SCH needs some nerfs

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Originally Posted by Grimoire-M

SCH is broken because of those reasons. There are two definitions of broken. The first is 'overpowered to the point of breaking the game with minimal effort', and the second is 'underpowered, non-functional, and incapable, even when optimized fully'.

Exil there was referring to the former. SCH needs nerfs in order to put it in line with the other two healers. That's the point of this entire thread.

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Hmmm as I already say SCH is almost perfect and I just prey for one adjustment (the one I said on top), still there is no reason to nerf it. The AST after the latest buff make it even better and DPS wise is really close to the SCH. The WHM has an amazing set of skills plus it’s easy to heal with, dmg wise is more difficult to optimise because of the inability to weave but the basic potency is higher, at this point I would buff the WHM by making PoM aoe and probably making Stone II instant. This changes willl bring “ balance back”

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Originally Posted by JohnSeal

You really don’t know what you are talking about.. SCH broken? It’s the most complete and efficient healer, great OGCD, ability two weave, CS, High mitigation, so please have a moment of meditation before type stuff like that lol xD
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You question the idea that SCH is broken, and then you list off all the reasons why it's broken....
It's a perfect job as it currently is now, it has no obvious downsides and that's precisely why it's broken next to a job like WHM.

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Originally Posted by Exiled_Tonberry

You question the idea that SCH is broken, and then you list off all the reasons why it's broken....
It's a perfect job as it currently is now, it has no obvious downsides and that's precisely why it's broken next to a job like WHM.

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Well that's just how you want to see the things:
SCH is broken compared to WHM. But then SCH is well balanced compared to AST. WHM is not the basis of healing in FFXIV.

I don't think the discussion is constructive if WHM is your focal point of comparison. SCH in Stormblood's high end content just fits the deal, and so does AST. There is not so much healing required in those fights, they can contribute to raid DPS by buffing or by their pDPS (meaning they can heal with little DPS loss). Their kits are well designed, that's a fact.

Healing in FFXIV currently works fine for 2 jobs out of 3. WHM is the problem, not SCH.

Issues with WHM have been confirmed by Yoshida, it will most likely receive some manner of a band-aid in 4.5 because it would be pretty bad form to leave under performing jobs in the dust for about half a year, and then be further reworked in 5.0 along with other classes.

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Originally Posted by Jollyy5

Issues with WHM have been confirmed by Yoshida, it will most likely receive some manner of a band-aid in 4.5 because it would be pretty bad form to leave under performing jobs in the dust for about half a year, and then be further reworked in 5.0 along with other classes.

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I'd rather they don't band-aid fix WHM in 4.5 because then that opens the window of:

"see, we fixed WHM in 4.5! So we don't need to give it a huge overhaul in 5.0!"

I'd rather they fix it right in a single go at this point - and I expect that fix in the 5.0 range.

I hope so! I really want to be maining WHM, but I can do arguably better with SCH while bringing some neat utility.

The issues on WHM, as far as I've experienced, and proposals to band-aid them:

- Lilies are basically an ignore-able mechanic. My suggestion to fix it, is that the more lilies you spend in those abilities, the stronger they become, less MP they cost. The reduced cooldown it's negligible at best. Also, make Stone like a 50% chance to proc a Lily, and add Holy to the enhanced spells.

- Plenary Indulgence sucks, because by the time you have enough confessions to make it work, your party won't need it anymore. I actually think the niche of this spell is really redundant. For a band-aid, maybe make the confession stacks last like 1 minute, so you'll have a full powered PI when the boss lands a big AoE again... Come 5.0, replace this spell for Arise, 190 recast time, raises your target and 2 other people nearby without the weakened debuff.

I think 5.0 should really set up the niche for WHM, as the "selfish healer", that just brings, beyond powerful healing, really powerful dps. Reducing the cast time from Stone IV, keep the Aero dot and Aero 3 ditched for a instant cast spell with moderate recast time (like 20 seconds) that do big damage in AoE... Maybe Water II or something like that? As of my 1st suggestion, Holy mp cost would be better with lilies, so you'd be able to weave in between a few Stones.

WHM Lily system is just under-par compared to AST cards and SCH fairy meter. If they designed a new resource system for WHM even with the current spells and abilities, WHM could be in a much better spot. One of the reasons SCH got so much better now is they gave it QoL improvements to make controlling the fairy a lot easier. Same for AST with the clipping reduction.

As easy as it may be to just use the nerf bat, they should focus on making WHM more fun to play with a new mini-game system for WHM. Lily is just brain-dead right now.

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Originally Posted by Mansion

Healing in FFXIV currently works fine for 2 jobs out of 3. WHM is the problem, not SCH.

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Acting like there isn't a huge gap between AST and SCH is either disingenuous or ignorant. Diurnal AST has clears because the alternative is WHM but Noct is essentially pointless outside of encounters that you have down to a science like the linked o9s video from Mono Sama.

WHM is an issue in terms of healer balance because it's underpowered but SCH is the same problem in the opposite direction.

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Originally Posted by Jollyy5

Issues with WHM have been confirmed by Yoshida, it will most likely receive some manner of a band-aid in 4.5 because it would be pretty bad form to leave under performing jobs in the dust for about half a year, and then be further reworked in 5.0 along with other classes.

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I'm really glad someone bought up that WHM question, seriously. However I don't think there's much they can do for WHM in 4.5 at this point. I'd actually prefer them to just sit on it and really rework things in 5.0 so they can really hone in on the issues instead of give us band-aid fixes. The acknowledgement alone is nice.

That being said, if they can at least address the useless lily trait that would be nice. I want to believe they left it alone all this time because they plan to rework lilies as a whole...

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Originally Posted by lulunami

WHM Lily system is just under-par compared to AST cards and SCH fairy meter. If they designed a new resource system for WHM even with the current spells and abilities, WHM could be in a much better spot. One of the reasons SCH got so much better now is they gave it QoL improvements to make controlling the fairy a lot easier. Same for AST with the clipping reduction.

As easy as it may be to just use the nerf bat, they should focus on making WHM more fun to play with a new mini-game system for WHM. Lily is just brain-dead right now.

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Though I'd say the Faerie meter is also a bit clunky and hard to use (that delay, oh damn...). But the SCH got already so many toys to play with, that it's not really missed.