Tales from Duty Finder: Some make you laugh, some make you cry. Let's vent.

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Originally Posted by Atoli

A9S crushed my pride as a healer ._.
*cry*
I used to main AST in raiding back in Midas, but switched to WHM because I don't like the recent AST changes. Got talked into trying to heal A9S yesterday (with strangers) despite not being confident in my familiarity with the class yet (been maining BLM for Creator progression).
We could, for the love of all things alive, not get below 16% on Faust Z x.x I want to blame the DPS for the severe lack of dmg, like, how can you do less than 1k DPS on ilvl 260? But then I'd have to answer how I can't soloheal this mini-boss on ilvl 250 either, so..idk...joke's on me, I guess ._.

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/pet

Solo healing this can be very tricky at iL250 our healers tried. With better gear it is much easier. But making lower than 1k dps the real issue here.
Faust Z shouldn't take more than 3 minutes. its is a dummy fight. Does this mean dps are making lower than 1k in less than 3 minutes?

Idk if you had another healer who went full dps or you went in with 5 dps..

So I've been leveling my WHM alt, and recently have been running into a slew of players who apparently don't know you can combo their weaponskills. Now, I always try to offer advice, some people listen, some don't, we go on and finish the Duty, nbd.

I ran into a very special case however.
Was running Qarn NM. The PLD (mind you, a level 55 PLD) was losing aggro to me, then I noticed they were doing things like Savage Blade > Fast Blade, Shield Lob, Savage Blade > Riot Blade, Rage of Halone (by itself...), Shield Lob.

I asked why weren't they using Halone in a combo, since that makes them do less damage, generate less enmity, and making them take more damage because no STR debuff - also pointed out the melee ranged Shield Lobs, which do much less damage than Halone and eat more TP.

They immediately reply with "You should spend less time in Cleric and heal better ; )". I'm flabbergasted by this as no one came even close to dying and I was contributing to DPS nearly full time since dungeon healing is generally very easy - but apparently "healing better" is sitting the whole time spamming cure. Right afterwards, the DRG in the party (mind you - the classic no Heavy Thrust DRG, dude was level 60 too, but I didn't even bother pointing this one out in party chat) points out "Uhh a level 36 vs idk how many 60's?", as if I didn't know what I was talking about. This honestly got a giggle out of me as my main is a full BIS DRG with A12S on farm.

3 seconds later and I'm loading into Gridania. I got booted. Quick Lode search, they were in the same server and FC. This actually left me impressed at how bad and clueless people can be in this game and made me lose hope on trying to give advice to other players. This was not the first time I got kicked for trying to give advice, but the way the situation developed with them thinking they were in the right and I should shut up because I had a leaf on my alt was just facepalm worthy.

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Originally Posted by Estelle9lives

The PLD (mind you, a level 55 PLD) was losing aggro to me, then I noticed they were doing things like Savage Blade > Fast Blade, Shield Lob, Savage Blade > Riot Blade, Rage of Halone (by itself...), Shield Lob.

.....

They immediately reply with "You should spend less time in Cleric and heal better ; )".

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I just got cancer.

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Originally Posted by Atoli

A9S crushed my pride as a healer ._.
*cry*
I used to main AST in raiding back in Midas, but switched to WHM because I don't like the recent AST changes. Got talked into trying to heal A9S yesterday (with strangers) despite not being confident in my familiarity with the class yet (been maining BLM for Creator progression).
We could, for the love of all things alive, not get below 16% on Faust Z x.x I want to blame the DPS for the severe lack of dmg, like, how can you do less than 1k DPS on ilvl 260? But then I'd have to answer how I can't soloheal this mini-boss on ilvl 250 either, so..idk...joke's on me, I guess ._.

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That is absolutely a DPS issue. Although difficult to solo-heal at 250, it wouldn't make enough of a difference if your DPS are pulling that low. At ilvl 260, they flatout have no idea what they're doing to perform that poorly. It's definitely not on you.

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Originally Posted by Estelle9lives

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The phrase, "you can't heal stupid" has never been more appropriate.

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Originally Posted by Estelle9lives

I ran into a very special case however.

I got booted. This actually left me impressed at how bad and clueless people can be in this game and made me lose hope on trying to give advice to other players. This was not the first time I got kicked for trying to give advice, but the way the situation developed with them thinking they were in the right and I should shut up because I had a leaf on my alt was just facepalm worthy.

