Naoki Yoshida's Comment in Regard to Jump Potions/Boost Potions

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Originally Posted by Aerowaffle

Call me old fashioned, but I fail to see why gating content behind story progression is such a big problem and why there's such a large amount of pushback for it.

Gating content is part of most games, why is it a problem with MMO's?

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Literally read this entire thread. The gating is the reason the endgame is so inaccessible, and the devs are still doing it despite the problems that it is causing

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Originally Posted by Aerowaffle

Call me old fashioned, but I fail to see why gating content behind story progression is such a big problem and why there's such a large amount of pushback for it.

Gating content is part of most games, why is it a problem with MMO's?

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It's the nature of how the story is presented. Were the story an even and seamless flow it wouldn't be looked down upon. But for some MMOs, like FFXIV, the story is modeled in such a way to have multiple breaks and interruptions to fit patches and expansions. There's also the issue of egregious amounts of filler quests for the sole purpose of exp that it begins to feel more like a chore than an exciting adventure.

A fetch quest or escort job here and there every now and then to catch pacing and prepare the next setting during a story is one thing, but these were quests that existed to pretty much get you higher leveled and keep you busy; basically what felt should have been side quests, not something mandatory. Enough of these can feel like a slog unless you're super into the characters and such, but otherwise, it becomes a deterrent.

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Originally Posted by Lewtskie

It's the nature of how the story is presented. Were the story an even and seamless flow it wouldn't be looked down upon. But for some MMOs, like FFXIV, the story is modeled in such a way to have multiple breaks and interruptions to fit patches and expansions. There's also the issue of egregious amounts of filler quests for the sole purpose of exp that it begins to feel more like a chore than an exciting adventure.

A fetch quest or escort job here and there every now and then to catch pacing and prepare the next setting during a story is one thing, but these were quests that existed to pretty much get you higher leveled and keep you busy; basically what felt should have been side quests, not something mandatory. Enough of these can feel like a slog unless you're super into the characters and such, but otherwise, it becomes a deterrent.

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Ah, that's understandable. Then I would say the problem is not with gating content, but with the main story line going off on tangents that are uninteresting.

So clearly they realize they are scummy with their billing tactics and feel the need to make up arbitrary excuses to try to explain their greed. That's what everyone likes to see. Rather than acknowledge and fix your grossness just make excuses for it and continue the practice.

As crazy as it may sound, there are people out there that actually like the MSQ as it is and would maybe prefer it be an optional service to skip rather than have what they already like completely overhauled into something they may not enjoy as much.

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Originally Posted by Khubla_Kha

So clearly they realize they are scummy with their billing tactics and feel the need to make up arbitrary excuses to try to explain their greed. That's what everyone likes to see. Rather than acknowledge and fix your grossness just make excuses for it and continue the practice.

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Everything is greed if you wanna look at it that way.

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Originally Posted by Aerowaffle

Ah, that's understandable. Then I would say the problem is not with gating content, but with the main story line going off on tangents that are uninteresting.

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It's not even that. In other MMOs once you reach X level you have access to content that is design for said level. Here's max level raid or max level dungeons. Sometimes they may be tied to a quest or small chain, but usually that starts at A and ends at B.


FFXIV has the concept that you unlock thing going from A to B, but to unlock the next feature you need to go from B to C (instead of say C to D). see where I'm going with this? The hooks are not self contained. If you want to gain access to the mount feature, you need to progress the story. It's not access to the Chocobo, it's access to the mount system.
The best solution would obviously be to un-hook and separate these system quests from the main story (or even better, make them leveled based whenever it makes sense). Problem is that takes a long ass time to do retroactively since they've cornered themselves with the design AND have to continue doing this going forward, while at the same time not affecting the story flow they've created.

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Originally Posted by Aramina

As crazy as it may sound, there are people out there that actually like the MSQ as it is and would maybe prefer it be an optional service to skip rather than have what they already like completely overhauled into something they may not enjoy as much.

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That's an excellent point i keep forgetting to come back to and a sentiment with which i fully agree. Many people seem to advocate against a potion, that doesn't directly affect them; but at the same time they're ok with having the story flow that's currently present butchered for gameplay reasons. While i do agree it sucks how the systems are locked behind story, I also think it works great as a narrative.
The only thing i hate more than cash shops is censored or cut content. It's one of the reasons i hate what wow has become. The legendary chains, long epic journeys, are now cut when an expansion ends. Huge segments of story, lore and entertainment, gone because fuck you.

Even if i did complete it on a character, there's no way to experience it again on a second character, or even watch it in the inn like we can in XIV. It just disappears.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

No, and this is yet another reason why the jump potion isn't really a solution. Were I a player who had just shelled out the price for not one game but three games (ARR, HW, and Stormblood), only to find that the first part was a horrendous slog and the endorsed solution by the devs was the sale of a skip potion that approaches the price of the game itself... well, that would not leave a good impression on me at all.

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Exactly, this is exactly what I was getting at as well. I don't think some people fully understand the perspective of new players. Granted, that they are completely new and just starting out. Imo, before people say, "yea well a new player could just buy the whole thing and jump to the expansion right away". Well I can't deny this wouldn't happen, but its a complete unlikely scenario, and makes no sense whatsoever. New players will most likely want to experience ARR first before buying the expansions. And even if we have people telling their friends to buy the jump potion, it's really not that simple. First and foremost, they need to enjoy the game (This is why the early game is important), and secondly, theres also the pricing to consider.

Also to people saying were spreading "salt", please do not label players who are just trying to figure out a better alternative as complainers. That obviously does not contribute anything at all and instigates negativity. We care about the perspectives about new players, and this is why we have a issue with ARR. I have way too many of my buddies quit because of this.... And it's been happening for a long time. However, I do agree that there are people who shouted out their dissatisfaction of the jump potion, with no alternative in mind, and with a bad tone. So I completely understand your frustrations.

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Originally Posted by VTXShiva

It's not even that. In other MMOs once you reach X level you have access to content that is design for said level. Here's max level raid or max level dungeons. Sometimes they may be tied to a quest or small chain, but usually that starts at A and ends at B.


FFXIV has the concept that you unlock thing going from A to B, but to unlock the next feature you need to go from B to C (instead of say C to D). see where I'm going with this? The hooks are not self contained. If you want to gain access to the mount feature, you need to progress the story. It's not access to the Chocobo, it's access to the mount system.
The best solution would obviously be to un-hook and separate these system quests from the main story (or even better, make them leveled based whenever it makes sense). Problem is that takes a long ass time to do retroactively since they've cornered themselves with the design AND have to continue doing this going forward, while at the same time not affecting the story flow they've created.

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That's the issue. I transitioned over to FFXIV from other MMOs because it wasn't like other MMOs.

I moved to this game as my favorite MMO because;

- The crafting system
- The class system
- I still went through all the content as a new player, none of the content was skipped (compared to WoW where the next expansion made most the previous expansion irrelevant and had no one do it).
- Finally, the immersiveness.

FFXIV has made sure (for the most part at least), that when you're doing a dungeon/raid/trial, there was a reason your character was doing it. To know the reason, you need to progress through the story.
Without the story requirement it would become more like,

Q: "Why are we attacking Nidhogg, and why is he so angry with us?"
A: *shrug*

And that's what it always felt like in MMO's like WoW.

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Originally Posted by Cedane

... you know, he does make a point there. Now thinking about it, do you think maybe we indirectly caused the Jump Potions to even be a concept?

Eh I'm sure they'd have done it anyway but, still, food for thought.

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I wouldn't be surprised if the way newbies are treated in the level 50 main scenario dungeons were a prominent factor in the decision to make these available so early.