Tales from Duty Finder: Some make you laugh, some make you cry. Let's vent. 2.0

Had a WoD yesterday where a peculiar-looking sprout DRG from another alliance tried to do the "Hold the chain for easy DPS" vs Cerberus. I was standing right next to them entire time, watching them waiting and waiting as that chain buff timer ticks down... to 0. Immediately I typed "RIP" in alliance chat. Looking at how the DRG was wiggling where they are, I knew they're must've been panicking, hard. There goes Cerberus mowing us all down in next minute.

DRG:"That was me. Somebody told me that I should hold the chain for easy dps gain. Sorry..."

Thankfully the whole alliance was mostly chill, except 1 particular individual. But none of us bit the trashfire bait into an argument.

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Originally Posted by Padudu

[...]FC membah had a healer who flat out refused to dps because "it's meant for pvp, it's not even on my bar. my job is to heal" with the party agreeing with the healer.[...]

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: p u t__l i t t e r__i n__i t s__p l a c e :

ok here's the tea lmao, sorry it took me a bit since I had to edit it. let me know if you can still see names (Idts though) color code:
blue = FC member
red = the healer
yellow = other party member

another correction: they said "pve" not "pvp". makes even less sense now lol

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Originally Posted by Kaoru_Nagisa

what

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Originally Posted by Rein_eon_Osborne

: p u t__l i t t e r__i n__i t s__p l a c e :

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You guys ever notice the tags at the bottom?

derp ala derping pain hilarity *fragile tank egos* *fragile dps egos* here we go again cringe compilation hi /v/ #gcbtw cats unga bunga all human life is here purgatory™

Of course it's when I level a BLM I get a tank that doesn't stay still.
A first time tank in Babil.
They aggro, they stop for 2 GCD, then continue moving until they hit a barrier.
Well, can't entirely blame them since some sections in Babil spawns 1 set of mobs at a time.

But stopping in the middle of a pull and then decide to move again?
At Lv83 they should know better.

I'm only lv 50 (48) when this happened. I haven't played in over a year and read I needed to do the roulette wheel daily. So I was a little apprehensive because I'm a Tank and didn't want folks screaming at me because I didn't know which way to go or missed holding aggro. Like I said I'm still relatively new doing first content. Anyways I joined a party and I knew something was wrong I was taking probably to much dmg and couldn't keep aggro. I knew the Healer was probably getting frustrated but instead of raging the healer said hey Ax if you don't put up your stance I'm not going to heal you. There is was I was like omg what stance I was thinking I was frantically looking through actions, traits etc. Finally I just admitted I was coming back after a year and literally forgot most things. The healer told me it was my Iron Will Ability. I was very thankful that this game has players that are understanding and actually helped instead of booted me or whatever.

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Originally Posted by Axhammer

I'm only lv 50 (48) when this happened. I haven't played in over a year and read I needed to do the roulette wheel daily. So I was a little apprehensive because I'm a Tank and didn't want folks screaming at me because I didn't know which way to go or missed holding aggro. Like I said I'm still relatively new doing first content. Anyways I joined a party and I knew something was wrong I was taking probably to much dmg and couldn't keep aggro. I knew the Healer was probably getting frustrated but instead of raging the healer said hey Ax if you don't put up your stance I'm not going to heal you. There is was I was like omg what stance I was thinking I was frantically looking through actions, traits etc. Finally I just admitted I was coming back after a year and literally forgot most things. The healer told me it was my Iron Will Ability. I was very thankful that this game has players that are understanding and actually helped instead of booted me or whatever.

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For the most part, if you’re upfront & communicative with your issues, people tend to be very understanding & helpful. Personally I get more annoyed if said player are consistently making mistakes against repeated challenges & being 100% silent. The latter makes it worse because I have no clue if that player are receptive enough to receive advices.

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Originally Posted by Padudu

LMAO I need to grab the screenshots (and edit them obviously) but FC membah had a healer who flat out refused to dps because "it's meant for pvp, it's not even on my bar. my job is to heal" with the party agreeing with the healer. We were in awe because this was a level 80 SHB dungeon lol. He ate the penalty after they struggled to clear the bosses. Believe it was Heroes Guantlet. There's a type for everyone :p

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Umm, I barely DPS. If you want a wannabe healer get a Sage. I have only ever had one person whine why I do not DPS. Most of the time I get into parties who shockingly are suprised on how quick and painless the run is because the Healer actually healed instead of people freaking out because the healer only might start healing once your below 15%.

