Please patch Turn 2 enrage

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Originally Posted by Zumi

Maybe it will get ninja fixed in the patch today like they did with Dark Devices, and other speed runs.

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I wouldn't be surprised at all if this happens. Actually, after the way they handled dark devices Im almost expecting this to get ninja patched.

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Originally Posted by Jilse

Says every other Final Fantasy game ever. Heck, they put in enrage counters in XI just to stop people from taking too long to kill. You ever try and kill KB after he enrages? Do not be surprised if they put in a real enrage in a patch or two, just to watch people scream.

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Simple answer, this isn't final fantasy XI or any of its predecessors.

I don't like it and wouldn't use it ever, but I don't really mind people who go with this enrage thing anymore.

Sometimes people just aren't lucky to make a proper group, for various reasons. Maybe they just aren't suited to fights that need a bit of strategy - which makes them prey to T4/T5, maybe they just can't find 7 people with both enough skill and interest to start a group.

Enough time has already passed for people to be ilvl90 with only Myth - Coil loot has BiS here and there, but they're not that special anymore, except for the weapons.

Don't like it? Don't do it. If you are a bit more cautious, don't run other stuff if you think this serves as an example of their behavior on other content.

There isn't anything wrong with it if you don't like it don't do it.

For one a tank usually changes to a healer or at least the ones I've been to. I like passing Rot because its faster. Also we have like what 6-7 weeks before 2.2 so who cares.

I'll be all for this Enrage "Fix" When SE makes it so people can't kite Caduceus after it rejoins, And when they "Fix" T3. You could say that T3 is broken, Is it fair that everyone just runs pass all the mobs and not fight them like intended? But no that's ok to do right?

So to Recap Who Cares about a fix 2.2 is 6-7 weeks away.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

Do you think all of those PF groups that are always putting enrage mode, or rage strat in their comment would be clearing it if they fixed it? Probably not, and it does cheapen people's wins who kill it legit.

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This is a bad argument in general. It doesn't help players who use that down T4 or move them past any significant hurdle. The only thing it does is allow people easier access to T2 loot. The method basically requires overgear in the first place.

Someone who uses enrage method does not diminish your rot stacking method kill. Oh, you think we all somehow forgot that the fight like that already almost excludes having more than 1 MDPS and punts any WAR to the curb who isn't supported by a PLD and BRD or two BRDs? Yeah, I could fight through T2 for 4 hours or organize a static group (so I can make my game more like a job), or I can enrage and get on my life. I choose the latter.

People need to be less concerned with peeing in their neighbor's cheerios and care more about themselves. You don't group with these people what does it matter? If it bothers you get a static of friends and likeminded folks and go HARDCORE ALL NIGHT LONG. MMOs involve playing with other people and dealing with societal issues on your own. Not running to mommy and daddy (SE) all the time when something isn't exactly how you like it.

It was a clever thing people figured out /shrug let them have it as it's not taking gear away from you.. Dwelling on other's actions instead of your own for self-worth is a pretty poor way to go about a cooperative game.

Good point brought up by Gamemako.

Does it cheapen your T3 clear that I skip all the mobs? I means its about progression not loot right? So your point is?


**Welcome to MMO's .

They should also make Turn 4's 'enrage' an instant wipe too if they were to change Turn 2's 'enrage'.

I will never, ever be part of a group who uses the enrage tactic. Even if my coil group decided to do it, I'd simply drop out. I know that my group would never do it though. Hopefully the devs change their mind and fix this. :(

I just did enrage today with 2Tanks I think it is fine yo and should stay.

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Originally Posted by remidi

They have already said its a viable strat. Deal with it and move on. There is more than one way to do an encounter. Don't be mad because someone figured out a super easy way to do so.


*Dead....whiny....horse

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I am not mad, except at you calling me a dead whiny horse. I will most likely use the exploit until it is changed. All I am saying is you asked since when does enraged mean game ender. I said since always. Its a fact, the one most people are using to complain about the strat. I have played a lot of MMO, and up until this encounter, as far as I have seen, enrage does mean wipe.

