Ishgard' s archbisschop

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Originally Posted by Morningstar1337

If their pope has been tempered to worship Shiva instead of Halone

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Can't there be the possibility that Shiva and Halone are the same? Or aspects of each other? They do share some similarities with each other. I don't remember any word on if the primals and the twelve were distinctly different from each other and there was speculation that they were related, or in fact the same.

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Originally Posted by Taliss

Can't there be the possibility that Shiva and Halone are the same? Or aspects of each other? They do share some similarities with each other. I don't remember any word on if the primals and the twelve were distinctly different from each other and there was speculation that they were related, or in fact the same.

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It's possible but there seems to be evidence aganst the Primals and the 12 being the same beings (Not unless the latter pantheon are hiding some dark secrets, which is actually par for the course in a Final fantasy title)

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Originally Posted by MercuryD

And the Eelezen lady is the physical embodiment of Shiva? (what I thought when I saw the trailer)

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It could happen. Rather, the Elezaen look might simply be a glamour, the way some imps/bogeys tend to "glamour" during levequests.

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Originally Posted by Taliss

Can't there be the possibility that Shiva and Halone are the same? Or aspects of each other? They do share some similarities with each other. I don't remember any word on if the primals and the twelve were distinctly different from each other and there was speculation that they were related, or in fact the same.

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This actually isn't such an off-the-wall theory. Gods have been known by different names to different cultures over the years (Ares/Mars, Zeus/Jupiter, Hermes/Thoth, Guan Yin/Kanon, etc.). Halone also happens to be the member of The Twelve representing Astral Ice. It has been speculated that The Twelve are beings akin to primals. Perhaps the aetheric entity once called Halone has adopted (or been given) the name "Shiva" by her current worshipers. Since primals derive power from worship, it's possible that Halone/Shiva is trying to double dip from the beliefs of the Ishgardians and the unannounced beastmen tribe.

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Originally Posted by axemtitanium

This actually isn't such an off-the-wall theory. Gods have been known by different names to different cultures over the years (Ares/Mars, Zeus/Jupiter, Hermes/Thoth, Guan Yin/Kanon, etc.). Halone also happens to be the member of The Twelve representing Astral Ice. It has been speculated that The Twelve are beings akin to primals. Perhaps the aetheric entity once called Halone has adopted (or been given) the name "Shiva" by her current worshipers. Since primals derive power from worship, it's possible that Halone/Shiva is trying to double dip from the beliefs of the Ishgardians and the unannounced beastmen tribe.

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So you're assuming that hundu beastmen once found halone and named her Shiva?

I'd like to shoot some holes in this theory:

* Some Primals such as Odin and Leviathan have no correlating member of the 12
* The elements don't match the corresponding of the 12 for most of them
Im sure there are other holrs but those are what comes to mind for me.

How about this crazy theory, the council of Ascians we see in 2.3 are the 12 Eorzeans worship. They taught the beasttribes how to summon, because Eorzean's fear them. The primals are shapes and parts of those Ascians essence and take forms appealing to those worshiping them. Hence Ifrit is lizardy like the Amaljaa, leviathan is fishy like the Sahagin, Garuda is birdy like the birds and so on. Again a theory, but would be interesting and great shock value of, "oh you are our gods? Well damn!" Lol

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Well, if they are tempered by Shiva, they're doing a very good job at hiding it - usually tempered are so zealous they can't wait to immediately let everyone in earshot know their 'devotion' to the Primal who tempered them.

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There are different levels of tempering, so it's possible Shiva has tempered the Ishgardians to believe that she is Halone, while she builds up her plan.

Yoshi has been very cryptic regarding Shiva, and I get the feeling that she's "different" from the other Primals. All the other Primals met are devoted to protecting their beastmen worshippers. The Primal's goals seem very short-term: gather more followers and kill their enemies. Shiva, Ramuh possibly as well, seem to be playing a long-term game. If she has tempered the archbishop, the she has done it in away that isn't obvious. She wants to remain hidden and steer Ishgard from the shadows. Since Ishgard is fighting the dragons, it's reasonable to assume that the dragons are a threat to her plan. I'm getting a vibe that Shiva is being built up as the next "big bad" after Gaius.

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Originally Posted by Icepick823

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Then I can see Ishgard declaring war in the rest of Eorzea. a fantasy version of the War on Terror perhaps? Oh and an Enemy Mine with the Empire.

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Originally Posted by Morningstar1337

Then I can see Ishgard declaring war in the rest of Eorzea. a fantasy version of the War on Terror perhaps? Oh and an Enemy Mine with the Empire.

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Well Yoshi hinted prerelease that Ishgard will be more of a battlefield location and not a straight up city. I cant find interview now but it was last year sometime.

What if each element of the Twelve represents part of a Primal? The dual aspects of each element being the astral/umbral representations of the primal that corresponds to that element.

ex.) Menphina could be the astral version of Shiva and Halone is the Umbral version of Shiva.

The names Menphina and Halone would then be used to refer to the astral and umbral natures of a single Primal.

And on a further idea that maybe Menphina and Halone were both, long ago, two separate people who the crystal(s) could have chose to manifest as on single being for whoever knows why.