How do you tank Titan Hard and keep hate the whole way as Paladin?

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Originally Posted by AdvancedWind

That said, if the fairy uses Whispering Dawn on a 8-man group before the tank has some time to grab hate, it might end up getting too much hate for the same reason as Medica II. Put it on steady / obey to avoid it, but otherwise hate is never a problem.

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Disturbingly enough my faerie tends to get hate mid fight or towards the end. Only thing I can think of is that some of the tanks in my party start getting lazy in regards to their rotations.

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Originally Posted by Linadae

Disturbingly enough my faerie tends to get hate mid fight or towards the end. Only thing I can think of is that some of the tanks in my party start getting lazy in regards to their rotations.

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After a jump if the tank doesn't do shield lob right away a WHM or Faerie will get agro... the tank just can't stand at the edge and wait for him to come back, he will not.

Any time Titan is standing far enough that I can't reach him with my sword, I use shield lob, if for no other reason than I want to constantly be doing damage to him regardless of how little damage a tank actually does. More hate is an added benefit of this.

Just blame it on Eos, its almost always his fault!

I hate running with sch's in WP because of EOS. They get lazy and don't reposition their pet and they pull the tonberries, every single time.

I haven't had a problem with losing hate on Titan. However, when I'm the offtank, the main tank always seems to have problems keeping hate. I usually have to take over for him. It makes me sort of sad.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

A WHM shouldn't be "spamming" Medica II regardless, because of how some of its healing is tied into a HoT. They should only use it once and if more healing is still necessary, finish up with a Medica while the HoT is ticking (or single target heals to top people off, if you've got enough time or people are too spread out). I've never had a single aggro issue healing in this manner in any fight where Medica/Medica II come up as useful spells.

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Exactly. I had to coach a few new whm's in our FF about that. Took some of them a bit to understand though. They seem to forget there is more than one healer, so I had to encourage them to trust their other party members. We eventually won our attempts easily so it's all about the teamwork.

Provoke > Shield Lob > Get in front of him > Sword Moves > Flash > Repeat.

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Originally Posted by Gucci_Charms

Provoke > Shield Lob > Get in front of him > Sword Moves > Flash > Repeat.

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You shouldn't start any fight by using provoke, if you do you should re-read the tool tip.

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Originally Posted by Nadrojj

You shouldn't start any fight by using provoke, if you do you should re-read the tool tip.

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Indeed. Provoke does nothing if nobody has hate yet. Use provoke only when somebody else has more hate than you.

I shield lob, then when hes in position, I just hate combo it. If its a white mage whose pulling off you, make sure they use their hate dump when they get close to you, other than that, you just have to keep the hate combo going.

My bad reversed the order lol.

Press 1, 2 and 3.

Damn, that was hard, right?

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Originally Posted by Sunarie

I've never had issues with a Scholar pulling aggro, and I'm not sure what they have for hate reduction, so no comments there.

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Nothing. Scholars split hate with their fairy, something like 2/3 fairy (if Eos), 1/3 scholar. I have my fairy pull hate sometimes on trash encounters but never bosses, so scholars are essentially always in half hate mode.

It was a nasty surprise for me and the tank when I had to switch to WHM to let the other member get their win on SCH when I tried to heal the tank going the "Cure" -> "Cure II if needed" route and immediately pulled hate on my second Cure I. After discussing it with the tank, he told me he'll try building more hate and I never hit orange again. Though I admit, I had to use shroud of saints every time it was up.

So I'd say@OP if your WHM is using shroud of saints and is not overhealing, then you should adjust your rotation somehow. Otherwise, remind your WHM to use Shroud of saints.

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Originally Posted by Ryios

I hate running with sch's in WP because of EOS. They get lazy and don't reposition their pet and they pull the tonberries, every single time.

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If you'd run with me then Eos would be your only healer. I don't even have to get out of cleric stance if the group is decently (over)geared.

All these people telling you to flash Titan are wrong. Never use flash on a single target boss fight. Its a waste of the global cooldown and generates much less hate then rage of halone combo. Initiate the fight with Fight or Flight --> Shield Lob --> Spirits Within --> Circle of Scorn --> Rage of Halone combo. Then just repeat rage of halone the entire fight, while always having fight or flight off cooldown and using spirits within and circle of scorn when they are up. Your main focus should be popping defensive cooldowns after heart phase.

