I'm calling it the Epidemic. (This is a rant, if you dont wanna hear it, don't click)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by akaneakki

Oh. I'm sorry. But what the other guy said. Dots on single target vs aoe on 3 or more. You would obviously aoe. Sorry again! And mnk is fun, so have fun with that.

---

Oh, I intend to, I played a monk in my ancient dim and distant past as a student playing AD&D in the wee hours of the weekend...it's time for the return of the 'Open Paw' art of combat to return...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Funny thing is, you'll never be able to come to a consensus on what players actually qualify. People throw away "elitist" nowadays for simply putting out what they're doing is wrong.

---

You wouldn't need to come to such a consensus, I'd think that self selection would result in a server even more packed than any other.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by akaneakki

Nobody is askign for the 1% top players gameplay either. They are asking to actually try and get better each time. Doesn't mean you have to be top player. What I don't get is why does people use the word elitist as a offensive word, when it's not? Now that's funny. Keep in mind there is a lot of great players and they are more than 1% of the playerbase. It feels like people actually ignore what people say in this thread and makes up some bs nobody said lol.

---

Elite players are not by definition elitist. There is a huge difference between the elite players who can achieve world and/or server firsts and are in the top 1-2% whenever DPS is measured for their job(s) and being a player who believe that they are that good and demands that play from everyone else - whether or not they can actually achieve it them self.

Basically, being an elite player is a measure of player skill; being an elitist is about the attitude of players, not their skill.

I frequently observe that the best players are the least likely to be elitist.

Casual players are not by definition bad players they are simply casual. Hardcore players are not by definition good, they just play a lot more and in a more focused way than casual players. Neither of these terms is a measure of relative skill of the player.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kosmos992k

Basically, being an elite player is a measure of player skill; being an elitist is about the attitude of players, not their skill.

---

People know the difference. There's an agenda behind the whole thing. " 'Elite Players' are elitist jerks. How else did they get so good at what they do and have the gear to show for it?"

Ignorance is not as widespread as people claim or think it is. That's just an excuse to avoid holding people accountable.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ArrowAmethyst

-Ninja's not using 'Kiss of the Wasp/Viper' (That's a 20% DPS loss for those that don't play Ninja, and its a set it and forget it skill)

---

I don't know about the rest, but depending on what I've been playing/doing and how tired I am, I do periodically forget to put up auras that I had up and lost due to being scaled down. It could just be a simple mistake on their part. If I see other people doing it, I may try to mention it in a non-aggressive way, which usually solves the problem.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kaethra

People know the difference. There's an agenda behind the whole thing. " 'Elite Players' are elitist jerks. How else did they get so good at what they do and have the gear to show for it?"

Ignorance is not as widespread as people claim or think it is. That's just an excuse to avoid holding people accountable.

---

I disagree. My experience with MMOs and other similar types of games strongly suggests that people are just given to drawing conclusions too quickly, as well as lacking sort of a broader perspective of where people fall. A lot of the most obnoxiously elitist people seem to actually be sort of mid to low tier in terms of skill and clear content very late, if at all, but simply have assured themselves they're a good player, likely because they've spent time reading a guide and can poorly replicate the instructions with little to no understanding of the underlying principles. Because they are much more numerous and spend much more time in more casual content, they're much more likely to encounter the sort of very casual and/or bad players they like to target for often unnecessarily harsh criticism. Those players they criticize in turn also tend to lack perspective and consequently don't really have the ability to realize that the player criticizing them, so they just kind of take them at their implicit word that they know what they're doing. Genuinely good players tend to be a lot more relaxed, but they're also somewhat more cliquey and generally prefer to stick to their own groups of friends, which severely limits the exposure the player base at large has to them. As a result, people essentially end up with an inordinately negative view of players who are better than them (or who they may at least believe are better than them), as they tend to only interact with the worst of the bunch (who ironically aren't very good at all), who are also typically the ones that will make a big stink out of discrepancies in skill or game knowledge.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kaethra

People know the difference. There's an agenda behind the whole thing. " 'Elite Players' are elitist jerks. How else did they get so good at what they do and have the gear to show for it?"

