Change Pharos Sirius Difficulty or Remove it from Duty Roulette please......

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Originally Posted by Max_Damade

SE went to a tremendous amount of effort for both Pharos Sirius and King Moogle, but people aren't finding the rewards worth the effort.
It's sad really.

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Maybe SE will realize the monster the created with Ilvl one of these days.

They have constrained themselves to a linear progression and anything that can be skipped and is even marginally difficult will become "Obsolete" and skipped for the rest of it's days.

IE: Moogle mog.

You can just ROFL your way through the other primals for weapons almost as effective (Better if you get Titan) or just skip them all and go right for your relic.

Its a fun dungeon and there is really no difficulty to it. The only time I ran into any difficulty is when we had 2 smns as the dps since they couldn't get adds down fast enough and our tank couldn't stun Lunatic Voice for anything. If you stun LV Siren is nothing. Its completely silly that ppl complain about PS the way they do. Same with Titan HM, its not that tough. But god forbid you cannot one shot something and actually have to try and learn a mechanic or two. phhht

Just to add to the people who said that the dungeon is easy, We had a dps DCed, while waiting for him to be back, we still managed to 3 man the 2nd boss. The fights in the dungeon is really about everyone knowing the mechanics.

nailed it after 2nd run, played it 5 times so far, have'nt been able to since cause of quitters

This is why I was highly advised not to even unlock the hardmodes or this dungeon by my FCmates. My high level roulette is either WP or AK which is fast and easy either way, and phil tomes for better gear than these hardmodes drop are showered upon me.

honestly, its not only gear, its people not knowing what to do.....or failing on purpose probably. just recently was in there with a somewhat fresh whm, guessing i61 give or take, he managed to heal through all of the fights, died at the end of the first and second to last right as we downed the boss, most of them was because he was standing too far from the tank to pull the adds, but we downed it with ease (i86ish pld, i83mnk{me}, and i74ish brd). and we came to siren...............told him to stand near (and not in front of siren) so tank could grab the walkers while me and brd drop the crawlers fast........we wiped 4 times because that healer couldnt do something simple, kept getting hit by the aoe charm....and worst yet, didnt know how to deal with the adds when doing the fight, he didnt listen once to what i said to him

its not the dungeon, yes it has a somewhat higher difficulty than the rest, its the people

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Originally Posted by Max_Damade

The problem is there are no exclusive rewards for completing it.

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The exclusive rewards are the same as pretty much any other dungeon; junk. All the i60 gear is useless since you'll have better gear when you do it, and if it's gear for another job you can get darklight very easy if you can beat PS. Craft ingredients are common, potions are cheap.

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Originally Posted by AnimaAnimus

Same with Titan HM, its not that tough. But god forbid you cannot one shot something and actually have to try and learn a mechanic or two.

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The issue with Titan HM is the reaction time required for the slow connection, slow processor people. If your PS3 or slow PC/connection takes half a second to show you what's coming, you have to be already moving on weight and lucky on landslide. I'm already out of the blast area when weight appears on my screen, but a bad landslide is unavoidable. All I can do is take the hit and be positioned to not get knocked off the platform.

I've beaten it once out of three attempts myself, it's not hard to get to the Siren, but the Siren itself has very little room for player error.

beat it once and never ruturned the dungeon is not hard really but annoying when ppl dont know what to do

plus the dungeon difficulty doesnt reward players with i70 or i65 gears at least

i hope to god they dont nerf pharos, just increase the rewards. its an incredibly fun dungeon with interesting and fresh mechanics. unfortunately the rewards vs. the ilvl req to get in just dont add up.

imo make it harder and give it ilvl70 loot so we have an alternative to darklight

it was nice challange, only it was to hard for gear that drops in there was not worth it.
Going in there full 45 55 gear is a challange.

