Yoshida-san: Please Give Us a BETTER System for Relics and Future 2.0 Challenges!

If you want to increase drop rates on Miser's Mythril, take a look at the item description...

Then go kill yourself.

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Originally Posted by Luxanna

OK.

1/70ish total runs.
1/560ish combined individual chests.

http://ratisil.net/toey/ffxiv/16-06-2012%2003-31-01.jpg

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Silly Miner ability D:

With drop rate so low it only begs to reason theres a "catch" or certain way you must defeat MM for the drop.

Try doing the "slow method" of MM using Arc and Blm etc and go through 2-3 regen phases. Maybe some ??? pops on the map.

Btw I was kidding with Ghosts >.>;; Its long standing LS saying that we don't get any Darklight because we don't kill ghosts D:

We've tried regening three phases, killing everything, killing all ghosts, not eating food, incapping everything, killing all flowers and slugs. Does nothing. We're pretty convinced it's just a trollishly low drop rate.

We're going to try eating +1 zucchinis before opening the chest next.

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Originally Posted by Wevlum

Coming up to 700 replies and over 350 likes. Time for a dev response soon hopefully.

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Not happening bud...

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1/70ish total runs.
1/560ish combined individual chests.

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It is 1/70, it is NOT 1/560.. seriously who started this retarded shit?

Its like saying: Hey right now 50 Groups in the Instance, so im 0/400 after one Run! That is fucking retarded.

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Originally Posted by Nero

It is 1/70, it is NOT 1/560.. seriously who started this retarded shit?

Its like saying: Hey right now 50 Groups in the Instance, so im 0/400 after one Run! That is fucking retarded.

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All 8 ppl get their own chest, Opened x amount of chest got 0 drops are you stupid?

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Originally Posted by Firon

All 8 ppl get their own chest, Opened x amount of chest got 0 drops are you stupid?

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Correctly.. 8 people get their OWN Chest, dont you understand your own post? Read my Post again... its annoying as shit if people go "I AM 1/400", cause they added the Chests from the whole Group, which they dont have access on.

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Originally Posted by Nero

Correctly.. 8 people get their OWN Chest, dont you understand your own post? Read my Post again... its annoying as shit if people go "I AM 1/400", cause they added the Chests from the whole Group, which they dont have access on.

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no one said they was 1/400 they said they only got 1 item out of 400 chest opened....Which is true.

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no one said they was 1/400 they said they only got 1 item out of 400 chest opened....Which is true.

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And how it looks like to people which never did it and have no clue about how the Chests work? Since that Post is done by a single Person, people will think they are all openend by one Person, which isnt true.

Crap like this are a reason why FFXIV gets bad reviews. People who write them read Stuff, missunderstand it and simply put it the wrong way.

Can we please stop hijacking the thread?
I'm sure we can all agree that this current quest path (or lack of/slapping into content) is insulting, especially for relic weapons, and often the insane hours of effort being completely meaningless

I am at 1/400~500++ Darklight Cuirass ; ;

Okay, my first post here on these forums, though I have read and followed along with different threads for a while now.

My 2 cents with the gist of what's going on about the new relic weapon requirements is that the developers have decided to go with an extreme implementation of "variable ratio" or "variable interval schedule." I do see how this system actually more closely resembles a Random Number Generating system though, as (to my understanding) a variable ratio would reward a player after an average number of attempts and a variable interval schedule would reward players after an average time period has passed. They seem to have gone this route with the implementation of tokens from primal fights, so you can at least see the progression.

I agree with the initial post though, this is a somewhat mean and unfair (maybe even lazy) implementation of either variable factors based on a lot of testimonies I am reading about drop rates and success rates (on melds). The whole point of the variable ratio and interval schedule has a player thinking if he/she sticks with it long enough, they'll be rewarded- but it looks like many players are doubting the possibility of a reward at all due to how abysmally bad drop rates are. I admit though, it would be great if someone found a way to increase the drop rates to sensible levels for the chest items, but if there really isn't anything, shame on the developers.


