#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

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Originally Posted by Azurarok

I meant party-wide mits, probably should've specified. I think personal mits are pretty necessary (looking at you VPR), though how strong they should be is another thing

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To be fair that’s arguably the entire problem, every class in the game has at least 1 mitigation so in a world where healers are more seen as mitigators than actual healers one of the healers having the least mitigation of any class in the game ends up being problematic for balance

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

To be fair that’s arguably the entire problem, every class in the game has at least 1 mitigation so in a world where healers are more seen as mitigators than actual healers one of the healers having the least mitigation of any class in the game ends up being problematic for balance

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I wasn't implying WHM having the least mitigation is fine though? I just still think at least a self mitigation is necessary to deal with clutch situations.

Though I think it all really stems from there not being enough things to manage since they've largely removed MP/TP and aggro management. All the jobs are fighting over who gets to have dps and who gets to have mitigation because that's kind of all there's left.

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Originally Posted by Azurarok

I wasn't implying WHM having the least mitigation is fine though? I just still think at least a self mitigation is necessary to deal with clutch situations.

Though I think it all really stems from there not being enough things to manage since they've largely removed MP/TP and aggro management. All the jobs are fighting over who gets to have dps and who gets to have mitigation because that's kind of all there's left.

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Oh sorry I wasn’t accusing you just kinda pinballing off you

My mistake for not making that clearer

Something that is kinda funny is that know since I've gotten the chaotic boots, the healing and dpsing in FRU is so much easier now. Kind of gives a perspective that how much of a dead-weight stat that Piety is in Ultimate with this.

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Originally Posted by Tigore

We've probably got so much little things adding up to the healers not needing to heal very much that we probably need the newer encounter damage to increase to "fix" the issue first. Forsaken Roe's Aetherblight idea does look good as one to add. It also gives us a reason to consider Esuna and could open up an AoE Esunaga niche for a healer too. More than likely, SGE could probably get that one.

I believe Snow also mentioned an HP sharing cooldown as another secondary cooldown for a healer to possibly get (SGE maybe?). I can confirm this works well for Shamans in WoW and this makes the off tank HP more useful.

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WHM struggles to find a niche to occupy, Esuna is a White Magic traditionally, why not have WHM be the one able to use an AOE Esuna? For something like TEA (6 Throttle debuffs to remove) it'd be pretty great, but that mechanic occurs exactly once in the fight, so I doubt the playerbase would resort to 'you MUST bring WHM or you're griefing' even if it could remove all 6 by itself. Combine it with the Aetherblight idea (specifically, the part where Aetherblight can be removed via Esuna) and WHM becomes the number one choice for all your Aetherblight removal needs, giving it a very solid niche to occupy

I can't imagine SGE with Spirit Link Totem, that's a level of power this game is not prepared for. But if it were implemented, I'd rework Philosophia to do the effect, rather than add it as a new button

If there were to be a Spirit Link Totem equivalent, I would have thought an empowered Bole the obvious choice, tbh.

I was thinking if WHM could cover the AoE Esunaga, but I also noticed the posts about SGE struggling too. The DPS to heal niche is kind of too weak now from what I am hearing about them. Just a glorified SCH fairy limited to one target as others have said for the strength. Soteria and Philosophia definitely needs to grant either a stronger effect or better heals to be more worth it from what others are saying. I won't say no if the majority decides the WHM fits best for Esunaga. I am just thinking of what would be fair for SGE too. If we can come up with other things for them, it may still be okay to let WHM have it.

As for the Spirit Link Totem effect, I was thinking of SGE fitting the doctor feel the best out of the 4 healers. It's may be a bit flimsy on the lore effect, but the best I can think of would be those IV Blood transfusions. Except in this case, it would be borrowing someone's life aether or something and donating it to another who needs it most. If we do place it on Philosophia, Soteria could be the SGE to Kardia link for sharing HP too. We'd probably have to include an effect that breaks the link when the "donors" reach 10 - 30% HP just to be safe. Although SGE should be more than capable of exploiting this effect with Ixochole, Kerachole, Physis, Pneuma and Holos. Consecutive Tank Buster hits definitely become a lot more smoother to heal with the whole raid potentially sharing their HP for the damage done. It could perhaps be another strong niche.