I have had constantly tanks thank me for not stressing them out and DPS who thanked me for getting us through the dungeon early. Typically mechanics whiners who are the cause of all issues in this game (They often roll Bards/Sages) are the main cause of misery because now we have one less DPS because we got a mechanic whiner literally not doing his job DPSing telling everyone what they need to do and not do well that person who is often a bard/sage does not DPS and spends the entire run trying to boss everyone around.

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Originally Posted by Axhammer

I'm only lv 50 (48) when this happened. I haven't played in over a year and read I needed to do the roulette wheel daily. So I was a little apprehensive because I'm a Tank and didn't want folks screaming at me because I didn't know which way to go or missed holding aggro. Like I said I'm still relatively new doing first content. Anyways I joined a party and I knew something was wrong I was taking probably to much dmg and couldn't keep aggro. I knew the Healer was probably getting frustrated but instead of raging the healer said hey Ax if you don't put up your stance I'm not going to heal you. There is was I was like omg what stance I was thinking I was frantically looking through actions, traits etc. Finally I just admitted I was coming back after a year and literally forgot most things. The healer told me it was my Iron Will Ability. I was very thankful that this game has players that are understanding and actually helped instead of booted me or whatever.

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I am so sorry to hear that. Often I will make comments it small pull tuesday but when someone tells me they just got back to the game I tell them I gotcha and try to inform them on various changes and such. Most people forget leveling duties are essentially a learning experience. Some Mentors or Mechanics whiners sadly roll the Mentor Roueltte and instead of helping someone they just want the XP to get in and out which is wrong.

I am also odd enough to remember when we had the cross class system and expected to level other classes so we could get certain abilities. Thankfully only the mechanics whiners liked that system and they don't matter.

Also most people need to be patient and understanding I remember when I was a young tank doing Alexander my first time and no one told me to Limit Break as a Tank never really uses that. When we all died I had mostly a party who did not understand though thankfully many did.

Yeah I just leveled a BLM all the way to 90 this year. Typically as a Tank if a DPS gets argo I expect them to bring the mob to me since again if they run to the other side of the dungeon trying to avoid the mob and I have to move the chess board to save a pawn I can endanger the most important piece on the board healers by redirecting the mob to save a healer. Playing a BLM I really need to pull get the argo move on get another pull and then once I decide I got enough mobs to stop and not move as much so the caster has time to cast.

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Originally Posted by Curisu

There was no rage or whatever towards the DNC or the group. It was just the unusual situation of a dancer running first into a boss and attacking it while the tank was to far away to do anything, and I just let the situation play out and continued.

Do not compare this situation to someone who wipes a whole group with uninvolved player.
That's defenetly not funny and just a time waste for everyone.

Also, what did the DNC lose due to the death?
His rotation? So should I now always do a 17sec CD as PLD in a dungeon so I can play my rotation correctly?
Time? This 10 sec longer Bossfight in a group who was already quicker then most other groups?

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So this is sort of like when a party runs in and skips the cut scene when the tank or healer is not there and shocked it causes a wipe. At a certain point you have to decide when you so far away and can barely make it, is it worth it to come in and wipe with them or let them wipe for rushing in and start over and go in as a team.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

The tank was definitely a baby here, but the healer literally could have just clicked yes instead of acting like a brat. It’s just a ready check. Clicking yes ain’t that hard.

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The entire purpose the ready check is to see if everyone is ready. If I as the healer is not ready and I select no due to various issues, maybe I need a bathroom break or water break or perhaps I need my MP to refill the DPS who runs in to start the clock is causing issues.

The tank was very nice to do a ready check.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

Over the weekend, I've come across two tanks that just didn't belong in the dungeon they queued for.

The first was in Smileton. I was DPSing. The first double pull went well enough, but then things started to slow down, pulling one pack at a time. After a couple times, I started watching their buffs. They weren't using their mitigations. I proposed using those. My fellow DPS mentioned using MP for blackest night. They said "okay" then gave some excuse about getting back into playing DRK.

The second incident was in Ktisis and more or less followed the same pattern. It was a warrior and they were only using Bloodwhetting on pulls. I looked at the gear and they were in the 515 crafted gear for left side with a couple 520 pieces on the right. I linked a piece of level 86 crafted as recommended gear. "oh, yeah" "I got unlucky on the roulette"

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Sadly, I think this reason here is why almost all dungeons are switching to a Trust Mode. In the early dungeons as tanks there are certain gear you can buy but it means you can't equip anything to your feet or head when wearing that armor. Its just for ARR content from 20-40 but yeah a fresh sprout and new to the game might not have the money to buy the special gear.

