New Jobs Gated Behind Completion of 2.0 Story?

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Originally Posted by Evangela

Imagine new players want to start playing with Heavensward and they can't do anything until they finish all the long quest line from 2.0 to 2.55.

ridiculous.

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I agree, FFXIV:HW is a new game, the story continues but the game is new.

Logically SE wants to attract players to buy the game. The New 3 Jobs are the basic starters for the new game.

I think they'll have a starter Lv.25 to 30, but they won't have any access to FFXIV:ARR map nor content.

As I see a new adventure -from scratch- starting in Ishgard is very logical compared with the conclusion of main sscenario of 2.55.

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Originally Posted by Zfz

You have to be level 20 and clear Ifrit story to ride a chocobo.
You have to be level 30 and have the appropriate secondary class to unlock any job.
You have to complete 2.55 story to enter 3.0 content.

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1. No need of GC Chocobo, at a certain level you will obtain a land/flying mount (as per 3.0 scenario).
2. New jobs don't follow the (main class/sub-class), they are your ONLY choices as Tank, DPS, or Healer.
3. Not really, New players will start a fresh adventure in Ishgard, but they won't be able to access the ARR content.

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Originally Posted by Kuwaitum

1. No need of GC Chocobo, at a certain level you will obtain a land/flying mount (as per 3.0 scenario).
2. New jobs don't follow the (main class/sub-class), they are your ONLY choices as Tank, DPS, or Healer.
3. Not really, New players will start a fresh adventure in Ishgard, but they won't be able to access the ARR content.

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lol, what?

It's already been stated you have to clear the last mission of 2.55 to access the new expansion content/storyline. Thus, you need to have completed the ARR content. >.>

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Originally Posted by Kuwaitum

1. No need of GC Chocobo, at a certain level you will obtain a land/flying mount (as per 3.0 scenario).
2. New jobs don't follow the (main class/sub-class), they are your ONLY choices as Tank, DPS, or Healer.
3. Not really, New players will start a fresh adventure in Ishgard, but they won't be able to access the ARR content.

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1. At a certain level, in ishgard, most likely after a quest chain. Your point is?
2. I won't bother you because of the syntax error but you still have to realise that Zfz was listing the examples of gating already in the game. And all the jobs now need to be unlocked anyway by leveling 2 other classes.
3. Ehhmmmm. Where did you get this? NOt only does it go against what we know about the plot, but makes no sense whatsoever because (1. the new jobs wont start at level 1, 2. the story is direct continuation of 2.55 and not a fresh adventure, 3. Heavensward is not a standalone expansion that you can play withouth ARR content)

Heavenwards is not a new game...seriously, why do you think it's called an expansion for?
people need to understand that it means it's the continuation of the game we know, not a new game or something like this.

ps: we can argue the whole years about the jobs and area gated behind the completion of the 2.55 quest line, but seriously it's for the better, it give a goal on the long terms for the new player.

what it's amazing it's most of the people talking of the new player are already playing the game. let's see what say the soo called new playr instead to act like you know everything. it's tiring to see people simply coming here whinning for nothing.

the gating of the new class is a good thing, since they are advanced class! they will be probably ask more that the starting class for be played well.

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Originally Posted by Zfz

You have to be level 20 and clear Ifrit story to ride a chocobo.
You have to be level 30 and have the appropriate secondary class to unlock any job.
You have to complete 2.55 story to enter 3.0 content.

It's called progression.

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There are also more unlocks within story progression

you have to finish Stone Vigil storyquest to unlock beastmen quests.
You also have to finish the Ultima Weapon storyquest to unlock the lv 50 dungeons, except Wanderer Palace and Amdapor Keep. To unlock Amdapor Keep you have to finish the GC missions (clear Aurum Vale).
And you have to defeat Ifrit, Titan and Garuda storymode to get their Egis as a summoner.

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Originally Posted by Evangela

Imagine new players want to start playing with Heavensward and they can't do anything until they finish all the long quest line from 2.0 to 2.55.

ridiculous.

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Already now in 2.x you can't do everything if you don't do the storyquests. It is nothing new.

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Originally Posted by Kuwaitum

I agree, FFXIV:HW is a new game, the story continues but the game is new.