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Hmm I think for everyone\\'s sake we hope they were just trolling. Because sure I have seen similar stuff and tried to help, but if I got booted for such simple remarks I would be awe struck. I have made a couple alts because crafting... >_> and I remember a few remarks like that, but at least I didn\\'t get booted

Scenario: tralala la oh hey there fellow adventure watch out for those goblins. Response... TEETH TO THE CURB!!! O.o /kick.. ;-;

The case Estelle told us about reminded me about a very special ninja I ran into my in an A9S on my Pld alt. My tank friend and I duo qued RF, Faust Z np.

I was like sweet nin I can start in sword oath. Pull starts no shadewalker alright I will give him a sec nope. :0 nin takes Agro dead. I switch into shield we continue, second scrapline I have boss not on a cardinal direction just off of straight west. Tb 6 people die... o.o Healer was like huh can you place on cardinal? Sure I say. My friend smh, muttering just move.. (LS) nin pipes up! Mt is trying to troll us, that was intentional wipe. O.o I say no, we go again. This time I say can you please shadewalker me at the pull, "I guess I have to, bc you can't hold hate." I ignore that, my friend starts laughing because nin initiated a vote kick. -_- it doesn't pass, we kill the boss next pull. The whole time I am asking for goad, Pld tp rip. He decided at 10% that maybe the MT should be able to attack. Smh..

Every single time I do a guild heist I start with "Don't kill the turtle please." even before the load screen has finished.

50% of the time some one kills the turtle and acts shocked when it fails.

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Originally Posted by Estelle9lives

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thud - I... I just don't even... are people really this level of "special snowflake" attitude these days? I'm trying to be angry but I'm just so flabbergasted I can't be... I mean this seems like a comedy sketch from Harry Hill's TV Burp.

I got Sephirot from Trials. 2 new people. Cool.

At 80%-ish, cohealer dies and I raised her. As soon as I did, one tank goes down for the count. Cohealer raised the tank.

By 70%-ish, two people fell off, and they weren't the newbies. Lol.

At 60%-ish, cohealer falls off. That leaves me solo healing the entire fight. Which would have been nice if all 4 other people stayed alive. I spent the whole time spamming Indo whenever possible, hoping that my aetherflow would be off GCD, and pretty much going crazy trying to heal like a boss. Oh and occasionally raising people. I believe I had to raise 3 people before we finished the fight. How many coms I got? Nada. Bard fell off so my MP was almost always down.

Couple of days ago, I found myself in Vault as a DRK. Healer was SCH, DPS were MNK and BLM.

Anyway, things were going well enough. At 58, I had access to almost all the skills that make me love mass pulling as DRK. (Oh, you want an Abyssal Drain? Do you want an Abyssal Drain with that? How about an Abyssal Drain to drink with that?)

On the way to Grinnaux, I noticed the BLM was holding an Ironworks rod. Praying that it was just glamour, I examined them.

Nope. Not glamour. They're in Vault, with ilvl 120 gear and accessories. Why me.

Grinnaux was just... a pain in the ass, as he always is. I felt sorry for that MNK, because I had to keep repositioning Grinnaux due to AoEs. But we made it.

So, as we were fighting the two robot-knight-horses before the threshold to the third section, I finally started paying attention to what the BLM was actually doing. What I witnessed made me want to cry blood.

Going from Astral Fire III to Umbral Ice I via Transpose, with more than 7k MP left, then hardcasting Thunder III twice on the same mob. Using Flare while in Umbral Ice I. And I don't think Enochian was a thing to them. Admittedly, without Fire IV, Enochian is meaningless, but still.

So I paused, asking them to explain their rotation to me. Maybe in some weird-ass fantasy world, hardcasting Thunder III twice in a row is indeed the best way to maximise your DPS, and maybe I just missed the memo.

Thankfully, there was no such thing. I paused to type out the basics of the lvl 50 BLM rotation, just before the blue dotted line. The SCH wisely stayed with me, while both DPS ran on ahead and got eaten alive.

And while thinking of what to explain to this BLM, I realised that there really is no fast way to explain all the intricacies of the job, so I just gave up after explaining the rotation and went on. They did seem slightly receptive to it, at least.

Anyway, after Charibert's dead, I fully expected to get 0 comms for wasting everyone's time to explain the basics of a job to one of them, and healers usually get all the comms in that dungeon anyway. So I left.