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Originally Posted by Kazahashi

I have to agree. Though, not everyone "leaves" because it's too hard or they don't know the fight. I have a friend, that will leave on PS in DR too, as a healer....and he is FAR from bad at healing. He just hates the dungeon and the fact that there's little to no reward for doing something of that difficulty level. When people do their "daily" they aren't looking for pain and suffering, they're looking to get in, get it done, and get out. This just rarely ever happens in PS, so people would rather just leave then sit in a dungeon for 90 minutes, only to fail because certain people can't grasp mechanics or are just incapable of doing it.

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So you want more difficult content, but won't challenge difficult content already within the game because ... it's difficult?

Well they announced to make PS easier in near Future already so the whole discussion will be obsolete soon. I don't think PS is much harder than Hauke or Copperbell HM so the level 60 chests are fine in my book. I only wonder why people aren't more curious about it. I know how it is with myself..if there is a dungeon I have not beaten yet (or even seen) it is my priority to get in it and to run it often enough to know how to play it on my own so I do not need explanations anymore. But whenever PS is in high level roulette, I stand in an empty dungeon lol so I keep doing it with my FC, don't even try to register via DF for it. I don't think ilvl requirements are too low, in fact too much DPS is bad for PS. It is just the stigma that this dungeon has now..can't remember how it started but almost everybody is like "are you crazy, i can get my tomes much easier, it's too hard". If you enter a dungeon thinking this one is too hard for you, you have already lost.

I think that more people are complaining about the duty roullette of this thing than it being too hard. As was mentioned people don't unlock it just so that they don't deal with it with the random idiots from daily. Going in with friends or people from your server(although community is horrible here aside from FC) is far more doable with this type of dungeon than with the random slobs who you can get in random(Yes. Even full af2 relic people who never touched anything difficult are slobs. they don't know their jobs and get offended if anyone even mentions there is something they might now now).

I wonder how they can nerf it without making it another bland nondescript dungeon.

First boss

1. Nerf debuff explosion damage? Becomes just a dps rush and heal through.
2. Nerf boss damage? Becomes just a dps rush and healer kite all adds.
3. Nerf debuff cast time? Tank L2P and dodge properly please. Melee not welcome.
4. Nerf debuff to single-target? Becomes just a dps rush and heal through.
5. Reduce number of waves of adds? Feasible. But then the debuff needs to last longer or content is trivialized.
6. Make ground AoE and boss AoE smaller? Feasible, although it then loses much of its feel.
7. Force adds (boss invulnerable when adds are up)? Feasible.

If I have to choose one I'd probably say reduce to 1 add per wave but make the debuff last much longer.

Second boss

1. Nerf boss AoE damage/egg frequency? Becomes just a dps rush and heal through.
2. Force destruct (boss goes invulnerable when egg begins to hatch)? Feasible.
3. Give a longer cast to aerial blast? Feasible but trivializes it quite a lot.

I'd choose force destruct. But really this fight is already not hard. I actually don't know how to wipe on this. Perhaps there's an enrage timer?

Third boss

1. Might as well remove this boss and just put the coffer there if you're gonna nerf it.

Actually, buff this boss please. :3

Siren

1. Show emote to indicate type of AoE (like chimera in Cutter's Cry)? Feasible.
2. Reduce number of adds per wave? Feasible.
3. Reduce frequency of debuffs? Feasible.
4. Reduce potency of Lunatic Voice? Trivialize and makes the fight a brute force heal through.

To choose one, I'd say just adding the boss emote would make a huge difference to its difficulty. Perhaps also add Lunatic Voice to some of the zombie casters in the dungeon to prepare people for it.

Pharos Sirius? Pfft. I get people bailing on Copperbell and Mannor hard as soon as they pop in it in a regular basis.

People can't clear the boss in Mannor or the FIRST boss (the winding platform with the gigas and slime things) in Copperbell. Thus turning into ragequits. I find both very simple but people just won't even try.

Did SE in fact say nerf? I can't remember the exact language, but I seem to remember they said something like they 'would bring difficulty and rewards more in line', which could be read either way. But I might be remembering wrong.

