Can the PC players give the PS3 players a break a little?

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Originally Posted by Krystalynn

Why should we? The fact the game is on your console is why this game was watered down. Why we have zone borders. Why we lost belts, high level textures. Why zones are the smallest among modern mmos. Because they tried to fit a game like FFXIV on a console with 256mb of video ram. No breaks for you. Everywhere I look my game bleeds because you wanted to play a modern mmo as beautiful was FFXIV 1.0 on a console I could buy for 99 bucks on craigslist. Mash the start button more.

This game used to be a beautiful, wide open world. I used to be able to walk down the bridge of Limsa Lominsa and explore the city without loading. There was no such thing as Eastern Thanalan, Western Thanalan, Northern Thanalan and Southern Thanalan. It was just Thanalan.

This was its theme. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g00knvH5Oks

When Ishgard comes out, not a single one of us will have the pleasure of riding down that long bridge over the clouds. We get a portal and a teleport thanks to you. I honestly don't care. It was a mistake to put this on the PS3, and I wish you guys would whine more about it so Squaresoft realizes it just the same. They could have waited for PS4 and released this in 2014, and had a PC and Console title with similar and competetive processing power, but instead weakened the entire game for the 200 thousand players forcing them to release it on an EIGHT YEAR OLD SYSTEM. I'm glad things are bad on it. They should be.

Could you imagine how awesome this game would have been if PS3 wasn't in the equation? The size of the zones? The beauty in the textures? Sad part is, YEARS from now, even brand new content has to be released that the PS3 can handle because you're the lowest common denominator! Our game is outdated from the getgo, thanks to you. You should be giving us a break.

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Should have saw this coming from a mile away if you came from XI. No matter how strong a console it, it will eventually hold back an MMO as time passes by. This would have been true even for the PS4, but developing it down for the PS3's level only made it much worse as you're effectively trying to put a modern MMO on an antique piece of hardware.

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Originally Posted by Yahavage

Mmmm dat copy and paste landscape. Thanalan never used to be broken up and it all looked the same! It used to be wonderful running 10minutes across the zone and it didn't change in the slightest!

I prefer the newer landscapes. What I miss are the textures, they used to be so pretty but are a tad garish now.

I don't think I'll hold it against ps3 users though ^^;

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Lack of artistry in the environment was a failing of the devteam that was eliminated. The thought of Yoshi's team getting the resources that Tanaka's had to work with gives me chills. To think of what they could have been capable of. They forced a square peg into a round hole because of the PS3, and then its market want us to give them a break because they lack four corners. Alright then. No.

Edit: Oh by the way, one of the reasons they went with copy paste geometry, is because FFXIV 1.0 was slated to also be a console game. Tanaka's team wanted to give PS3 player the widespread open world, with its limitations inmind. By pasting the world again and again, they would have saved resources. It never worked out, but even that poor system existed because of the limitation of a console.

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Originally Posted by Deculture

Should have saw this coming from a mile away if you came from XI. No matter how strong a console it, it will eventually hold back an MMO as time passes by. This would have been true even for the PS4, but developing it down for the PS3's level only made it much worse as you're effectively trying to put a modern MMO on an antique piece of hardware.

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Exactly. XI players know this sting all too well. Decade old mmo still held back by a PS2 console, that sadly, some today still play on, at the selfish cost of every PC gamer that could have had a better game over time. It's a tragedy honestly.

It is actually the fault of Playstation owners that Square-Enix decided to release this game on Playstation. How could have this crisis been averted? Well




uhhh.

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Originally Posted by Sussie

It is actually the fault of Playstation owners that Square-Enix decided to release this game on Playstation. How could have this crisis been averted? Well




uhhh.

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*Puts on anti console helm*

PS3 owners should have taken the honourable route and tell SE not to release this game at their consoles in the first place. Now they will be dishonoured for generations to come.


Seriously, the PS3 release is like a face saving tactic. And PS3 owners got sucked into thinking FFXIV on the PS3 will behave like FFXI on the PS2.

