Shell FCs are a bigger problem than we think...

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Originally Posted by Valfreyja

If you want to stop Shell FCs from being a thing, go to the root of the problem. Don't punish FCs that are only three friends enjoying the game together.

Workshop access should be available to ALL. Not just FCs.
Everyone should be allowed to access airships and submarines.
Everyone should be allowed to access projects.
Everyone should be allowed to have a communal chest for extra storage.
Everyone should be allowed to access gardening, with indoor growing plots for apartments.

Most people don't care about housing. They care about the Workshop/Airships/Submarines being gated by housing.

Don't blame the players for fixing the system where SE denies us stuff.
And before you say "join an FC", that is meaningless. Every FC I have ever seen gates their members so that only the officers and leader get to access Voyages and Projects. Not the general membership. So that isn't a solution either.

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Then what would be the purpose of an FC if private owners had all that you mentioned? They should just get rid of the FC's all together? They need to up the active members required base on plot size. I mean actual active members should be maintained too by recruiting active players on a semi regular bases. FC's are a community base entity with projects that an FC can work on as a whole, take that and give it to everyone, FC's would seem pointless. They need to up the requirements to form an FC and maintain one. Not give every Joe Smoe the exact perks an FC has when joining one.

Anyone in my FC the members are welcomed to use the workshop, gardens and community chest with dedicated tabs for members needs. We also run airships and submarines daily and what they bring back belongs to the FC not any one individual . It's either given away in a random drawing or sold to earn gil for the FC and it's activities. If you're in an FC that doesn't allow these perks, then you should join one that does. These amenities should remain exclusive to an FC and they should tighten the restrictions and responsibility of being a leader of an FC or what's the point?

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

There was no leak from some insider needed. The only information needed to prepare was publicly released in the November Live Letter.


Which is why many of us keep pointing out that being part of a FC that owns a house does not guarantee access to housing. The FC Master (and any officers who can adjust ranks and privileges) controls access and that access is usually reserved for officers only. Such restriction isn't without reason (trolling and theft are common when the officers don't use caution in assigning access) but it doesn't help the individual player who would like to engage with housing features.

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Thank you for pointing out FC masters dont restrict house control for no reason.

What's the point of joining an FC if the leader and staff don't let you do that stuff in the first place?

You are spending your time gaming to earn them Company Credits, so they get to play with that stuff, while you are left on the sidelines.

And no, they shouldn't be exclusive to an FC. An FC should be a group of players and nothing else. They shouldn't get special perks or privileges like that.

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Originally Posted by Valfreyja

What's the point of joining an FC if the leader and staff don't let you do that stuff in the first place?

You are spending your time gaming to earn them Company Credits, so they get to play with that stuff, while you are left on the sidelines.

And no, they shouldn't be exclusive to an FC. An FC should be a group of players and nothing else. They shouldn't get special perks or privileges like that.

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https://datastudio.google.com/u/0/re...62f/page/ez06B

https://i.imgur.com/2wmyL97.png

https://i.imgur.com/2wmyL97.png

Its a western thing, which is pretty funny because its also the same people who bitch about players running solo FCs.

The % of FC houses with 30 people or more on the JP DC is 4.5%.

Basically, NA/EU are crybabies and are too lazy to take matters into their own hands.

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Originally Posted by Valfreyja

What's the point of joining an FC if the leader and staff don't let you do that stuff in the first place?

You are spending your time gaming to earn them Company Credits, so they get to play with that stuff, while you are left on the sidelines.

And no, they shouldn't be exclusive to an FC. An FC should be a group of players and nothing else. They shouldn't get special perks or privileges like that.

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FCs are social groups with their own personality and content interests. People tend to find comfort in being part of like-minded groups that do things together.

If the only reason you're joining the FC is because you want free access to the garden and workshop, naturally they're going to be suspicious. You're not joining to be part of the group, you're joining for gil.

But FCs still need a way to fund their social activities and events. Company Credits are pretty much useless for the purpose - the variety of items that can be purchased with credits and sold for gil (or used to purchase items that can be sold for gil) are too few. Lacking a workshop and garden, they have to rely on member donations. With access to a workshop and garden, they have a way to earn gil to fund those things without bugging their members.

Workshops also used to be social activities. You had to be in a light party with 3 other DOH to operate the Fabrication Station. I can remember plenty of times I would help out friends in their workshops, sitting and chatting as they did whatever it was. Because players complained that it made no sense to require 3 other players when it was usually a single omnicrafter doing all the work, SE removed the requirement.

It's a MMO. It's about playing with others. Social groups do deserve to get some priority as a result. If you're only after a solo player experience, there are so many other games that do that better it's surprising that you're here.

MMO are social things, yes. Doesn't mean you have to always be social.

And there is still no reason social groups should get access to special exclusive content, just because a bunch of people decided to bunch together.

Not saying I don't enjoy the social aspect or grouping. What I object to is the exclusivity of the Workshop. And if just the leader and staff are running the Workshop, even if the FC benefits from the gil made, it's still just the leader and staff leeching off their membership.