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Originally Posted by Cubsbane

Yep. That and the enemy cast bar flashing meaning it's interruptible were added long after launch, so there's no tutorial for them... but they SHOULD be added. I cannot tell you how many times I've seen a sprout tank failing to Interject at an important moment. And who could blame them? How should they know this?

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Esuna is a god send when I don't see Healers using it with keeping Medica II on and see the Healer just DPSing it always gets me. The problem here is we have people in this game a small minority who get upset when Healers heal so instead we get healers who barely if ever heal or seem to use Healing spells or regain.

Also remember a large part of the community is using not a keyboard buy a controller. So Tanks are not able to use every single ability on their bar. Yes there is the tap trick which helps but sadly some tanks are overburdened with skills instead of as you level the new skill overtakes the old skill. Thankfully Shadowbringers and Endwalker and got rid or merged some skills.

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Originally Posted by Cincierta

Why is it lately I've been getting tanks in roulette that don't aoe?

Lately a lot of them will stick with single-target to get aggro, no ranged, no provoke, nada. Died several times as a healer doing roulettes the other day because all of the mobs plus their grandparents were on me like a stack of hotcakes.

Please tanks, please use your aoes.

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Remember again a large party of the community uses a gamepad so provoke is very hard to use since its not as simple as point and click for someone on a gamepad. Also AOEing should always be done by a tank rather then using provoke.

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

Umm, I barely DPS. If you want a wannabe healer get a Sage. I have only ever had one person whine why I do not heal. Most of the time I get into parties who shockingly are suprised on how quick and painless the run is because the Healer actually healed instead of people freaking out because the healer only might start healing once your below 15%.

I have had constantly tanks thank me for not stressing them out and DPS who thanked me for getting us through the dungeon early. Typically mechanics whiners who are the cause of all issues in this game (They often roll Bards/Sages) are the main cause of misery because now we have one less DPS because we got a mechanic whiner literally not doing his job DPSing telling everyone what they need to do and not do well that person who is often a bard/sage does not DPS and spends the entire run trying to boss everyone around.

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I'm a verrry new healer (like maybe a month into healing new). Part of it was for glam, other part is that I tank ALL the time and I want to see what it's like on the other foot and help with my focus (since I have problems with it. ADHD is not fun with this game lol.). You should always be dpsing between heals!! It's like boring anyway if you sit there topping everyone off when they're perfectly fine, it's just a waste lol. The majority of people won't say anything so if you're playing wrong you'll never know until you hit the harder raids and stuff. I learned that the hard way.

Anyway as far as HP goes I just go with what I'm comfortable with. Sometimes my reflexes are slow so I'm generally comfy with tanks being at 25-30% before I heal them. As a tank, I get the anxiety but put a little trust in people is what I've learned playing as healer. Overtime I think I've learned it's ok to let some HP go for the dps. When I go back to playing tank I realize most healers won't let me down as long as I'm also doing my job (using mits and my rotation). If I learned anything from the countless WHM videos.. ABCs.. always be casting. :) Anyways I'm not a healer expert by any means. But I do know the basics and try my best with it.

The person in the screenshots just wasn't dpsing at all. They didn't even have the dps skills in their bar, so they were literally just sitting there and healing.

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

Umm, I barely DPS. If you want a wannabe healer get a Sage. I have only ever had one person whine why I do not DPS. Most of the time I get into parties who shockingly are suprised on how quick and painless the run is because the Healer actually healed instead of people freaking out because the healer only might start healing once your below 15%.

I have had constantly tanks thank me for not stressing them out and DPS who thanked me for getting us through the dungeon early. Typically mechanics whiners who are the cause of all issues in this game (They often roll Bards/Sages) are the main cause of misery because now we have one less DPS because we got a mechanic whiner literally not doing his job DPSing telling everyone what they need to do and not do well that person who is often a bard/sage does not DPS and spends the entire run trying to boss everyone around.

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I'd have booted you for not doing your job. Run is faster when you're dpsing, and if you have a warrior tank you don't even need to heal.

You know when to heal and when to dps, no, not everyone needs 100% HP all the time. You'll learn the fights and get a feel for it.

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Originally Posted by Padudu

I'm a verrry new healer (like maybe a month into healing new). Part of it was for glam, other part is that I tank ALL the time and I want to see what it's like on the other foot and help with my focus (since I have problems with it. ADHD is not fun with this game lol.). You should always be dpsing between heals!! It's like boring anyway if you sit there topping everyone off when they're perfectly fine, it's just a waste lol. The majority of people won't say anything so if you're playing wrong you'll never know until you hit the harder raids and stuff. I learned that the hard way.

