Tanking Bone Dragon at the Edge

What a waste of a thread, CT strategy....

I think I will write a strategy on "How to kill a karakul properly in Coerthas Highland", because Killing Karakul's is harder.

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Originally Posted by Raminax

My experience has been that people are quite random about in which direction the Vassagos are shifted as the fire pools spawn. Is there actually any averse effect to Vassagos standing close to each other, though? Because I haven't noticed any. :p

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I think it destabilizes the tethers and accelerates the big bomb timer. I think I also read somewhere that it also gives the demons a damage reduction/ invul buff if they're too close.

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Originally Posted by Ryios

What a waste of a thread, CT strategy....

I think I will write a strategy on "How to kill a karakul properly in Coerthas Highland", because Killing Karakul's is harder.

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Or you could just post useless comments to random threads.

Never seen it tanked in the center, Just seems weird and too dangerous for no good reason.

Never heard of tanking him in the centre. Everytime it's been north but it's another viable option.

You can FaceRoll this fight so I don't think location really matters that much. Next time I tank it I'll ask the alliance and go with what they want. I guess both ways work and "Tanking north is stupid" is wrong. Never wiped or had any problems doing it. Since I haven't tanked centre I can't really comment but I'll give it a try if my next alliance want to try it :)

As long as the dragon is pointed north in the center its no biggie. Honestly I like tanking center better, its safer for the physical dps and if you can't kill skeles before they get to the center you probably are in for a long run anyway. I've died on a tanking on the edge but not on a center tank.

I've done 20-30 runs so far, and not one tanked him anywhere BUT the middle. I'm all for trying new strategy, but all the people claiming 99% of people tank him against the wall are just wrong.

There are 6 adds, and 8 green platforms.

If u drag him north, u have 1 platform taken up. 2 which are the same distance as they already were, and then 5 left to be "further away". In most cases, ppl have the 6th mob overlap one of the 5, making 2 get to the boss with a sprint effect.

Then u have the mobs running through poison, and healers need to reach/run further to heal people.

It's honestly just as easy to pull the skeletons in separate directions, while tanking the dragon facing north (so no one gets hit by breath)

Adds spawn in order of North to south, and they spawn in front of the panel u need to pull them onto.

It really is easy. I usually pull all 3 adds on the east or west side alone. (since i know when, and where they spawn)

You will be on green panels 50% of the time, and healers can sit on the middle east/west panels to reach everyone.

Pulling to the north brings more problems imo than it fixes. (Though some groups are so bad, its needed just to survive.)

So if your group knows the fight, its easier not to pull to the north.

If your group cant win, then its easier toi pull to the north, since u can still try to recover.

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Originally Posted by Doo

Players just do it because they feel safer but there's really no need to pull it to the edge. The dragons aoe breath is easily stunnable and grabbing adds is just as easy when it's in the center.

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Stunnable? I blow Brutal Swing all the time to try to do more dps when I'm pacified when I mt it, it always says its immune D:

ok let see the positive point of each strategy

to the edge:
more distance between the dragon and the skeleton... that all.

to the center:
less movement for the ranged dps for kill skeleton (since they will be at middle way between the dragon and the add)
the melee dps have more space for attack the boss
the melee can go help on the skeleton

the bad side, now
the edge:
skeleton are most of the time walking in the poison area, melee can't help on the skeleton phase.
skeleton will be close to each other as they get closer of the boss.
less space for the melee for dps in the last phase

to the center:
less distances for the skeleton for reach the dragon

actually it's more efficient to tank the dragon to the center... simply people think it's safer at the edge... loosing of sight that they are nerfing themself by doing this.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

ok let see the positive point of each strategy

to the edge:
more distance between the dragon and the skeleton... that all.

to the center:
less movement for the ranged dps for kill skeleton (since they will be at middle way between the dragon and the add)
the melee dps have more space for attack the boss
the melee can go help on the skeleton

the bad side, now
the edge:
skeleton are most of the time walking in the poison area, melee can't help on the skeleton phase.
skeleton will be close to each other as they get closer of the boss.
less space for the melee for dps in the last phase

to the center:
less distances for the skeleton for reach the dragon

actually it's more efficient to tank the dragon to the center... simply people think it's safer at the edge... loosing of sight that they are nerfing themself by doing this.

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That was rather biased.

Also Pro's for Edge Strat:
- Ranged DPS can focus 1-2 skeletons at a time, able to assist where it's needed most
- It's easy to adjust for mis-placed Skeletons without the skeleton reaching the dragon
- Less chance anyone takes a hit from the dragon

Pro's for center:
(you were more detailed here)

Cons for edge:
-More spread out, harder for healers
Note:
Melee can in fact attack the skeletons here, it's not like the poison deals heavy damage. Plus, nothing else even deals damage here. Not to mention Dragoons having a ranged ability for desperation plus jumps. It would be far more accurate to just state that melee will take damage here.
I have never seen the skeletons link using this strategy unless they were placed wrong. That was a bit of a null point.

