An Open Letter to Yoshida-san: Please Slice One Zero Off the Housing Prices

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Originally Posted by Vantwan

The funny thing is that there are a lot of smaller FC's out there who have been saving gil for housing since the game launched but I doubt they expected something like 30+ million gil for medium sized land, which doesn't even include the cost of the actual house.

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I know individuals who make over a mil a day messing with the markets. Player size has nothing to do with anything if an FC will get anything (Mostly anyway). It comes down to how hard they will be willing to work to something. This gives a lot of people a reason to play over a long time, a long term goal.


If your FC has twenty people in it and they all passionately want a house, surely they can do the dailies or work the market or craft or do whatever they need to to earn their house rather then sit around and complain that they don't have one..?

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Originally Posted by WhiteDragon

They never said housing was based off an average in that post.

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Then what is it based off of according to you?
Whatever the answer is to that question, I highly doubt it'll justify the current pricing scheme.

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Originally Posted by Billzey

I really don't understand all the QQ regarding housing, specifically why people even care. I keep reading posts about how people were really really really looking forward to housing as if it was the only thing they were interested in. Are you kidding me? Having a house serves no purpose whatsoever. It's a completely vain nicety that has no impact on how I play FFXIV. What do people even expect to do in these houses...? Walk around and maybe do some /sitting and /dozing on the beds? Wow, that sounds like fun. Or maybe I can craft inside the house because the environment in which I craft is so important!

If the only thing you were looking forward to in 2.1 was housing, then I highly suggest you play a different game--something like Second Life.

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And everything in FFXIV is only a completely vain nicety that has no impact on real-life. Your point has no point. The only thing that is tied to real-life is the sub price, and that is based on the consumer being pleased with the service.

I give Camate kudos for at least saying something. But it only shows how little they understand what all the backlash is about. The Prices are outrageous and the Price-Disparity even more so. There are other far more effective ways to balance the gil of the servers than off-setting the price of a vanity system.

An even better question is 'Why all the concern about the amount of gil in the 1st place?' The game is designed where gil is pretty much pointless. What does it matter if some FC with no life has 3 billion gil, if there's nothing for them to use it for? The High Prices only punish people. What's the justification for why it's supposedly so important to balance the gil on the different servers that u use the game content that you have been pushing more than anything else for prmotional hopes of additional subs, when there's no examples in the game of where gil is important? The Devs have done nothing to try to stimulate an economy so why think there is such a need to bleed as many resources as you can, just because they wanted to release a content that they don't have the resources to allow the players to utilize?

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Originally Posted by Hasseo

And come on if they could really account for the RMT gil then they could just as easily ban them all.

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Yep, other than what has turned out to be straight-up lies for the hopes of subs; that has to be the stupidest thing I've ever heard Yoshi-P say except for this:

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We understand that the initial prices for housing are extremely high [he has complete control of the housing prices], but this is a patch filled with a lot of content, so as you are having fun and enjoying everything the price will come down.

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Ok... If housing is supposed to be something that noone cares about and just be like 'oh, we'll throw away the gil for it one day but whateyer...' WHY IS IT ALL U EVER TALK ABOUT IN THE LIVE LETTERS

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Originally Posted by Descend

How about you implement small cardboard boxes, with jars of old pickels inside, and a urine scented blanket with holes for 1 - 2 million that we new players on legacy servers might be able to save up for? this way we arent homeless... or how about making a shelter, where we can stay, as long as we arent drinking...

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Like... an Inn... or something?

A place where you could log out maybe. There could be one in each major city, they could be free... have a bed... a summoning bell, and maybe even a storage device!

"One thing we wanted to avoid was situations where free companies wanted to build a house but couldn't because the land was sold out."

Answer: Let's set the price so high that they can't get one anyways. - Thus reaching the same conclusion.

LOGIC!

I suspect no one of the staff will even take a look on this thread.

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Originally Posted by WhiteDragon

Like... an Inn... or something?

A place where you could log out maybe. There could be one in each major city, they could be free... have a bed... a summoning bell, and maybe even a storage device!