On my tank? I love this dungeon. I can help grab adds on the first boss so the DPS/healer aren't getting over whelmed. On the second boss, designate a DD to kill one egg and no problem. On the third, just round up the adds while the DD murder the boss. On Siren? The same. Silence all Lunatic voices and grab the walkers so they don't murder the healer. Easy peasy.

As a healer? I freaking HATE this dungeon and I refuse to do HL-DR as my WHM because of this place. The first boss, I always get the group that doesn't kill adds and the tank that stands in the AOE. Everyone splodes and blames me. Second boss? Not a problem unless the DD refuse to kill the adds, again ending with me dying. Third boss? Believe it or not, I've died on this one before due to trying to stop for a second to heal and having 4 plus mobs beating on me. And then... there's Siren. The couple times I've tried this as a healer, this is the road block. Everyone getting hit by the charge, no one stacking for AOE charm, people not killing crawlers or just letting walkers beat on me non stop. No one stunning Lunatic Voice, which makes it impossible to heal everyone back up without throwing out 4 Esuna's, etc, etc, etc. I tried to explain to the tank/DD in each of the runs I tried to heal this and the first time, I got "I've never had to do those things... you may just not be ready for this...", when I'm in full DL with Relic. The second time, I just left after explaining and wiping a few times.

Again, fun dungeon... as long as you're not a healer.

Pharos should have been ilevel 70 rewards, but of course SE can't go and kill the philosophy tomestone that soon. Perhaps 65 would have been better.

I never unlocked it. But I see the same problem with the 2 HM places. Tanks pop in and Give up as soon as they see it's HM.

I say make it harder.
Make the reward i75 gear
People will stop complaining because now it's another step to i90 gear.

Nerf it to the point that all you need to do is step in to win.

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Originally Posted by Versiroth

As a healer? I freaking HATE this dungeon and I refuse to do HL-DR as my WHM because of this place. The first boss, I always get the group that doesn't kill adds and the tank that stands in the AOE. Everyone splodes and blames me. Second boss? Not a problem unless the DD refuse to kill the adds, again ending with me dying. Third boss? Believe it or not, I've died on this one before due to trying to stop for a second to heal and having 4 plus mobs beating on me. And then... there's Siren. The couple times I've tried this as a healer, this is the road block. Everyone getting hit by the charge, no one stacking for AOE charm, people not killing crawlers or just letting walkers beat on me non stop. No one stunning Lunatic Voice, which makes it impossible to heal everyone back up without throwing out 4 Esuna's, etc, etc, etc.
I tried to explain to the tank/DD in each of the runs I tried to heal this and the first time, I got "I've never had to do those things... you may just not be ready for this...", when I'm in full DL with Relic. The second time, I just left after explaining and wiping a few times.

Again, fun dungeon... as long as you're not a healer.

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Q to the F to the E!

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Originally Posted by Quiz

They already said they're nerfing Pharos difficulty.

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Correction, they said they are weighing what the best path for Pharos will be.

My money is on it not changing in difficulty, and the rewards being modified (better gear or new tomestone tier come to mind)

Sigh just nerf this game into the freakin' ground why don't ya?

NOTHING in this game is even REMOTELY hard.

Nerf PS wut? This dungeon is stupid easy. The siren fight isn't all that hard once your tanks start stunning the crap out of lunatic's voice. As a healer, I don't even have to really move to dodge anything. All damage dealt is easily healable. If you're dodging to the left or right to avoid her stupid dash move, don't. As an sch, I just sacred soil for it and heal through the damage because it's not even significant. If people think PS is too hard, I don't want to see them anywhere near any of the coil turns.

