Cartoony style graphics....

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Originally Posted by Elexia

Lightning is what most developers use to make something look better than it is.

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hmm so for 1.0.

http://foto.arcor-online.net/palb/al...6534653839.jpg

http://foto.arcor-online.net/palb/al...6630623439.jpg

Yep, as you can tell mostly the shaders and lightning being applied. The only other aspect regarding graphics was physics being added and the character no longer clinging to the ground from α > β, much like you can notice that character models barely changed between the versions, there were tweaks from the first alpha, but for the most part they largely stayed the same.

This is why people see an issue with ARR because while it seems "unfinished" there's still a polish to it that we see in other MMOs with certain things (like strafing etc.)

http://foto.arcor-online.net/palb/al...3634306331.jpg


http://foto.arcor-online.net/palb/al...3130346533.jpg

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Originally Posted by Omigad

http://foto.arcor-online.net/palb/al...3634306331.jpg


http://foto.arcor-online.net/palb/al...3130346533.jpg

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Wonder if they will let us jump off that tower on the right from the second photo...

Those links are from the most recent video right?

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Originally Posted by Starlord

Keep going shooting down people's opinions *thumbs up*

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You could also consider gravity an opinion as well................................ just saying.

You are digging yourself deep, real deep my friend.

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Originally Posted by Omigad

http://foto.arcor-online.net/palb/al...3634306331.jpg


http://foto.arcor-online.net/palb/al...3130346533.jpg

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This looking so cartoon

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Originally Posted by Rokien

You could also consider gravity an opinion as well................................ just saying.

You are digging yourself deep, real deep my friend.

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Gravity is a fact because there are "Sources" behind those facts. Talking about Graphical changes there is no source behind it, just opinions and based assumptions. If you can find an "SE" source that says that these Graphical Changes looks "cartoony" then I will admit I was wrong and admit they are facts, till then they are opinions and nothing more than opinions.

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Originally Posted by Starlord

Gravity is a fact because there are "Sources" behind those facts. Talking about Graphical changes there is no source behind it, just opinions and based assumptions. If you can find an "SE" source that says that these Graphical Changes looks "cartoony" then I will admit I was wrong and admit they are facts, till then they are opinions and nothing more than opinions.

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Have you really never heard the terms "Water Shader" or "Fur Shader"? I understand you're sticking to your "opinions" however I promise you game designers using shaders isn't an opinion or people making assumptions lol. Look at the sig you're touting -- There's shaders being used for the hair alone. The whole "Looks cartoony" thing is because of the plastic look which could be due to the lack of shaders and appropriate lighting or because of the stiffness of characters.

Trust me, I know the phrase ignorance is bliss, but you're basically telling people it's only an opinion when as Rokien said, you could consider Gravity an opinion if you use that line of thinking -- You say "gravity is fact", so is the use of shaders to make the water look realistic or hair to move properly.

Honestly Starlord, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shader just read this and maybe you'll understand what other people are saying when they mention this word.

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Originally Posted by Starlord

Gravity is a fact because there are "Sources" behind those facts. Talking about Graphical changes there is no source behind it, just opinions and based assumptions. If you can find an "SE" source that says that these Graphical Changes looks "cartoony" then I will admit I was wrong and admit they are facts, till then they are opinions and nothing more than opinions.

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Curious. What are your sources that you need to determine that Graphic is "fact", if we're experiencing it everyday?

Speaking of sources, if we're speaking of the latest trailer that has the 'cartoony' look, SE, themselves, stated that the trailer is old, and does not look as intended, (since you want this) as sourced here: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/54815-TGS-Trailer-ahoy%21?p=836726&viewfull=1#post836726

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Producer/Director Yoshida here.

The assets used to create the trailer were actually older than what was shown during last week's Letter from the Producer Live. Also, depending on the area shown, the lighting, as well as hair, neck movement, and facial properties are still being adjusted.

The time period in which these assets were taken was within the scope of what we planned; however, clearly the stuttering of the video was not intended and we're currently investigating this. Today, well I guess yesterday, I went to the Tokyo Game Show floor to see it in person, but since the trailer playing there didn't have any problems, the possibility that this is an encoding-related problem is quite high.

I apologize for such a rudimentary mistake, but once we figure out what caused it, we'll be sure to let you know.

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Finally. Maybe you don't have good eyesight, but people can clearly see that the graphic isn't perfect and needs improvement.

I think we should wait and see more of 2.0 before we judge

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Originally Posted by Renen

I think we should wait and see more of 2.0 before we judge

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Sadly this was said before we even seen 2.0 footage. The only mistake SE is making is not tagging videos and etc with:

"Content under development"

like they did with Seeker's trailer to let people know "no, this isn't the final product"..they can say it but what if someone not playing FFXIV will be looking at it for the first time then join up FFXIV now to play around and realize just how much of a difference the game will look whether good or bad?