What ppl forgotten is FFXI is a console port. While FFXIV is developed from the PC.

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Originally Posted by Krystalynn

Exactly. XI players know this sting all too well. Decade old mmo still held back by a PS2 console, that sadly, some today still play on, at the selfish cost of every PC gamer that could have had a better game over time. It's a tragedy honestly.

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Thank god we can recognize this great horror of humanity with the gravity it deserves alongside such similar tragedies as the Holocaust and the Khmer Rouge.

People like you make me all the more delighted to play on a PS3 and do so at the utter shock of my Coil static and the endgame players I frequently party with.

And they said that the PS3 wouldn't hold the game back.

Personally, I think they should stop supporting the PS3 and PS4 version. I never ask if someone is on a PS, but they normally announce that they are followed by apologizing for any mistakes they make because of it's limitations. The PS users seem to complain about themselves more than the PC users do.

I am on the pc but I think it is great that I can group with ps3 and ps4 players. I am not an ass and I do enjoy the game being out for all platforms because we are all gamers ;)

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Originally Posted by Krystalynn

Why should we? -snip-

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All of those things suck, I won't argue, I miss a lot about 1.0 and i've never hidden that. But it's hardly the players fault. SE decided to make it this way, not them. The players are trying to make the best of a less than ideal situation, and in terms of gameplay it's almost unnoticeable if they are practiced enough. In terms of zoning that's a different matter of course, but they didn't make it that way, so don't take it out on them.

can always tell a ps3 player. Slow to trun you cant turn on a ps3 as fast as you can with mouse look. turning on a ps3 is equivalent to keyboard turning on a PC. Its bad and slow. its not just ps3 its people that play the game with a controler its the imitations to the controler and how it turns. I always see controller character getting their ass kicked to aoe because of this slow arcing turn they do before they get out of the aoe. Also as others mentioned Targeting is a joke with controller. Cycle through targets. no thank you i rather use mouse over macros or select my target by clicking it in the enemy list or clicking its name plate. give a quick example. tanking a pack of mobs 1 starts to run off to the healer instead of needing to actually target this mob i have a mouse over macro for provoke shield lob...so i just hover my mouse over that target click the macro never dropping target from the mob i currently have set to be killed first. This is just a couple examples of advantages over controller players keyboard/mouse has.

People can hate me for playing on PS3 all they want but it doesn't affect me in the slightest. I actually like being hated for the simple fact that I have affected someone else by doing what I want to do. I love the fact that people say PS3 limitations blah blah but cannot do anything about it except moan and cry. If people are so judgmental and rude to people doing what they prefer then they can but just know that everyone who plays on PS3 will always be ahead of you for the simple reason that the console will never be dropped by SE.

If you don't believe me - do some research into Japanese gaming culture.

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Originally Posted by Kyriea

People can hate me for playing on PS3 all they want but it doesn't affect me in the slightest. I actually like being hated for the simple fact that I have affected someone else by doing what I want to do. I love the fact that people say PS3 limitations blah blah but cannot do anything about it except moan and cry. If people are so judgmental and rude to people doing what they prefer then they can but just know that everyone who plays on PS3 will always be ahead of you for the simple reason that the console will never be dropped by SE.

If you don't believe me - do some research into Japanese gaming culture.

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Oh we can do something about it. its called vote kick. Constantly the controller user is dieing to aoe messing up you can vote kick them now! In hopes of a PC player or non controller player. I've seen ps3 players that use mouse and keyboard and they do just fine its more controller limitations then it is ps3.

PC players use a controller too, and good luck with your ban! Vote kicking for players playing on a console is strictly against their terms. That's if you even notice I'm playing on PS3, but luckily I'll never have the misfortune of coming across you! :)

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Originally Posted by Mailstrum

Oh we can do something about it. its called vote kick. Constantly the controller user is dieing to aoe messing up you can vote kick them now! In hopes of a PC player or non controller player. I've seen ps3 players that use mouse and keyboard and they do just fine its more controller limitations then it is ps3.

