Coil T2 rage mode...

SE designed this fight to do xxx amount of dmg every 3 seconds at 0 ticks. Working as intended.
3 healers instead off an tank makes titan's damage a joke. Is that an exploit too?

Btw don't you get rid of mechanics by killing the nodes anyway? like there is allagan rot node. Would take a while to kill the node that you would hit the zero ticks ADS tulmult. So i think this is an alternate strategy. Coil 1 and 2 are easy any method you use.

Koeta recorded a run of a static using this method
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwfEV...ature=youtu.be

Not really an exploit but the enrage seems horribly undertuned. Should make the aoe slowly go up as time passes or have him do his normal skills aswell.

Simply put - this should be consider exploit.
Enrage Timer - Why we have enrages timers - to make sure a minimum number of DPS/GEAR CHECK is needed, else we'd go with 1 tank and 7 healers and eventuallly we will never die.

So enrage timer is there to instant wipe the raid if you dont suceed killing the boss in considered amoutn of time. Some enrage timers are one shotting people and some 1shot the whole raid. You can gain some extra seconds from enrage timer but you should not be able to leave through if for however long.

People like easy ways because they dont have what it takes to do normal/difficult way.
I'm sure this bug will be patched, bug not soon as SE does not do fixes that fast most of the time.

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Originally Posted by Simos

Enrage Timer - Why we have enrages timers - to make sure a minimum number of DPS/GEAR CHECK is needed, else we'd go with 1 tank and 7 healers and eventuallly we will never die.

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Pretty sure you'll die from boredom in that config. :)

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Originally Posted by Simos

Simply put - this should be consider exploit.
Enrage Timer - Why we have enrages timers - to make sure a minimum number of DPS/GEAR CHECK is needed, else we'd go with 1 tank and 7 healers and eventuallly we will never die.

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According to your definition then, locking out mobs at the boss' zone-line in WP should be considered an exploit, but SE said it was not. Standing on top of pillars for Dark Devices should be considered an exploit, but SE said it was not. So far, it would appear that SE is not concerned with players utilizing unusual strategies for completing content, provided that:

- It doesn't lead to increased RMT.
- It doesn't utilize a bug/glitch.

If we have to wait for SE to approve every new strategy for content, this game will grind to a halt.

As someone who has never used this strat I like it. Considering the whole floor is about risk vs reward choices. For those crying foul that this is a gear check deferent to keep the fight within a certain timeframe, note t2 can be done, with good purchased accessories, with all members in af in 10 clicks.

This is a choice to buff ads with an undodgible steady attack, as opposed to the easily avoidable alternative.

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Originally Posted by CatholicFan

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The problem is with the enrage timer, is we don't know if it was to be a hard enrage timer or a soft one.

i would assume it was to be a hard one, but if SE fully intended to be a soft enrage timer that was fully survivable with an alternate setup, I'm all for it.

if it was to be a hard one that insta-wipes...well, its too weak.

If SE had intended for people to wipe after enrage, they would have just made them blow up like a timed out Allagan Rot. There are multiple instances where SE forces a wipe. Ifrit Spikes, Titan Heart, Garuda aoe w/ stones.

They didn't do that here, so they left the door open for this alternate method. I don't see how the viability of this is in question. When SE wants you to wipe after a certain point, they'll make you wipe. A "pulsing aoe" doesn't spell intended instant death to me.

I personally won't do this for multiple reasons. As someone stated, it's longer cuz you have to wait for the timer to run down. It also forces you to use jobs outside of your normal static composition. If you have enough people with alt classes appropriately geared for this type of run, or you're able to pug people that are competent enough to do what needs to be done, then more power to you.

SE will decide if this is a strategy they are happy with or not. If they are, it's a thing you can do. If not, they will likely patch it and make the boss next to impossible to kill during its rage period.

Not always do the people developing the battles know ahead of time just what players will do, and sometimes it can be good to know what they eventually do try for future reference. If they did try to figure them all out, they'd never release the content.

The only thing that I find odd about the strategy, is that ADS stops using his normal abilities to do some other kind of thing, which is obviously fairly simple to heal through. It's a bit of a cop out, that means a good number of PUGs will simply resort to this to bypass the difficulty of the normal rot/pacman ADS (or whichever nodes you decided to leave up). That, I would consider a good reason to say "this isn't an intended strategy, please don't use it, and it will be made harder to use."