Anyway as far as HP goes I just go with what I'm comfortable with. Sometimes my reflexes are slow so I'm generally comfy with tanks being at 25-30% before I heal them. As a tank, I get the anxiety but put a little trust in people is what I've learned playing as healer. Overtime I think I've learned it's ok to let some HP go for the dps.

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Then your personality or your ADHD might not work with being a Healer. If your low on mana and the party wipes because you been DPSing the entire time its not the Tanks or DPSs fault. Your job is to heal put Medica II up and if you know your going to throw out one or two Holy Bombs or Hits make sure your tank also has regain on. The problem with the Jobs in this game they made the cool jobs Tanks. So there are a lot of people who roll the wrong job for the wrong reasons. In your case you rolled because of Glam?

As a White Mage you have three DPS skills. One a regular attack, the 2nd is a overtime attack skill which is easy to put on, and then you have a third spamming Holy Spell.

What some DPS Healers don't understand if you only start healing once your tank is at 15% chances are that tank is stressed. If he gets hit with Paralysis and you don't Esuna it because you're to busy DPSing if he freezes or something bad happens there is going to be a wipe. I've seen cases and seen stories in this thread were DPS Healers let their entire team die because instead of healing they DPS'd and the entire party died due to the healer not curing Doom or not healing 100% in which the spell then kills everyone.

You get anxiety but most people's anxiety might be worse than yours. Going through an entire run keeping your team on edge because you are barely healing is just asking for problems because you can only stress people out so much.

As for DPS I agree. DPS are pawns, if they die you could easily wait a minute or two or even three to revive but the tank has the entire team on his shoulders if he falls chances are so is everyone else.

But people should really consider their personality before rolling a class even if they look good or they think the class is cool. Its like being a person with road rage and using cruise control in the slow lane. Either you learn to calm down or you go crazy and do things your own way.

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Originally Posted by Imora

I'd have booted you for not doing your job. Run is faster when you're dpsing, and if you have a warrior tank you don't even need to heal.

You know when to heal and when to dps, no, not everyone needs 100% HP all the time. You'll learn the fights and get a feel for it.

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This reminds me of the argument for the cross class system in which we used to have in this game in which its a system barely anyone but the hardcore players liked which I think you'd enjoy it.

You are playing your class when you are healing. You DPS when you can but the Tank is the Tank and the DPS is the DPS. There is no cross DPS/TANK/HEALER system. I know your new to the game but you seem like one of those people. Have you ever wondered why in Prae you can't skip the cutscenes? That's because you used to be able to do that and what would happen is people would vote to kick anyone who was watching the cut scenes instead of skipping and running in.

You mentioned booted me? You do know booting people for playing their class is a violation of the terms? Just like for example if your a DPS Healer and refuse to heal that is techically a violation of the TOS. As a Healer you are expected to heal and when or if you can DPS.

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

This reminds me of the argument for the cross class system in which we used to have in this game in which its a system barely anyone but the hardcore players liked which I think you'd enjoy it.

You are playing your class when you are healing. You DPS when you can but the Tank is the Tank and the DPS is the DPS. There is no cross DPS/TANK/HEALER system. I know your new to the game but you seem like one of those people. Have you ever wondered why in Prae you can't skip the cutscenes? That's because you used to be able to do that and what would happen is people would vote to kick anyone who was watching the cut scenes instead of skipping and running in.

You mentioned booted me? You do know booting people for playing their class is a violation of the terms? Just like for example if your a DPS Healer and refuse to heal that is techically a violation of the TOS. As a Healer you are expected to heal and when or if you can DPS.

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You're NOT playing your class only healing, and if the rest of the group agreed with it, there's nothing you can do because forcing your playstyle on three people that disagree with you is also a violation of ToS.

PS: i played during ARR, I know the cross class system well and yes, I did like it.

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

Then your personality or your ADHD might not work with being a Healer. If your low on mana and the party wipes because you been DPSing the entire time its not the Tanks or DPSs fault.

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? It's called management and reading the situation lol. I think I've only had trouble with my mana when I was literally like a week or two new into it. If everyone gets bonked from an AoE or something ofc I'm not DPSing. You shouldn't be running low on mana as long as you're being pretty consistent and you're not constantly having to heal. If a tank is constantly low and needing heals, they're not using mitigations correctly or at all, or there's something wrong with their gear. But even if you DO need to heal them constantly, mana was never that much of an issue. I'd like to think I know when I am the problem (on either side) and usually if a wipe happens I know if it's me, someone else, or both. I'm not really afraid to blame myself lol because how else do you learn. That's super insulting to say, btw. My ADHD makes it more difficult at times, it doesn't make the class unplayable.