---

If 7 people can clear extreme/savage, then they know how to play really well. I honestly don't play as good as other's for example, but it's good enough to do it well with 7 people without getting enrage. The issue is also people say it's fine 1 guy is way behind on damage as long the thing is dead. I don't fully agree there.

I've seen countless of enrages on sophia these days and it's such a shame. The people I run savage/ex with did sophia ex with 4 people many months ago, there is even a video on youtube. Link If you check the date, you can clearly see it's been a while. I just find it sad how 8 people can see enrage and we barely have any deaths in it.
This one of the few things I could bring up. If 8 people in 12s will see puddles, why do we skip ours almost with 7 people? We are basically 4-5% off the first puddle. Calling good players elitist, then come with follow up they are jerks, when they give people advice, then you simply shouldn't even talk.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nixxe

Genuinely good players tend to be a lot more relaxed, but they're also somewhat more cliquey and generally prefer to stick to their own groups of friends, which severely limits the exposure the player base at large has to them. As a result, people essentially end up with an inordinately negative view of players who are better than them (or who they may at least believe are better than them), as they tend to only interact with the worst of the bunch (who ironically aren't very good at all), who are also typically the ones that will make a big stink out of discrepancies in skill or game knowledge.

---

Sounds like you are saying "anyone who's giving advice in a dungeon is a bad player"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bardaboo

Sounds like you are saying "anyone who's giving advice in a dungeon is a bad player"

---

They're saying that's how they are perceived.

When in the rare occasion a good and decent player is in a PUG, and then offers advice, the other players basically shat on them. Calling them elitist and saying things like "You can't tell me how to play." And other derogatory stuff.

Again I believe is cultural. People in the NA/EU/AU regions have serious jealousy issues. Anyone who's better at something is a tryhard, anyone who has more wealth has exploited someone to get it, anyone who's charismatic and pleasant to be around is doing it for attention. Goes right into gaming from outside as well. Those with better gear, more experience, and generally succeeds does so because they are no-life elitist hardcores.

My viewpoint is that I try to give people the benefit of the doubt. My experiences of helping people has generally been positive. As in, people have been receptive of it. Maybe it's the way I phrase it (which I find surprising, I have a social disability after all). I tend to be like "Have you tried this? Here is why it helps." and give good explanations. My mentor crown isn't binned, though I rarely put it on. I take a logical approach and try and put forth an explanation behind the solution I am giving. Generally speaking, it's taken on board. I get the occasional ignore, but what can you do. But never once have I had anyone spout vitriol or the "My sub, my way" card on me.

I guess as someone with a disability myself I work differently (much like in society I work differently). However, I always try to give my best but work to give people the benefit of the doubt. I had to kick one person from a mentor roulette I was in and that was because the off-tank didn't have provoke and we literally could not beat the content without it (and not for lack of trying either). I don't intentionally enable bad play, but I do try to work to improve people. I guess the difference here is the levels at which we deem a certain player unsalvageable. And I say that's fine, as differences are what makes the world more exciting.

In DF, I go in with no expectations and be ready to see some of the most bizarre stuff which I try to work with and help fix if problems arise that I can help with. That being said, I don't know every class so I won't comment on stuff outside of my knowledge unless asked and then I will say "I believe this to be the case, but don't take my word as gospel as I'm not 100% sure" (so it's accepting I may be wrong and that they should do some further research after in case I inadvertently gave them the wrong knowledge). I try to be forgiving. I won't be walked all over (at least not intentionally), but I'll use vote kicks as a last resort only.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cadmar

We should separate the data centers based on a skill test. If you pass the test then you can only work with other skilled players. If you can't then you get relegated to the minor leagues. Just think of all the problems that would solve.

---

Will there at least be an above-average-but-don't-want-to-play-with-hardcore-???????s data center? I'd like to hit that sweet spot where I don't have to hear about savage raids, but still clear Dun Scaith without any wipes.

This game doesn't have elitists​ players , what we've got are deluded morons with poor child like attitude. Players who believe/think that are better than others in their own little world. Simple as that.