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Originally Posted by SulwynCaliope

Nerf PS wut? This dungeon is stupid easy. The siren fight isn't all that hard once your tanks start stunning the crap out of lunatic's voice. As a healer, I don't even have to really move to dodge anything. All damage dealt is easily healable. If you're dodging to the left or right to avoid her stupid dash move, don't. As an sch, I just sacred soil for it and heal through the damage because it's not even significant. If people think PS is too hard, I don't want to see them anywhere near any of the coil turns.

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You forgot to add you don't want to see them in EM primals either. >.>

I think the reason this dungeon can suck is because a ton of the mechanics are based around boss HP (such as adds spawning) which leads to you being effectively punished for being overgeared. The first boss is awful if you get several waves of wolves on top of you and don't get any time for the crystal debuff to wear off. Eggs on the 2nd boss spawn much more quickly if your DPS is high and waves of adds can start stacking up because of it. IMO it doesn't work because people that are having issues with the dungeon are at a nebulous grey area where they are geared enough to push DPS enough for it to become a problem, but they aren't past the point where they can overcome the extra difficulty caused by it either due to not being proficient enough at their job due to gear or skill.

I think it would be better if they just changed adds to be time-based or limited the amount of adds that could be up at once.

Siren needs some better way to tell when she is on the edges or needs to return to the battlefield much sooner before she starts doing her attack. No matter where she teleports to she takes her sweet time appearing and gives you very little time to react. It's worse if she goes on the edge for her line attack as you will likely miss her if you spin your camera to see where she is.

Lunatic Voice also needs to have its cast time increased for what is essentially a party wipe move. Off-GCD Silence/Stun moves are barely fast enough to interrupt it and you likely will not make it in time if you are mid-animation on another skill.

They should definitely add i70 gear as a drop. That would make this dungeon worth it :D

but if it drops i70 also raise the ilvl requirement.

p.s. This dungeon rocks please don't nerf it.

...so am I like the only healer who thoroughly enjoys Pharos, and has 0 problems with it? Lame...

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Originally Posted by Meshico

They should definitely add i70 gear as a drop. That would make this dungeon worth it :D

but if it drops i70 also raise the ilvl requirement.

p.s. This dungeon rocks please don't nerf it.

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I love the dungeon. Problem is everyone wants to overgear and mindlessly blast through it. You can't do that in Pharos. It requires some active thought to clear it. People don't want to put effort into ANYTHING and will rage quit the second they see Pharos queue up. I've also seen this (to a lesser extent) in Copperbell HM. I try to hold them accountable by refusing to vote abandon and trying to give words of encouragement, but people (mostly tanks for some reason) just don't want to hear it and if vote abandon fails, they take the rage quit (if you are that adamant about quitting because you failed this dungeon so many times, the problem might not be the dungeon or party, it might YOU).

It's ironic that the people who clamor for difficulty are the first to bail the second it's introduced. I'd imagine that as there isn't i95 gear drops or huge amount of myth drops people don't see value in it. I guess clearing something for the challenge and helping out others isn't enough.

P.S - I hope it's not nerfed. It would be a shame as it's obvious to see that the devs tried really hard to make a detailed zone with multiple mechanics to stave off burn out.

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Originally Posted by SulwynCaliope

Nerf PS wut? This dungeon is stupid easy. The siren fight isn't all that hard once your tanks start stunning the crap out of lunatic's voice. As a healer, I don't even have to really move to dodge anything. All damage dealt is easily healable. If you're dodging to the left or right to avoid her stupid dash move, don't. As an sch, I just sacred soil for it and heal through the damage because it's not even significant. If people think PS is too hard, I don't want to see them anywhere near any of the coil turns.

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Titan HM is also stupid easy.. if you have a good party that knows what to do. But, have you tried to pug it through DF? How many groups that try it in DF are successful? I'm betting less than 2%. Puging PS can be the same kind of nightmare Titan HM is. Siren requires the tank to silence Lunatic Voice and pick up the privates so they don't rape the healer. It requires the DD to kill the sergeants ASAP and then kill the privates. It requires the healer to top people off with charm and then esuna/leech all debuffs that get through. It also requires everyone to either run to the extreme sides away from her charge or to stack in the middle to avoid her AOE charm.