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

What some DPS Healers don't understand if you only start healing once your tank is at 15% chances are that tank is stressed. If he gets hit with Paralysis and you don't Esuna it because you're to busy DPSing if he freezes or something bad happens there is going to be a wipe. I've seen cases and seen stories in this thread were DPS Healers let their entire team die because instead of healing they DPS'd and the entire party died due to the healer not curing Doom or not healing 100% in which the spell then kills everyone.

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This is what I mean by 'put some trust in your healer'. I've been hit with stuns and not esuna'd as a tank plenty, plenty, PLENTY of times and yet I'm not left to die. They pop a heal, timer is gone, nice. If they esuna? Nicer. Again, it's called reading the situation lol. I'll admit, I don't esuna everything. But somehow I've been able to keep them healed through trash mobs while still dpsing - it's like magic (and a bit of swiftcast).

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

You get anxiety but most people's anxiety might be worse than yours. Going through an entire run keeping your team on edge because you are barely healing is just asking for problems because you can only stress people out so much.

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Just like my teammates aren't responsible for my ADHD/anxiety, I'm not responsible for managing theirs. Tankxiety is something you have to learn to ease up on, that's just a fact. It just makes it harder if you don't.

Why do you guys bother responding to a dude who thought his FC was full of 'prostitutes' when it was a couple people joking around in the yard, and had been causing trouble in that same FC by acting like a tool?

There ain't no getting through to some people. Ignore trolls and don't feed them, hard as that is to do.

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Originally Posted by Kaoru_Nagisa

trolls and don't feed them, hard as that is to do.

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trolls make the world go 'round, though. Also, we don't have Skiros talking about masculinity in XIV, so bored. :(

I'll tbh I don't even think (based on what the FC leader replied anyways before that thread was blasted out of existence) that the dude is trolling most of the time. I just think it's a case of uhh.. one sandwich short of a picnic situation. lol

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Originally Posted by Kaoru_Nagisa

Ignore trolls and don't feed them, hard as that is to do.

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Its this or another Dark Knight needs a rework thread.

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Originally Posted by Kaoru_Nagisa

Why do you guys bother responding to a dude who thought his FC was full of 'prostitutes' when it was a couple people joking around in the yard, and had been causing trouble in that same FC by acting like a tool?

There ain't no getting through to some people. Ignore trolls and don't feed them, hard as that is to do.

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I'm more surprised that the guy didn't just vanish with the previous thread after that one fiasco.

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Originally Posted by Cincierta

I'm more surprised that the guy didn't just vanish with the previous thread after that one fiasco.

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Why, when what I saw with ERPing was against the TOS and asking if being in the same FC is going to jeopardize my account? It's sort of like when a FC uses RMT and gives it out to members. I saw a cached version of the post and yeah the response to me from the FC included many falsehoods. The only thing that was correct was I tended to give nicknames but that's about it. Before I left I sent an in game mail the FC owner and expressed my concerns and told her I was leaving. I did not say anything rude if anything I am sorry I was going to be leaving.

The reason why I did not respond to the above two is because it has nothing to do with the thread and I consider it rude, harassment at this point and reported as such.

Also, my last word on that matter there were a couple of people who disagreed with me in that thread but there was also many more in the thread who agreed or understood where I was coming from with asking. As you see with my join date I've been here for a while and there as been eRP threads here and with people complaining that people shouldn't get banned for it of course it always goes downhill from there. My only regret with that thread was I couldn't contact a CSR to ask due to COVID cutting hours and days you can call in to ask questions.

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

Why, when what I saw with ERPing was against the TOS and asking if being in the same FC is going to jeopardize my account? It's sort of like when a FC uses RMT and gives it out to members. I saw a cached version of the post and yeah the response to me from the FC included many falsehoods. The only thing that was correct was I tended to give nicknames but that's about it. Before I left I sent an in game mail the FC owner and expressed my concerns and told her I was leaving. I did not say anything rude if anything I am sorry I was going to be leaving.

The reason why I did not respond to the above two is because it has nothing to do with the thread and I consider it rude, harassment at this point and reported as such.

Also, my last word on that matter there were a couple of people who disagreed with me in that thread but there was also many more in the thread who agreed or understood where I was coming from with asking. As you see with my join date I've been here for a while and there as been eRP threads here and with people complaining that people shouldn't get banned for it of course it always goes downhill from there. My only regret with that thread was I couldn't contact CSR due to COVID cutting hours and days you can call in to ask questions.

