So Thursday's maintenance is supposed to bring crafting/gardening adjustments...

So much ignorance in this thread. I spent about 100 million leveling all of my crafts to 60 during the first week because people decided mats were worth 50k each. Who collected those mats to sell? Combat classes and gatherers. Same people complain about Thavnairian Bustier selling for 10 million and how RMT is absolutely required to be able to afford them. Meanwhile, the silk to make the bustier sits on the MB for 3 million each and the bustier requires 3 silk, not counting the rest of the mats - you do the math. Who sells those silks again? Oh right, combat classes and gatherers. But no, crafters must be greedy, evil hoarders out to rob everyone of their hard-earned gil. :rolleyes:

Yeah so many entitled people feeling their time > crafters' time. We all pay a sub no? Its entirely possible to level crafts without spending much. I went from 0-4 stars crafting in 3 months. There's opportunities to make money everywhere. Its just a matter of time and effort. I certainly don't hear people complaining when the 4 star recipes were released. Who were the ones making money off Allagan leathers and Allagan silk? DOW and crafters via desynthesis. Do you even know how shitty was it to unlock the 4 recipes? @ little boy Hypie please use some brains and research before you comment on your arachne set being too expensive. Sure the set is pretty outdated but do you even know to unlock the recipe to even craft that shit, its totally up to RNG and crafting skills? People whining why how they are so poor and how the mb prices are so high should use your time to figure out how to make more gil and not spending time in the forum whining how expensive everything is. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Felis

try it with reselling
as an example: Buy crafting gear from the NPC at the moogle village for 9k gil, sell it on the MB for 30k gil

Or send out your DoW/DoM retainer out every hour to farm hides.

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The vendors themselves charge more than the market sells for and all the mats I can explicitly send the retainer to get are worth very little compared to costs of most desirable items.

I don't know; it seems to me that the only way to make enough gil for something in a decent amount of time is to be a crafter or gatherer. I mean, the average player is certainly not able to sell runs after all.

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Originally Posted by Lyrinn

Same people complain about Thavnairian Bustier selling for 10 million and how RMT is absolutely required to be able to afford them. Meanwhile, the silk to make the bustier sits on the MB for 3 million each and the bustier requires 3 silk, not counting the rest of the mats - you do the math. Who sells those silks again? Oh right, combat classes and gatherers. But no, crafters must be greedy, evil hoarders out to rob everyone of their hard-earned gil. :rolleyes:

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This a hundred million times! People are so full of crap, "Only crafters make millions of gil".

The last few weeks the Silk have been around 3mil+, the last few days around 2mil+. You need a dragonskin map to get them, from who? Gatherers. Map were like 150k-300k for a while(lot less lately), the last week prices have dropped to less than 100k, last I checked today was like 70kish. But DoW/M are still selling the Silks for 2mil+...... and crafters are greedy.

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Originally Posted by Arkista

This a hundred million times! People are so full of crap, "Only crafters make millions of gil".

The last few weeks the Silk have been around 3mil+, the last few days around 2mil+. You need a dragonskin map to get them, from who? Gatherers. Map were like 150k-300k for a while(lot less lately), the last week prices have dropped to less than 100k, last I checked today was like 70kish. But DoW/M are still selling the Silks for 2mil+...... and crafters are greedy.

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The people will not run out of complaints. Then the DoW will whine"why are the maps so expensive". Next the DoW who buys the maps"Why the drop rate so low and i didn't get anything useful!" And finally the DoW who wanna buy it from the mb"Why is it so expensive when the crafter just jams a few buttons to make this for my glamour" Only the DoW are always right "So hard to make money in this game, i wonder why?" Their time > crafters and gatherers' time.

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Originally Posted by Hypie

The Crafting in MMO's was never intended for making Profit.

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That's how economy works. What other MMOs are you used to? Because in all the ones I know people made a lot of currency off crafting. WoW? I made quite a bit selling equipment pieces for thousands.

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Originally Posted by Hypie

I dont say to totally make it worthless but to nerf it down to a level where a normal player can buy stuff after saving his dungeon run gil for 2-3 weeks. Or give PvE Players a Way of getting Gil while restricting the Crafters just to raise the Price.

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There already are plenty of ways to make gil without crafting. But from this it sounds like you only do dungeons.

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Originally Posted by Hypie

That's correct. I can tell you why. I wanted the Arachne Set just for the Looks. The Set is outdated since...long Time. But still Crafters want nearly a Million Gil for one Piece. You can buy EVERYTHING! For roughly 300-400K Gil. So you just pay a Crafter for hitting 2-3 Macros double the Mats.