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Originally Posted by Gucci_Charms

My bad reversed the order lol.

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Not really, provoke shouldn't be in your list at all to pull hate initially. It's an "oh shit button". It's only good for getting hate back once you lose it, and even then you have to immediately follow it up with another enmity move because it only makes you even on the threat list with the person with the most hate. at the start of the fight that should be you. So if it's in your list to start that means it does nothing at all except put provoke on cooldown.

If you are losing hate its most likely a WHM spamming medica/II make sure they are checking their hate bars and force them to dump the hate.

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Originally Posted by HeiZei

All these people telling you to flash Titan are wrong. Never use flash on a single target boss fight. Its a waste of the global cooldown and generates much less hate then rage of halone combo. Initiate the fight with Fight or Flight --> Shield Lob --> Spirits Within --> Circle of Scorn --> Rage of Halone combo. Then just repeat rage of halone the entire fight, while always having fight or flight off cooldown and using spirits within and circle of scorn when they are up. Your main focus should be popping defensive cooldowns after heart phase.

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I disagree. While I don't recommend spamming it, Flash is an enmity generating move that doesn't use TP thus giving you more TP to use for skills like Spirits Within and Circle of Scorn. The reason to use it is to put more enmity generating moves into your rotation.

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Originally Posted by HeiZei

All these people telling you to flash Titan are wrong. Never use flash on a single target boss fight. Its a waste of the global cooldown and generates much less hate then rage of halone combo. Initiate the fight with Fight or Flight --> Shield Lob --> Spirits Within --> Circle of Scorn --> Rage of Halone combo. Then just repeat rage of halone the entire fight, while always having fight or flight off cooldown and using spirits within and circle of scorn when they are up. Your main focus should be popping defensive cooldowns after heart phase.

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This is close to how I tank. I repeat Fight or Flight + Rage of Halone(Combo). Shield Lob when waiting for titan to return after jump if i'm good on TP. Use Spirits within and circle of scorn in between GCD when up. Only time a healer will take the boss is if they are spam happy with medica II at the start of the fight.

Might use Flash if low on TP or have a very large enmity lead.

You want to use flash for the Blind Debuff after the Heart.

Missing a Mountain Buster (or even a Rock Buster before Mountain Buster) is a huge help.

I use blind potions on WAR.

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Originally Posted by HeiZei

All these people telling you to flash Titan are wrong. Never use flash on a single target boss fight. Its a waste of the global cooldown and generates much less hate then rage of halone combo. Initiate the fight with Fight or Flight --> Shield Lob --> Spirits Within --> Circle of Scorn --> Rage of Halone combo. Then just repeat rage of halone the entire fight, while always having fight or flight off cooldown and using spirits within and circle of scorn when they are up. Your main focus should be popping defensive cooldowns after heart phase.

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I disagree. Flash can be used to make moves miss which means you could possibly take ZERO DAMAGE. Like Molly Said, it preserves TP too.

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Originally Posted by HeiZei

All these people telling you to flash Titan are wrong. Never use flash on a single target boss fight. Its a waste of the global cooldown and generates much less hate then rage of halone combo. Initiate the fight with Fight or Flight --> Shield Lob --> Spirits Within --> Circle of Scorn --> Rage of Halone combo. Then just repeat rage of halone the entire fight, while always having fight or flight off cooldown and using spirits within and circle of scorn when they are up. Your main focus should be popping defensive cooldowns after heart phase.

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Pretty much this.

The only time I'll use Flash in a single target boss fight is when I'm out of TP and need to keep some enmity up while it regens a bit.

If you are losing hate on titan its probably because the whm is using too much medica 2. Medica 2 should not be used at all until the heart phase. Medica 1 will do.

A lot of whm don't understand overheals indeed to count for hate. Medica 2 puts a regen on everyone and at start of the fight where you don't need it that is a lot of extra hate from over heals on the regen.

