Need advice: static imploding because of cheater.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

and you should also accept that people left your static, you fucked around and found out

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no I didn't, I did exactly what was expected of me to do according to the procedure that was applied to UNNAMED_

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

no I didn't, I did exactly what was expected of me to do according to the procedure that was applied to UNNAMED_

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yeah yeah muh TOS I know I know dont worry, well as I said you fucked around and found out, you thought you were the only one that mattered in the static, and people showed you otherwise.

Seems like things worked out

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

yeah yeah muh TOS I know I know dont worry, well as I said you fucked around and found out, you thought you were the only one that mattered in the static, and people showed you otherwise.

Seems like things worked out

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oh okay so if the rest of the team says it's ok to cheat then it's okay to cheat?

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

oh okay so if the rest of the team says it's ok to cheat then it's okay to cheat?

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I love the implication that the whole world cares about some no name team that's nowhere near anything world first related as much as about the world 0th clear. Literally no one would care if your entire team played from the ISS.

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

oh okay so if the rest of the team says it's ok to cheat then it's okay to cheat?

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I mean if you think its cheating, you are free to make a different static and to put the rules down that you are not allowing any type of third party, and even then people might use them without you knowing

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Originally Posted by Saraide

I love the implication that the whole world cares about some no name team that's nowhere near anything world first related as much as about the world 0th clear. Literally no one would care if your entire team played from the ISS.

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ohh ok so it's ok to cheat if you're a nobody team?

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

oh okay so if the rest of the team says it's ok to cheat then it's okay to cheat?

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Looking at the big picture:
- From what I'm gathering, you didn't state from the beginning that using plugins that are raid related were disallowed when forming your static.
- Someone joined your static and used them quietly until streaming one day (for idk how many people or the context behind that)
- You created a rule then based on that and removed them without giving them a chance to respect that rule.
- Your teammates got upset as a result of that, on top of the decision being made so quickly that a replacement wasn't even ready to go and you're now impeding on the progress of 6 other people.

This ultimately all comes down to a massive lack of communication for what you wanted out of the static, a knee jerk reaction made out of anger or fear of consequences and screwing over the six other people there because they couldn't keep progressing. Do you get where you went wrong now?

If you had a replacement ready it might have ended differently but you completely thought of yourself in that moment, not the entire team. Which, you know, isn't what a leader is supposed to do. Even if you were dead set on removing this person, it should have been done once the rest of your team was taken care of with a replacement.

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

ohh ok so it's ok to cheat if you're a nobody team?

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Who would stop you?

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

ohh ok so it's ok to cheat if you're a nobody team?

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People aren't criticising you over the zoom hacker, people are criticising over your handling of the situation. please get that through your thick skull.

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

ohh ok so it's ok to cheat if you're a nobody team?

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It's okay to do whatever you consider necessary for you to have fun, yes.

Put something in your head, cheating in this game is ultimately harmless, it will not impact anyone outside the group you cleared with, and it can even be imperceptible if they don't out themselves, so people don't consider it a big deal to do it, it is just going to enhance their experience, and perhaps other people's experience by having a teammate that is completely on top of their game, so you need to be upfront about no third-party tools, it doesn't matter if it is ToS, it is just how things shake, and taking a decision based on something that wasn't a properly established rule that affected 7 other people(yes, I am including the cheater here, they are also a living human being) on a whim because you didn't like that isn't okay, do keep in mind there is a chance your static would've agreed with you, but you still made a call that you shouldn't have and that's upsetting.

The right thing to do in that situation was, which I am sure has been repeated a lot in this thread: Bring it up with the static, get their opinion, take action based on that, and if you were uncomfortable with the outcome still, leave the static yourself, anything else would've led to this situation

A static is an entirely unofficial group of people to the game, it's just a few people personally agreeing to play together. The rules of the game have no bearing who can and can not be in that group. You are not required to remove anyone from your static even if they got banned ingame. You are free to remove anyone from your static for any reason (or even no reason at all). You are not free from the consequences of doing so because no one is required to stay in your static if they do not want to stay.
The fact that this needs to be explained to a static leader should be weird but OP's lack of understanding has already exploded the group so at this point all that is left is to learn from it.