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2.0 was a new game
3.0 is an expansion to a old game, not a new game.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

what it's amazing it's most of the people talking of the new player are already playing the game. let's see what say the soo called new playr instead to act like you know everything. it's tiring to see people simply coming here whinning for nothing.

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Okay, see you in three months when the New Players forum is full of new players complaining that they hit level 50 but they can't access the content they just bought the game on the basis of until they slog through six whole patches worth of old storyline content.

Slavish devotion to making new players run through all the content in strict sequence is a surefire way to make a game inaccessible to new players. Just look at WOW, the previous expansions were only level-gated but it didn't make a damn bit of difference whether you actually did all the quests or not, you could always jump straight into the new expansion as soon as you hit the required level, and with every expansion they made it quicker to level through old zones as a catch-up mechanic. And now they straight-up sell level 90 boosts so new players can skip everything and go straight into the shiny new stuff.

I like the game a lot, and I want to continue playing it for a long time, but MMOs absolutely need a steady influx of new players, and if a game develops a reputation as one that's pointless getting into because you have to catch up on years worth of old content it's going to die.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

what it's amazing it's most of the people talking of the new player are already playing the game. let's see what say the soo called new playr instead to act like you know everything. it's tiring to see people simply coming here whinning for nothing.

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First off, Yoshida himself said he wanted to present Heavensward to the players as "one whole, new game". And it's what an expansion is. A continuation of the base game is an extension.

Secondly, I for one am talking for a new player, who doesn't have the game yet (he will get it in June, with the pre-ordered bundle), and as such cannot post on the forums. He did not buy ARR the past year and a half, nor FFXIV, because, go figure, it was a game he did not like. He likes to use Great Swords in MMOs, and as such he waited for a Great Sword class to make an appearance in XIV before bothering to give it a try. Go figure though, SE wants him to first play the game he did not want to buy (ARR) before he can access to a job (DRK) with which he would probably enjoy the game in its entirety (including ARR. He doesn't want to skip the MSQ, but he's upset to not do it as the class he wants, and feels he'll likely rush through it and not enjoy it all that much as whatever class he'll choose for 2.0-2.55).

There are plenty of reasons for people on this thread to express their confusion on this sudden turn of direction of SE to the playerbase service. They range from alts (I wanted to start an Au Ra alt with MAC myself to play along myself and redo 2.0 with him), from people with new player friends, to people who are just concerned about the direction of future expansions.
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Lastly, I'd like to remind everyone who calls "whiny" or "hater" whoever dares but to point at any thing in the game...

To criticize a product is a sign of care for it, not of hatred. This is why we don't "go play something else" or shut up and "quit whining". It's not whining, it's comprehensible criticism. To blindly accept everything the developers do and never stop to question their choices or ideas, and instead get defensive and angry towards those who do, is nothing short of being an ignorant fanboy/fangirl that will eat anything their Idol serves them without even looking at its contents.

The first sign of appreciation towards something is taking the time to examine it to notice pros and cons, and nothing is flawless. If SE didn't want people to "complain" on this thread they would've closed it long ago with many others. They probably appreciate the feedback and are interested in seeing the opinions even on their marketing choices with the expansion. So please, can we stop insulting the OP and other concerned people with names such as "whiny" and so on?

I actually think it's really cool that SE decided to cater to their pre-existing playerbase than create content specifically for potential players who might only be interested in what HW has to offer than the game as a whole. As a paying subscriber, I think it's reassuring that they were looking at us when they made this new content. Because we're the ones who will get most out of this expansion.

What bothers me is that ARR/2.0 is not automatically bundled with HW/3.0. I don't mind that new players have to start at lv1 and go through 2.0 content first, the game is not that long anyway if you don't count all the side quests and random things you could do outside of story, but it would be really confusing if a new player picks up HW thinking he could play the game with that, not realizing he needed to get ARR first. I guess it's fine if the package explicitly says it's an expansion and that it would require getting ARR.

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Originally Posted by JimboTCB

Just look at WOW, the previous expansions were only level-gated but it didn't make a damn bit of difference whether you actually did all the quests or not, you could always jump straight into the new expansion as soon as you hit the required level

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In WoWs most popular expansion (TBC), pretty much everything was locked behind something.
Reputation, quests, more quests for raiding, etc. As well as equipment requirements. (had to farm heroics for that)