This looks like the right track to frustrate players with factors beyond their control in an attempt for the developers to "keep players from running out of 'content' before 2.0 arrives."



Got the Ifrit/Moogle/Garuda/Darklight set (or what you care to obtain)? You still have plenty to do; you don't have a relic weapon yet.

The lack of response is just kind of funny given certain responses we have had lately. I'm not bashing on lore or anything and I actually liked the post but when there's a thread with like 700 replies, 350+ likes, and it's quite heated, it's hilarious that we got a post on the lore behind lalafell names instead.

Anyway contrary to ideas about how this is content used to separate the skilled from the unskilled it really isn't. It's content that separates the lucky from the unlucky and those with nearly infinite time to play with those that don't have infinite time to play or simply don't want to dedicate that amount of time to rolling a dice over and over.

Furthermore I think it's a cheap trick to extend the life of content we already have. Nothing new was added for the relic weapons. We have to do hamlets which people were either doing already or didn't care about, we have to meld class specific weapons which we had already, and we have to go back to the raids which we had already.

If it's just a cheap attempt to keep people occupied until 2.0 fair enough but if this is what to expect in 2.0 then that's depressing. I know in interviews and such he's said that he wants 2.0 to be less about this kind of system but given what they've just given us for relics it's hard to take that seriously.

Also just a little note about "omg not everyone should have one". Why? They pay the same subscription fee each month why shouldn't it be feasible that a person that has less time to play could eventually get *one* relic weapon? Are people that desperate to be a special snowflake that they'd deny people with less time to play *one* weapon? Fair enough, maybe they shouldn't be walking around with 5 of them but people with less time to play are likely to only have 1-3 jobs anyway. That's just my thought on that.

I have done about 180ish runs in AV (finished)
and about 150ish in CC (finished)
I'd say roughly 60% where SR5C but i will do this:

180 + 150 = 330 x 4,5 (rough estimate of chests opened) per run = 1485 chests opened overall.


I have yet to see a Cowl, a Corselet or a Cuirass drop myself.
(maybe seen about 17 or so items drop alltogether)

Just gonna leave this ^ here... :)

Because you can't just change something like this overnight, it will take many discussions on how to take on this situations and if they are gonna do away with it what will be the next step.

Mind you nobody in this thread has come up with other solution, they did say they "do not want RNG system" but how do you want it instead? how do you want this new system to be implemented? give a real example.

Do you want to spam AV/CC for 50x instead for a guarantee drop? spam hamlet 50x for guarantee drop?
or do you want not to spam content? you want challenging fight? when most whiner here dont even have garuda kill, you want something based on skill? How is that more feasible than what we have now?

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Originally Posted by Chardrizard

Because you can't just change something like this overnight, it will take many discussions on how to take on this situations and if they are gonna do away with it what will be the next step.

Mind you nobody in this thread has come up with other solution, they did say they "do not want RNG system" but how do you want it instead? how do you want this new system to be implemented? give a real example.

Do you want to spam AV/CC for 50x instead for a guarantee drop? spam hamlet 50x for guarantee drop?
or do you want not to spam content? you want challenging fight? when most whiner here dont even have garuda kill, you want something based on skill? How is that more feasible than what we have now?

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I seen a few posts on how they want it instead, like really good examples too, I am too lazy to go find them for ya in this huge thread, You can look tho.

About skill, peeps who done it hardcore killed it after the hotfix patch however there are some like me aswell.

I have little time so i choose (for now) to spend it on raids BECAUSE!
I have a retainer full of weapons, dont really need more atm, what i dont have is a solid good gear set to go with them :)

And getting a full DL is the most timeconsuming thing ever (due to this retarted drop system)
No chance i will spend a single minute (atm) on killing Garuda and getting nothing (ofcourse)....

I NEED A DL SET DUDE!

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Originally Posted by YuriSan

I seen a few posts on how they want it instead, like really good examples too, I am too lazy to go find them for ya in this huge thread, You can look tho.