As for "they have said its a viable strat", they say alot of things are working as intended and then do a fix. I am just saying do not be surprised when the mechanics change and you come back here being a whiny dead horse. Your words, not mine. Personally, I would be laughing my ass off if I went in one day all set for the enrage strat, and we go annihilated. Because its a game, and I would find it hilarious. Then I would come here, and laugh at all the posts exactly opposite of the OP point, wanting it back.

Please also fix speed running in all dungeons
Please also fix speed running Garuda
Please also fix mob locking out in WP and other dungeons.

Because you all exploit this, and it should be fixed if enrage is fixed.

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Originally Posted by Jilse

Do you really take the time not only to shoot down others but to insult them at the same time?

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The only people that are getting shot down are people that think they are special snowflakes. If you feel that way, its your problem.

Rage mode has its own mechanics. The fact that they're easier to overcome doesn't mean they're not there; players have simply figured out how to do it efficiently. Honestly, even fighting Turn 2 using the non-rage method isn't very hard, you just need people who can coordinate together.

It's no more an exploit than overwhelming bosses by throwing overly geared parties at them.

It is definitely a strategy that does not count as an exploit, but I believe it was never intended to be that easy. I give the stamp of shame to whoever resorts to this method without beating it the normal way first.

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Originally Posted by remidi

Sadly you are all very sensitive and when someone is honest with you you get offended and act defensively. Your problem is you are too sensitive, you think your T2 kills are special.....

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I'm not the one acting defensively. lol. I was never rude to you. You jumped down my throat all angry-like when I posted my opinion.

Enrage substitutes a flatter learning curve for a somewhat harder one in the long run. Once you learn to manage multiple things at once, you will clear Turn Two the old way every time. Enrage will always require you to adhere to a more gear dependent and time consuming strategy. Someone above asked how many people who clear Turn Two with enrage strat would be able to clear Turn Two with the old fashioned strategy. I think a better question would be how many people manage to clear Turn Five after doing only enrage strat on Turn Two. If you look at Turns One and Two, they seem more like basic training for Turn Five than anything else. The need to manage multiple things at once is, if anything, even more intense on Twintania than it is on ADS. If your only goal is to clear through Turn Four and get some loot, then enrage away. If your normal intent is to progress through Turn Five clears, then you are trading that flattened learning curve in Turn Two for an enhanced one in Turn Five.

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Originally Posted by Jilse

I will most likely use the exploit until it is changed.

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It's not an exploit, per se. It is doing exactly what it was designed to do. It just wasn't tuned quite to where players think it ought to have been. It would not surprise me in the slightest if they adjusted it upwards, but at the same time, it's almost impossible for them to do anything but make it an instant wipe button because of how much healing 3-4 overgeared healers can deliver.

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Originally Posted by Elim

I'm not the one acting defensively. lol. I was never rude to you. You jumped down my throat all angry-like when I posted my opinion.

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I didn't jump down anything. You can't handle someone being honest and direct with you.

Nothing wrong with it.
A static/decent group will clear T2 regardless of strategy used.
Move on.

omg would you people just stop with this already its not gonna change get over it.

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Originally Posted by remidi

I didn't jump down anything. You can't handle someone being honest and direct with you.

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Get over yourself.

If you are so selfish that you would leave a coil grp over that I would laugh at you and wave goodbye.


*This game is filled with a bunch of people new to raiding in MMO's and they think they are special snowflakes...

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None of my posts were attacks on you personally.

Anyway, my opinion still stands. I hope they fix it! They have changed their minds in the past.

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Originally Posted by Camate

Greetings,

The development team is aware of the strategy that is being used for the Binding Coil of Bahamut Turn 2 against ADS and they do not consider it to be an exploit. There are currently no plans to make any adjustments.

