Instanced Raids Unveiled!

Yuck. World of Warcraft (I'm not up for it.) Different content, different names, different systems. Raids and dungeons can go to Hell.

@ Dav: if thats true then take the suckers down...
I can bet most of the community would agree to take down the servers if it meant we get more stuff faster.

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Originally Posted by viion

I hope they dont nerf if they go and reduce requirements, that ruins the current set of higher level NM's.

If people wanna attempt to solo or duo let them, even if its impossible lol elitism will be happy!

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The ideal solution would be to balance content in a way that you can get by the skin of your teeth when you're short one person, but any less than that the dungeon in question is pretty much impossible. Lowman world mobs are alright, but that won't go over well if you have that kind of stuff going on in instanced dungeons. At least, not at appropriate level.

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Originally Posted by Coldbrand

Yuck. World of Warcraft (I'm not up for it.) Different content, different names, different systems. Raids and dungeons can go to Hell.

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That doesnt make sense. instances have been around before WoW...and i'm sure raiding dungeons/ the name Raid for large party dungeons has been too.

Similar to when a SWAT team carries out a raid on a building, you go in with a large team. Thats all raid means when it comes to dungeons: Assaulting with a large team. And as far as dungeons go...well thats obvious. Besides, i'm sure they will have official names later, not just called raid dungeons.

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Originally Posted by Zanfire

@ Dav: if thats true then take the suckers down...
I can bet most of the community would agree to take down the servers if it meant we get more stuff faster.

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This would make an interesting Poll.

Would more people be willing to have the servers taken down for 2-3 months if it helped the Dev Team with production?

or DO more people want to continue to "play-test" the new content in incremental patches?

I am for whatever gets more stuff done faster/better.

p.s. I am too lazy to make a Poll, besides the "Likes" would go to my head, so if someone wants to...feel free.

Patches are developed with test server, taking the servers down will not speed up development and it will exclude the devs from getting input from players testing what they put out.

All negatives no positives. Why shut it down.

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Originally Posted by Xatsh

Patches are developed with test server, taking the servers down will not speed up development and it will exclude the devs from getting input from players testing what they put out.

All negatives no positives. Why shut it down.

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some people want to stop, but dont want to fall behind others, and this is their solution to it...
and some just want the game shut down so some people will go back to 11

Yoshida had to be the director from the beginning, with Tanaka as producer. That's all.

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Originally Posted by Colino

Unfortunately you don't build videogames with sincerity.

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No, but it's a start.

Especially for a game like this, where having a good, honest relationship with a developer that you give feedback to and expect it in return can make all the difference.

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

some people want to stop, but dont want to fall behind others, and this is their solution to it...
and some just want the game shut down so some people will go back to 11

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Having to develop new content while keeping the live servers working and maintained seriously subtracts resources.

They should either turn the live server into a TRUE testing server (as in we get what they're working on as soon as it is playable) or invite people to a testing server and take the live servers down.

It's what makes sense as far as wanting feedback goes. I mean, we haven't gotten any large content patches so far so there's not much to give feedback on in-game that wasn't there on release.

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Originally Posted by Coldbrand

Yuck. World of Warcraft (I'm not up for it.) Different content, different names, different systems. Raids and dungeons can go to Hell.

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More stupidity. FFXI had instances, dontcha-know.

I say bring on raid content in conjunction with lots of overworld content too, which is apparently exactly what Yoshida intends to do.

The issue with taking the servers down is that we did pay for the game. And tho many will say "we're still in beta", we aren't.
I still enjoy playing and would be VERY put off if they shut things down while they work. i realize that things are taking a while and this is turning people off but, to me, if you're not going to play, it should be voluntary. Many of us DO want to continue playing even if things are less than perfect.

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Originally Posted by Leenk

The issue with taking the servers down is that we did pay for the game. And tho many will say "we're still in beta", we aren't.
I still enjoy playing and would be VERY put off if they shut things down while they work. i realize that things are taking a while and this is turning people off but, to me, if you're not going to play, it should be voluntary. Many of us DO want to continue playing even if things are less than perfect.

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No, that is not an issue...

....explain how paying for the game = right to play it AT ALL TIMES?

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Originally Posted by Davorok

Perhaps he meant, "If the servers remain Live while we work on it, we will continue to work in incremental patches, if the servers were to be taken down for a time, we would add large scale content in larger chunks."

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There isn't anything in the English or Japanese post that implies that.

I'm honestly not keeping my hopes up for anything they say until I see it in game. I'm not gonna stress over how awesome chocobos or airships are if we're gonna have to wait till december to have them.

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Originally Posted by Colino

I'm honestly not keeping my hopes up for anything they say until I see it in game. I'm not gonna stress over how awesome chocobos or airships are if we're gonna have to wait till december to have them.

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/trollface to you.

If you don't wanna help the dev team; why are you posting here? ; ;
If you wanna whine about game's situation; why don't you stop playing? ; ;
if you wanna make us lost time; why are you becoming Bayohne's work harder? ; ;

People need to play more to form good ideas to the dev. team.
Troll don't help at all.

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Originally Posted by Sephr

More stupidity. FFXI had instances, dontcha-know.

I say bring on raid content in conjunction with lots of overworld content too, which is apparently exactly what Yoshida intends to do.

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FFXI was NEVER dull enough to release cut and dry "raids and instances". You mean Assault? Einherjar? Nyzul Isle? Salvage? Each has its own set of systems, unique name, and unique theme. They aren't like wow crap.

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Originally Posted by Coldbrand

FFXI was NEVER dull enough to release cut and dry "raids and instances". You mean Assault? Einherjar? Nyzul Isle? Salvage? Each has its own set of systems, unique name, and unique theme. They aren't like wow crap.

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Let's compare the year 2000 to the year 2666, you know, since we're comparing the future to what's already happened and all.

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Originally Posted by Coldbrand

FFXI was NEVER dull enough to release cut and dry "raids and instances". You mean Assault? Einherjar? Nyzul Isle? Salvage? Each has its own set of systems, unique name, and unique theme. They aren't like wow crap.

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I think the fact that they even keep calling it "raids" and "dungeons" Like 90% of MMOs takes away from what we are used to in FFXI, unique names and rules.

When i hear "raid" i hear kill mobs til back room and kill boss...which is done in so many MMOs, its like a cliche.

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Originally Posted by Coldbrand

FFXI was NEVER dull enough to release cut and dry "raids and instances". You mean Assault? Einherjar? Nyzul Isle? Salvage? Each has its own set of systems, unique name, and unique theme. They aren't like wow crap.

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Einherjar, ZNM, Dynamis- you go to a dungeon, kill stuff, and there's a boss! Collect stuff to unlock more dungeons and more bosses!

Honestly,if your in such a twist about the names, you can call it "adventure!" Or "splunking!" But in the end, you are doing the same thing, and are only asking to be deluded.

Here, how about we call it "Dungeon Crawling"? Wow people don't crawl, and its nice and nostalgic!

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Originally Posted by SuzakuCMX

Let's compare the year 2000 to the year 2666, you know, since we're comparing the future to what's already happened and all.

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Yup, that's when Bacon will rule the Devil World, emerge from the center of the Earth And ENSLAVE US ON...

going to Baconator at least one time per day.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

Einherjar, ZNM, Dynamis- you go to a dungeon, kill stuff, and there's a boss! Collect stuff to unlock more dungeons and more bosses!

Honestly,if your in such a twist about the names, you can call it "adventure!" Or "splunking!" But in the end, you are doing the same thing, and are only asking to be deluded.

Here, how about we call it "Dungeon Crawling"? Wow people don't crawl, and its nice and nostalgic!

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+1 for Spelunking!

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Originally Posted by Kallera

Einherjar, ZNM, Dynamis- you go to a dungeon, kill stuff, and there's a boss! Collect stuff to unlock more dungeons and more bosses!

Honestly,if your in such a twist about the names, you can call it "adventure!" Or "splunking!" But in the end, you are doing the same thing, and are only asking to be deluded.

Here, how about we call it "Dungeon Crawling"? Wow people don't crawl, and its nice and nostalgic!

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They were never that straight forward, they had unique aspects to them along with not being called "raids" like every other game.

like the name efting matters.

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Originally Posted by Coldbrand

FFXI was NEVER dull enough to release cut and dry "raids and instances". You mean Assault? Einherjar? Nyzul Isle? Salvage? Each has its own set of systems, unique name, and unique theme. They aren't like wow crap.

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Don't really need to reply to this considering others already have, however yes, FFXI was indeed 'dull enough' to release cut and dry raids and instances. The difference was they were given needless FF jargon that's pretty typical of any final fantasy game. If you look on the timeframe for future implementations there's actually something called 'Dungeon crawling' coming up next year, so look forward to that.

Besides that, all the above you mentioned were in fact dungeons with some kind of spin on them, be it gimping certain skills or whatever. Not really enough to set them apart as really different from your standard MMO dungeon.

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Originally Posted by Zanfire

They were never that straight forward, they had unique aspects to them along with not being called "raids" like every other game.

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Lots of MMOs have lots of variations on the dungeon overall design, doesn't make FFXI's particularly special in that respect.

The obsession with being different for the sake of it really confuses me, I'd rather they took on board what everyone else is doing right and worked to improve on that design with the details that'll make it unique to FFXIV on top of that.

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The reason why there are various limitations is due to the problems with instance occupation and content occupation. I have every intention of wanting to avoid making people wait in line for instances that are occupied by parties that do not meet the number of members or rank to be able to clear a dungeon.

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Please don't tell me instances can only be entered by one group at a time?...Please don't...just don't...

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Originally Posted by TirionCrey

Please don't tell me instances can only be entered by one group at a time?...Please don't...just don't...

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These are strictly Dungeons, meant partially for leveling up, so yes only one group of 4 or 8 can enter the dungeons at once. These aren't meant to be endgame content that requires an alliance of 4 parties to beat.

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Originally Posted by DurtiMonkeyToe

These are strictly Dungeons, meant partially for leveling up, so yes only one group of 4 or 8 can enter the dungeons at once. These aren't meant to be endgame content that requires an alliance of 4 parties to beat.

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What does that have to do with ANYTHING? I don't give a crap if it's soncsidered endgame or not, even low populated servers got several hundreds players online. So you tell me it's "ok" to only have 4 people, or 8, based on which dungeon they will enter to see it at once? 1h time limit to clear a dungeon(or get as far as possible) results in a maximum of 96 people seeing the R30 dungeon a day and 192 people seeing the R50 dungeon a day. And that's not considering that most of these players might want to do the dungeon at the same time...so who is gonna wait?

The fact that Se is still not able to let instances be streamed for different groups at the same time only gives me a bad feeling for the future. Being able to enter an instance and be seperate from another group entering the same instance is like a base function in most MMOs now and SE still want's us to "wait" for anotehr group that may just have entered to get out of it first before we are allowed to enter?...this is just horrible and destroys all my "fun" I was gathering up for those dungeons cause now I know, I won't be able to enter them whenever I want to(not considering the lockout time it's gonna have), but I have to HOPE that there is nobody else in there or wanting to go at the same time as me...this is just...urgh...can't even tell how shitty that is!

I thought that SE is ahead of stupid crap like that now and would be able to allow players to enter such content w/o having to hope/wait for others to get out of it...

EDIT: After rereading your post I noticed you probably got mine wrong. I didn't mean that several groups should enter the dungeon and fight "together". I meant that different groups should be able to enter the dungeon and run through it on their own, not being effected by the other groups.

Cause right now it sounds as if a 4man party is inside the R30 dungeon, that any other party that might want to do the R30 dungeon as well, have to wait for the other 4 to get out of it first...and this is just unacceptable in these times.

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Originally Posted by Fated

Some people take anything Yoshida posts as if they are words coming from his heart or something. This is a business, he might be a "good" person, but he's in this to make it work so it can make money.

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Everyone has a little 'Otocon' in them.

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Originally Posted by TirionCrey

Please don't tell me instances can only be entered by one group at a time?...Please don't...just don't...

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If they are then the dev team is a bunch of morons.

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Originally Posted by Zanfire

If they are then the dev team is a bunch of morons.

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I'm fairly certain that, if you think rationally, you will know that that is just the madness setting in on various posters. They are taking bits and pieces from other MMOs. then do that? Uh huh...yeah. By the way, I don't know if any of you played World of Warcraft just after the release of Wrath of the Lich King (EU side) but for a while it became impossible to enter instances as too many were in play, due to the way the lockout system worked - they eventually sorted it by adding new servers and general changes to the lockout system (as it had not had one for standard five man dungeons before then! Oh Ramparts, how I loathe ye), but restrictions were placed upon group sizes until they got it sorted out (ie, no solo instancing)

Same deal here I'd assume, they are not limiting it as they honestly don't want people to try and solo it, or do it with a member or two less, but just to reduce server load by not opening up extra instances. They did say that after all, and it makes perfect sense - though hopefully in the future they can let folk do so if they wish.

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Originally Posted by DurtiMonkeyToe

These are strictly Dungeons, meant partially for leveling up, so yes only one group of 4 or 8 can enter the dungeons at once. These aren't meant to be endgame content that requires an alliance of 4 parties to beat.

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I'm pretty sure he was meaning like Dynamis where only one group could go in.

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Originally Posted by Zanfire

If they are then the dev team is a bunch of morons.

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That would be absolutely bonkers, I doubt it.

Gah, wish I could level up quicker! The first actual content in the game and I'm nowhere near qualified! *monocle pops off*

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Originally Posted by InuraBera

I'm fairly certain that, if you think rationally, you will know that that is just the madness setting in on various posters. They are taking bits and pieces from other MMOs. then do that? Uh huh...yeah. By the way, I don't know if any of you played World of Warcraft just after the release of Wrath of the Lich King (EU side) but for a while it became impossible to enter instances as too many were in play, due to the way the lockout system worked - they eventually sorted it by adding new servers and general changes to the lockout system (as it had not had one for standard five man dungeons before then! Oh Ramparts, how I loathe ye), but restrictions were placed upon group sizes until they got it sorted out (ie, no solo instancing)

Same deal here I'd assume, they are not limiting it as they honestly don't want people to try and solo it, or do it with a member or two less, but just to reduce server load by not opening up extra instances. They did say that after all, and it makes perfect sense - though hopefully in the future they can let folk do so if they wish.

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I'm leaning more towards this

Luckly you cant solo it, you need a group of 4 or 8 to even enter...which is almost nice, just sucks for the people who do things with smaller groups....or the big shells that are stuck only using 4 or 8 people.

I don't know if this has been asked in this thread or anywhere else, and the devs seem to be paying attention to this thread so I'll ask here:

So we all know that the new focus is going to be to a certain extent on soloing, 4-man and 8-man groups. Will there be any possibilities in the future to form sort of an alliance of 2 groups of 8 for certain types of higher order content, or is that just a balancing nightmare/bad idea?

Personally I'm cool with it just being up to 8-man at max. I'll probably be sticking with 4-man style play personally, since to me that's what FF has always been about, but I understand that's just my own style. I'm wondering about the pros/cons of introducing that FFXI-style alliance play into FFXIV.

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Originally Posted by Malakhim

I don't know if this has been asked in this thread or anywhere else, and the devs seem to be paying attention to this thread so I'll ask here:

So we all know that the new focus is going to be to a certain extent on soloing, 4-man and 8-man groups. Will there be any possibilities in the future to form sort of an alliance of 2 groups of 8 for certain types of higher order content, or is that just a balancing nightmare/bad idea?

Personally I'm cool with it just being up to 8-man at max. I'll probably be sticking with 4-man style play personally, since to me that's what FF has always been about, but I understand that's just my own style. I'm wondering about the pros/cons of introducing that FFXI-style alliance play into FFXIV.

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Yeah there was a thread started regarding this issue.. and of course the Comreps and Devs never replied :(

Since he mention big PvE before, and he says that raid is not his huge PvE, so I think multiple party is possible.
however, I wonder about his post, did he mean that 1.18 will have 3 dungeon on rank 50? or it is just his wish?