Well, it looks like I been beaten *white flag* /waves ( I have glasses, so yes I don't have good eyesight)

but this thread was made before the New Adventures trailer. But the way things "Visually look" everyone will have a different opinion about them, weather your arguing technical terms or not. People will see things differently than you, on a visual level.

But I did say Lighting and shade does make the game look better as I said in one of my comments. However, how the game looks as a whole is opinionated. I'm sorry you want everyone to agree with your opinion(s), but we are human not extraterrestrials.

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Originally Posted by Elexia

Sadly this was said before we even seen 2.0 footage. The only mistake SE is making is not tagging videos and etc with:

"Content under development"

like they did with Seeker's trailer to let people know "no, this isn't the final product"..they can say it but what if someone not playing FFXIV will be looking at it for the first time then join up FFXIV now to play around and realize just how much of a difference the game will look whether good or bad?

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Deadpool had it right. Common Sense is a super power, because it's so rare = =.

You'd think people would have enough common sense to know that what they are showing is far from finished? I mean, come on look at how different Alpha and Beta looked in 1.0. that should give you a hint that what you're seeing is in pre-release, is not final. After all, they call it a "pre-release".


My how quickly people forget this.

I think the graphic now even though it alpha stage looks pretty dam good so once they polish it even more the better it be imo. I think to many are over analyzing this game its only in alpha stage its not like it the complete version or anything yet. People expectation's over an alpha release video of the game are way to high for a alpha phase and show lack of understanding of how a game process in the making actually works but that is an opinion of mine sorry if you don't agree with that my apologies if that offends anyone.

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Originally Posted by Starlord

Well, it looks like I been beaten *white flag* /waves ( I have glasses, so yes I don't have good eyesight)

but this thread was made before the New Adventures trailer. But the way things "Visually look" everyone will have a different opinion about them, weather your arguing technical terms or not. People will see things differently than you, on a visual level.

But I did say Lighting and shade does make the game look better as I said in one of my comments. However, how the game looks as a whole is opinionated. I'm sorry you want everyone to agree with your opinion(s), but we are human not extraterrestrials.

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If a majority of people feels that there's something is wrong, surely it's more than just an opinion, but something that need to be said, right, or is it still their opinion?

Besides, Renen had it right. Don't judge the game until it's fully released, and then judge all you want.

However, if you feel that there is something wrong with the game, then by all means, say something. That is what Alpha and Beta Testing is all about. Who the hell cares what's opinion or what's fact. Say it. This is what SE needs to hear.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

You could also consider gravity an opinion as well................................ just saying.

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Gravity is a self-evident fact. An opinion could only be given about how it works exactly.

How a game looks to you is completely subjective, and your opinion.

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Originally Posted by odintius

I think the graphic now even though it alpha stage looks pretty dam good so once they polish it even more the better it be imo. I think to many are over analyzing this game its only in alpha stage its not like it the complete version or anything yet. People expectation's over an alpha release video of the game are way to high for a alpha phase and show lack of understanding of how a game process in the making actually works but that is an opinion of mine sorry if you don't agree with that my apologies if that offends anyone.

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The real issue is this is a relaunch and expectations are really high because everyone figured it would take 1.0 and make it 100x better, however when we started to see even alpha footage, it looked like they took step backwards in the graphics ontop of them confirming the removal of animations is why people are "over analyzing", there's alot of concerns about certain things.

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Originally Posted by Faiyez

Gravity is a self-evident fact. An opinion could only be given about how it works exactly.

How a game looks to you is completely subjective, and your opinion.

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However certain elements in a video game can't be achieved without the use of proper lighting and shaders, thus they are to video games as gravity is to us.

Don't think they took a step backward's to me looks more a step forward people expectation's are different. If you expect it to be 100x better base on whatever standard certain people perceive to be better isn't that just a tad bit of being overboard on there part?

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Originally Posted by Suirieko

If a majority of people feels that there's something is wrong, surely it's more than just an opinion, but something that need to be said, right, or is it still their opinion?

Besides, Renen had it right. Don't judge the game until it's fully released, and then judge all you want.

However, if you feel that there is something wrong with the game, then by all means, say something. That is what Alpha and Beta Testing is all about. Who the hell cares what's opinion or what's fact. Say it. This is what SE needs to hear.

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But the thing is majority don't think the game looks cartoony. There is a "Mixed" feeling between them though. It's 50/50 This Thread in general with see alot of jumping around saying Yes and No it doesn't look cartoony a lot. So to me they are all opinions.