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It's always someone's else's fault but yours huh? lol and reporting for harassment when you say my personality/ADHD is the problem with healer, but ok. I guess THATS not rude

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Originally Posted by Padudu

It's always someone's else's fault but yours huh? lol and reporting for harassment when you say my personality/ADHD is the problem with healer, but ok. I guess THATS not rude

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Didn't you know?
You need a "healer personality" to play healer. Meaning the cutesy uwu anime girl healer that just wants to help everyone and takes good care of them nyaa~ :3
Curse you for wanting to contribute and being able to dps and heal at the same time, that's so not cute.

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

What some DPS Healers don't understand if you only start healing once your tank is at 15% chances are that tank is stressed.

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Take a piece of paper and stick it onto your monitor over your health bar. Now you can't be stressed. As long as you press mitigation it's the healers responsibility. I know, I'm a genius, but no need for thanks.

I dunno why people gotta so aggressively interpret everything...

DNC: *Puts Dance Partner on Tank*

Me: Tank got dance partner.

*I get ignored for a good while*

Me mid countdown: Dancer change dance partner.

DNC: Okaaay then.

Tank: But you promised :(.

Others: *Gets mad at me and starts going on about how it's not a log run so who the fk cares stupid elitist*

I was about to respond '' okay then I won't use TA '' sarcastically but it was too late with the countdown.

Holy hell, sorry for noticing?
How am I supposed to know they had some kind of arrangement? I was the last person to join they said nothing about it, even then why dance partner on PLD tank?????????
I don't understand the point at all.

It's not the first time either I've even had tanks that demanded to get dance partner or they'll leave it's just weird.

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Originally Posted by Kolsykol

I dunno why people gotta so aggressively interpret everything...

DNC: *Puts Dance Partner on Tank*

Me: Tank got dance partner.

*I get ignored for a good while*

Me mid countdown: Dancer change dance partner.

DNC: Okaaay then.

Tank: But you promised :(.

Others: *Gets mad at me and starts going on about how it's not a log run so who the fk cares stupid elitist*

I was about to respond '' okay then I won't use TA '' sarcastically but it was too late with the countdown.

Holy hell, sorry for noticing?
How am I supposed to know they had some kind of arrangement? I was the last person to join they said nothing about it, even then why dance partner on PLD tank?????????
I don't understand the point at all.

It's not the first time either I've even had tanks that demanded to get dance partner or they'll leave it's just weird.

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Bold of you to assume most people in DF would care about or even notice a lack of TA. You're giving people way too much credit. :p

I killed my party as a GNB in Smileton for disconnecting 3 times in a row :( When I came back on for 3rd time I saw they managed to whittle down the Big Cheese's health to 10% before wiping cause mess ups. I look up my command prompt and saw I had like 900ms ping spikes across the entire reconnecting and disconnecting :cry:

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

Snip

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How to say you have no idea how healing in XIV works without saying you have no idea how healing in XIV works.

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Originally Posted by Imora

You're NOT playing your class only healing, and if the rest of the group agreed with it, there's nothing you can do because forcing your playstyle on three people that disagree with you is also a violation of ToS.

PS: i played during ARR, I know the cross class system well and yes, I did like it.

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Also for both: argue semantics of ToS all you want. They are written vague for a reason that's definitely not to favor the players but SE themselves.

The fact remains however, healers barely have anything to heal in general contents; the amount of times they press their shiny healthy button are insultingly scarce compared to their DPS buttons. Playing chicken when there's no damage going out is straight up gimping your party's overall dps. Press.That.Nuke.Button. Is it reportable to kick for that reason? Debatable, but it's surely socially unacceptable to see those sort of healers considering how it requires little to no thought to just press that 1 button. They're bad, plain and simple. No in-betweens.

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Originally Posted by Curisu

Small petty story by me.
I ran expert as tank (WAR) a few days ago.
The others are WHM, DNC and SMN.

I do my usual big pull and we kill everything quickly.
Same goes for the adds before the 2nd Boss.
Before the last adds die, i notice that no one opend the chest, so I slowly move towards it with the remaining 2-3 adds.
These adds die and the way to the boss opens.
I walk the remaining yalms to open the chest and when I turn my camera i see the DNC sprinting and dashing towards to the boss and pulling it.
I move (without sprint due to cooldown) to the boss area, turn off tankstance and start my rotation and watch the DNC die.
He also did not get healed, dies get rezzed and we continue as nothing happened.