About skill, peeps who done it hardcore killed it after the hotfix patch however there are some like me aswell.

I have little time so i choose (for now) to spend it on raids BECAUSE!
I have a retainer full of weapons, dont really need more atm, what i dont have is a solid good gear set to go with them :)

And getting a full DL is the most timeconsuming thing ever (due to this retarted drop system)
No chance i will spend a single minute (atm) on killing Garuda and getting nothing (ofcourse)....

I NEED A DL SET DUDE!

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I am not gonna dig 70 page of crap, chances are even the devs will miss it if there is good idea inside. If someone truely believe they have a well thought out ideas and lay out how it will be implemented properly in this game while making sure relic will stay rare and prestige, then make a new thread.

I am sure it will get devs attention faster than 70 page of arguments and crying.

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Originally Posted by YuriSan

180ish runs in AV (finished)
150ish in CC (finished)
roughly 60% where SR5C

180 + 150 = 330 x 4,5 (rough estimate of chests opened) per run = 1485 chests opened overall.

I have yet to see a Cowl, a Corselet or a Cuirass drop myself.
(maybe seen about 17 or so items drop alltogether)

Just gonna leave this ^ here... :)

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wow what a math,

180ish runs in av, 60% time attack = 108 time attack
150ish runs in cc, 60% time attack = 90 time attack

Cowl, Corselet and Cuirass drop only from time attack chest

108+90 = 198 time attack chest

Just gonna leave this ^ here... :)

I wanna do math too..

roughly 400runs AV
400 runs CC
roughly 90% were SR5C

400+400=800 x 4.5 = 3600 chests opened estimated


I am 1/3600 Darklight Cuirass D:!!!

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Originally Posted by Luxanna

wow what a math,

180ish runs in av, 60% time attack = 108 time attack
150ish runs in cc, 60% time attack = 90 time attack

Cowl, Corselet and Cuirass drop only from time attack chest

108+90 = 198 time attack chest

Just gonna leave this ^ here... :)

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I know, i wasnt just reffering to Body drops tho.

So out of 1845 chests opened its ok to only see 17 items drop overall?
And is it ok for a body to not drop a single time in 198 chests???
We are 8 people in a party and everyone wants one or another............

17/1845 = 0.009214% <-- lmao...
0/198 = 0% <-- lmao x2
Ya thats a solid drop rate for 8 people to munch on in a run
that takes 25 mins to finish, ya definetly nothing wrong with it...

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Originally Posted by Chardrizard

I wanna do math too..

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MATH IS POWAH!!!

I bet you feel all special and hardcore for getting one item in a gazillion runs
you already know and can do easily.

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Originally Posted by Chardrizard

Because you can't just change something like this overnight, it will take many discussions on how to take on this situations and if they are gonna do away with it what will be the next step.

Mind you nobody in this thread has come up with other solution, they did say they "do not want RNG system" but how do you want it instead? how do you want this new system to be implemented? give a real example.

Do you want to spam AV/CC for 50x instead for a guarantee drop? spam hamlet 50x for guarantee drop?
or do you want not to spam content? you want challenging fight? when most whiner here dont even have garuda kill, you want something based on skill? How is that more feasible than what we have now?

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And most people that currently do have the garuda achievement only have it becauseeeeee
http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instanc...x/19881453.jpg
so that means nothing about skill etc. I don't but I've maybe only tried the fight 20 or so times since release.

As for systems, I'd much rather a grind something 50 times and be done system than a grind it 50 times and maybe grind it 50 more still trying to get the same item. Think most people dont care so much it's Hamlets AV CC repeated old content they just want a fair system with visible progress. Run AV 50 times = "Ughh wtf really??" But at least each time you do it's guaranteed to put you closer to that 50. At the minute. 3 Misers Mythril. could take you 3 runs, could take 300...

Some people have said 1% drop on mythril. accurate? I dunno but if it is, there's still a 36.6% chance you'll not get one in a hundred runs. and you need 3....