"You received a player commendation!"
"You received a player commendation!"
"You received a player commendation!"

Huh... okay then.

I had a fun Castrum run yesterday. Loaded in and saw what I got. Someone voiced what we were all probably thinking. But then everyone else all started chatting and the run was smooth. It was all fun.

Ran A12N for the first time on my alt on another server last night, loaded in and watched the curscene, party commented happily on the bonus and I gave a "o7" so they knew it was me. I was WHM and the other healer was AST.

It was such a fantastic, smooth A12N. Only had two deaths, mechanics got done almost perfectly, saved the MT from a punishing heat near the end with a Bene. I rolled a 1 on the toy Alexander and still got it, got the crank I needed, and walked out of there with 5 comms. 8)

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Originally Posted by Santherelle

Every single time I do a guild heist I start with "Don't kill the turtle please." even before the load screen has finished.

50% of the time some one kills the turtle and acts shocked when it fails.

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The worst is when the tank holds the turtle away from the smoke canister and slowly bring the poor animal to its death while everyone else is screaming to move it :p

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Originally Posted by Chocolys

The worst is when the tank holds the turtle away from the smoke canister and slowly bring the poor animal to its death while everyone else is screaming to move it :p

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That is when I unsummon my fairy and let him die so we can win.

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Originally Posted by Chocolys

The worst is when the tank holds the turtle away from the smoke canister and slowly bring the poor animal to its death while everyone else is screaming to move it :p

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This, except in my case it was a sprout arcanist with the Topaz Carbuncle keeping aggro off the tank while we begged and pleaded with him to get rid of it.

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Originally Posted by Pyretta_Blaze

That is when I unsummon my fairy and let him die so we can win.

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LOL

Rate up +10

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Originally Posted by SilkaN

With that Lala profile pic your post made me feel sad, too.
I will try to find you ingame and give you a cookie.

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Thank you everyone for all the kind words :)
Especially to Vikky, who actually found me ingame to really gift my slightly confused (because I hadn't read the replies here yet) self a cookie :o

-Ramuh HM
-Healer gets frozen
-I get targeted
-Stand next to frozen healer so we can both be broken out at same time
-2-3 people near us have the AOE that can break us out
-No one notices either of us.
-Other healer is useless because tank somehow dies
-Apparently I was second on the threat chart so Ramuh f**ks me and frozen healer up because we're so close
-DRG dies shortly after
-Healer finally gets a rez
-DRG gets a rez
-Both healers at ~50% mp
-I'm still dead.
-Ramuh at 30%
-DRG somehow dies again
-about 3-4 minutes go by

-Ramuh at like 3%
-DRG still dead
-I finally get a rez

https://media.giphy.com/media/106PwpLIIXJnXi/giphy.gif

This is exactly why I always get nervous when I'm not healing. Because I have to rely on people like this.

This happened earlier to my husband while I was asleep. I've been playing as my husband's BLM for the last week or so making sure his BLM got caught up ilvl-wise. He has a lot of 260 gear except for his body and weapon (240). He prefers to play Battlefield 1 and God Eater lately. He does quite a lot of damage, and it made me want to get my BLM to 60. I've seen him play before and I don't have an issue with his rotation, I just do mine differently.

Apparently he jumped into expert roulette and the tank told him "It's a good thing it isn't midnight in Japan for another hour or so because I can call you the worst DPS of 2016." That was completely uncalled for. I don't understand why people are downright mean but don't offer constructive criticism to help it. People will not change unless you tell them what exactly they're doing wrong.

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Originally Posted by Sil3ntxR3qui3m

This happened earlier to my husband while I was asleep. I've been playing as my husband's BLM for the last week or so making sure his BLM got caught up ilvl-wise. He has a lot of 260 gear except for his body and weapon (240). He prefers to play Battlefield 1 and God Eater lately. He does quite a lot of damage, and it made me want to get my BLM to 60. I've seen him play before and I don't have an issue with his rotation, I just do mine differently.

Apparently he jumped into expert roulette and the tank told him "It's a good thing it isn't midnight in Japan for another hour or so because I can call you the worst DPS of 2016." That was completely uncalled for. I don't understand why people are downright mean but don't offer constructive criticism to help it. People will not change unless you tell them what exactly they're doing wrong.

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Isn't the 60 BLM rotation not really up for debate? At all?

I just did Sohm Al with a mentor BLM who kept moving from ice to fire with Fire 1 (and the other way around) AND using Freeze as a climax of their rotation.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

Isn't the 60 BLM rotation not really up for debate? At all?