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http://i.imgur.com/nqycvec.gif

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Originally Posted by Kyriea

PC players use a controller too, and good luck with your ban! Vote kicking for players playing on a console is strictly against their terms. That's if you even notice I'm playing on PS3, but luckily I'll never have the misfortune of coming across you! :)

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It wouldn't be vote kicking for playing on a console. It would be vote kicking for consistently being unable to perform per the expectations of the group and causing wipes. If I'm paired with a tank who is consistently unable to dodge AoE attacks and is losing group aggro constantly because he's relying too heavily on macros due to overly-cumbersome gamepad controls, causing numerous group wipes, I would have no compunction about voting to replace him with someone competent. I don't give half a crap if you're playing on a gamepad or not; I care about whether you're a liability to the group. Unfortunately, using a gamepad more often than not does make you a liability.

A gamepad is a handicap over a mouse and keyboard in a game like FFXIV. There's no arguing this point. Some people are able to overcome that handicap and perform at the same level as a good mouse and keyboard user, and I say more power to them for it, but it's still a handicap. And for every 1 gamepad user who's capable, there are at least 20 who are useless and need to be carried through group content because they're too slow and inflexible.

I'm not one of those PC elitists who think consoles are dragging gaming down and that the glorious PC is the only way to go. But even I recognize that releasing FFXIV on the PS3 was a mistake when the PS4 was launching literally 3 months later. It would've been much better for everyone had SE simply released the game on PC in August and waited to make it's console debut on PS4. Because they're now obligated to support the PS3, all future content will need to be developed within the hardware confines of an 8 year old system, and no one wins because of that. The PS3 version is practically unplayable as is with restricted control customization, terrible loading times, the equivalent of Low graphical settings and still a piss poor framerate in many areas. I have to wonder whether the number of PS3 subscribers over time will be worth the gaol they've built for themselves.

I'm a PC user, mid-range-ish since I upgraded to a GeForce 650, and I don't care what you play on or with as long as you can work with/around it.

In other words, if you suck on a ps3 odds are you're still going to suck on a PC too. Skill over gear...skill over gear...

One of the things I learned from Final Fantasy XI and still holds true no matter the mmo.

idk I play on both and don't have any issues really other than the slow loading time. But I use a controller on PC. I can't imagine how people play this game with keyboard and mouse lol.

Gotta love the PC players talking about honour and betrayal.

We prostrate ourselves before thee, oh powerful ones.

off topic:

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Originally Posted by Mezolitik

Gotta love the PC players talking about honour and betrayal.

We prostrate ourselves before thee, oh powerful ones.

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to quote a friend of mine when ever he hears "ps3 limitations" from pc players "MAN GTA V's pc graphics look amazing" XD

NOW back to on topic:
i have played well with pc players who thought i was on pc i use my mac for teamspeak so i can communicate clearly and effectively and i know where the cursor is pointing so i can use AOE's effectively even though i cannot move the mouse without a usb mouse, got all buttons in my cross bar memorised so i can use the skills/actions i need,
it doesn't matter if a user is PS3, PS4, Vita or PC its more down to how good the player is and how clear there internet is :3

I wonder how badly PC users are going to take it when they port ARR to the Vita...

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Originally Posted by Mailstrum

can always tell a ps3 player. Slow to trun you cant turn on a ps3 as fast as you can with mouse look. turning on a ps3 is equivalent to keyboard turning on a PC. Its bad and slow. its not just ps3 its people that play the game with a controler its the imitations to the controler and how it turns. I always see controller character getting their ass kicked to aoe because of this slow arcing turn they do before they get out of the aoe.

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What the heck are you on about? There is no turning animation when using a controller. When you move the stick in a direction - you immediately move in that direction. In fact it's probably easier to move around using a controller. You're blatantly biased against PS3, and that's nice, but don't spread lies. Maybe it's a graphical error and it looks like they're turning around, but regardless - it's their bad play, nothing to do with them being a PS3 player.