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Originally Posted by Dirty Harry

Do you feel lucky punk? Well, Do Ya?"

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Originally Posted by Dzian

And most people that currently do have the garuda achievement only have it becauseeeeee
http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instanc...x/19881453.jpg
so that means nothing about skill etc. I don't but I've maybe only tried the fight 20 or so times since release.

As for systems, I'd much rather a grind something 50 times and be done system than a grind it 50 times and maybe grind it 50 more still trying to get the same item. Think most people dont care so much it's Hamlets AV CC repeated old content they just want a fair system with visible progress. Run AV 50 times = "Ughh wtf really??" But at least each time you do it's guaranteed to put you closer to that 50. At the minute. 3 Misers Mythril. could take you 3 runs, could take 300...

Some people have said 1% drop on mythril. accurate? I dunno but if it is, there's still a 36.6% chance you'll not get one in a hundred runs. and you need 3....

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Idk why u brought up the BLM burn exploit and why does achievement has to do with anything, people that uses exploit, if they cant beat it after then so be it, they wont defeat it.

It still wont change the fact if they make garuda fight a requirement for relic, like collect 60 totems, majority of the whiner here still won't be able to get relic. It doesn't color me surprise that alot of people that asks for challenging fight or an instance to display their skill doesnt even have the currently most difficult fight done.

I myself isn't a fans of RNG, if they make me spam AV for 50x, i will do it. If they make me fight a very tough monster, i am very sure my team will take it down. So, whatever works for me.

I got the impression you were measuring skill based on that achievement....

Don't get me wrong I havent beaten Garuda. life is one reason, lack of people wanting to try is another. But I love that fight. I look at garuda and the more recent United We Stand. and I think "Oh my god this dev team can put out some truly amazing stuff"

If 2.0 has content like those example's I'll be a happy chappy. Hard? who cares? CoP was hard that why it was such an awesome feeling to beat it.

Then though I look at the rng for everything and think "wtf???" if 2.0 follows this approach do I want to continue?

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Originally Posted by Mikheli

I really like the relic system the way it is now. Easier then what it was in say ffxi or some other games... yes there is random luck in getting it! But it shouldn't be just handed to you. Working for something as good as a relic should take time and effort and a bit of luck!

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LOL its takes A LOT of luck though, the time and effort is both dependant on the luck factor.

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Originally Posted by Dzian

I got the impression you were measuring skill based on that achievement....

Don't get me wrong I havent beaten Garuda. life is one reason, lack of people wanting to try is another. But I love that fight. I look at garuda and the more recent United We Stand. and I think "Oh my god this dev team can put out some truly amazing stuff"

If 2.0 has content like those example's I'll be a happy chappy. Hard? who cares? CoP was hard that why it was such an awesome feeling to beat it.

Then though I look at the rng for everything and think "wtf???" if 2.0 follows this approach do I want to continue?

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I am sorry if i gave out that impression hah.

I myself have given up on relic attempt myself until i have more time and have decided that i will enjoy the game without relic since it's not a very gamebreaking weapons anyway.

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Originally Posted by Nero

It is 1/70, it is NOT 1/560.. seriously who started this retarded shit?

Its like saying: Hey right now 50 Groups in the Instance, so im 0/400 after one Run! That is fucking retarded.

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I don't know how one could make it any clearer when they say total runs, and individual chests. If someone comes to their own conclusions they either can't read or simply don't want to believe facts. Also Nero, this drop rate is indeed f****** retarded.

Hamlet drop rate is fine and it always has been but this drop rate, which is around 1% is insulting.

Almost all the new content I don't feel like doing at all because of the RNG. I would be doing Garuda a lot if it weren't for some weird problem my computer has in the final stage and only for the fact that you get actual progress. All new content should be like Garuda and all current content should be changed to match it where you have actual progress instead of just luck.