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Originally Posted by Saraide

A static is an entirely unofficial group of people to the game, it's just a few people personally agreeing to play together. The rules of the game have no bearing who can and can not be in that group. You are not required to remove anyone from your static even if they got banned ingame. You are free to remove anyone from your static for any reason (or even no reason at all). You are not free from the consequences of doing so because no one is required to stay in your static if they do not want to stay.
The fact that this needs to be explained to a static leader should be weird but OP's lack of understanding has already exploded the group so at this point all that is left is to learn from it.

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I mean look who OP is. They don't have a good track record of not making troll-like threads and posts.

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Originally Posted by Saraide

Who would stop you?

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I guess people need actual consequences to raid with integrity. More strange thinking from people here where people who follow the tos are flamed.

This forum really needs an active moderator.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

I guess people need actual consequences to raid with integrity. More strange thinking from people here where people who follow the tos are flamed.

This forum really needs an active moderator.

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"raid with integrity," says the guy who doesn't raid.

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Originally Posted by Mosha

"raid with integrity," says the guy who doesn't raid.

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I’ve raided in the past in ffxiv. I hardcore raided in other mmos. Even if I never raided I can still have an opinion about cheating.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

I’ve raided in the past in ffxiv.

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the most raidy mount you have on the lodestone is a stormblood dog.

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Originally Posted by Mosha

the most raidy mount you have on the lodestone is a stormblood dog.

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What’s your point? I said in the past. I haven’t had time for raiding and that commitment in quite some time. Doesn’t mean it’s not part of my past and a topic I’m interested in.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

What’s your point? I said in the past. I haven’t had time for raiding and that commitment in quite some time. Doesn’t mean it’s not part of my past and a topic I’m interested in.

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I assume it was "Your opinion doesn't count because you haven't raided in FFXIV recently, and therefore can't have an informed opinion on the subject"? Not sure though.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

What’s your point? I said in the past. I haven’t had time for raiding and that commitment in quite some time. Doesn’t mean it’s not part of my past and a topic I’m interested in.

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I wouldn't call unysncing suzaku extreme raiding. like legit you don't even have any savage mounts, what you could get by unsyncing and clicking buttons.

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Originally Posted by Mosha

I wouldn't call unysncing susaku extreme raiding.

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When I raided it was current content unsynced. Why do you keep pulling assumptions out of thin air? I know it’s very common among the cheater sympathizers here.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

When I raided it was current content unsynced. Why do you keep pulling assumptions out of thin air? I know it’s very common among the cheater sympathizers here.

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ok, let's take it at face value two extreme dogs you got when it was current from 4 years ago, I wouldn't call you a raider.

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Originally Posted by Mosha

ok, let's take it at face value two extreme dogs you got when it was current from 4 years ago, I wouldn't call you a raider.

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I already said in the past. My account was from 2014 and yours is 2020. There was a lot of content that was never current for you that was in the past.

Still don’t know why you feel you can gate keep opinions on cheating in raids.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

I already said in the past. My account was from 2014 and yours is 2020. There was a lot of content that was never current for you that was in the past.

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that's my forum account, I started playing in 3.4 and even if I started in 2020 by the looks of our achievements I've done more in a shorter time regarding raiding.

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Originally Posted by Mosha

that's my forum account, I started playing in 3.4 and even if I started in 2020 by the looks of our achievements I've done more in a shorter time regarding raiding.

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Good for you? Lol

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

Good for you? Lol

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who's opinion is worth more some guy who has a Stormblood doggo or someone who actively raids savage?

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

I already said in the past. My account was from 2014 and yours is 2020. There was a lot of content that was never current for you that was in the past.

Still don’t know why you feel you can gate keep opinions on cheating in raids.