Cons for center:
- Must focus on closest skeletons, less time to help other if needed.
- A poorly placed skeleton is located much closer to the dragon.
- North quadrant becomes a big no-no area.

I have always seen it at the edge. Always seen it where melee stay on bone and ranged and tanks stay on skele. Some have broken it down to alliance a on bone b and c on skele duty.

If its not being tanked in the center then they are doing it wrong.

I've yet to see anyone tank the dragon in any place other than the center. Of course I think I've only done about 10 runs of CT since it launched. :D The biggest problem that seems to occur with tanking the dragon in the center is his conal attack, but it's easy enough to get out of the AoE if you're paying attention.

Truly as bad as Chimera hill or turn 2 enrage.

Tanking him at the edge excludes melee from most of the fight. Skeletons cut through large areas of poison and spend very little time on solid ground. Dps'ing the dragon himself is a little awkward for melee, as well.

Tanking the dragon in the center is easy. Kill the skeletons at the ends of the spokes and you have MORE than enough time to kill them before they reach the dragon. I've NEVER seen a group fail at this. Thus, tanking the dragon on the edge is needlessly complicated for many classes.
Also the room is set up in an OBVIOUS spoke pattern. The most efficient strategy is pretty much told to you. People just like to "beat the system," and think they have made some kind of discovery with this edge thing.

I've done both methods as a Melee DPS/Ranged DPS/Tank/Healer.

Both work, and both are effective if you have people that pay attention to what they're doing.

If DPS is ranged it makes absolutely no difference.
If DPS is melee it means you step into the poison for a second while you do a flank WS then step back onto a platform, and that you might have to step in the poison for a few seconds on skeletons but there is more time to DPS them.

Learn to be a bit more adaptive.

Not sure why DPS are caring so much. The only people who have to know how the wall strat works are the off-tanks moving the skeletons and the healers who have to run around more. Melee have to run through poison? Easy remedied with a succor and/or medica II. I don't see the issue.

No offense but only stupid tanks take him north and honestly deserve to die. If you say tanking him there leaves room for error then you're wrong.

1. if he is tanked in the center that means less room to travel when pulling skeletons to the edges.
2. tanking him north means that some skeletons will cross through the water meaning more damage on you and more work on healers.
3. tanking him north also means less room for dps to get positions on him and will likely have to go into the water resulting in less dps more work on healers.
4. If he is centered the healers can easily reach everyone.
5. group a should pull east while group b pulls west.
6. no one will get hit by BD's cones if no one stands in the front. Only stay to his flank or rear.

Every time I've done CT, there's been at least 3 derp tanks that have to provoke and tank whatever they can that's in sight of them. Tanking in the center with those types of players is an absolute liability.

I don't have any issues with either strat. I like them both, I've used them both. Edge tanking is easier when you have derps, center tanking is easier when you have competent players. The only thing is, with the NA/EU duty servers, 19/20 groups will have idiots in them, so the edge strat is the go-to strat for most.

I think the biggest thing that people are forgetting is that nobody cares about melee DPS and their woes. If we could tank everything in fire, we'd do it.

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Originally Posted by Marxam

2. tanking him north means that some skeletons will cross through the water meaning more damage on you and more work on healers.
3. tanking him north also means less room for dps to get positions on him and will likely have to go into the water resulting in less dps more work on healers.
4. If he is centered the healers can easily reach everyone.

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Frankly, as a healer, I don't mind because the entire fight is a snoozefest. Poison does pretty negligible damage, and we have sprint. Healing is no fun when people aren't dying.

Really though, both methods have their pros and cons and both methods work. Stop trying to invalidate one or the other.

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Originally Posted by Marxam

No offense but only stupid tanks take him north and honestly deserve to die. If you say tanking him there leaves room for error then you're wrong.

1. if he is tanked in the center that means less room to travel when pulling skeletons to the edges.
2. tanking him north means that some skeletons will cross through the water meaning more damage on you and more work on healers.
3. tanking him north also means less room for dps to get positions on him and will likely have to go into the water resulting in less dps more work on healers.
4. If he is centered the healers can easily reach everyone.
5. group a should pull east while group b pulls west.
6. no one will get hit by BD's cones if no one stands in the front. Only stay to his flank or rear.