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Originally Posted by Zezlar

I don't know how one could make it any clearer when they say total runs, and individual chests. If someone comes to their own conclusions they either can't read or simply don't want to believe facts. Also Nero, this drop rate is indeed f****** retarded.

Hamlet drop rate is fine and it always has been but this drop rate, which is around 1% is insulting.

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I know it is hard to understand a simple Phrase.. but "individual" is not an indicator for Solo or Group-Content. If people come to their own conclusions they cant read or simply dont want believe facts? That is interesting.. where does it say again that "individual" or even "total runs" means "open'd by one person", or "open'd in total of the whole group"? That is everything i was talking about.. people have to make it Clear if they are 1/400 or just 1/50. Not adding any Info about it, will make it look weird to certain people and thats it... not more, not less.

I never said anything about the Droprate tho.

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Originally Posted by AmyNeudaiz

Almost all the new content I don't feel like doing at all because of the RNG. I would be doing Garuda a lot if it weren't for some weird problem my computer has in the final stage and only for the fact that you get actual progress. All new content should be like Garuda and all current content should be changed to match it where you have actual progress instead of just luck.

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Can't blame you. SE dropped the ball majorly on this. People should not want to do it because of the difficulty of the content, not because of a really flawed and incredibly bad system like RNG.

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Originally Posted by Chardrizard

Because you can't just change something like this overnight, it will take many discussions on how to take on this situations and if they are gonna do away with it what will be the next step.

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Dev response =! overnight change.

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Mind you nobody in this thread has come up with other solution, they did say they "do not want RNG system" but how do you want it instead? how do you want this new system to be implemented? give a real example.

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Dynamis.

What are the odds that the current process involved in obtaining a relic weapon will be left unchanged in 2.0?

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Originally Posted by Dragon

Dynamis.

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Oh, please no.

Horrid drop rates there when I left FFXI in like 2010. I heard Dynamis has been revamped since then, but waiting weeks and months just to see certain pieces drop was torture.

Lets see, first Mailbreaker broken. Lets see how many it takes for me to quit this game. - -;

Can anyone tell me if other regions are complaining as much as we are? :P

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Originally Posted by Velhart

Lets see, first Mailbreaker broken. Lets see how many it takes for me to quit this game. - -;

Can anyone tell me if other regions are complaining as much as we are? :P

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Mailbreaker is an alright step. I didn't mind the double meld portion of it. The step after will make you want to quit though. ^^

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Originally Posted by Velhart

Can anyone tell me if other regions are complaining as much as we are? :P

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Nope.. never did, never will be. XD

Its no offense, but i know someone will take it as offense... NA always was, is and will be a Complain-Forum. Its not only in FFXIV that way tho.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

Lets see, first Mailbreaker broken. Lets see how many it takes for me to quit this game. - -;

Can anyone tell me if other regions are complaining as much as we are? :P

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you are still okay as long as you dont break your 19th mailbreaker.
i believe Sho Kanti is holding the record 1/19 Alkalurops double melding

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Originally Posted by Cidel

Oh, please no.

Horrid drop rates there when I left FFXI in like 2010. I heard Dynamis has been revamped since then, but waiting weeks and months just to see certain pieces drop was torture.

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Why do I have to be specific every damned time? I was speaking of the Dynamis' currency system, which made Dynamis at least feel like progression was being made.

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Originally Posted by Nero

Nope.. never did, never will be. XD

Its no offense, but i know someone will take it as offense... NA always was, is and will be a Complain-Forum. Its not only in FFXIV that way tho.

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They should hire you as a translator, being able to speak every language is a rare talent.

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Originally Posted by Dragon

Why do I have to be specific every damned time? I was speaking of the Dynamis' currency system, which made Dynamis at least feel like progression was being made.

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It helps to be specific sometimes instead of assuming people follow every post you make.

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Originally Posted by Len

What are the odds that the current process involved in obtaining a relic weapon will be left unchanged in 2.0?

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99% chance itl be left as is

if they change anything itl be specific drop rates but not the process itself