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devs dont plan on doing anything about it.

Nothing wrong with the strategy, it's just an alternative. No need to patch.

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Originally Posted by KenzieLynch

Nothing wrong with the strategy, it's just an alternative. No need to patch.

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But...but...I don't want scrubs getting through my elite content when they don't have mad skillz like me! /cry

Why not put ilvl caps on Content and level sync players gear? Seems fair.

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Originally Posted by EinSoFZ

But...but...I don't want scrubs getting through my elite content when they don't have mad skillz like me! /cry

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Thats the funniest thing about this. This content is not even hard..... The hard part is just finding people who put as much effort as you into learning the fight. It's hard in this game because for most this is their first MMO.
Go try being a top 100 guild for heroic raids in WoW. That is some serious competition. Entire websites dedicated to rankings. They were designing encounters like this years ago.....

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Originally Posted by remidi

I know I had server first with the release boss(buggy pos). However in this situation its not an exploit. Its a perfectly viable strat.


Sadly you are all very sensitive and when someone is honest with you you get offended and act defensively. Your problem is you are too sensitive, you think your T2 kills are special.....

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Why are you so salty when discussing this? You're the only person acting defensive in your conversation.

I don't care if they fix it anymore. It's not like people that can only clear turn 2 using this method will get much further.

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Originally Posted by Devilray

That is true from where (I assume you cleared Coil) we stand, but it is a concern for PUGs in general that makes people voice negativity about it. I have to admit it kind of makes me lose my nerve when I see shouts for enrage strat all day in mor dohna or in PF. I started playing when this game came out, and t2 was quite intimidating... not anymore due to this uncovered flaw in t2's mechanics. You don't see NEARLY as many shouts for t1, t4, and t5. All I see 90% of the time is " T2 ENRAGE STRAT JOIN IN PF." Kind of sad the DEVs are egging on these people and giving them "Free" allagan loot. Whatever... it just means they got something harder in store for us I hope.

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It is lame that you only see this shouts for this strat, but it honestly doesn't effect us. Their inability to pass rot doesn't really have an impact on my play. It sucks that they're handed gear for face-rolling already easy content, but why waste the energy being annoyed? I'm pretty hopeful that we'll still be getting wrecked in the newer turns one they're released, so don't sweat it!

My group hasn't had more than two to three hours per week to earnestly give Twintania a go for a while. We were working on killing the snake in time after the last set of dive bombs so once we can sit and put time into it we will (hopefully this week T_T).

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Originally Posted by Marleytiva

Why are you so salty when discussing this? You're the only person acting defensive in your conversation.

I don't care if they fix it anymore. It's not like people that can only clear turn 2 using this method will get much further.

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That is true from where (I assume you cleared Coil) we stand, but it is a concern for PUGs in general that makes people voice negativity about it. You think people with some allagan loot are actually good, but it really required no skill to get the gear besides healing out of your butt. I have to admit it kind of makes me lose my nerve when I see shouts for enrage strat all day in mor dohna or in PF. I started playing when this game came out, and t2 was quite intimidating... not anymore due to this uncovered flaw in t2's mechanics. You don't see NEARLY as many shouts for t1, t4, and t5. All I see 90% of the time is " T2 ENRAGE STRAT JOIN IN PF." Kind of sad the DEVs are egging on these people and giving them "Free" allagan loot. Whatever... it just means they got something harder in store for us I hope. The thing I am most interested in seeing is how many less people would clear t2 if they patched the enraged strat. OBviously less, right? Isn't that the way it should be? I think so.

My static group can clear turn 4 in one go, but we can still fail multiple times at turn 2. Because we only have a bard, and the tank silent is not always reliable due to animation/lag/dodging AOE. It doesn't make sense that turn 2 is harder than turn 4, which I think is why the dev decide to leave it for now.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

It affects them because it cheapens their "honest" wins, and it means people with poorer skill can get past what ordinarly required competent players. Since SE legitimized it its nearly impossible to do it the "legit" way now. It takes less time, but everyone would rather have loleasy rather than faster runs.