I agree that weather it is fact or opinion, SE needs to know so they can optimize on the matter. Don't judge the game till its fully release~ I agree with that fully. If there is something wrong say it~ Agreed. If Majority feels something is wrong (or right even), Yes it can be considered a fact.

But the main reason this whole debacle even started was because of Rokien saying The game is Cartoony, which is fine people are entitled to their opinion. However, he's making it sound like what he says "is" facts, when this thread has been quite mixed.

I am sorry if I caused any pain or suffering.

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Originally Posted by odintius

Don't think they took a step backward's to me looks more a step forward people expectation's are different. If you expect it to be 100x better base on whatever standard certain people perceive to be better isn't that just a tad bit of being overboard on there part?

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Nope. They confirmed they removed certain animations, that in itself is a step backward rather than finding a way to fix issues without stripping things out.

Maybe to some people that isn't seen as a backward step, but to a lot of people taking something away is usually a negative rather than positive. For example if they strip out targeting modes but add in a better targeting system, that's definitely a step foward, but they took out an animation that didn't really need to be removed unless the base design was that badly done.

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Originally Posted by Elexia

Nope. They confirmed they removed certain animations, that in itself is a step backward rather than finding a way to fix issues without stripping things out.

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well and for me (as i posted before)

this

http://www.adventureleague.net/board...177_478137.jpg
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__...hroud-view.jpg
http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m9...taqo2_1280.jpg
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m9...taqo1_1280.jpg
http://www.adventureleague.net/board...177_234589.jpg

http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/img/sc...ARR_PUB_10.jpg
http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/img/sc...ARR_PUB_11.jpg
http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/img/sc...ARR_PUB_12.jpg

is a very big improvement to me if you ask me.. it wins much of ATMOSPHERE and charism...


and that silly "stopping" animation... you can just have it... if you hadnt told me i even havent recognized. it looks not more bad than any current MMO when it comes to amiation.

And its very unfinished.. as yoshida said.. it was forbidden for him to show the current water effects, because they work on it right now... like the tail of the miq'uote was bugged and was not visible.

I see you point and I can respect that and value your opinion if you can accept mine as well. For you yes taking away certain animations/stripping things out is an issue for you and for other's as well so I'll will respect that view. For other's though there perspective might be different from other's and see it as a way to improve something that might be flaw to the developers etc some don't see it as being negative more as a positive as you've stated. There will always be two sides to a coin when it come to matter's like this each have there value and need to find common ground on not just one sided.

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Originally Posted by odintius

I see you point and I can respect that and value your opinion if you can accept mine as well.

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Not many people seem to respect other people's opinion's on these forums. =( I miss Gath... at least he was a trying to make the forums lively with his comedian ways.. Now he's gone =(. R.I.P

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Originally Posted by Faiyez

Gravity is a self-evident fact. An opinion could only be given about how it works exactly.

How a game looks to you is completely subjective, and your opinion.

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You do know gravity is a theory lol

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Originally Posted by Rokien

You do know gravity is a theory lol

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Gravity is a fact in that it exists. The theory of gravity is how it exists/why. *

Like we understand that all masses have gravity, you have a gravity its just tiny.. Now make theories onto why you produce a gravitational field.

* This is as long as you prescribe to a general thought process. Some people here could go and be like "but do we even exist, the world is a hologram in the imagination of a kid created by gods on the toilet"

If gravity wasn't a fact we be a floating yo :P hehe.

It really feels like 2.0 is sacrificing the close up details for the larger details. Less detail on characters more detail in surroundings. Of course I want to be in the damn Alpha/Beta so i can see what kind of graphics people with higher spec machines can pump out of the engine.

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Originally Posted by Jynx

It really feels like 2.0 is sacrificing the close up details for the larger details. Less detail on characters more detail in surroundings. Of course I want to be in the damn Alpha/Beta so i can see what kind of graphics people with higher spec machines can pump out of the engine.

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ppl like you fail to realize that to have the best of current game together with ALL ARR is coming with the same few that can play current version at max w/o a problem will be the few that will play ARR ..do you think SE wants that?... making the graphics with so many lil animations and demanding graphics was a mistake to begin with bcuz not as many ppl as SE would like have the PC to handle it ...they need the money to keep the show going ..drill that into your brains is not that complicated

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Originally Posted by Warlock

ppl like you fail to realize that to have the best of current game together with ALL ARR is coming with the same few that can play current version at max w/o a problem will be the few that will play ARR ..do you think SE wants that?... making the graphics with so many lil animations and demanding graphics was a mistake to begin with bcuz not as many ppl as SE would like have the PC to handle it ...they need the money to keep the show going ..drill that into your brains is not that complicated

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The level of hostility in your post is unnecessary in response to what Jynx said.