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Staying in someone elses inn is fine and all, but cant a man just live free in his own cardboard box after he saves the world?

Some of you are missing point an FC house is CASUAL content. This isnt endgame or anything else. Should not need for 50+ people spend all their time farming for months to get. That is peoples points. So all your its a goal or people want handouts bs is nothing more than you wanting to run your mouth. Noone has said need as soon as servers come up or gotta start with some huge mansion. They want something they can enjoy and continue to improve. That is point of casual content. Asking players to spend majority of time for something thats not even their own and as peoples goals and lifestyles changes may need to leave one group is just unrealistic. We wanted harder more challanging game content and we were basicly told no, so dont tell us that something casual is suppose to be some long term personal goal. And come on if they could really account for the RMT gil then they could just as easily ban them all.

Maybe i could just sell food and exp pots for millions.

Oh wait...:p

the main problem with housing was that most of us were led to beleive like they said a small house would be 3X are 1-50 quest gold and we all got prepared for that but are now blown away by the gold requirements for a house. As someone on the lowest tier i wanted a big house nothx. I and my friends saved over 7mill considering that would be the range it would cost but nope the problem is these prices just promote more people buying gold with there usd. people say have large companies and have all donating but if out of those 400+ people 1 decides to buy gold with usd? goodbye to your house. this just promotes greed in my opionon now extreme primals will be getting sold now everything will raise and now we are going to see even more gold spammers. i'd rather have a option to pay 1million a week for a large house like tax. They could have just made the furniture harder to optain so the market could get better with crafting but this way just promotes so much more bad then good.

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Originally Posted by Minigae

People act like something being "exclusive" is a bad thing. Housing is what they need to do to endgame because nothing worth having is easy to get. Thing is it is really not that bad I have never went out of my way to make gil yet I could buy a small house solo. I am sure FCs that have members that actually work on it will not take long to get a house. Now if you are a new player or a legit player from 1.0 on a legacy server I can see housing being unattainable but on new servers its just the same old casual dilemma "I want EVERYTHING but want to do NOTHING".

Housing is completely useless it affects nothing in the game the only value it has currently is the exclusiveness so they are not taking that away. And if SE did reduce the prices by the astronomical amount the players complaining are asking for they would not get a house anyway. Because other FCs that have players that want to work will buy it all out before you even hit rank 6.

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Look, we've gone over this already. We don't want EVERYTHING, and we especially don't want it for doing NOTHING.

Please STOP using that argument, it is invalid.

We want to participate in a feature that was advertised, and for which we HAVE BEEN WORKING since we heard about it.

A lot of the people who are upset about pricing are ON the legacy servers. The majority of people I've noticed that are ok with the prices are on the cheaper servers. So you're using the wrong examples.

If housing is completely useless, why should it take just as much work and dedication and time as downing Twintania????????????

They should allow down payment and housing mortgage. So does for the lands.

Players: "Lower the housing prices! We seriously can't afford this!"

Yoshi: "Nope"

Players: "Kay"

Bunch of pushovers. This is why we can't have nice things.

And "selling out of housing" is complete BS. This isn't real life. THEY CAN CREATE INFINITE HOUSING INSTANCES. IT'S DIGITAL SPACE....
It's like when EA sold out of digital copies of a video game.

Wat...
They have what? 600k subs? @ $10 a month? A cool $6million+ a month and they can't buy a few servers to make this content viable for everyone?

Whatever.

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Originally Posted by DoctorMog

Yoshi: "Nope"
Players: "Kay"
Bunch of pushovers. This is why we can't have nice things.

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Tons of people (like you) are whining. Don't get why you say they're being pushovers.

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Originally Posted by Hasseo

Some of you are missing point an FC house is CASUAL content.

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says... you? Maybe they want it to be Endgame content. You're just making up something in your head and trying to push it as fact.

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Originally Posted by Zezlar

"One thing we wanted to avoid was situations where free companies wanted to build a house but couldn't because the land was sold out."