No one said a word, the DNC opend all chests afterwards and I got a com at the end.

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that's literally against ToS my dude.

What's with all that ToS around here? Let's grow up and stop. I just don't understand why it's aaaalways that.

For example: So it's against the ToS if a DPS is using single target during a wall-to-wall-pull? Or is it forcing them into my playstyle because I want them to do AOE? But they are ruining my game experience? Oh I shall run with people I know if I want to speedrun? But why aren't they running with their people if they want to go slow? You understand what I mean? Yeah, let's just play together and everyone should try their best. Start reading tooltips, ask for help if you want to.

I've met a RPR yesterday that used their shroud form only one single time in dead ends. Was on my SGE and that RPR took every debuff and dmg they could. I considered letting them die to focus on DPS more. But I'm not that kind of person and it would've slowed down things even more. Don't know if they had some connection problems in general, because they disconnected once directly after the dungeon started.

If it had been me with connection issues, I would have left the dungeon to don't be a burden and get my problems fixed.

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Originally Posted by MonsterHugger

that's literally against ToS my dude.

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You mean to pull the boss as a dps when the tank is not in range of the boss?

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Originally Posted by LyraMaru

What's with all that ToS around here? Let's grow up and stop. I just don't understand why it's aaaalways that.

For example: So it's against the ToS if a DPS is using single target during a wall-to-wall-pull? Or is it forcing them into my playstyle because I want them to do AOE? But they are ruining my game experience? Oh I shall run with people I know if I want to speedrun? But why aren't they running with their people if they want to go slow? You understand what I mean? Yeah, let's just play together and everyone should try their best. Start reading tooltips, ask for help if you want to.

I've met a RPR yesterday that used their shroud form only one single time in dead ends. Was on my SGE and that RPR took every debuff and dmg they could. I considered letting them die to focus on DPS more. But I'm not that kind of person and it would've slowed down things even more. Don't know if they had some connection problems in general, because they disconnected once directly after the dungeon started.

If it had been me with connection issues, I would have left the dungeon to don't be a burden and get my problems fixed.

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*Notices melee isn't doing any positionals*

*Brings it up out of genuine concern because they might not know*

Response: '' HOW DAREEEEEEEEEE YOU!?!?!?!+11+1+1+1+!?1+21+4151962498642 TOXIC ELITIST TELLING ME HOW 2 PLAY U DON PEY MY SUB"!3 I DIDONT FKINWN ASK HOW CAN U DUN DID THIS TO ME?#! ''

Other group members: '' YEAH HOW DAER U WHO GIEV A SHIDT JUST DON HALP ANY1 EVER IM SOOOOO MAD AT U 2 FOR SUM REASOWN ''



...

Alternatively the person in question thanks for the help and actually appreciates it but other group members have the same response lol.

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Originally Posted by Loonies

You mean to pull the boss as a dps when the tank is not in range of the boss?

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Nah, to drop tank-stance as punishment. Tank admitted they were at the boss already when they did that.

Some days I wish that non-FFXIV mentality of "you pull you tank" would just go back to the other games.

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Originally Posted by HisShadowX

if you only start healing once your tank is at 15% chances are that tank is stressed.

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Oh, no. Anyway.

Ran dead ends in expert yesterday. Was on blm. I’d like to apologize to my party, that was one hella stoned mentor stinkin up the joint

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Originally Posted by Shibi

Nah, to drop tank-stance as punishment. Tank admitted they were at the boss already when they did that.

Some days I wish that non-FFXIV mentality of "you pull you tank" would just go back to the other games.

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Yes the tank should have kept the tank stance on, but would it not have been better that the dps would had wait for the tank or wrote "sorry have not seen that the tank is not there for pull"?

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Originally Posted by Shibi

Nah, to drop tank-stance as punishment. Tank admitted they were at the boss already when they did that.

Some days I wish that non-FFXIV mentality of "you pull you tank" would just go back to the other games.

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Tbh I think that is just a "everyone is a bit in the wrong" no one is clean from that story lol.

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Originally Posted by Loonies

Yes the tank should have kept the tank stance on, but would it not have been better that the dps would had wait for the tank or wrote "sorry have not seen that the tank is not there for pull"?

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We don't know if the DPS in their story does that out of impatience or to prompt the tank to accept the teleportation. That is up in the air; one that we'll never know, it's pointless to talk about that. But what we know for sure is the said tank enters the boss room THEN turns off the tank stance, in addition to the healer's absence of healing.