FCs have ways to fun themselves without needing the workshop. There are a bunch of them. Should be easy for them to farm PotD, HoH, Bozja, Eureka, Primals for weapon materials. Lots of things they can get and sell. Not to mention Treasure Hunt loots with map farms.

All of that, yet they still need the Workshop to be exclusive? Since the Garden is not exclusive to an FC, it is exclusive to houses in general.

But at least SE is starting to take steps for some of this, so maybe they'll open the workshop to more people.

With all due respect, who are you to dictate how people run their own FCs? If you join one, don't get access to the workshop and subs/airships immediately and that's an issue for you, that's a *you* problem - and if so, you should probably form your own FC where you can share everything communally. For most of us though, time, effort and gil have been put into unlocking and then using these features, we shouldn't just open these things up to everyone who joins simply because you asked.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

FCs are social groups with their own personality and content interests. People tend to find comfort in being part of like-minded groups that do things together.

If the only reason you're joining the FC is because you want free access to the garden and workshop, naturally they're going to be suspicious. You're not joining to be part of the group, you're joining for gil.

But FCs still need a way to fund their social activities and events. Company Credits are pretty much useless for the purpose - the variety of items that can be purchased with credits and sold for gil (or used to purchase items that can be sold for gil) are too few. Lacking a workshop and garden, they have to rely on member donations. With access to a workshop and garden, they have a way to earn gil to fund those things without bugging their members.

Workshops also used to be social activities. You had to be in a light party with 3 other DOH to operate the Fabrication Station. I can remember plenty of times I would help out friends in their workshops, sitting and chatting as they did whatever it was. Because players complained that it made no sense to require 3 other players when it was usually a single omnicrafter doing all the work, SE removed the requirement.

It's a MMO. It's about playing with others. Social groups do deserve to get some priority as a result. If you're only after a solo player experience, there are so many other games that do that better it's surprising that you're here.

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FCs as it is are afterthought feature in this game.
For raiding there are statics. For most of the activities such as hunts there are cross server discords/link shells. For RP there are venues and discords to find them out. General socializing? Once again there are discords and in game people do not talk much anyway.
What is left for FCs then? Treasure hunts?

And now Square Enix are adding trusts to duties so you can play even more of the game without other people if you so desire. Because in truth this genre was never about massive multiplayer, but live service game model. Shared areas are just for showing off glamours, glowy weapons and titles to entice other players in participating in these activities (or go to cash shop).
Housing in this regard is a failure, as players see stuff they cannot get themselves, so devs are basically leaving untapped game revenue (having a house with demolition system forces people to maintain subs).

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Originally Posted by Somnolence

FCs as it is are afterthought feature in this game.
For raiding there are statics. For most of the activities such as hunts there are cross server discords/link shells. For RP there are venues and discords to find them out. General socializing? Once again there are discords and in game people do not talk much anyway.
What is left for FCs then? Treasure hunts?

And now Square Enix are adding trusts to duties so you can play even more of the game without other people if you so desire. Because in truth this genre was never about massive multiplayer, but live service game model. Shared areas are just for showing off glamours, glowy weapons and titles to entice other players in participating in these activities (or go to cash shop).
Housing in this regard is a failure, as players see stuff they cannot get themselves, so devs are basically leaving untapped game revenue (having a house with demolition system forces people to maintain subs).

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I disagree, this game has very much been an FC game, even with Linkshells. It's the players who've used social media / third party social programs that have come about since the game's inception to take the social out of the game.

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Originally Posted by Illmaeran

I disagree, this game has very much been an FC game, even with Linkshells. It's the players who've used social media / third party social programs that have come about since the game's inception to take the social out of the game.

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For pure raiding purposes, an FC would have been at most a list of players as a group, and feature no extra benefits on that, other than making parties easier to start.

However, in FCs there are actions that benefit you, which as solo player you cannot get. A shell FC can cover these features.

Shell FC are on that not a problem, its just that there are always players who abuse these things. And most important would be that SE should simply just ban those abusers. Its very clear when this was done, and in this case which accounts were involved (i bet all of them were trial accounts, and only the winners ended up becoming a sub). At such scale you nearly always will notice a pattern (same FC name, same email domain that isnt a large hoster, same bank account, all trial). It would be efficient if SE can react on that.

Personaly i would even say that trial members are still excluded from housing, unless they already made a payment (in which cancelling the payment before the trial ended must have something as an additional requirement that your account must not have been used in housing - where technicaly they only will not accept refunds on those shell fc abusers, while most accounts are going to be fine). The payment is there to make spamming trial accounts harder, and also to fund SE into preventing abuse (because you will know they will abuse it anyway). Payment info will also be harder to get a lot of identities in (as governments will prevent this), so you can restrict a lot on that already. Also, abusers will usualy also use stolen creditcards etc (using your own information makes you vulnerable in being targeted by the company). Which is information that can also be used to remove the house again (as this information is often shared in order to counter abuse).