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I've never seen a npc merchant run out of fishing lure or not have enough gil to buy up my trash items. I do not see how something virtual could become sold out. I think he's hiding another issue with the fundamental mechanics of the system being broken and the pricing is just covering up for it. What's next Ifrit going to have a sold out of weapons sign up next to him .

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Originally Posted by DoctorMog

Players: "Lower the housing prices! We seriously can't afford this!"

Yoshi: "Nope"

Players: "Kay"

Bunch of pushovers. This is why we can't have nice things.

And "selling out of housing" is complete BS. This isn't real life. THEY CAN CREATE INFINITE HOUSING INSTANCES.
It's like when EA sold out of digital copies of a video game.

Wat...
They have what? 600k subs? @ $10 a month? A cool $6million+ a month and they can't buy a few servers to make this content viable for everyone?

Whatever.

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You, I like you. Keep doing what you're doing.

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Originally Posted by WhiteDragon

Tons of people (like you) are whining. Don't get why you say they're being pushovers.



says... you? Maybe they want it to be Endgame content. You're just making up something in your head and trying to push it as fact.

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Yeah, sinking millions of gil into a cosmetic house is endgame now. Not raiding bosses, doing massive group missions, or exploring the whole land. Nope. All of your money into a single source. Yup. Endgame.

WhiteKnight on, fanboy.

So much talk about housing in the live letters and then these prices.
I'm not in a FC so I don't care too much about it but the numbers are still insane. (at least for my server)
20 mil for a plot that can hold a house as big as a moghouse? c'mon...

this is so great ! because the prices are super high !!!! thats why i am now missing the mog houses from ffxi

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Originally Posted by cainejw

Yeah, sinking millions of gil into a cosmetic house is endgame now. Not raiding bosses, doing massive group missions, or exploring the whole land. Nope. All of your money into a single source. Yup. Endgame.

WhiteKnight on, fanboy.

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So you're saying it's best that they make it so you can only do a raid if you spend 60 Mil but leave houses free?

You have interesting views.

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Originally Posted by WhiteDragon

Tons of people (like you) are whining. Don't get why you say they're being pushovers.

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Come to a thread, provide decent arguments, raise valid concerns, get called a whiner.
Cool man.

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Originally Posted by WhiteDragon

says... you? Maybe they want it to be Endgame content. You're just making up something in your head and trying to push it as fact.

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Then maybe they should've advertised it as such, and not as something that would be attainable and enjoyable by everyone in the game!

Edit: I'm also still waiting for an answer on my previous question.

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Originally Posted by WhiteDragon

If it's that important then you should be happy to farm and work for your important goal.

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you make me count to 10... but your trollish comment aside, i have been farming and working and saving and selling and choco-porting and walking and banking my gil since i was able to in Beta 4. i have wanted a house since i knew it was a possibility. i went as far as to make my own solo FC in hopes that it might be obtainable. it was a shot in the dark and no, you wont see me crying for the prices to drop for people like me. but bottom line is the reasoning behind the cost is aggravating. especially for those that are in a decent sized group, who have been saving and finds housing to be important. i am holding on to hopes that this will not be the approach for personal housing because that is MY end-game.

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Originally Posted by WhiteDragon

Again, SE has HARD DATA [....]

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Quite simply, Legacy worlds have more gil because they have players that have been playing the game for years longer than everyone else. It's not illegitimate or requiring special consideration. Non-legacy worlds have different amounts of gil because some have more population going through gil-generating game content, and some were added weeks after launch.

If SE noticed more FCs could afford housing at first on some worlds, they should have put in more housing areas for those worlds. The graduated pricing seems to indicate that SE is limiting housing areas to the same number for each world, because they are doing this despite the hardship uneven pricing causes most of their customers.

IMHO.