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Keep in mind accounts in the forums don't match the date you joined the game. She could have started in 1.0 and started posting here in 2020 and you would be none the wiser.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

Good for you? Lol

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...and you don't even care when your argument is proven wrong. Fantastic. That L must be hard to swallow.

Anyway, on this ridiculous notion that "people who use any tools are cheating" that not even SE gives two darns about 90% of the time, I do love it how there are "Cheater Sympathizers" yet the people using that term clearly haven't realized they're on the opposite end: the annoying whiner that needs to crack a dictionary and figure out what "cheating" means.

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Originally Posted by Mosha

who's opinion is worth more some guy who has a Stormblood doggo or someone who actively raids savage?

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I don't raid all that much, only when dragged to do it by my friends. And even I know virtue signaling against raiders when I see it.

Just ignore people who conflate using any third party tool as "cheating", Mosha. Saves you sanity points in the short run.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

How was I proven wrong? She made up things with no evidence at all. She was objectively wrong as she /he wrote without having any info whatsoever. You don’t criticize that as you want upvotes with this hive mind of cheaters.

Congrats on trying to find another way to personally gatekeep. I do hope someday the devs take actions against these account. But given they don’t seem to care that much or even about what happens in these forums it’s doubtful.

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No sweetie, I'm not the one kissing ass between you and me.

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Originally Posted by Midareyukki

Keep in mind accounts in the forums don't match the date you joined the game. She could have started in 1.0 and started posting here in 2020 and you would be none the wiser.



...and you don't even care when your argument is proven wrong. Fantastic. That L must be hard to swallow.

Anyway, on this ridiculous notion that "people who use any tools are cheating" that not even SE gives two darns about 90% of the time, I do love it how there are "Cheater Sympathizers" yet the people using that term clearly haven't realized they're on the opposite end: the annoying whiner that needs to crack a dictionary and figure out what "cheating" means.

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How was I proven wrong? She made up things with no evidence at all. She was objectively wrong as she /he wrote without having any info whatsoever. You don’t criticize that as you want upvotes with this hive mind of cheaters.

Congrats on trying to find another way to personally gatekeep. I do hope someday the devs take actions against these accounts. But given they don’t seem to care that much or even about what happens in these forums it’s doubtful.

It's so weird having people who dont raid put raiding at such high of a pedestal. I get it atleast conceptually if you are a raider yourself and just want something to brag about with but from casuals? IDK dude, do it yourself and find out that it's just being halfway decent at your job and learning how to mechanic.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

How was I proven wrong? She made up things with no evidence at all. She was objectively wrong as she /he wrote without having any infonwhatsoever. You don’t criticize that as you want upvotes with this hive mind of cheaters.

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You said yourself you did it as current content that was unsynced so like at the end of SB. what's fine I do the same with EX's but that doesn't make you a raider tbf.

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Originally Posted by Midareyukki

I don't raid all that much, only when dragged to do it by my friends. And even I know virtue signaling against raiders when I see it.

Just ignore people who conflate using any third party tool as "cheating", Mosha. Saves you sanity points in the short run.

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yeah that was a bit harsh I'm just fed up with non-raiders telling us what is correct, I've also hit the post limit so no more replies lmao.

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Originally Posted by Mosha

You said yourself you did it as current content that was unsynced so like at the end of SB. what's fine I do the same with EX's but that doesn't make you a raider tbf.

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I didn’t say I was a present raider. What aren’t you understanding? You think your opinion matters more as your raid now. That’s fine. My opinion matters more to me than yours lol. Neither matters to the devs who don’t seem to even moderate behavior here.

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Originally Posted by Mosha

who's opinion is worth more some guy who has a Stormblood doggo or someone who actively raids savage?

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Oh my don’t make me stand up for zephyr. It doesn’t matter if he doesn’t have any mounts or current raid experience. They are entitled to their opinion. The way you’re really hammering on the “you don’t have mount” and “you just unsynced them” is both cringey and pathetic. Sing a different tune. You’ve gotten stale real quick.

People unsyncing content but caring about the legitimacy of the clears of others, yea okay sure.