Content should be harder when you hit a rage timer, not easier or simpler. If you can still pull it off post-rage, then more power to you. It's not as impressive to essentially "cheat" the mechanics by bypassing it for something more preferable.

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Originally Posted by Myrhn

I would like enrage to be like T5, insta-wipe, thats why the enrage is there for.

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And every time you say something stupid in forums, SE should Double your Sub fee.

An enrage that acts as an enabler. Please tell me more about how this is good game design.

It's bad game design but certainly not an exploit, I would rather do it the more time efficient way though.

People who build LB to get a 3 bar for titan, are they cheating? That's supposed to be a dps/gear check.
People who skip feathers and burn garuda down, are they cheating? That's supposed to be a mechanic you have to deal with.
People who skip adds on caduceus, are they cheating? They're avoiding a mechanic with superior gear.
People who run past mobs in T3, are they cheating? The mobs are supposed to be killed or they wouldn't be in there.
People who powercure through T4 rage, are they cheating? Or is that enrage timer supposed to insta-wipe parties now, too?

People crying foul over this need to be quiet, because I'd bet dollars to donuts that they do each of those things. Also, anyone who has actually fought ADS in T2 knows that dodging his mechanics is laughably easy anyway. I'd guess it's harder for a party to cure through all that crap than it is for them to do it normally. It just puts all the stress on the healers and gives the melee a break from dodging. I'm all for it.

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Originally Posted by Peptaru

People who skip feathers and burn garuda down, are they cheating? That's supposed to be a mechanic you have to deal with.
People who skip adds on caduceus, are they cheating? They're avoiding a mechanic with superior gear.
People who run past mobs in T3, are they cheating? The mobs are supposed to be killed or they wouldn't be in there.
People who powercure through T4 rage, are they cheating? Or is that enrage timer supposed to insta-wipe parties now, too?

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Powering through something with superior gear and forcing an enrage timer to make the fight EASIER are very different things. The T4 enrage is something you run into towards the end of phase 6 and it actually makes the fight harder.

I get it that people found an easier way to deal with T2 and they don't want to have it taken away but don't pretend this is intended in any shape or form.

HAS NO ONE SEE FIGHT CLUB?!?!?!

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Originally Posted by Xikkorak

Powering through something with superior gear and forcing an enrage timer to make the fight EASIER are very different things. The T4 enrage is something you run into towards the end of phase 6 and it actually makes the fight harder.

I get it that people found an easier way to deal with T2 and they don't want to have it taken away but don't pretend this is intended in any shape or form.

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As I said, his mechanics are so easy to dodge, I'd say doing him normally is easier. Thank you for explaining the T4 rage to me, by my use of it in a familiar way, it was clear that I didn't know what or when it was.
And ignoring/avoiding/skipping mechanics is ignoring/avoiding/skipping mechanics regardless of the purpose or effect. Instead of condemning people who don't live up to your standards of gaming, you should be celebrating that people found a use for melee DPS.

I don't understand what the big deal is. Is it because people are butt hurt that others got through something easier than the way they've always done it ? And have some crazy ego that "unless you do it this way, you're not worthy!" ? That's what it seems like to me. People getting butt hurt because they can't be happy for others for figuring out a way that makes it easier for them.

It's definitely easier if you PUG it every week. It's pretty common to end up with at least one clueless player in a PUG and it only takes one person to botch the Rot passing and restart the run. The enrage method eliminates a good portion of the individual responsibility in T2 which saves you from having the space cadet wipe you 10x. If you have a static that has been clearing T1-4 for a while; there's no reason to go this route.

Not supporting or defending it; I had always done Rot method, missed the FC train this week, and ended up beating it with this enrage method last night in a random PUG. It's not the Wall of Justice in XI, but it's more like NINs subbing BRD for Raptor Mazurka. The former was a clear exploit and the latter was unintended use of a mechanic for players' benefit that was eventually patched; I think this is like the latter and I wouldn't be heartbroken if they remove it or left it in.