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Originally Posted by Loonies

Yes the tank should have kept the tank stance on, but would it not have been better that the dps would had wait for the tank or wrote "sorry have not seen that the tank is not there for pull"?

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Maybe, maybe not. Pulling is not a cardinal sin nor is it against the ToS. DPS have procs and buffs they might lose and wasting them makes no sense. Same principle applies to trash pulls, where the DPS loss can get significantly bigger.

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Originally Posted by rewd

Maybe, maybe not. Pulling is not a cardinal sin nor is it against the ToS. DPS have procs and buffs they might lose and wasting them makes no sense. Same principle applies to trash pulls, where the DPS loss can get significantly bigger.

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Mob & Boss Pulls honestly depend on the team, which lie in a grey area. The perspective of pulling really depends on the player's own skill level & party coordination level. If the DNC didn't die and the healer could keep the DNC alive until the tank manage to establish aggro, there was really no issue (which happens more often than not in a well-oiled party with a good healer -- healing is overtuned in dungeons and tank aggro generation is ridiculously high with tank stance on). With the amount of AoE healing abilities a healer have, it's actually not an issue for a DPS to take a couple of hits and then let the tank re-establish aggro to spread the outgoing damage better, even in dungeon bosses. Most people just don't care enough about it because it's casual content and people aren't expected to be playing optimally beyond just their regular rotation and take into account of party coordination. Plus, damage is generally non-lethal in dungeons, so it's just more work for very marginal gain.

At the same time, it's not against ToS if tank was unprepared, didn't notice, or was ignorant of the matter in the pull. However, it is against ToS if you're intentionally griefing. What OP stated is intentionally turning off tank stance - ergo griefing the healer / DNC in the party. Whether the DPS was unaware the tank wasn't there or the party was ill-prepared to face the boss without a tank, two wrongs don't make a right.

It does sound like the party was doing well enough that the DPS can afford to take a couple of hits without everything going completely south though since they could do big pulls without a problem, so the DNC would've been fine with some light healing even if the tank shows up 15 to seconds later in the boss fight. I've done a full run without a tank on dungeon bosses before as a healer and DPS were tanking so I know it's definitely doable, but a lot rougher if the 3 remaining party members is not contributing to mitigation on a tankbuster. However, it's undisputable that the tank is definitely in the wrong here by intentionally turning off tank stance to kill someone else.

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Originally Posted by AnotherPerson

Mob & Boss Pulls honestly depend on the team, which lie in a grey area. The perspective of pulling really depends on the player's own skill level & party coordination level. If the DNC didn't die and the healer could keep the DNC alive until the tank manage to establish aggro, there was really no issue (which happens more often than not in a well-oiled party with a good healer -- healing is overtuned in dungeons and tank aggro generation is ridiculously high with tank stance on). With the amount of AoE healing abilities a healer have, it's actually not an issue for a DPS to take a couple of hits and then let the tank re-establish aggro to spread the outgoing damage better, even in dungeon bosses. Most people just don't care enough about it because it's casual content and people aren't expected to be playing optimally beyond just their regular rotation and take into account of party coordination. Plus, damage is generally non-lethal in dungeons, so it's just more work for very marginal gain.

At the same time, it's not against ToS if tank was unprepared, didn't notice, or was ignorant of the matter in the pull. However, it is against ToS if you're intentionally griefing. What OP stated is intentionally turning off tank stance

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That is a middle of the road answer seeing both sides. The problem with randoms is a lack of teamwork and coordination. If I am a Healer, my first thing in a dungeon is to let my tank know they are free to pull as much as they want and I got them. If I am a tank I ask my healer if they can handle healing for big pulls or small pulls. This way we can be in sync to work together.

I also try to work with my DPS if I notice they are pulling and not running towards me so I can get take the heat off them. However, on the other hand, if I am rolling and me the healer are far behind and a two DPS rush a boss and by the time we get to the area or right before we get the ability to teleport they are 1% health and its going to be a wipe I don't see why a tank should enter that fight knowing all that will happen is wipe. It's just a waste of time. Now, depending on the Healer and the boss battle we can salvage the party.

On the other hand, I have also witnessed healers rushing in attacking a boss and we are no where near by and the Healer is like butter so its a wipe depending on where we are all at.

I think the penalty timer is the cause of most bad parties staying together. I think getting people to accept the fact they might have to take a 30 minute time out is probably for the best we also need an option to Vote for Kick for a member of the group breaking the harmony on the group. Sadly, I do not think that would happen as Vote to Kick was abused for Prae and now everyone is forced to watch unskippable cut scenes in the MSQ for ARR.