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Originally Posted by Saraide

People unsyncing content but caring about the legitimacy of the clears of others, yea okay sure.

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It's almost as though unsyncing is something the Dev's implemented in their game for old content that no longer carries the same level (or any) prestige, and cheating is not only not a game feature, but against the TOS. But yes, I guess those are the same thing or you can make analogies from them.

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Originally Posted by Kolaina

Oh my don’t make me stand up for zephyr. It doesn’t matter if he doesn’t have any mounts or current raid experience. They are entitled to their opinion. The way you’re really hammering on the “you don’t have mount” and “you just unsynced them” is both cringey and pathetic. Sing a different tune. You’ve gotten stale real quick.

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It's their opinion that the lack of mount indicate a lack of raiding experience and they are entitled to it.

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Originally Posted by Kolaina

Oh my don’t make me stand up for zephyr. It doesn’t matter if he doesn’t have any mounts or current raid experience. They are entitled to their opinion. The way you’re really hammering on the “you don’t have mount” and “you just unsynced them” is both cringey and pathetic. Sing a different tune. You’ve gotten stale real quick.

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Seeing this quote brought a tear to my eye. What is going on here? <3

And yes I had to make it weird.

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Originally Posted by Sesera

It's their opinion that the lack of mount indicate a lack of raiding experience and they are entitled to it.

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Not having mounts doesn’t discredit an opinion. Especially pertaining to mods

For me the heart of why this bothers me is because I was a hardcore raider in the past, not in XIV but in EQ2 where you needed to coordinate 24 people, not 8, which already was a challenge before the raid even began. I dedicated 30 hours a week to the raid team (something I won't do anymore and is one of the reasons I don't raid anymore - it's addicting to me and not something I want to be tempted by due to other responsibilities now). We went for world or server firsts. So when I had "Cleric Mace of Shiny Shininess" - it had prestige and meant something.

That's how I used to view raid mounts and gear here - when I see them I'd think, "oh that person cleared the most challenging content. That's cool!" Seeing how commonplace "cheats" are just makes me question how cool that is in XIV compared to my past experiences.

In the grand scheme of life, does this matter all that much? No. As an MMO hobbiest and someone who was heavily into raiding, and enjoyed the aspect of "oh cool look at that thing you have!" as recognition that I put the time and effort into earning it, I do stlil care on that level.

I think if you can't clear content as designed, you aren't entitled to top-end gear and mounts. Maybe to most here how I think is strange and no one views clearing current-tier raids as having any prestige. And, as a former really hard-core raider, it's a little sad to me.

As an aside, I'm not 100% anti-mod of any form. I think parsers are useful tools to help people improve. Our raid team used parsers to help point out who needed to improve in as a supportive manner as possible. It helped people perfect rotations and uptime and they improved as a player. It's a tool I wish was supported here for the educational value it brings. But I think tools that change how the encounter is viewed, or in ESO a mod that actually said "MECHANIC INC! DODGE NOW!" cheapened the encounters to me.

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Originally Posted by Sesera

Only "cheating" third party like splatoon is a big no no like nobody is going to freak out because someone used reshade or ACT. Especially when ACT is pretty much mandatory to have if you do high end content.

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The person I quoted originally has a "ZERO" tolerance for addons, and they did argue ACT was cheating. Which is why I asked them, what exactly their point was they were trying to make.

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Originally Posted by Mosha

You said yourself you did it as current content that was unsynced so like at the end of SB. what's fine I do the same with EX's but that doesn't make you a raider tbf.



yeah that was a bit harsh I'm just fed up with non-raiders telling us what is correct, I've also hit the post limit so no more replies lmao.

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You're not any more above the rules because you're a current Savage raider, and someone telling you so can be either a WF racer or a Sprout: they wouldn't be wrong either way.

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Originally Posted by RobynDaBank

You're not any more above the rules because you're a current Savage raider, and someone telling you so can be either a WF racer or a Sprout: they wouldn't be wrong either way.

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You dont need to worry about other people getting in trouble with TOS, that's their risk to take and not yours.