Battle System Rant

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Originally Posted by mosaicex

I don't even. Shirking does not eliminate the need for tank swapping in fights that actually require you to do so, it just makes the process smoother. I have no idea what you're trying to complain about.

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Shirk gives 25% of the user's enmity to someone(Mostly the person who is main tanking) sounds like it needs to be on Healer AND DPS role action list instead of tanks, and you certainly don't need 2 role actions dedicated to tank swapping since most fights don't even call for it especially before Stormblood where Shirk wasn't even conceived at that point. Then again I am a DRK main who is still salty about unnecessary nerfs the job shit when Stormblood launched and most role actions felt like a slap to the face if you noticed some of the animations from tank role action or recycled from DRK only actions with different looks.

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Originally Posted by DRKoftheAzure

Shirk gives 25% of the user's enmity to someone(Mostly the person who is main tanking) sounds like it needs to be on Healer AND DPS role action list instead of tanks

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Let's say this happened, what would you purpose to replace the two actions for NIN that deal with emnity (Shadewalker and Smokescreen)? I mean no one picks NIN just for those actions but it does give it some unique standing amongst the other jobs, having Shirk as cross role for DPS kinda removes that niche for them.

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Originally Posted by Kurando

Let's say this happened, what would you purpose to replace the two actions for NIN that deal with emnity (Shadewalker and Smokescreen)? I mean no one picks NIN just for those actions but it does give it some unique standing amongst the other jobs, having Shirk as cross role for DPS kinda removes that niche for them.

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Leave those abilities alone and give Shirk to SAM? The recent "buff" to Merciful Eyes isn't going to be noticeable due to it be gated by an Third Eye proc. Alternatively; Give Shirk to NIN so that NIN has Shadewalker, Smokescreen, and Shirk.

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Originally Posted by DRKoftheAzure

Leave those abilities alone and give Shirk to SAM? The recent "buff" to Merciful Eyes isn't going to be noticeable due to it be gated by an Third Eye proc. Alternatively; Give Shirk to NIN so that NIN has Shadewalker, Smokescreen, and Shirk.

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It's literally free threat reduction, and every savage fight we've had is plentiful on raid wide damage.

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

It's literally free threat reduction, and every savage fight we've had is plentiful on raid wide damage.

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Latency is a big factor and you also have to perfectly time it in which every other time you can't even get it because of the 3 second window to get the proc for the that reduction which the game asks you to be perfect when other jobs can do that without the need for a proc. Making things needlessly complicated is not fun.

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Originally Posted by DRKoftheAzure

Latency is a big factor and you also have to perfectly time it in which every other time you can't even get it because of the 3 second window to get the proc for the that reduction which the game asks you to be perfect when other jobs can do that without the need for a proc. Making things needlessly complicated is not fun.

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If by 'time it perfectly' you mean 'hit it about 50% cast bar'

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

If by 'time it perfectly' you mean 'hit it about 50% cast bar'

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This. It's been a long time since I've missed a Third Eye. And without a NIN, a Merciful Eyes can mean more for rDPS (via tank dps) than Seigan. I'll Merciful whenever I'm nearing taking MT enmity if it won't lose me a Kaiten, Shinten, or Seigan over TA, or whenever to near to wait. Honestly, without a Monk present, I usually see Shirk again relegated to the tank swaps themselves these days, rather than CircleShirking.

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Originally Posted by Ekimmak

Funnily enough, both WERE available for cross-class before the revamp. Cure has a higher potency than Physick to make up for the latter having a fairy helping them.

When skills have differences in order to balance them (such as proc'ing something, a different cost or a different potency) they aren't good for role skills. I'm assuming that's why Anticipation doesn't get stronger on DRK to make up for taking away Dark Dance. I can only assume Raise stopped being cross class because of Resurrection, since they didn't want to take that away from Summoner.

The only case I know of where a role skill interacts with an actual job's toolset is how Paladin gets a boost to intervention if Rampart is up, but the thing is, it's not the job changing the role skill, it's the role skill changing the job, which I believe is easier to program.

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Actually Cure, Physick, and Benefic are all the same potency. The only differences are the traits that whm and ast get with them (sch has no traits on physick). Cure has a chance to proc a free Cure 2 and Benefic has a chance to make the next Benefic 2 crit heal.

Eye for an Eye used to be an arcanist (sch/smn) defensive buff, but now as a role action it's longer cool down and rng nature doesn't make it useful enough anymore. Oddly it still interacts with deployment tactics on sch, but even that is kinda meh.

I'm on the side that Esuna should be removed from role actions...tired of one hit status things that you have have to bring it for like Ex-Death doom. They could have added a trait to them to make them more interesting or powerful. Maybe whm gets a small aoe cleanse (pancea?). Give sch a warden's paean type shield.

Protect should be pulled out of role actions and then rename divine benison protect...make it physical damage and then give whm shell version for magic since they lost so many skills in 4.0.

Break should have been a spammable aoe like ice 2 was (not necessarily the same range) for low level aoe.

Largesse should boost healing overall...not just magic since that cuts off half of sch's toolkit.

Something I want to see is a version of shirk for healers...why can't we pass off our healing aggro to tanks?

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Originally Posted by Kalinas

Actually Cure, Physick, and Benefic are all the same potency. The only differences are the traits that whm and ast get with them (sch has no traits on physick).

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Cure is 450 potency while the other two are only 400.

Largesse + abilities is a problem that has to be adresses that's for sure.

Dissipation suffer from the same issue