RDM should get a slight nerf

Summoner could use a buff, that doesn't mean RDM needs a nerf. That's pretty ridiculous to even suggest honestly. RDM is fine. Keep it as it is, buff weaker jobs, maybe nerf Reaper slightly and maybe monk. that's all we need.

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Originally Posted by rewd

Magick Barrier is far better than anything Phoenix does because you can time it and it's not dependent on fight design. Mitigation is also better than healing with how bloated healer kits are (and how strong tank healing is, minus DRK). Verraise is better than Resurrection and the fact that you technically don't need to raise once you are farming just highlights how overtuned RDM is or, relatively, how undertuned SMN is because that means that RDM is superior both for prog and kills.

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For some reason people think that the Phoenix Regen is really great utility. I think they forgot how simple and easy it is to heal in this game even in prog

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Originally Posted by Dyvid

IMO, RDM and SMN are pretty much on par with one another in terms of utility.

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They're not. The only comparable thing about them is the Raise and party buff.

People have said this time and again, Phoenix's "utility" is too inconvenient to matter. No one is going to hold onto Phoenix for regens, especially when healers have a plethora of healing tools. It won't make a difference.

Magick Barrier and Radiant Aegis isn't even a fair comparison because Radiant Aegis only affects yourself, not the entire party. If you're going to do that then might as well add BLM's Manawall to the discussion.

If phoenix heal doesn't count as utility because healing is easy, then shouldn't Magick Barrier not count as utility for the same exact reason?

Okay, but branching outside of the M. Ranged role; why does RDM get Magick Barrier with two effects and the P. Ranged only get reduced cooldown on their equivalent?
Gimme secondary effects on Troubadour and such. :mad:

You can actually use Magick Barrier on-demand and it reduces damage which in theory gives healers less need to heal and more time to DPS.

Meanwhile the Phoenix regens are unreliable because it's part of SMN's rotation and it would more likely take effect when nobody needs healing. I don't understand why people think it's good nor think it actually matters as utility. It just doesn't.

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Originally Posted by Sylvant

Okay, but branching outside of the M. Ranged role; why does RDM get Magick Barrier with two effects and the P. Ranged only get reduced cooldown on their equivalent?
Gimme secondary effects on Troubadour and such. :mad:

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Magick Barrier lasts 10 seconds and only does magic damage. Troubadour lasts 15 seconds and does all damage.

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Originally Posted by SaberMaxwell

Magick Barrier lasts 10 seconds and only does magic damage. Troubadour lasts 15 seconds and does all damage.

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Nooo! I knew somebody would call me on my bullshit...

Jokes aside, I do think RDM has gotten quite the arsenal of supportive tools to the job's benefit. So far, they've only stolen cookies from the WHM and BLM cookie jar, so I'm happy they're kind of branching out and using things in other jobs as well. I don't think the job needs a nerf, rather, I think SMN needs to be brought up a little bit.
Now if only they'd get more melee skills...

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Originally Posted by Sylvant

Nooo! I knew somebody would call me on my bullshit...

Jokes aside, I do think RDM has gotten quite the arsenal of supportive tools to the job's benefit. So far, they've only stolen cookies from the WHM and BLM cookie jar, so I'm happy they're kind of branching out and using things in other jobs as well. I don't think the job needs a nerf, rather, I think SMN needs to be brought up a little bit.
Now if only they'd get more melee skills...

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I agree, SMN needs to be brought up to RDM's level. RDM got a lot good this expansion, though everybody else is looking at Magick Barrier while I'm like "Look everyone! Acceleration changes! Bankable mobility I'm so happy!" I think a nerf Red Mage does need is to make Verraise incompatible with Dualcast, that way they can keep raise and they can keep swiftcast raise and the utility gets equaled out with SMN's own variant of the spell.

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Originally Posted by MaelleRiou

If phoenix heal doesn't count as utility because healing is easy, then shouldn't Magick Barrier not count as utility for the same exact reason?

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Because mitigation is always good because it can make a difference in a raid wide and mechanics.the problem with healing is it really easy to cap the party hp with just oGCDs or one GCD even in healing extensive fights.

But even if Phoenix Regen would be useful it's on a 2 minute CD that you have to use when the CD is up because you can't delay your rotation