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You are kind of paying him for taking the time and effort to level that crafting class. Do you think it was any easier in the past? No, it was only harder/required more time/gil.
And you are paying them to take the time to craft for you.

If you dont like that you could find someone you know that crafts, you could find someone else with a lower fee, or you could level it yourself.

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Originally Posted by Hypie

I wanted the Arachne Set just for the Looks.

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But you were too poor to buy it since you only do dungeons and never cared about gil before. Result being this topic.

You could of easily made millions leveling a retainer and having it farm materials. Since you only dungeon spam anyway, you should be full on seals as well.



Also LOL wanting the Arachne Set and cant pay 1 mil. I want the full Thavnarian Set, any idea how much that costs on my server? xDDD (about 40m in material cost alone)

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Originally Posted by StouterTaru

I can craft anything, I can gather anything. I'm holding off on melds until they introduce more difficult recipes.

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Youll need better stats then that for the 1* nodes tho.

I just dislike the fact the efficient farming is pretty much relegated to those with extra retainers to do all the work for them.

I havent started crafting because I am getting all my gatherer's to 60, and farming every single material I need for any given synth purely because I refuse to shell out the millions of gil other crafters and gatherer seem to want for their materials.
In the mean time before crafting and while Im levelling my gatherer's, I have all of my retainers farming additional materials that I believe'd to be needed for a variety of recipes. (Ie, rainbow cotton bolls, arch skins, ramie stalks, mythrite sand, etc)
And crystals arent a problem at all now thanks to the moraines and rocks I've been getting from Ephemeral Nodes.

I'll not give the MB another penny for materials (atleast not until the prices drop to a more manageable state)

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Originally Posted by Hypie

Btw right after HW hit i got a Crafter doing it for free! After asking why he said "Well i get exp for that."I can't shake of this Feeling off....ya know "it helps me so its okay...it helps me not so lets charge him on a sum i like".

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You call crafters selfish and greedy, but then even when you find one that is willing to make your items free of charge, you complain because they weren't falling over themselves to kiss your ass and praise existence that they had the pleasure of doing making this item for you?

Are you ok? I mean that seriously, because judging from your posts I'm concerned that where your head is currently lodged you may not be getting enough air.

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Originally Posted by Hypie

No only the Players who OVERcharge. And because it's a economy based on the wellfare of crafters you can't do nothing against it.
You think Players will start charging low Prices because no Reason? Dream on. You have to make serious Changes so that they lower the Price. So yeah basically you have to force em or they would hurt themself. Thats Capitalism.

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Free Market

: an economic market or system in which prices are based on competition among private businesses and not controlled by a government

: an economy operating by free competition
Source: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/free%20market

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@DejectedBunny:

So you want XIV to be a Second Job? Uhm don't take it personally but last Time i checked XIV was a Game meant to be enjoyed and not a "second Workplace".

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MMORPGs are designed to account for the long term, hence the reason why anything that is considered a long-term investment (e.g. crafting) requires more effort on the part of the individual to make it payoff.

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Crafting is a big Cornerstone of every Game and no matter how much you argue its not on par with other MMO's. Its outdated overcomplicated Stuff based on RNG and heavily punishs the ones who don't invest a huge amount of Gil. It's not...suitable for the mass. Yeah...not suitable for the mass at all.

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You're absolutely right, the system we have in this game far exceeds that of the majority of other AAA MMOs on the market. This system requires a bit of thought and more work than just click the button, dispense item.

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Originally Posted by Hypie

Rather what you force em to cough up or piss off...

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Again, you are confusing free will with coercion. Neither myself, nor anyone else is forcing players to buy our wares. Last I checked everyone has the ability to level each and every craft and make the stuff themselves. You still have to answer the question of what is preventing you from leveling the crafts yourself.

You're chasing after some phantom boogey-man. Put your sign down, and take a few deep breaths.

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Originally Posted by Hypie

You didn't "earn" it Wobi. You just used the Time while it was easy. Now it's way harder and punishing. And you are just blatantly ignoring that. But please go on on your naive Trip of "i eaaaaaaaaaaarned iiiiiiit" Man....poor girl/dude.