If these things are all done, you're right. Siren (and Pharos as she's the main road block) is easy. The problem is, those things rarely happen. You'll have DPS who either don't kill adds at all or they'll kill the crawlers and leave the walkers to eat the healer. Tanks that won't attempt to pick up walkers even if the healer is within range for them to do so. Tanks who can't interrupt Lunatic Voice, Healers who don't top people off and don't use Esuna if Lunatic goes off. And groups that seem to constantly get hit with charge and the AOE debuff (Yeah, both...). These groups are far more common than the perfect group that moves in sync and plays perfectly.

The only nerfs I really do want to see is with Charge and Lunatic Voice. Give charge a smaller area of effect (so it's easier to react and move away. As is, I rarely have a group that can move out of it in time) and then give Lunatic Voice's cast time a couple extra seconds so tanks will quit letting it go off claiming that "I can't seem to time it".

Why don't they just nerf this game as a whole?

How do you even nerf an easy game? potato level?

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Originally Posted by Synapse

Why don't they just nerf this game as a whole?

How do you even nerf an easy game? potato level?

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Or, they could not over react, like you and others are doing and only slightly nerf the content that a lot of people are having issues with? Sound better?

Can we let this thread die so the mods/devs can not see it, cause once they look at it they're gonna go "Hmm well we already nerfed the game for the terribads, I guess we need to nerf it some more"

People are wimps.

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Originally Posted by Lumiin

Can we let this thread die so the mods/devs can not see it, cause once they look at it they're gonna go "Hmm well we already nerfed the game for the terribads, I guess we need to nerf it some more"

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Na, more nerfs please. At least enough to force all of the snotty elitists to move on.

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Originally Posted by Versiroth

Na, more nerfs please. At least enough to force all of the snotty elitists to move on.

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I hate when people use that word and have no clue what it means. First off all the real elitist have moved on once they saw how easy and casual friendly this game is. The people that's left that people call "elitist" aren't they are just freaking jerks. Elitists roll in packs. They don't even hang out with non elitist for you guys to even have problems with them. They don't pug or any of that. This game (imo anyway) is full of jerks because this is the first time a lot of people in this game have even SEEN end game in a mmo and are trying to be elitist but have no idea how.

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Originally Posted by Lumiin

I hate when people use that word and have no clue what it means. First off all the real elitist have moved on once they saw how easy and casual friendly this game is. The people that's left that people call "elitist" aren't they are just freaking jerks. Elitists roll in packs. They don't even hang out with non elitist for you guys to even have problems with them. They don't pug or any of that. This game (imo anyway) is full of jerks because this is the first time a lot of people in this game have even SEEN end game in a mmo and are trying to be elitist but have no idea how.

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Na, Elitists are people that make fun of others by calling them "terribads" because they can't complete some of the games content. Just because they have completed the same content, they think that the people struggling should simply be shiz out of luck. Elitist want hard content to stay hard because they don't think "lesser" gamers deserve the win if they can't beat it as is. Which is stupid.

Considering the only tougher dungeons are CT and Coil, I'd prefer if at least the newest of the dungeons were actually difficult. I don't support nerfing this one at all.

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Originally Posted by Versiroth

Na, Elitists are people that make fun of others by calling them "terribads" because they can't complete some of the games content. Just because they have completed the same content, they think that the people struggling should simply be shiz out of luck. Elitist want hard content to stay hard because they don't think "lesser" gamers deserve the win if they can't beat it as is. Which is stupid.

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Elistist call people "terribads" not because they can't complete content but because they refuse to learn their class, etc. Elitist care more about gear and experience. You can't play with them unless your gear is top notch, beyond top notch, you've beat the hardest boss out like 50 times, etc etc. The only people that want old hard content to stay hard after patches are morons ._. But all of that is neither here nor there.

Please don't nerf this dungeon ;<