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Originally Posted by Peptaru

As I said, his mechanics are so easy to dodge, I'd say doing him normally is easier.

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Instead of condemning people who don't live up to your standards of gaming, you should be celebrating that people found a use for melee DPS.

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Not sure if serious

If enrage was meant to be game over it would be, it's not so it wasn't meant to be. It never made since that coil is supposed to be the endgame and you have a 12min timer. Also I wouldn't mind being a healer in the traditional method, I usually slow my dps at first so that the other mage gets most the hate and therefor all the lasers and I don't have to dodge much. Being a healer in the second method seems liek way more work then being a dps, so to dps its easier but to tank/healer its a bit more intense. I do this because while I have reduced my lag it's still pretty bad and this game doesn't allow for any sort of lag in endgame if you have lag you either have to be proactively compensating for it or you are stuck at garuda never to move forward. There is no forgiveness in this game no fight to come back. So why you may have your perfect internet connection my only option now is to hardwire. I finally fixed most of the lag and then game registers this and boost up my graphic and that pisses me off I want my graphics low so I can survive and I set them low. don't go oh better connection, screw your low settings and screw the red lines and letting him see animations lets make his character look smoother. I can do that on my own in the inn watching cutscenes I would rather survive a fight.

Honestly, you guys aren't crediting SE with being very clever. I'm pretty sure it occurred to them that the amount of damage the T2 enrage would generate would be something players could learn to manage, since.. you know... they coded its numbers and all.

They may have intended it as a kind of over time, sort of like turn 4's. Survive the fight up to now, boss probably low hp, give them this enrage to pressure the group to finish or die. And I'm sure that when they made the decision to have the boss stop using other moves at this point, it may well have occurred to them that groups might try to tackle this mechanic rather than the other mechanics.

Just because there are alternate/multiple solutions to the problem (namely: acquire loot) doesn't mean they are "poor design" or "exploit." It just means there are multiple solutions. Turn 2 is all about cost-benefit choices. Which nodes to kill? Kill an extra or have more time on boss? Face the lazers and rot or face the enrage? Different groups will make different choices.

One method people use for rot is the staggered stack up (first person gets it, stands in centet, second person runs in right before explosion, third, fourth, etc until they are all stacked so it automatically cascades.) This isn't an exploit. Imo its not needed and we don't do it, but it is a alternate solution.

people who simply suck at gaming will always find cheap ways to beat things, I'd never do it cause I think it's just too lame but I can see it becoming a trend; most players want rewards without actually doing something even remotely hard for it.

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Originally Posted by Thanotos

And every time you say something stupid in forums, SE should Double your Sub fee.

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I really hope they do that. Tha way people like you find another place to go.

Did this this week, makes for a nice little light show. Just wanted to see what it was like before it gets patched. I'm pretty sure SE was expecting this to go off in groups at the tail end of the bosses HP, with rot still out. IMO this just made the fight way too easy. Another issue this is causing is now only 1/8 players looking for T4 groups is tanks. For this reason and the fact that this fight is now a simplistic loot pinata I hope it gets patched.

gotta be honest....our group tried this last night. we on turn 4 and quite well geared....we found it a lot harder lol, and way more stressful...maybe we just missing a key point to the strategy

How did a healer only have Iffrits, don't you need a relic to get into coil? I haven't tried to join without one so I don't know for sure.

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Originally Posted by Bayman

How did a healer only have Iffrits, don't you need a relic to get into coil? I haven't tried to join without one so I don't know for sure.

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You need to have cleared titan hard mode. That doesn't entail that you have a relic, and even if you do, you could enter on a class you don't have relic for yet.

Bigger question: There are people who don't have all relics? Plebeians.


(J/k)

Even though our group was able to one-shot Turn 1 on a regular basis, we still tried out the Burn tactic this week to keep things fresh, and it turned out to be a lot of fun.

The same goes for Turn 2. We don't have any problems with Turn 2, but we're going to try this tactic out next week anyway, since running the same content over and over can get a little boring; this actually sounds like a fun new tactic with a different party requirement.

Hi, i have a little Question, is this a Exploid.

I have a discussion in my Guild, the most player think it is an exploid when we kill the ADS in Enraged mode.