As for the Piety remark, I also avoid that stat too with my current casual play. For obvious reasons of course with very few of the Savage Mechs we are talking about. The "1HP White Hole" I only remember from a certain spoiler story Trial at the end of Endwalker. If the stat also did some other things like improve the healing done and boost the shield amounts in addition to MP regen, it might be a bit better. Although just a bit now since we are already talking about the extra healing not being needed yet. We'll have to increase encounter damage first before that extra suggestion starts to look more valuable. We may not need to nerf the tank and DPS self heals or party mitigation very much if the encounters actually damage the party consistently. The dance mechs have their place, but it's become apparent that the devs are relying on them too much. It mostly amounts to occasional cheap shots on first timers or lagging players with the healers mostly needing a raise or 1 oGCD heal to fix it. There are times everyone gets hit, but that is quite rare and players tend to notice and share where to go after a wipe. If a solution cannot be seen immediately, there would usually be enough veteran players who did the encounter already present to follow on where to go. It also keeps the easy stuff easy (solo hunts and FATEs) if we don't have to nerf the self sustains much.

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Originally Posted by Tigore

We'll have to increase encounter damage first before that extra suggestion starts to look more valuable. We may not need to nerf the tank and DPS self heals or party mitigation very much if the encounters actually damage the party consistently.

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This is why Aetherblight, or a system like it, has so much potential IMO. As the example I gave shows, you could quite easily make encounters that are a doddle for a Healer to handle (due to how much HPS we can put out with so little effort, or our unlimited access to Esuna effects), yet it's still too much for DPS and Tanks to handle alone, due to their healing moves having such CDs as they do. A simple mechanic like 'Every 12.5s, a tower to soak appears in the centre of the arena. It puts Aetherblight on the player who soaks it, equal to their Max HP. If the player tries to soak a tower while they have Aetherblight, they die instantly', while it sounds very hard to handle, it's really not, because you can simply cast Esuna once per 12.5s on whoever soaks it and remove the Aetherblight instantly. A joke to handle as a Healer (such that people would likely criticize it for being so bland a solution for 'making healing more interesting'), and yet it's still far too much for a 1T 3DPS team to handle, because only BRD can cleanse DOTs, and they have a 45s CD on their tool

As such, implementation of such a system means that all these non-Healer jobs can keep their utility actions, and even at the power they are currently at. Nobody needs to lose anything, nobody needs to be 'nerfed', because their numbers aren't getting changed

My primary concern is that it will be made the same as damage is - Your entire HP bar or so little a crit heal will cover it plus any accompanying damage.

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Originally Posted by ForsakenRoe

This is why Aetherblight, or a system like it, has so much potential IMO.

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I've been trying to imagine this every which way and I still can't really find any significant appeal to building so much around Aetherblight, specifically, when I imagine it out relative to other options that would likely be mostly mutually exclusive with it.

Ultimately, Aetherblight just adds Esuna-able sustain requirements. Which is essentially a way to further take the myriad of healing choices by which to deal with that given portion/source of damage and suborn them instead behind something that ignores the magnitude of that damage to heal it all at once. That in itself seems... a downgrade. The only redeeming points to me are that at least this then-spammable-healing-nuke, Esuna, is (A) normally just single-target and (B) only affects that portion of damage and therefore might be less obligatory... when the given healing absorption is insignificant anyways.

More importantly, aside from propping up Esuna (and increasing the relative power of barriers not generated based on healing done while gutting the relative power of barriers generated based on healing done), I have to wonder what, if any, impact Aetherblight would have relative to just... making HP bars less zingy by nerfing both burst incoming damage and outgoing healing. Both slow how long it takes to heal someone to full and increase the relative value of --again, Esuna aside-- healers with greater optional (e.g., uptime-spending / at-cost) HPS.