PS3 users - There is no content that can't be done on PS3 to the same standard as on PC. And for the love of the twelve, stop saying "sorry I'm a PS3 user" as an excuse for bad play. With such an attitude you're begging to be patronised for the format you're on, but unfortunately you're also causing every other player capable of doing anything the game to get discriminated against for no good reason. Although I wouldn't be surprised if some of these people are actually PC players being trolls.

PC users - I always feel bad about these arguments. While I wouldn't be playing the game right now if it wasn't on PS3, and still wouldn't be for a while - I totally understand all the issues about it holding back the potential of the PC version with its now rapidly-ageing hardware. And I sympathise. But Square made the choice to do this, and it's done. "I'm sorry". But that's got nothing to do with gameplay. Next time someone says "srry I'm ps3", know that it's no fault of the system. Maybe they feel better by pointing the finger at it, but it's just an excuse. I'll say it again:
There is no content that can't be done on PS3 to the same standard as on PC.

I don't really care what platform someone plays on, I can be patient whether you need time to watch your CS or take a few extra seconds to do something. It's all about if you act like an a-hole or refuse to listen to the party's instructions in my eyes.

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Originally Posted by Keiichi81

*lots of hypocritical nonsense*

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So you're not a PC elitist saying consoles are dragging down these games, then say consoles are dragging down this game. You say you don't care if anyone plays using a gamepad, but you totally care if anyone plays on a gamepad because to you it's an automatic handicap. And so on, and so on. Girl, you're a contradictory mess, and you sound like you don't know what the hell you're talking about with the example you use. Like a tank on a gamepad who can't play because of all the macros to make up for the "overly cumbersome gamepad controls". If that's how you've seen someone legitimately try to tank (and you were told everything about his setup so that you weren't just assuming crap to fit your argument), then they're simply a bad player. My counterexample: my tanking on a gamepad is quite effortless and macro-free (aside from my in-party notice when I pop Hallowed Ground that says "IN SOVIET RUSSIA, GROUND HALLOWS YOU"), thank you. I made sure it would be as effortless as possible for me because I -- gasp -- customized everything about my layout and hotbars to optimize my performance.

A bad player is a bad player is a bad player. Give them a mouse/keyboard, gamepad, joystick, pong knob, whatever -- they will be a bad player regardless of method. Get over yourself.

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Originally Posted by Avalon_Albrook

*lots of ignorant feel-good garbage*

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I'm not being hypocritical in the least.

Is the PC the end-all-be-all of gaming systems and is always better for gaming than consoles no matter what? No. Is designing a modern MMO to fit within the confines of an 8 year old system with 256MB of RAM going to severely limit the development path of that title and negatively affect the end experience of PC and PS4 players? Yes, absolutely. No hypocrisy there. I can accept that all platforms have their place while also recognizing that the PS3 is a poor fit for FFXIV, especially with the PS4 right around the corner at the time of it's release.

Are there players who are proficient with a gamepad and can keep up in the most demanding of content? Yes, of course. Does that mean that gamepad controls aren't a handicap? No, don't be silly. No hypocrisy there either. Just because there's someone out there who can win an Olympic sprint with 2 prosthetic legs doesn't mean that being a paraplegic isn't a handicap. It just means that some people are capable of overcoming that handicap. I'm sorry, but needing to press 2, 3, 4 or more buttons in various combinations to navigate the crossbars and activate an ability is a handicap compared to a method that requires you to only push 1 key. A control method that forces you to scroll through a list in order to select the desired target is a handicap compared to a control method that allows you to click on your target directly. A control method that takes several seconds to rotate your camera 360 degrees is a handicap compared to a method that let's you snap your camera 90, 180, 240 degrees or any direction in between instantly. There is no avoiding this. Hence why I say that the gamepad is a handicap. Maybe you personally are good enough that you're tanking Turn 5 and Garuda EX with your gamepad no problem. Good for you if you are. Congrats on winning that Olympic medal. But don't go around telling people that they should chop off their feet because prosthetics are totally every bit as good as flesh and blood legs.

A bad player is a bad player regardless what system they're using.