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I have no idea. I do what makes sense to me.

Did the Aery last night with my brother, who is levelling his mnk. I decided to take smn, since I wanted a break from healing.

Tank - full ironworks set (and a darklight fending that is ilvl 70). Kept passing on tanking gear drops in the Aery. Kept making huge massive pulls, then ran in circles, so my brother's positionals were fubared. But hey, that's life. Then whenever I would drop a shadowflare...NOPE. Just yank 'em on out of that too (He also had a 60 smn). I was displeased.

Healer - didn't know what stoneskin was, but that was about the extent of my complaint.

I missed my deathflare.

Edit: Holy shit. I found one of those angry dps who doesn't like healers in CS. She spends a majority of the time in Fists of Earth (in DD), confirms that she has Fists of Fire, doesn't answer if my healing is unsatisfactory, then gets mad when I explain why I'm asking. According to her, she knows what the Fists do, she's not dumb. Yet, she can't tell the difference between a male Elezen monk (who asks why the fuck she's doing that) and a female Hyur white mage, and declares, "why nerf your heals and attack alot (sic)?"

Unfortunately, she was right on the last boss. I nerfed my heals and dpsed so much that she died twice - once to standing on top of the tank during all the cleaves, and another to standing in the void pitches during the last phase. Except when I was healing the tank.

This happened a few days ago in Gubal HM. The team I was with (drk/whm/drg) seemed like they wanted to be lazy so I spoke up a few times. I asked the healer to start dpsing on bosses instead of healing once and afking for 10 secs till next heal (that irritates me). Throughout the whole dungeon the drk would never put -darkside- on unless it was a boss fight. As a lvl 60 drk with full i260 tome gear this confused me. What also confused me is the Drks mp just never got filled or even above half way with each pull. So near the end I speak up and ask why they didn't use -darkside-. What I got was an apparently "grown man" (more on this later) crying his eyes out and calling me out for being an overbearing asshole and I was not their parent. The only stuff up to this point I said was "healer, stop being lazy and help dps" and "why don't you ever use -darkside- or regen your mp?".

I ask him if he knew how to restore mp on his drk since that seemed to be the main reason why he never used darkside. He promptly tells me to shut up and he "knows what hes doing" with the other players in the party, seemingly part of his inner circle of either fc mates or friends, backing up his claim and that I was being overbearing for asking why he wasn't using a basic stance every drk uses constantly.

I ask again if he knew how to manage his mp and darkside by this point in his journey (cause he should have with how geared he was, granted it could have been from his lvl 60 pld) and he responds with the most ignorant uneducated response I have ever heard fall from a drk mouth......"How do you expect me to have enough mp each pull if I have darkside on". At this point I was blown away by the shear response and had to double take if that's what he actually said. A lvl 60 dark with full i260 gear. I facepalm and proceed to explain that he has 3-5 moves to restore mp. Bloodprice, mp combo, carve and split, sole survivor, and blood weapon. He blows up on me saying once more that I should back off but doesn't respond to my question if he knew what those moves did. I'm only trying to help but at this point the gloves are off. I tell him "If someone doesn't say your doing something wrong then you'll never know".

After the boss he tries to make me feel inferior with a lie so obvious it makes me question how old he was in reality. He goes on a rant. Asks me "How old are you anyway?". I don't respond to it as it has nothing to do with his laziness and aggressive response to me trying to help him.

Then the remark of a lifetime...... "I am watching TV with my wife and 2 kids. I make 180k a year. What do you make huh? Don't tell me how to do my job". WOOOOOW. So his final response to try to make me feel bad was an obviously made up retort trying to make him seem like a man that has his life together but couldn't be bothered to learn a job hes playing or even figure out he has moves to restore his mp. His buddies once again threw in a few remarks about me being a horrible player and I leave with some pity toward his close minded bubble he's living in.

He was the most idiotic tank i've come across that was so set in his ways that any advice I gave made him angry and bitter toward me. That remark with the yearly salary made me cringe so hard cause that has nothing to do with your skill level.

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Originally Posted by Maddonious

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I can't even...good grief. IDC if you make a million a year, that's no excuse for not even knowing the basics of the job you chose to play.

