Selling Runs and Clears

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Originally Posted by Dualgunner

Okay but who does that really harm? It's an annoyance at worst to unrelated and uninterested people.

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You could say its the same as seeing RMT spam every time you port in a main city, SE doesn't tolerate that nor should it be tolerated, I don't want to see sale listings everytime I open PF to see who needs help.

Unless you go check these out on discord you don't know if it's RMT or not. As of last december cross server parties can be made. If anyone is foolish enough to give out their sign in information for getting a dungeon done, they kind of deserve whatever happens to their account.

Also, selling clears is not against tos at all. Think about it, the whole game revolves around adventurers making gil from doing quests.

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Originally Posted by Zarabeth

Unless you go check these out on discord you don't know if it's RMT or not. As of last december cross server parties can be made. If anyone is foolish enough to give out their sign in information for getting a dungeon done, they kind of deserve whatever happens to their account.

Also, selling clears is not against tos at all. Think about it, the whole game revolves around adventurers making gil from doing quests.

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If they are asking for account info like an earlier post said they know people who do it is very much a TOS violation. Also I see PF listings from different servers selling clears, how are they making gil when you can't even trade gil to people in a different server? Its RMT.

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Originally Posted by Dualgunner

Okay but who does that really harm? It's an annoyance at worst to unrelated and uninterested people.

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Shouting RMT adverts in Limsa Lominsa doesn't harm anyone either and it's annoying at worst. Yet they are banned for the simple reason that such behavior is against the rules. People buy this game with the expectation that other players around them will not be allowed to behave in forbidden ways. If those rules aren't enforced then why have them at all?

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Originally Posted by SerLuke

You could say its the same as seeing RMT spam every time you port in a main city, SE doesn't tolerate that nor should it be tolerated, I don't want to see sale listings everytime I open PF to see who needs help.

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RMT affects the economy in a negative way, causing harm. Cluttering PF a bit harms nothing. I'm sorry you don't want to see sale listings; I don't much like seeing advertisements, but I've gotten good at ignoring them.

inb4 "But people RMT to buy the clears", they RMT for houses and gear too. Should SE ban themselves for putting houses up, or crafters for selling gear?

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Originally Posted by Reinha

Shouting RMT adverts in Limsa Lominsa doesn't harm anyone either and it's annoying at worst. Yet they are banned for the simple reason that such behavior is against the rules. People buy this game with the expectation that other players around them will not be allowed to behave in forbidden ways. If those rules aren't enforced then why have them at all?

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Are RMT banned for shouting in Limsa, or for real money trading? Are they banned for being annoying in shout chat, or for actively harming server economy?

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Originally Posted by SerLuke

Not sure what you are trying to get at with that last point, people have gone to GM jail for trying to sell housing over PF.

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My point is, I care very little about "cluttering" the party finder. But go ahead and start reporting people en masse; you might get some raiders banned, or at least sent to GM jail, and clean up that PF of yours a bit.

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Originally Posted by SerLuke

Also, if someone is using cross server PF to advertise clears to people on different servers, how do you think they are getting paid since you can't trade gil across servers?

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I have no clue. It's also none of my business. So go ahead and get to reporting.

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Originally Posted by Dualgunner

RMT affects the economy in a negative way, causing harm. Cluttering PF a bit harms nothing. I'm sorry you don't want to see sale listings; I don't much like seeing advertisements, but I've gotten good at ignoring them.

inb4 "But people RMT to buy the clears", they RMT for houses and gear too. Should SE ban themselves for putting houses up, or crafters for selling gear?

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Not sure what you are trying to get at with that last point, people have gone to GM jail for trying to sell housing over PF.

Also, if someone is using cross server PF to advertise clears to people on different servers, how do you think they are getting paid since you can't trade gil across servers?

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Originally Posted by SerLuke

If they are asking for account info like an earlier post said they know people who do it is very much a TOS violation. Also I see PF listings from different servers selling clears, how are they making gil when you can't even trade gil to people in a different server? Its RMT.

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If you see them asking for account info then report them. That was kinda my point about checking them out on discord. But those who are selling runs for gil are not violating TOS.

Selling run against gil are not against ToS.
I didnt see any part of ToS that says you cant have an afk in the run.
Nothing else to give freely gils to another people with no reason.
and nothing to trade an help against gil...

RMT are against tos because it is forbidden to trade in game things against real things. (so real money vs in game money. real money vs in game service ... )

There is ethical matter with runselling, but not legal matter...

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Originally Posted by Dualgunner

Are RMT banned for shouting in Limsa, or for real money trading? Are they banned for being annoying in shout chat, or for actively harming server economy?

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They are banned for breaking the rules (real money trading). Just like the people selling clears cross-server (RMT) or buying clears by account sharing should be. Getting carried for free or for gil is not forbidden or harmful so there's no problem with that.

So what's worse?

The person who buys a run to get a slight gear upgrade to show off.

Or the one who cares about the one who bought it being better than them?

I put both in the same boat personally.