First off, it was confirmed by a community rep that there are some things being sacrificed. Also, he only stated that he wants to play the Alpha/Beta so he can see what it's like on max settings, since it was also confirmed by the devs that they don't present at max settings.

Reading comprehension. Drill that into your brains. It's not that complicated.

Anyone notice how the Mi'Qote dont have tails in any of the gameplay vids we have seen so far? i have a funny feeling they are still working on chr detail right now. unless of course this is what we get as some people seem to think.

"bah, cat people dont need tails"
- Yoshi-P?

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Originally Posted by ZakarnRosewood

Anyone notice how the Mi'Qote dont have tails in any of the gameplay vids we have seen so far? i have a funny feeling they are still working on chr detail right now. unless of course this is what we get as some people seem to think.

"bah, cat people dont need tails"
- Yoshi-P?

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They had tails (even the male Miqote did.) the issue was in the live letter they stated they actually had a bug for that specific version which reset their length to 0 considering it's going to have length customization. So I doubt they're working on character detail and it was just a random bug when they were working on a related system (Customization)

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Originally Posted by ZakarnRosewood

Anyone notice how the Mi'Qote dont have tails in any of the gameplay vids we have seen so far? i have a funny feeling they are still working on chr detail right now. unless of course this is what we get as some people seem to think.

"bah, cat people dont need tails"
- Yoshi-P?

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Did you not watch the translated video? They mention this exact thing...

anyone noticed sidestepping looks disjointed in alpha footage? hope this is just a placeholder.

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Originally Posted by Majidah

anyone noticed sidestepping looks disjointed in alpha footage? hope this is just a placeholder.

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Everything about movement looks generic, so I wouldn't doubt if that's how it will be come release. They'll likely refine it a bit more but it actually looks pretty standard for an older MMO.

Rokien is FFXIV's greatest troll.

All he has to do is post a new thread and say something stupid, then watch the entire community implode on itself.

The entire graphics issue is irrelevant, nothing you say or do is going to change the course of what's happening. Griping aloud about it or defending it astutely does absolutely nothing.

As to the impression on whether or not the graphics look 'cartoony'. I disagree. They're not hyperrealisitc, but they're not terribly far in the uncanny valley territory either.

But I waste my time trying to speak reason in a Rokien thread. Resume your self-inflicted social segregation.

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Originally Posted by Hyrist

Rokien is FFXIV's greatest troll.

All he has to do is post a new thread and say something stupid, then watch the entire community implode on itself.

The entire graphics issue is irrelevant, nothing you say or do is going to change the course of what's happening. Griping aloud about it or defending it astutely does absolutely nothing.

As to the impression on whether or not the graphics look 'cartoony'. I disagree. They're not hyperrealisitc, but they're not terribly far in the uncanny valley territory either.

But I waste my time trying to speak reason in a Rokien thread. Resume your self-inflicted social segregation.

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^ What she said.

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Originally Posted by Hyrist

As to the impression on whether or not the graphics look 'cartoony'. I disagree. They're not hyperrealisitc, but they're not terribly far in the uncanny valley territory either.

But I waste my time trying to speak reason in a Rokien thread. Resume your self-inflicted social segregation.

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FFXIV 1.0 is how you say now FFXIV 2.0 is ken dolls....... The clothing, armor everything about the characters look plastic.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

FFXIV 1.0 is how you say now FFXIV 2.0 is ken dolls....... The clothing, armor everything about the characters look plastic.

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I see that in some of the clips but not others. Since they said that at least some of it was old footage I am willing to wait and see some more newer examples before I crab about it anymore.

Some of it looks really nice too which is why pages ago I said I was thinking/hoping there was some sort of problem because different clips were inconsistent with each other.

Also, it IS pre alpha and I'm willing to wait until at least a beta phase before I get overly worried.

But I will worry some, the graphics in games are important to me and I don't tend to stick around long in games that aren’t visually striking.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

FFXIV 1.0 is how you say now FFXIV 2.0 is ken dolls....... The clothing, armor everything about the characters look plastic.

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rokien, you are plastic.

does not look more plastic to me than now
http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/img/sc...UB_0901_04.jpg
http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/img/sc..._20_PUB_09.jpg
http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/img/sc..._20_PUB_11.jpg

rokien played the game already it seems.

in some footage they look less good.. (maybe earlier version) we never know.. what does it tell aus? play it first or wait a bit before you come to conclusions like you already play it.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

FFXIV 1.0 is how you say now FFXIV 2.0 is ken dolls....... The clothing, armor everything about the characters look plastic.

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They do not... :rolleyes: