Why do casual players seem entitled to cosmetic items added in game?

nah haha but since I am off work I can finally explain my point.

so for people that work early morning like 4/5 in the morning we tend to fall asleep when most static goes so savage aren't exactly easy to get into I was able to do chaotic because I was in vacation with many other for xmas. I saw until .4 then never saw below 40% but for alot of people that work early they might never see the hard content unless they take off during that time.


other point to we all pay and chaotic seem to be the bridge of casual to harder content but we'll they kinda messed up on second phase. I am more piss that I might never get the armor over the hairstyle not gonna lie and yes I will complain because I do pay for the game and I don't wanna scrap my sleep schedule for a game. I do understand both side but sadly with how pf can be yes I do agree that they should give the armor or just a glam of it elsewhere.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mawlzy

Disgusting? Really? I do apologize that I disgust you.

As does reality, apparently? There are those that raid in this game, and those that do not.

Not following the self-reporting thing, though. If I wanted the hairstyle I would buy it.

---

Yup, your essentialism is pretty disgusting, as all essentialism is. "Raiders" aren't a homogeneous group, neither are "non-raiders", or "casuals", or any other similar grouping. There is nothing about this hairstyle that qualifies it as "appeal to non-raiders" compared to any other kind of reward obtainable, whether that is mounts, BiS gear, minions, orchestrion rolls, emotes, fashion accessories etc.. The fact that you don't see your own statements like "locked behind savage level content" when it's freely tradeable, as well as the fact that you on principle disagree that it should be a reward for doing a high-end duty as an expression of entitlement is very much not surprising. And don't give me that "I nEvEr SaId iT LiKe ThAt". You are both old and educated enough to know that words have meaning and implications, and you constantly harping on in this thread that paints the developers as some kind of evil organization out to deprive people from those hairstyles for the way they designed both the content and its reward structure isn't a "neutral" statement.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nero-Voidstails

so to you everyone that have a life aren't allowed to the armor nor hairstyle correct so it disgust you weird because what disgust me is people who think like you. some people doesn't want to scrap they're sleep schedule for something but again this is a raiders mentality but eh you be you right?

---

"everyone that have a life" .. grow up, will you?!
This is a subscription based game, you have to fork over money every month to get access to even be able to login. When you decide to sit down to play it, that is "life" as well, after all, you only have one. It's no more and no less "life" than going to see a movie, or going on a bike trip, or playing badminton. If the rest of your life has you busy so you cannot make time, why bother to pay for a subscription to this game? In fact, what do you need the hairstyle for? If you have a problem with the core principle of this game, where nearly all activities have some kind of reward that requires some kind of "work" by the player to achieve, then you are playing the wrong game, simple as that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nero-Voidstails

so for people that work early morning like 4/5 in the morning we tend to fall asleep when most static goes so savage aren't exactly easy to get into I was able to do chaotic because I was in vacation with many other for xmas. I saw until .4 then never saw below 40% but for alot of people that work early they might never see the hard content unless they take off during that time.

---

You are playing an MMO, find or form a group that can make your schedule work. Be the community you wish to see in the world, instead of expecting everyone else to do all the work for you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nero-Voidstails

other point to we all pay and chaotic seem to be the bridge of casual to harder content but we'll they kinda messed up on second phase.

---

It's not a bridge, was never intended in any communication by the developers. It's garbage wishful thinking by the community that simply made up the categorization of the difficulty of the encounter. Difficulty of mechanics wise, it's in the ballpark between EX3 and EX4, but due to 24 people involved, turns into more of a savage experience. Which is what was communicated by the devs before release.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nero-Voidstails

I am more piss that I might never get the armor over the hairstyle not gonna lie and yes I will complain because I do pay for the game and I don't wanna scrap my sleep schedule for a game. I do understand both side but sadly with how pf can be yes I do agree that they should give the armor or just a glam of it elsewhere.

---

You pay for access, and you are getting access. Again, you seem to be playing the wrong game with that kind of attitude. There are thousands of games out there where the only "skill expression" and time investment required is swiping your credit card. You can find them piled up on the graveyard of zombie MMOs.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AllenThyl

Sure thing, here you go: This whole "but customization shouldn't be locked behind anything" tirade isn't an argument, it's merely your opinion. You simply drew an arbitrary line around certain kinds of items, according to your personal taste.

---

Not once did I advocate for savage rewards being given to people who didn't do savage. The hair is locked behind savage. Nothing I can do about that. Never asked for it to be handed to me.

Also, I don't believe the line I drew is arbitrary at all. FFXIV's character customization is already pathetically limited. Everyone knows this. It's been complained about for years and Square has done nothing to fix it. Therefore, I don't find it a good system to lock character customizing items behind high-end content when there are already so many character customization barriers naturally in place in the game.

You're free to disagree, but I don't see the reason for getting so hostile.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnLakeside

All the barriers you listed seem perfectly reasonable tho. Idk, it makes sense to me that to be able to step into the top-tier content that you'd need to make top-tier preparations. I kinda like that. Its part of the journey. The friction is rewarding. I say this as someone who just started EW and hasn't done any savage or ultimates tho. All the barriers you listed sounds cool as hell though. It'll be like i'm a warrior kitting myself up for a battle instead of just being able to instantly enter.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CCheshire

What? If you meld the wrong materia you can just remove it, which might break most materia, but it is cheaper than gear. Unless you're doing week 1 Savage raiding I don't see anyone with penta gear sets for any extreme farms, which I started a few weeks ago. Also, for raid food, you can just look it up on Icy-Veins site, which holds all the BiS gear guides too.

I've def caused wipes during my fresh prog in Extremes but no one said anything or were rude to me like PF is truly random ppl who you will never meet again unless you're being toxic to be blacklisted. Also, if the party is not working out, you can just say bye and join another listing or host your own PF.

If raiding itself is completely off the table, the hairstyle is 29m on aether DC too, along with the mount.

---

I 100% understand where both of you are coming from. Which is why I added this little tidbit:

"And maybe raiders will say, "You don't NEED to be 100% perfect to clear" but that is absolutely the perception from casual players like me who watch raiders spend millions of gil overmelding and getting their hands on the absolute best of everything."

It's the *perception* of it that freaks casual players out. I, personally, understand what the requirements are and I just decided a while ago that it wasn't worth the trouble for me.

But if you've only ever done casual content, and suddenly you have this laundry list of things you have to do, it can be intimidating. That was my point. I don't believe it's entitlement driving casual players to vent about really wanting rewards for savage raiding, but rather intimidation at what they have to do in order to get the stuff the right way.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AllenThyl

Yup, your essentialism is pretty disgusting, as all essentialism is. "Raiders" aren't a homogeneous group, neither are "non-raiders", or "casuals", or any other similar grouping.

---

I understand that, Allen, we have some terminology struggles on these topics as you well know. I was trying to avoid the even less adequate hardcore vs casual nomenclature.

Non-raiders are of course not a homogeneous group, but if we're going to play with set theory, they'd all be in the circle marked "do not raid." You don't have to study the work of Georg Cantor to understand this point.

I'd suggest you are easily disgusted. I'm honestly not thrilled with the way you gallop through here tilting at windmills while handing out mental health assessments. You might get taken more seriously if you reeled yourself in a bit. I would think this playing to the gallery is exactly the sort of thing that would disgust you in others.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IndraSyngiwyb

Not once did I advocate for savage rewards being given to people who didn't do savage. The hair is locked behind savage. Nothing I can do about that. Never asked for it to be handed to me.

Also, I don't believe the line I drew is arbitrary at all. FFXIV's character customization is already pathetically limited. Everyone knows this. It's been complained about for years and Square has done nothing to fix it. Therefore, I don't find it a good system to lock character customizing items behind high-end content when there are already so many character customization barriers naturally in place in the game.

You're free to disagree, but I don't see the reason for getting so hostile.

---

that's sadly how most raiders are that's why I always say this community is fine until you reach savage or ultimate where most people are toxic and hostile.

Hmm. Alte Roite was already in Mogtomes.

That's Savage mount. So, say, if the Chaotic hair - or any Savage weapon coffer, or Ultimate tome - was stuffed into into any alternative acquirement route would anyone lose their marbles? Just because you could get hair then by spamming ARR dungeon as BLU instead of sweaty prog?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Burmecia

Hmm. Alte Roite was already in Mogtomes.

That's Savage mount. So, say, if the Chaotic hair - or any Savage weapon coffer, or Ultimate tome - was stuffed into into any alternative acquirement route would anyone lose their marbles? Just because you could get hair then by spamming ARR dungeon as BLU instead of sweaty prog?

---

I think some people on the forum would pretend to lose their marbles.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Burmecia

Hmm. Alte Roite was already in Mogtomes.

That's Savage mount. So, say, if the Chaotic hair - or any Savage weapon coffer, or Ultimate tome - was stuffed into into any alternative acquirement route would anyone lose their marbles? Just because you could get hair then by spamming ARR dungeon as BLU instead of sweaty prog?

---

I just think the problem with chaotic it was new and a first try so if it failed hard no one will do the content making the hairstyle way rarer and so on I think it's mostly what the problem was there

I think when it comes to cosmetic items tied customization of your character, it really shouldn't be put out of the casual players' reach. They do it to get casuals like myself onto said content, but the data shows that it doesn't work. If a good 85-90% of the playerbase just ignores the content when it's new. To me, at least it seems like a failure attempt to get me the casual into the content.

Just give up. Give you guys the cool gear and the mounts. People complain about it, sure, but it's never as loud as customization items. And they know this. We have the datasets. Just stop being morons, but that's too much of an ask for SquareEnix.

Blizzard has been failing at this for over 20 years. You'd think at some point someone would understand this. You can not get someone who is uninterested in the content to do it. You can't. You just can't.

Even if you invented a fantasy scenario where I login and get put in a pug to do high-end content it's still going to fail as I'm not prepared to do and I don't care enough to prepare to do it. Even in the impossible scenario, it fails, and you waste people's time.

STOP DOING IT!