. It's just glamour, why do you need to have it RIGHT NOW?

I, for one, am quite happy that there's not a bunch of people running around with their primal weapons and complaining that there's nothing to do since 2.3 wasn't exactly a high-end content patch.



Judging from most posts on this forum, I wonder as well sometimes.

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I didnt ask for right now, however with the amount of RNG involved I may never ever have the chance to get it. Unless someone does the dirty work for me.

Oh. My. God. There are people here WITHOUT their moggle weapon?! Lmfao!
http://i.imgur.com/4gaddke.jpg

You wanna know what I did? I sold primal carries to buy the ten battlemateria and I sat my ass in moggle mog HM for about 5 hrs straight just so I had a slim chance to get a weapon. After 50+ clears the moggle fists dropped and I desynthed them. You know what happened? They broke so I had to do it all again but eventually three demimateria dropped. If you really want these weapons you either need to pay up or do the stuff yourself.

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Originally Posted by Impure

Oh. My. God. There are people here WITHOUT their moggle weapon?! Lmfao!
http://i.imgur.com/4gaddke.jpg

You wanna know what I did? I sold primal carries to buy the ten battlemateria and I sat my ass in moggle mog HM for about 5 hrs straight just so I had a slim chance to get a weapon. After 50+ clears the moggle fists dropped and I desynthed them. You know what happened? They broke so I had to do it all again but eventually three demimateria dropped. If you really want these weapons you either need to pay up or do the stuff yourself.

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Meanwhile I'm on my 14th hour, 90 alchemist, over 200 commendations earned. And not a single Demimateria of Crags. And also non on Market.

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Originally Posted by TeaTimeBear

15 mil is not rather poor. Talk to me when you're still stuck @ 300k.

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You are _very_ poor((

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Originally Posted by TheRogueX

So why bother giving them stats and an iLvl at all?

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To sweeten pill a bit?

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Originally Posted by TheRogueX

This is a laughable attempt to justify SE's ridiculously bad vanity system. Oh, and there are no 'cheap' vanity-specific items.

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This shows that you know nothing about fashion trends in FF14 :cool:
Vintage doublet priced at 4.5k. It's very cheap and very popular vanity item. Patrician Bottoms 15k. Sailor shirt at 20k. Spring dress is 150k.
And 150k is considered to be on a cheap side in this game as you can earn 200+k in a week just doing roulettes, challenge logs, beastman tribe quests etc.

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Originally Posted by TheRogueX

lol! 15mil is poor? What!? That's the lamest thing I've heard for quite some time! I've never even broken 1mil! Anyway, there is no "lack of understanding" here. The Bugatti Veyron is definitely not your usual budget class car. However, this game doesn't have a budget-class of vanity gear. Therein lies the problem.

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You know, even budget-class cars don't priced at 100$.
15mil gil is a mediocre amount of money, I would put it at "middle class". And less than 1 mil is just below living standards.
I know people who are rich/super-rich with 50-200+ millions of gil and for them spending several millions is nothing. Some LS buddy just gifted me an 300k vanity item other day and I'm not related to him besides being in same LS. But he is full 3* crafter, so for him it's not really a big deal.

The same situation you can see in minions. Some of them are very cheap. Some of them goes for millions (bluebird, opo-opo, nutkin etc). And they are even less visible than vanity gear as many just forget to summon them often. But they are fancy cute things, so prices do not go down, and often just go up (bluebird went from 600k 3 months ago to 1.5mil now on my server).

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Originally Posted by Felessan

You are _very_ poor((.

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Hey now, i never said that was what MY wallet looked like.

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Originally Posted by axemtitanium

They're stronger than Tidal weapons i95 if you meld them. Vanity is for the rich and vain, as it should be.

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Ah, I see now. I was wondering why they were so weak, but totally didn't realize you could meld them. My mistake. :S

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Originally Posted by TeaTimeBear

Hey now, i never said that was what MY wallet looked like.

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My bad, I'm very sorry