Anyway, I have a story of my own:

Did a bunch of A9N runs for a bolt in order to get some upgrades. Had a few derp moments, and a couple of times where I caused a wipe. Here's a few gems from the run:

• Had a NIN that wanted to do the countdown timer himself, but who never survived through any of our attempts (I admit I messed up a couple of times there).
• Had a (bonus) DPS on one run. Explained that the adds needed to be killed after having been positioned...so what's he do? He starts grabbing generators and fighting me for the tethers. He finally gets a set, and doesn't position it correctly, so we end up wiping because of the resulting 2-stack clothesline. Had to explain to him that the generators were the OT's job and not to mess with 'em.
• Went in with an FC healer, who didn't know you didn't have to wake up he first gobwalker mob...and not only woke it up but promptly pulled it out of the glowing corner. I hollered at him to bring it back and kill it...we didn't get it dead in time - wipe. He was embarrased, and left the generators alone after that.

And the real capper....went in with another DRK, who decided to MT, and I proceeded to mess up on Faust not once, but twice....then failed to get the next add after Faust the third time around in time. Luckily I did get it, got it dropped in the lava, and the healers were on top of the resulting explosion, but that was embarrasing.

--Erim Nelhah

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Originally Posted by Maddonious

words

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Well, I can't speak on the specific words from the party chat having not seen them myself, but your description of the events does make you seem overbearing. /shrug It also sounds like you may have been rude.

@aesteval -

I was thinking this same thing while reading it.

It could just be me, but whatever. I have noticed a lot of people in here claiming to be trying to help others, but the conversations being said (if they really are are word for word what was said in chat) seem rather rude. I'm not saying people aren't trying to help, but the way they are going about it in chat seems a bit rude and "leetish."

Seriously, if you really are wanting to help people you come across DF, take a step back, pause and collect yourself for a minute, and think about what you are going to say. I don't think a lot of people realize what they type out and think may be nice, could "sound" rude to a lot of people. We don't have the luxury of being face to face, in person, or even in voice comms with random people we meet, so something that "sounds" nice to you may not translate to "nice" to someone else.

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Originally Posted by AutoWhit

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Maybe he wasn't the nicest he could have been. But, he was correct. And that's something that people don't seem to care about anymore when you're talking to them, and it strikes me as very strange.

If I'm playing Overwatch and a huge jerk starts making calls in voice, it doesn't matter if he's a jerk. It matters if his calls are good or not. I'm not going to purposefully ignore his good information because he's mean, because winning and playing well is more important than some petty fight over playing nice.

The goal of a team is to win. It would be nice if everyone was pleasant on the way there, but the goal shouldn't be compromised because they're not.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

The goal of a team is to win. It would be nice if everyone was pleasant on the way there, but the goal shouldn't be compromised because they're not.

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Wouldn't it be nice if that's how the world really worked. Unfortunately this is not the military, and treating people like that will, 95 times out of 100, get a negative response.

I guarantee you trying to "help" with a positive attitude will get you a positive response most of the time. If you come across as "leetish," rude, or superior be prepared to get a negative response.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

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When I'm matched with random players, I assume a courteous and respectful attitude to the others and expect the same from them to me. If someone starts being rude or disrepectful to someone else or me, I just go into "ignore mode" regardless of what he's saying, because while socially interacting in a videogame with strangers, for me the form is as important as the substance.

As AutoWhit pointed out, unlike with face to face or with natural voiced language, there is no "expressive natural clues" in a texted message about the intention, so the form is important as to include these missing clues. Sometimes you don't need much, just a simple smiley ":)" can make a great difference about how a line of text might be perceived.

There is also such thing as unwanted advice, and unless someone is compromising (compromising as causing failures, not as being less efficient as he could be) the success of run, I won't start asking over and over why he's not doing thing better in a different way.
And it works both way, if someone starts complaining continuously about how I play while I'm actively participating and not compromising the run, after I politely made clear I'm not interested about his opinion, then that someone goes into the "ignore list".

To go back on Maddonious's story, yeah the tank was a jerk and I would have stop caring about him as soon as he first said "shut up". I would just go on so I could enjoy both completing the duty and not being in his presence anymore :)

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Originally Posted by Chocolys

sniperooni

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That's fair. When it comes to teammates, in this game and elsewhere, I've always valued performance over politeness. That's not to say that I'm going around telling everyone to get cancer, but I would rather have a jerk who knows how to play than a nice guy who doesn't. The former can get me a clear. The latter causes vote abandons.