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Dear god...
1. Skeletons spawn in center regardless of where the dragon is located.
2. Valid point, my healers choose not to care.
3. Honestly, the dragon dying faster would lead more to a wipe then a success (all skeletons that are alive when the dragon dies auto run to him)...This is not a DPS race!
4. Valid point.
5. This happens regardless of strategy.
6. This happens regardless of strategy.

So, your only valid point is that healing will be a bit more difficult and this is cause to claim that people using it deserve to die? Nice.

Ive only tanked him in the center. Sometimes we had tanks who tried to provoke off me and move to the north, was kinda funny actually.

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Originally Posted by Amyas

Stunnable? I blow Brutal Swing all the time to try to do more dps when I'm pacified when I mt it, it always says its immune D:

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Yeah it's stunnable. I do it all the time.

its horrible to tank at the edge, takes forever to position it and melees have to run through poison to damage skeletons and the path is unnecessary long, any average melee could kill skeletons before they reach center. The conal issue can be solve by always facing the dragon north, there are enough platforms on the lower half of the arena to accommodate the skeletons.

also, the north platform is so small it's very difficult for melee to dps effectively without standing in poison

note: if you kill the dragon fast enough you can effectively skip a few skeletons.

JP servers, mostly tank at center. Have not seen any CT raid that tanks at a corner.

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Originally Posted by Aegis

All right then. Scenario 2: Tanking Vassagos; do you move them clockwise or anticlockwise when first fire pool spawns?

Any data centre variations? Balmung (which I believe is Aether) tanks them clockwise.

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Hyperion (which is on the Primal data centre and does Dragon at the edge, unlike Balmung) tanks them clockwise as well... theoritcally. There's very often one group that tanks them the counter-clockwise direction making it lopsided. Oddly enough this is almost always group A, resulting in the two Vassago (Vassagi?) being tanked just to either side of where the entrance bridge was. I have never seen group B tank the wrong direction, and only rarely seen group C do it. I still haven't figured out why A is always the one to move the wrong way when it happens. Maybe it's because when they pull, their Vassago moves towards the entrance, meaning they're more likely to end up on the counter-clockwise side of the fire aoe when it spawns, and their tank just takes the shorter route out of it.

CT raids I have been on, most of the time if not always tank at the far north. It is just easier that way. but the center can be done as well.

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Originally Posted by Aegis

Overlapping AOEs, Dark Halo or Grim Halo or whatever it's called

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actually if they get close the laser beam things go all crazy looking and pump up the bomb really fast as well as giving them a huge defensive buff to the point of them taking damage in the low teens

If you really wanna throw people off pull it south.


https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho...98044098_n.jpg

Really enjoying the posts telling the melee to just fight the skellies in the poison and "suck it up." I'm fully capable of doing this, but as I stand out in the poison fighting killing my skeleton (i've seen this strategy maybe twice on my data center,) I can't help but wonder "WHY are we doing this," and I've yet to see an answer.

So when the skeletons are spending 70% of their journey to the dragon in the purple goop and the alliance consists of mostly melee dps, I'd hate to be a healer at that point.... lol

Just keep the dragon in the middle. Last phase, people should respect which way the dragon is facing. Tanking him on the outer edge isn't the best thing in my opinion :P But to each his own.

In the Chaos server block we tank him at the edge with no problems.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DipAbVU4hWk

It's really simple, as the MT:

Do you trust that the other 5 OT's arn't derp and can effectively grab the skeletons from healers and place them in the correct locations? Tank boss in center.

Do you have little faith and believe that some skeletons may die in the dumbest of places (like the center circle -_-)? Tank North.

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Originally Posted by Aegis

All right then. Scenario 2: Tanking Vassagos; do you move them clockwise or anticlockwise when first fire pool spawns?

Any data centre variations? Balmung (which I believe is Aether) tanks them clockwise.

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There hasn't been any real movement at all on the last handful of runs I've done. The Vassagos stay pretty much right where they start the whole time, and the tanks move just enough to keep themselves out of the fire.

I feel as long as the outcome of X Strategy gets you a victory ( without too much problems to get there), then I welcome all ways to beat anything :).

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Originally Posted by Dhex

If you really wanna throw people off pull it south.


https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho...98044098_n.jpg

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lol ur sig is awesome!

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Originally Posted by Mhaeric

Rawr!

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Whatno.

Don't be silly, it's always group C that has to be contrary and ends up sucking. ALWAYS.

after reading the opinions...Is it me or It kinda seems like the north strategy is used when alliance is full of unskilled players.

Probably did about 30 CT runs.... always the middle, tanks always take the skeleton to the end platform.. and its smooth... only time i ever seen a wipe is when retarded dps don't realize they have comets and place them on behemoth's ass. *yeah im looking at you monks*