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Ah yes, I remember those times when crafting was easier. The having to grind out philosophy tomes to purchase materials, the having to make 5 HQ Rose Gold ingots, Darksteel ingots, etc. for master books. Or my personal favorite, the 50 HQ turn-in tokens needed for each Artisan main hand tool. Also, let's not forget the demimaterias that were needed for Supra tools and Artisan gear. Yeah, you're right, we had it so much easier back then. As for earning it, well I guess you could argue that we didn't "earn" any of it any more than someone with BiS coil gear, a Zeta relic weapon, or a level 50 / 60 job did.

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Originally Posted by Nadirah

And overmelding is what broke crafted accessories in Coil. They're why they won't make good crafted gear. Get rid of overmelding and you can have crafted gear that's a viable alternative.

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Crafted gear has always been second rate to raid gear. It's been that way since day 1 so that no one felt they had to buy or make crafted gear to participate in content. As for the groups that used overmelded accessories and gear to clear Final Coil, that was merely a workaround for them to clear the content without having to spend a lot of time farming out gear. In the end the gear they used (the crafted, overmelded stuff) was still less than equal to the drops they got from the raid content.

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Originally Posted by Hypie

Other People, with conscience mind you, would tell you that's scam.

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It's called due diligence. No one is stopping you from researching the item or purchasing it at the lower price from the NPC. Likewise, you have only yourself to blame if you decide to pay a marked up fee for purchasing it off the MB. Do you protest outside of Target because they are selling an item for a higher price than Walmart? The information is easily and readily available to everyone, if you choose not to use it, that's your fault.

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Originally Posted by Hypie

Should be the other Way around my Friend. We should start charging you carrying you through the Stuff :) Good Idea! every Crafter cough up a million for every other player who needs bear with you in the raid or gtfo :D

I wonder how long you would last XD

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I must have missed the update where we were allowed to enter content as a crafting job. In which case, I'll agree that having a CUL or a BSM in the party would be a real hindrance to clearing content. Even with full melds and an Artisan main hand, I was doing horrible damage against the striking dummy outside my house. I mean, it took 3(!) of us to take the dummy down and that still took over 3 minutes of auto-attacking.

Fellow Crafters of Eorzea,

It is time that we petition SE to give us better offensive capabilities! We should not have to make the rest of our party suffer because of the dismal DPS output of our tools!

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Originally Posted by KisaiTenshi

Anything that can be bought from a NPC becomes trash value.

The game -enabled- crafters to not have to use the market by being able to buy NQ materials from NPC's, thus torpedoing the value of all materials dropped from dungeons, thus people don't even need on them anymore.

At launch, all the crafters wanted the 'coke' item which was super-expensive. All the GC-purchasable items became trash value.

So high material prices hurts crafters, but low material prices hurt gatherers, so people don't even bother to go find the materials.

The average level 1-30 item on the market is sold for 1 gil or below NPC price, Anything that sells below the "NPC" price is better off being sold to an NPC just to trash-vendor it. But there's a lot of GC-purchasable items, and high-level roulette items that are selling at trash prices.

Part of the changes in 3.0 was to not allow players to be "masters of all" so that players would be forced to buy precursor craft materials on the market (eg stuff you make that isn't a finished item.) Thus allowing the market to function beyond being a dumping ground for RMT.

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You realize that the primary reason for items being sold by NPC vendors is so players can circumvent the MB if they don't agree with the prices. And the high-level roulette items (I'm going to guess that you're referring to coke, potash, peacock ore, etc.) are so cheap now because
1. The items made from these materials are typically outdated and not useful for anything outside of glamour and old FSH melds.

2. SE upped the drop rate on them to a degree (over several updates) that the supply far exceeded the demand.


A final bit of food for thought for all of you complaining about crafters.... If we were all to decide tomorrow that we would only make things for ourselves and friends, what would you do then? Would you come on here to lament how the MB are empty or would you put forth the effort to make the stuff yourselves?

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Originally Posted by myahele

as a glamaholic, I am glad that glamour prism did not get a new tier

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I can agree to this. I find it incredibly aggravating that they needed to have multiple levels of them in the first place.

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I'm also on Excalibur, sure there are under cutters, but a lot of high end crafts are calling for low level items. Not going to name them cause I'm making decent gil. Level your MNR, should take you like 4 days to hit 60.



Edit-

I'm assuming most of the people with complaints didn't craft in FFXI. Cause if you did you would know that crafting in FFXIV is super easy.

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Maybe if you're doing leves. I'm out of allowances. And I didn't play FFXI. I'm almost pretty sure a good number of folks didn't. I *have* maxed every crafter in most of the MMOs I've played though.

And Zumi, it wouldn't surprise me. Some of the stuff SE does is confusing.