In the context of an online cooperative game, playing to the best of one's ability is part of the social contract we all signed when we pressed queue. If your ability is low, that's fine. But, I've never met anyone who lacked the ability to use Heavy Thrust. They just didn't want to. And that is NOT fine. It's rude and disrespectful to everyone in your group.

And that is why the idea of unwanted advice boggles my mind. If I can improve my play, please tell me! If I'm making mistakes, shove them in my face. I WANT to play the best I can. I SHOULD play the best I can. Unwanted advice implies that you don't want to improve. Why wouldn't you want to improve at something you're doing? I wouldn't ignore advice in any other activity that could help me. Why would I do it here?

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Originally Posted by AutoWhit

I guarantee you trying to "help" with a positive attitude will get you a positive response most of the time.

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No...no it won't.

Your guarantee is void in all 50 states and most of Canada (those Maritimers are just too darn nice)

source: me trying to help other players all the time and doing mentor roulette

The jadedness is too darn high.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

The goal of a team is to win. It would be nice if everyone was pleasant on the way there, but the goal shouldn't be compromised because they're not.

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It sounds like the team won. Not in the most perfectly efficient way possible, but still won. Everyone doesn't have to play like they're neck deep in savage content at all times. Tips for efficiency? Fine. But in all seriousness, current ex dungeons absolutely do not need everyone performing optimally to succeed in. Would it go faster? Sure. Is it the end of the world if not? Nope.

I don't usually talk when I go into a DF. Sometimes I'll say hi, or cheer my party on, or pop open a bottle of wine, but never any extensive conversation. There was this one isolated incident though, where I threw out a reference from Mass Effect 1 and this female Hyur caught one. The entire dungeon from there on we talked about different games, current events, just talking while the other two stayed silent.

I was so captivated from the social interaction, it brought me back to my Guild Wars days and FF XI. I was sad to see her go afterwards, but we bid farewell as you do at the end of any dungeon and continued on. The next day when I hopped on she crept into my mind once more. I enjoyed her company even if it was for a moment and I thought I would add her or send her a message, only to be met with the horrible fate of forgetting her complicated lore friendly name. Since then I changed into a lore friendly name to remind myself about the friend who got away.

Much sad.

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Originally Posted by Miste

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I see you didn't post any examples of you being nice when helping others.

Has only happened once that I can think of, but here's an example - I get into a dungeon (don't even remember which one. It was a while ago), and during the very 1st pull the tank is yelling at me to " DRG use Doomspike! It's your biggest dps hit for this!" I tried to tell him "the mobs need to be lined up correctly for me to be able to do that (which they weren't). His response was "No they don't!" Actual skill description for Doom Spike - "Delivers an attack with a potency of 160 to all enemies in a straight line before you." So, I said not another word and just left. Pretty sure I know how to play DRG...it IS my main job.

Now, if he'd asked me why I wasn't using it I would've told him, 1st the mobs need to be lined up correctly to get the full advantage of spamming it, and 2nd we have no BRD, so I'm still not gonna be spamming it. I'll use it when I feel it's advantageous AND Invigorate is either off CD, or close to it.

Don't come into a dungeon as something other than a DRG and tell me what to do thinking it's "helpful." Ask me, or suggest to me helpful tips if you want. I'll most likely have an explanation, and if I don't then I'll listen.

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Originally Posted by AutoWhit

Don't come into a dungeon as something other than a DRG and tell me what to do thinking it's "helpful." Ask me, or suggest to me helpful tips if you want. I'll most likely have an explanation, and if I don't then I'll listen.

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See, when I've asked why someone isn't using an ability, the answer has always been something like "It's my sub I'll play how I want". I've never received intelligent discourse from someone in DF defending their play or rejecting advice. I've gotten:

"I'm an ice mage!"
"STFU"
"It's my play style"
"I don't know what that spell does"
"I took that off my bar"
"I don't like that spell"

I wish DF was a magical place where people care enough to learn to play. But, it's not.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

And that is why the idea of unwanted advice boggles my mind. If I can improve my play, please tell me! If I'm making mistakes, shove them in my face. I WANT to play the best I can. I SHOULD play the best I can. Unwanted advice implies that you don't want to improve. Why wouldn't you want to improve at something you're doing? I wouldn't ignore advice in any other activity that could help me. Why would I do it here?