Nobody is bad just because they're using either a PS3 or PC. They're bad because they're bad.

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Originally Posted by Keiichi81

I'm not being hypocritical in the least. *snip*

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If you say you don't have a problem with something and then list all the problems you have with that thing, you're being hypocritical. And more LOL at you comparing using a controller to having your limbs removed and trying to run with prosthetics.

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Originally Posted by Avalon_Albrook

If you say you don't have a problem with something and then list all the problems you have with that thing, you're being hypocritical. And more LOL at you comparing using a controller to having your limbs removed and trying to run with prosthetics.

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You should likely look up what Hypocritical means. Because nothing in Keiichi's post points to that. The things he is saying, they're correct. His comparison, while it will make people say things like you did, actually is somewhat valid. You just choose to ignore it, because you refuse to see the truth in it.

Not to mention, you miss the point of the analogy in the first place. He's not comparing controllers to prosthetic legs, he's comparing a handicap to another handicap.

There is no truth. There is opinion on this based on play style. I find keyboard/mouse usage cumbersome and am most effective using a controller. For me, keyboard/mouse play is a handicap. For others, it's obviously not. My truth is not the world's truth -- therefore, it's an opinion, and not one with which I condescend to anyone. To suggest that using a controller automatically gimps you as a general rule is crap and will always be crap.

It depends on the player and what they're comfortable with. I've never been able to get comfortable playing games on a PC. It just feels alien to me. I try it every once in a while and I'm simply uncomfortable doing it, and consequently I suck on that system because of it. But put me in front of a console and I can be successful because it's familiar and comfortable.

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Originally Posted by Avalon_Albrook

There is no truth. There is opinion on this based on play style. I find keyboard/mouse usage cumbersome and am most effective using a controller. For me, keyboard/mouse play is a handicap. For others, it's obviously not. My truth is not the world's truth -- therefore, it's an opinion, and not one with which I condescend to anyone. To suggest that using a controller automatically gimps you as a general rule is crap and will always be crap.

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And this is where people like you fail, you assume he's using his personal preference. You have to compare with 0 skill, ie without human influence, which would be better. You could even use equal skill, but with no player involvement one will always be better than the other for a given game. That's where his arguments about handicaps come from.

So no, it's not crap. If a game just simply works better with one control method over another, without taking player skill into account, then yes, one control method WILL be gimp. By how much? That depends on the game and how much it's compensated for.

All you have to do is look at it like this. Say you want to target someone, what do you have to do with each control method? You can't think about how YOU would do it. You have to think which could do it better based on the merits of the device(s) themselves. In this case, a Mouse will do it better.

I play on PS3 and have never had anybody question what I'm playing on, thankfully.

The lack of space on the cross hotbar was addressed with the L2+R2 and R2+L2 combination (not completely, but it's better than cycling through several different setups). Being comfortable and familiar with macros helps a lot, imo.

SDD makes a HUGE difference with load times, PC characters in your immediate vicinity, and draw distance. If you can get a cheapy, jump on it.

People shouldn't be concerned about what system you are playing on, only if you are playing your class properly and to the best of your abilities.

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Originally Posted by Krystalynn

Why should we?

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Because we're the reason you even have a successful game. Imagine of SE only catered to the VERY small fraction of like minded individuals such as yourself. The fact of the matter is you need money to cover production costs. Did that ever cross your mind?

Oooo it must burn you so that someone on a PS3 can potentially out preform you on your 1000+ dollar machine.

Using your skewed logic I can blame people like you for having to put up with RMT Bots. On a console this would rarely, if at all, happen. I mean I would LOVE to have a nice conversation in a city state or see what the community at large is up to but nope. PC RMT Bots.

I'm SURE SE would have LOVED to suffer another loss but as long as we have belts it's ok right?

We'll leave the light on for you.

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Originally Posted by ispano

And this is where people like you fail, you assume he's using his personal preference. You have to compare with 0 skill, ie without human influence, which would be better. You could even use equal skill, but with no player involvement one will always be better than the other for a given game. That's where his arguments about handicaps come from.