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What stops a static from doing this the normal way and not enrage mode? provided they are a full static and consider the enrage mode "cheap" they will not come across this "impossible" issue you are describing.

As per what the OP is suggesting. I honestly don't care. it's not like T1 is difficult either, and by legitimizing T2 enrage mode the devs have made it easier for non-static groups to at least get SOME coil gear and hopefully some T4 and onward practice.

I don't know what all the fuss is about. It doesn't harm anyone.

Let's say they patch it tomorrow, does it change the way you do the Binding Coil of Bahamut? Does it make your gaming experience any better? All I'm getting from this thread is "We did it the hard way and they're doing it the easy way! No fair!"

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

It affects them because it cheapens their "honest" wins, and it means people with poorer skill can get past what ordinarly required competent players. Since SE legitimized it its nearly impossible to do it the "legit" way now. It takes less time, but everyone would rather have loleasy rather than faster runs.

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Plus, Good luck actually finding a Turn 2 normal group due to this.

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Originally Posted by remidi

Neither were mine. I was stating facts. Sorry that you are selfish and stated so. I'd be upset if a core member in my raid team was gonna leave because we decided to use a strat he didnt like. If you took my general statement of the kinda people who think they are special snowflakes personally.....well then maybe you should stop being a special snowflake.

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You are afraid that if they fix it you wont be able to kill it. Hows that for a fact?
As ive said in another thread, if this was Blizzard and not SE this wouldve been hotfixed a month ago.

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Originally Posted by Wizhard

You are afraid that if they fix it you wont be able to kill it. Hows that for a fact?
As ive said in another thread, if this was Blizzard and not SE this wouldve been hotfixed a month ago.

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Most people have done it passing rot and 0 click thus nullifying your argument.

Square also said, on these forum boards, that T2 was operating as intended and the use of "0 click" is not a bug and will not be patched. Seriously, person, the company that makes the game has told you that it's not bugged and yet you question their statements? Who does that?

It sounds like you miss Blizzard and WoW. You should go back. Leave us devolved children to our 0 clicks.

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Originally Posted by Marishi-Ten

Most people have done it passing rot and 0 click thus nullifying your argument.

Square also said, on these forum boards, that T2 was operating as intended and the use of "0 click" is not a bug and will not be patched. Seriously, person, the company that makes the game has told you that it's not bugged and yet you question their statements? Who does that?

It sounds like you miss Blizzard and WoW. You should go back. Leave us devolved children to our 0 clicks.

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"Warriors are fine" Month later massive buff
"Dark Devices are fine" Month later massive nerf

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Originally Posted by Wizhard

"Warriors are fine" Month later massive buff
"Dark Devices are fine" Month later massive nerf

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Until that day comes or you get hired at Square to educate them on their wrong doings, it's working as intended.

If it's that big of an issue you know how to unsub.

bump... this is stupid easy

It's the principle people! If everyone keeps defending it and SE keeps making content with easy mode kills or keeps decreasing difficulty that's no fun to me. It's telling me that the future content of the game will be made with no real challenge. I have just started t5 but it worries me that people seem to prefer simple boring fights to complex tough ones.

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Originally Posted by Arcaloid

My static group can clear turn 4 in one go, but we can still fail multiple times at turn 2. Because we only have a bard, and the tank silent is not always reliable due to animation/lag/dodging AOE. It doesn't make sense that turn 2 is harder than turn 4, which I think is why the dev decide to leave it for now.

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The content is made vastly more difficult by having the wrong jobs. Bring 2 WAR, no BRD, and a bunch of MDPS to T2 and see if you win. People complaining about tanks not getting runs sound pretty silly to my ears; my two geared jobs, WAR and DRG, are both largely unwanted for non-enrage runs.