Please reconsider making tanks 100% vit-based damage for 4.0

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Originally Posted by Legion88

And what should happen with the STR on the whole Tankgear?
-Replace it with an additional substat?
-Raplace it with an additional materia slot?
-Just get rid of it?
-Stays as a fluff stat?

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% damage blocked/parried like it did in ARR or just remove it. really, probably should just remove it since it'd be as useless as parry unless there was a major change in how you tank bosses

Another issue is that the VIT/STR split makes secondary stats more important on tank gear, compared to other jobs, because the primary stats are weighted lower. This, coupled with the fact that you can get both parry and/or accuracy on tank gear pieces, occasionally results in situations in which lower ilvl gear is stronger than higher ilvl gear.

You can't phase out STR mid-expansion, though, so I'm hoping that they're just waiting on 4.0 to rectify this.

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Originally Posted by Lyth

Another issue is that the VIT/STR split makes secondary stats more important on tank gear, compared to other jobs, because the primary stats are weighted lower. This, coupled with the fact that you can get both parry and/or accuracy on tank gear pieces, occasionally results in situations in which lower ilvl gear is stronger than higher ilvl gear.

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The Vit/Str split doesn't do that... that happens with every job due to how the playerbase putting no weight on Accuracy and Parry tons of weight of Crit Rate.

The i260 crit/det Diabolic Turban of Scouting would be BiS for Ninja if they didn't need the accuracy purely due to the other choices being det/acc and acc/crit.

If you look at secondary stats on tanks, stats like crit, det, and ss have relatively higher weight values compared to other jobs (compare 0.530 per point of crit on DRK vs. 0.279 on DRG). You can either think of this as secondary stats being relatively stronger, or primary stats being relatively weaker (secondary stat weights are normalized relative to the primary stats).

See here under the section on "why tank secondaries are so valued" for further discussion, straight from the player who developed the stat weights himself.

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Originally Posted by Zetsumei_Tsunarashi

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think main stat materia has no effect outside of the guaranteed slot. So those vit melds are actually not doing anything to that ring ? Could be that's only for level 60 items, I can't remember.

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So here's what happens: Now you can't even try to meld a ring the way the one I linked is, but any existing ones work properly. I've confirmed I still get the stats from that ring. And if you tried to meld vit onto a vit ring it just says +0 on the screen.

...so yes, I have equivalent i190 right side pieces even when running Wanderer's Palace normal.

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Originally Posted by Lyth

If you look at secondary stats on tanks, stats like crit, det, and ss have relatively higher weight values compared to other jobs (compare 0.530 per point of crit on DRK vs. 0.279 on DRG). You can either think of this as secondary stats being relatively stronger, or primary stats being relatively weaker (secondary stat weights are normalized relative to the primary stats).

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What this is is that they're bloated so that STR and VIT are still shown as 1's instead of the .45 they really are. Just for simplicity sake. They could list them as they actually are in game for comparison to other jobs, and then secondaries would be more like what you see on other jobs.

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Originally Posted by Llus

VIT is a main stat, but I believe the ARR gear wasn't affected by main stat overmelds. Not even sure if the 150 chrysolite gear was affected by that change (haven't had to run an overmeld like ARR in so long I'm not sure but I believe my overmelded 150 accessories still worked after the change).

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There was a time you could overmeld the 150's this way, but tier 5's are minimum i160. There were never 160+ crafted accessories till after the change. I had some of the STR 150's that I had a couple of vit melds into but nothing serious, and don't have them now. If someone did however, they could have something like a Chrysolite Ring of Slaying with 29 STR 31 VIT (8x4 tier 4 melds) then 24 crit 17 sks, and either 6 det or 7 more sks. Which you'd use would vary by job but would be close. On WAR you'd have a ring with a stat weight of 81.504, closely equivalent to i230 (including tier 5 STR/VIT meld) depending on whether or not there were good secondaries that tier.

Would be interesting to see if there's someone running around with a set of those.

This is my WAR synched to 110 with these accessories:

https://bucket.bluegartr.com/c3d6870...69ced61509.JPG

...with normal accessories my STR drops to 424. (VIT does go up 3 points to 618 due to being cheap on melds at the end of 3 of those)

I have to agree just drop str entirely, since it was such a killjoy and made tanks too much dps, and just make AP just like 80 percent of the vit stat or whatever. Customization died with the changes in that one patch, they might as well put the bullet in the dying animal at this point. Eventially damages wont scale as nicely when were doing i 350 stuff and beyond. And its not fair, to force only one role to use 2 main stats when cookie cutter other roles get to pump it all in one. So what if tanks become desirable, maybe over dps, you always wanting more tanks in the queues anyway.

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Originally Posted by Lyth

If you look at secondary stats on tanks, stats like crit, det, and ss have relatively higher weight values compared to other jobs

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Weights taken from Ariyala :
DRG : Str =1, Crit = 0.279, Det = 0.207
PLD : Str = 1, Crit = 0.541, Det = 0.396
If you scale them properly, you have, for PLD, STR = 0.45, Crit = (0.541x0.45) = 0.243 and Det = (0.396x0.45) = 0.178.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Weights taken from Ariyala :
DRG : Str =1, Crit = 0.279, Det = 0.207
PLD : Str = 1, Crit = 0.541, Det = 0.396
If you scale them properly, you have, for PLD, STR = 0.45, Crit = (0.541x0.45) = 0.243 and Det = (0.396x0.45) = 0.178.

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Originally Posted by Alistaire

What this is is that they're bloated so that STR and VIT are still shown as 1's instead of the .45 they really are. Just for simplicity sake. They could list them as they actually are in game for comparison to other jobs, and then secondaries would be more like what you see on other jobs.

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Which they already addressed in the subsequent post.

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Originally Posted by Lyth

You can either think of this as secondary stats being relatively stronger, or primary stats being relatively weaker (secondary stat weights are normalized relative to the primary stats).

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hi im posting on my b/f thread as i was looking up tank tips on forums.

I very much with like damage calculations be vit on;y every other job but tank has their main damage source to be their main stat. since aggro is a mix of stance/attack and aggro based attacks this will just make it easier for tanks ti sustain aggro. it will also increase a tanks dps.

imo all wins in my book.