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i second this. I'm far from being an expert at all the jobs i play and i don't pretend to be, so if/when people give me advice i generally try to take it in stride. personally i don't really try to give tips unless it's either about my main AST or about really general stuff about some jobs. like i can't tell you anything at all about MNK or WAR, but i know at least the basics of most other jobs.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

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I understand your view from what you personally expecting from the game.

About performance over rudeness, for me it's not just about the potential valuable information from it, but it's about not encouraging rudeness. Because I think if someone changes his way to play following advice from rude comments, it will re-inforce the commenter into believing that using rude comments is the way to make other people change.
Note: I used the word "rudeness" not "politeness". You can be impolite while not being rude and when in fast paced gameplay where time does matter it's kind of usual to take shortcuts with the standard "polite form". I see nothing wrong about that.
I don't care if someone says "Do X please" or "Do X" or even just "X" in the midst of battle, it's just tactical information, but now if he says "fu**ing do X " or "do X you noob" then he will wait a very long time for me to do X

About unwanted advices: Video-games can be played for 2 reasons: fun/entertainment and e-sport (professional or not). If you play a videogame for e-sport, you will care about max efficiency, about training, improving and useful advices. But people who are just playing in relaxed way for entertainment might no care about such things, they are not playing the game in first place for such considerations.

It's kind like a difference between a soccer club where people are expected learn team tactic, becomes better at controlling the ball and do tricks, compared to few people hitting a foam ball in a dirty way to have fun. In the latter you don't expect someone to interrupt them, and start shouting at them they play like crap, nor they might be interested into working on new tricks.

When you play with a premade group, every can agree what is the purpose of that group, more like e-sport or just having a fun relaxed moment. But when you use the Duty Finder to be matched with random players you can't expect everyone to care about maximazing their efficiency because not everyone is interested in the first place by that. Asking for someone to do so in that context is like joining a group of random people playing soccer and expect them to play or want to play like pro.

For me the only thing I think I can legitimately expect from random matched teammates is for them to play honestly toward completing the Duty. And by honestly I mean playing as good as they can currently do with the way they play. With of course a minimum efficiency at their role, because they have to play the role they queued for, this is a minimum respect to the team.
For example if someone queue as tank and don't care at all about managing enmity and just play like a DPS while the monsters are eating the others alive, then yes I will certainly comment about it. But now if he manages the enmity enough so we can progress in the Duty, I don't see me as entitled to request him to play another more efficient way if he's not interested, because he simply did not sign for e-sport.

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Originally Posted by AutoWhit

I see you didn't post any examples of you being nice when helping others.

Don't come into a dungeon as something other than a DRG and tell me what to do thinking it's "helpful." Ask me, or suggest to me helpful tips if you want. I'll most likely have an explanation, and if I don't then I'll listen.

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Well..if you choose not to believe me then that's fine O.o

I have posted stories before; a few of them anyway and they are in this thread so I didn't see the point of posting another one. I have a lot but I also don't have the kind of time to post them all xD

There should be nothing wrong with telling people information. If I take your word on it that doom spike should not have been used there (DRG is the one job I won't try to tell people how to play because I suck at it beyond comprehension. The only things I could point out to a DRG is to keep heavy thrust on and blood of the dragon.) then he just was misinformed and yeah there are players running around with less info than they think they have, but just because of that doesn't mean that good info isn't out there if you listen to what people have to say.

You shouldn't have to walk on eggshells just to help out a fellow player with knowledge that can help them improve and assist them in their future time on this game. It gets to the point where its like "ohh I need to help this person...wait...wait I need to ask first I can't just simply type a quick explanation, make sure to add smiley face...ok wait next sentence...sugar sweet happy go lucky tone...wait how to I convey that with text? ...hmm ok pikachu ascii drawing or...or a kitty cat ok and another smiley face"

....then you get booted from the party for sitting there typing too much lol xD

Rudeness of course is wrong way to tell anyone anything, but unless they are being outwardly rude by using insulting language like calling people bad, noob, or dumb, etc then I don't see the problem with people telling other people some info.

So that guy was wrong about doom spike, yeah, and yeah he argued with you when you corrected him. Meh not a big deal, you can leave like you said you did or you could also just ignore him. Obviously I've seen people you shouldn't listen to, but you have to take a good look at what someone is telling you before making that decision. Seems to me that one was just nitpicking you though which I can understand it would be irritating.

Typing as a healer is extremely easy to me. Cast Malefic, press Enter, press keys, cast Malefic again, rinse repeat.