Changes Need to be Made to HoH

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Originally Posted by ArchlordPie

Matched party HoH is for whatever the matched party says it's for. If 3 people in the group decide they're speedrunning and skipping all the silver chests, then the run is a speedrun and silver chests will be skipped. If you don't like it, throw up a PF for "HoH aetherpool leveling" and stack the group with other people like you who want to hunt for upgrades. Most of the people solo queuing for HoH already have max aetherpool gear and just want to get in and get out, and quite frankly, if you got votekicked from HoH to begin with, you did something very wrong, because you can quite literally run a whole 21-30 round there without ever contributing in combat and still not get kicked as long as you're not interfering with everyone else's progress.

If I had to guess, all you did was ignore the fact that the exit was open and 3 people were standing in it waiting for you to join them, and you made them wait long enough that it convinced them that they'd get done faster if they kicked you and 3-manned the rest of the run.

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I won't address each point you've made as I know I've addressed all of them in my other posts. I appreciate your added voice to the conversation though. I know we won't agree, so there is no point in trying to change your mind.

The one point I'll state again is that the dungeon wasn't intended to be a exp farm. People found that it was an easy way to gain exp. I shouldn't have to change my playstyle when my playstyle fits the original purpose of the dungeon. That is what PF is for, when you want to do something outside of the original purpose. Exp was a side effect as SE knew people wouldn't run it if there wasn't an added bonus for people with max aether and/or didn't want the loot contained. They have to incentive other players to join to help the ones who are late to the content.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

HoH—and PotD—have always been “majority rules” when it comes to either the fast runs or coffer runs. It’s never been fully about one or the other. Whatever the majority of the group wants is what the party does. Just like any other content that you queue up for via a matched party. If someone doesn’t match the mentality of the majority, then the majority have the right to remove them. “Difference in playstyle” is a valid reason for a vote dismissal. It would be the same for the other way as well: if a majority wanted to farm chests and intuitions, but Bobby the DPS just wants to speed through.



You can use Party Finder for what you want to do as well. This street goes both ways.



It also doesn’t say anything about farming chests or intuitions for the sacks.

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Majority rules because that is what SE intended or majority rules bc that is what everyone decided was their preferred method of exping?

Actually, it does say something about intuitions:

"Locating the Accursed Hoard
While a pomander of intuition is in effect, an icon on the navigation map will indicate the presence of a piece of the Accursed Hoard."

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Originally Posted by AbysmalDuck

The one point I'll state again is that the dungeon wasn't intended to be a exp farm. People found that it was an easy way to gain exp. I shouldn't have to change my playstyle when my playstyle fits the original purpose of the dungeon. That is what PF is for, when you want to do something outside of the original purpose. Exp was a side effect as SE knew people wouldn't run it if there wasn't an added bonus for people with max aether and/or didn't want the loot contained. They have to incentive other players to join to help the ones who are late to the content.

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Did they ever say any of this? Seems a little odd they wouldn't fix this problem in the 4 years since HoH has been out. Especially since HoH is basically just another PotD which is even older content which is also and still used to farm levels.

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Originally Posted by AbysmalDuck

You are right, I could take my advice, but then you would basically say that everything in the game needs to be party findered as you said since there is no "right" way to play in a matched party. We are playing with wording at that point.

Also, the items in the hoard sacks may not be anything to you, but to me they are a way of collecting minions that I haven't gotten from retainers. The thing I'm trying to get across here if you want to play outside the scope of what the dungeon was originally designed for, then you should go to PF.

This is from the NA FFXIV official HoH page:

"While floors up to 30 are related to the story of Heaven-on-High, all floors after were created strictly as a challenge for players."

This does not say anything about speedrunning or exp farming. Again, this isn't to argue about what people are using HoH for. It is to state that I should not be vote dismissed for simply doing what the duty was created for.

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But of course not. PF applies to duties where you insist the party plays only one way - yours. In this case you indeed should use it. In a matched party you will have to deal with others playing a different way sometimes. And tools like in-game chat or vote dismiss exist to attain a certain compromise. And slightly tangentially but dismissing someone for "difference in playstyle" is completely valid.

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Originally Posted by AbysmalDuck

I know people will disagree and I'll get a lot of hate, but then again that is what this is for to provide my opinion and have an open discussion.

I want to go into HoH to gain aetherpool and collect chests. That was what the dungeon was created for. It was not created for 10 level speed runs to level your alts. Unfortunately, that was something the community found as a fast way of leveling and that is fine, but that isn't what matched party making is for. You should be creating party finders for this as you are changing the original intent of the dungeon to your playstyle.

This is the definition of party finder. PF is for speedruns/exp farming. You should not be allowed to vote dismiss me from HoH when I'm simply doing the duty as it was created to be done.

As I said, considering how many people I've had say shit to me thus far from just trying to collect silver chests and get intuitions, I know I'll get flamed, but if at least one person from SE sees this, I would appreciate you doing something about either the amount of exp or something to deter from this behavior.

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You know you can do what you want solo queueing. Plus fixed party is for what you are looking for. Thats for doing something specific. Matched puts you at the mercy of three strangers.

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Originally Posted by hydralus

You're trying to impose your playstyle on 3 other randoms while also saying it's wrong for them to impose their playstyle on you. Just relax. If you want complete control over the group content you run, make a PF for it, or try and run it solo.

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That's the thing though, I'm not imposing anything. I'm running the content as it was created and designed for. The other 3 are imposing their "exp farm/speedrun" playstyle on me. Like I said, I knew people would disagree and that is fine, but don't disagree just because the community has decided they like this way to farm exp. Provide a better excuse other than "You don't pay my sub."

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Originally Posted by AbysmalDuck

Majority rules because that is what SE intended or majority rules bc that is what everyone decided was their preferred method of exping?

Actually, it does say something about intuitions:

"Locating the Accursed Hoard
While a pomander of intuition is in effect, an icon on the navigation map will indicate the presence of a piece of the Accursed Hoard."

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Okay, and where does this imply that this is the purpose of the dungeon? Nowhere. You are trying to impose a purpose that isn’t there so that it will line up with your argument.

The content is multi-faceted. You cannot pin a singular purpose onto it, and it was never stated that the sole purpose of PotD/HoH was for loot farming or experience farming. So your argument doesn’t have any weight to it. You are trying to impose a playstyle onto 3 random people while complaining that they are doing the same to you. That’s a bit hypocritical.

Go solo or go with a like-minded party, problem solved.

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Originally Posted by AbysmalDuck

That's the thing though, I'm not imposing anything. I'm running the content as it was created and designed for. The other 3 are imposing their "exp farm/speedrun" playstyle on me. Like I said, I knew people would disagree and that is fine, but don't disagree just because the community has decided they like this way to farm exp. Provide a better excuse other than "You don't pay my sub."

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You're making their speedruns take longer so you're imposing your playstyle on them by holding them up.

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Originally Posted by Azuri

But of course not. PF applies to duties where you insist the party plays only one way - yours. In this case you indeed should use it. In a matched party you will have to deal with others playing a different way sometimes. And tools like in-game chat or vote dismiss exist to attain a certain compromise. And slightly tangentially but dismissing someone for "difference in playstyle" is completely valid.

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While I disagree, as I said to someone else, it was reported as a abuse of the vote dismiss system, so it is up to SE. I know I'll never hear the outcome and that is fine, but I at least did my part. Difference in playstyle can mean a lot of things. Them sitting at the exit point and not helping while still earning accursed hoard from my getting chests would be a difference in playstyle, but since I'm not the majority I get screwed. I did nothing wrong outside the confines of the dungeon/duty and therefore should not be removed.