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Originally Posted by HeiZei

All these people telling you to flash Titan are wrong. Never use flash on a single target boss fight. Its a waste of the global cooldown and generates much less hate then rage of halone combo. Initiate the fight with Fight or Flight --> Shield Lob --> Spirits Within --> Circle of Scorn --> Rage of Halone combo. Then just repeat rage of halone the entire fight, while always having fight or flight off cooldown and using spirits within and circle of scorn when they are up. Your main focus should be popping defensive cooldowns after heart phase.

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Flashing Titan is awesome if you do it before mountain buster there is a very high chance he will miss you and it will save the healers from having to heal 4k damage.

Primals don't even need flash for hate. Shield lob. Spirit,flight, fast blade and scorn. Every phase get shieldlob on him asap

Tell your healers to use shroud when hate gets up and refrain from using medica II till after heart. No matter how good of a tank you are 2 casts of that and the healer will take threat.

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Originally Posted by Arcturius

Tell your healers to use shroud when hate gets up and refrain from using medica II till after heart. No matter how good of a tank you are 2 casts of that and the healer will take threat.

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Yea I seen this mistake so much, I seen people medica 2 on the stomps in phase 1, then complain when they pull hate.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

Flashing Titan is awesome if you do it before mountain buster there is a very high chance he will miss you and it will save the healers from having to heal 4k damage.

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I rarely get hit for 4k dmg because we have a ton of defensive cool downs. Our healers precast heals expecting me to get hit so it doesn't save them a lot. I will rotate in a flash just in case shit hit's the fan and they can't heal me.

much tanker lose agro, becuase many whm overheals and also many blm like to spam fire3+flare like is there was no tomorrow, now if u losing agro to another class, them problem is on u.

Make sure your healers use shroud when their hate gets high. I Medica II after jumps and have never had a problem with hate with properly timed shrouds.

Tell your WHMs to stop using Medica II until after heart phase.

There is no need for it until then.

Open -> Fight or Flight -> Run to Titan -> Flash -> Circle of Scorn -> Fast Blade -> During GCD Spirits Within -> Savage Blade -> Rage of Halone

Constant Rotation: Halone Combo + Circle of Scorn/Spirits Within (weave)

@ Phase 1st Landslide -> Foresight (Tumults) -> Bulwark (Post-Tumults) -> 2nd Landslide -> (Tumults) Convalescence

@ Jump -> Rampart (before it lands and deals AOE) -> @ Phase 2 -> Repeat ^

@ 2nd Jump -> Sentinel (before it lands and deals AOE) -> @ Phase 3 -> Repeat ^

@ 3rd Jump -> Rampart (before it lands and deals AOE) -> @ Phase 4 (Heart) -> Tab + Shield Lob -> Combo + Circle of Scorn

- Heart downed -> Attack Gaol
- Gaol broken to edge -> Sentinel or Rampart for Earthen Fury -> @ Phase 5 -> Mountain Buster #1 -> Repeat Cycle
- Mountain Buster #2 -> Sentinel or Rampart (whichever you didn't use on 1st) -> Repeat Cycle
- Mountain Buster #3 -> Either (a.) Capped HP - Convalescence (b.) Lower HP - Hallowed Ground (Use a Macro to notify the healers so the do not Overcure or stress. Have a notification in macro set to effect duration to notify when vulnerable again*)
- Repeat ^ (as needed)

Key notes: Mega-potion of Vitality -> Use as Earthen Fury animation plays so your Max HP is higher; this allows the WHM/SCH a higher HP cap and more margin for error on the the first Mountain Buster.

If at all possible avoid taking Bomb damage in Phase 5 (post-heart).

If you need to use your Provoke - do so after a jump. If you do not have hate during Phase 4 (Heart) you should wipe - if this is happening though there may be serious issues with your gear.

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Originally Posted by Mahtari

I haven't had a problem with losing hate on Titan. However, when I'm the offtank, the main tank always seems to have problems keeping hate. I usually have to take over for him. It makes me sort of sad.

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We've been finding lately that Relic/Relic +1 coupled with Sword Oath seems to be doing enough DPS to almost or sometimes completely overtake the +enmity boost from Shield Oath even if the Shielder has a Relic/+1 as well. You might just have to just switch over to Riot Blade combos if your hate starts getting wonky as offtank.

If you're getting hate without doing Rage of Halone combos then.... uh...