And as for its impact on Esuna, it seems to devalue a more meaningful decision pathway (e.g., reduce the total damage that'd need to be healed by removing the DoT now vs. just ensuring the target has HP enough to survive the next hit between ticks, purging a bind or snare so that the target can dodge the otherwise unavoidable AoE vs. just shielding them enough to survive it regardless, etc.) with one for which the "decision" comes down to a simple strength computation a la reducing overheal (Would my heal have covered all the Aetherblight and then some anyways? Would I still progress further against the party's Aetherblight afflictions in total by spamming AoEs).

It feels like it just tries to solve too many issues at once through an unnecessary convolution and in doing so makes both the healing and Esuna a bit less interesting, especially when considering the net effect going in that direction would have relative to (at least partly) mutually exclusive options.

More concretely/analytically:

• Healing absorption typically rewards only knowledgeable greeding, which we already have a glut of rewards for by nature of the usual rhythm and tuning of damage intake in XIV encounters. I'd therefore prefer it be used sparingly and with deliberate (anti-)synergies with other mechanics in the fights in which it is used.
  
  
• Even when well situated, the considerations by which to weigh cleansing vs. healing through healing absorption effects are typically lesser than the kinds of considerations (in action choice and timings) offered already by virtually any other kind of debuff in their fitting contexts (slows, snares, vulnerability, damage down, etc.). It's essentially an especially lackluster cleansible.
  
  
• When you allow Esuna to remove a mechanic that would otherwise interact with your whole healing kit, allowing for any competing options requires the amount to be cleansed to be almost negligible as to allow the occasional nuke heal to surpass Esuna or for AOE heals to remain so overpowered as to have them, at least, be a competing option. Else, you replace an entire healing kit with one spammable OP button each time its opportunity for use appears.
  
  
• The upside would appear to be the accumulation of damage absorption across multiple contributing attacks allowing the priority to shift somewhat granularly from healing through to Esuna, with a healer being able to play chicken with the accumulated effect to Esuna once before nuke healing, but that effectively just limits the occurrence of actual heals even further, encourages far more risk of death for party members, and makes Esuna feel more like a Cleric Stance toggle than an action in its own right (e.g., one of situational more so than just scaled sustain value). I.e., it'd still be a downgrade in terms of QoL, action bloat, lost nuance, kit interactivity (especially in evenness of weighting across actions), etc. relative to just... not having that and instead increasing sustain action (or non-attack healer GCD action) requirements by any other means.

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General Opinion:

We don't need healing absorption effects, let alone as a broad undermechanic, to make healers more necessary or engaging. We just need (A) opportunity/use-case for a greater number of sustain actions(' casts) as to outscale what can be provided by non-healers and/or --similarly but more about gameplay than mere role balance-- (B) more meaningful real use cases for non-offensive actions among healers (and perhaps a few more non-healing actions against which they could broadly compete to add further nuance to timing/greeding decisions and fight knowledge rewards among those increasingly needed heals).

(To be clear, we can have healing absorption effects, absolutely, though I'd argue that may be something better specifically not cleansible by Esuna, while if we feel Esuna ought to see more use, it should do so through more situationally sustain-costing debuffs or through actual DoTs. But healing absorption ought to just be a singular mechanic among many, not a specific answer to broad issues in the relative balance of healing outputs vs. damage intake.)

Ideally, you leverage that even further by giving healers some non-healing outputs to actually look forward to and to occasionally make decisions that might have lesser efficiency in terms of MP or total healing output in order to maximize their rDPS contribution through buffs, debuffs, etc., when the healing in that moment would not add greater rDPS potential down the line (from healer GCDs saved, target uptime saved, lives saved, etc.).

And if giving more to heal would overwhelm healers because of how quickly that would mean health bars depleting, then you just nerf both burst damage intake and healing output so that there's less common waste to overhealing among healer GCD actions and more of an ongoing fight between curative and non-curative priority conflicts.