So no, it's not crap. If a game just simply works better with one control method over another, without taking player skill into account, then yes, one control method WILL be gimp. By how much? That depends on the game and how much it's compensated for.

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LOL. If the game was designed and optimized to be used with a PS3 and therefore a controller just as much as it is for a PC, then it is a crap argument. It comes down to personal preference only. To suggest otherwise is condescension on your part just as much as his.

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Originally Posted by Avalon_Albrook

LOL. If the game was designed and optimized to be used with a PS3 and therefore a controller just as much as it is for a PC, then it is a crap argument. It comes down to personal preference only. To suggest otherwise is condescension on your part just as much as his.

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If you knew how much was put into the game to work around a controllers difficulties with this type of game, you wouldn't say that. This is what I mean, when something just works for a given system, and you have to modify, adapt and make workarounds for something else, it means one is clearly superior to the other. It's like an FPS on controller or KB/M. With KB/M you just point and shoot. With a controller you can't get that same precision and most if not all controller based FPS games have some sort of aim correction. This game isn't an FPS for sure, but the workarounds to make a controller useable are evident. You might prefer controller for that type of game, and that's fine, but that doesn't mean it's equal to KB/M.

Not, i'm not against people who use controllers. If they play well, who cares. But that doesn't change if one is better than the other.

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Originally Posted by Avalon_Albrook

LOL. If the game was designed and optimized to be used with a PS3 and therefore a controller just as much as it is for a PC, then it is a crap argument. It comes down to personal preference only. To suggest otherwise is condescension on your part just as much as his.

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Optimized for PS3 so its drastically under par for PC. That is not something I would give praise about.

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Originally Posted by necrosis

Optimized for PS3 so its drastically under par for PC. That is not something I would give praise about.

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He meant the controls, not the graphics.

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Originally Posted by Riv

idk I play on both and don't have any issues really other than the slow loading time. But I use a controller on PC. I can't imagine how people play this game with keyboard and mouse lol.

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The way people play with keyboard and mouse? The answer to that would be competently and efficiently. I mean, if you like being able to just click your targets instead of that herp derp method the controller uses to scroll through everything. Or the lightning fast turning speed of a mouse instead of that (strangely enough) "keyboard turning" speed the controller does it at. Or the ability to have dozens of keybinds at your fingertips instead of scrolling through that small, limited number cross hotbar cluster@#$%.

Sure, you don't need to use a keyboard and mouse to get the job done. You don't need an engine in your car either. Just bolt a sail to it and hope the wind is blowing the right way. You'll get to where you're going eventually, even if it is slow and ineffective. Who cares if you're slowing down traffic if you enjoy sailing a car?

The PS3 is old, and out of date. This game will either have to support it forever, or drop it solely in favor of the PS4 after a year or two (I'm hoping for this). It has nothing to do with disdain for PS3 players, I love that people on consoles are making my world bigger. It's nothing against them.

I just don't want my graphics to never be improved, for areas never to get bigger, etc etc because we have to be held back by an antiquated console system that plays the game on low settings as is. Surely, you can understand this mentality even as a proud PS3 player.

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Originally Posted by Nathan061111

At the end of the day an average to good ps3 player is better than a bad to average PC player. Skill means mote than the system you play on.

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What are you even trying to say here? You essentially just confirmed PC>PS3 so what is your point

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Originally Posted by MurakumoMillennium

You don't need an engine in your car either. Just bolt a sail to it and hope the wind is blowing the right way. You'll get to where you're going eventually, even if it is slow and ineffective. Who cares if you're slowing down traffic if you enjoy sailing a car?

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Playing on a PS3 is not slow or ineffective if you play it right. If you can't do it right then more fool you. Technically the PS3 is a car without a shell, but it still has the basic engine to make it go - yes it can be a bit cold to drive at times and sometimes unpleasant to look at but when driven right it's just as effective if not faster than a car with a shell.

no issues with ps3. if u suck it doesnt matter which platform u play on. just saying.