If FC housing isnt casual content then they got bigger issues. This isnt something every player has control over, its not something that aids progression it is vanity and nothing more, In noway can that be considered end game content you have farther proven you have absolutly no logic what so ever. I am disabled i run 3 character got nothing better to do, is what it is. spend most by day farming and running dungeons, that is still alot of gil for me to give out to something i have limited control over. People that have school work etc get what 4hrs a day if do nothing else. There is no logical balance to that, You are simply a troll or happen to be an ls that got enough gil to carry you cause 3 lvl 50s startin in november your not doing it yourself thats for sure. Though gotta say FC housing as endgame content has gotta be that biggest LOLbs ive heard.

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Originally Posted by ArkhamNative

Quite simply, Legacy worlds have more gil because they have players that have been playing the game for years longer than everyone else. It's not illegitimate or requiring special consideration. Non-legacy worlds have different amounts of gil because some have more population going through gil-generating game content, and some were added weeks after launch.

If SE noticed more FCs could afford housing at first on some worlds, they should have put in more housing areas for those worlds. The graduated pricing seems to indicate that SE is limiting housing areas to the same number for each world, because they are doing this despite the hardship uneven pricing causes most of their customers.

IMHO.

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The main reason there is gil accumulated so much more on Legacy servers is because things were expensive in 1.0.

Even after a 90% gil-reduction "some" these people still have alot of gil accumulated. Why? Because even though gil is the virtual currency of the game's world, it really serves no purpose at all in ARR. The only things people buy are bought to be lazy and cut-corners. That is completely the fault of the Dev Team and not the Players. The Dev Team chose to lower gil costs on teleportation, ferries, repairs, dark matter, etc.; and then they say these same Players have too much gil and therefore aren't worthy to pay an equal housing price as the other servers?

I like how his fear was "if its too cheap people will buy up all the lots"

if you can only buy 1 lot\fc then each fc would buy the biggest they could get.

1 fc buying a 20 million house takes 20 million out of the game, because im pretty sure only 1 or 2 fc's will be stupid enough to throw away that kind of gil

100 fc's buying a 5 million lot takes 500 million out of the game.... nuff said!

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Originally Posted by WhiteDragon

Again, SE has HARD DATA and you have... your imagination I guess(?) when it comes to numbers of players and how much gil they have.

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You're still waiving your hard "data" around and defend UNDEFENDABLE! And where are the data saying how many of those "rich" players / FCs are actually planning to SPEND their money on the FC housing? There is the major flaw in your argument - nobody knows that, not even SE with their hard data - so please stop whiteknighting them. If you're happy - good for you - enjoy the new content and let others to express their deep dissapointment with the horribly designed housing prices.

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Originally Posted by Eloc

I like how his fear was "if its too cheap people will buy up all the lots"

if you can only buy 1 lot\fc then each fc would buy the biggest they could get.

1 fc buying a 20 million house takes 20 million out of the game, because im pretty sure only 1 or 2 fc's will be stupid enough to throw away that kind of gil

100 fc's buying a 5 million lot takes 500 million out of the game.... nuff said!

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b-b-b-b-b-but there is only enough land to sell 10 houses! When they sell out, there will be no more houses! Ever!

(/sarcasm)

Open more damn housing instances SE. This isn't rocket science.

Gonna post a long winded rant on my behalf about my feels on the subject at hand. Sadly since it's so long it most likely will have to be like 3 separate posts but going to try to make it back to back hopefully ><; so there's nothing in between.

My original post was too long so i'll but the basics in, prices should be cheaper all around, should only be a little higher for some servers not dramaticly higher. gold seller, bots and buyers gil should not count towards a total server amount (concidering it will be taken away anyways, or should be at least) i'm not legacy but even i can tell the prices for them are insanely high. We should be thankful (or something like it) for the amount of stuff in the patch.

The best thing we can do is cancel subs, for those who are upset over this absurd barrier-of-entry to content we've been looking forward to since launch! I, for one, just cancelled my sub...was supposed to renew tomorrow on patch release day, how convenient huh?

I will no longer be throwing my hard earned money away to this idiotic dev team and I suggest everyone else that's unhappy do the same and stop flaming on these forums, especially since we get idle responses like the ones from the team here-in!

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Originally Posted by Bensmack

The best thing we can do is cancel subs, for those who are upset over this absurd barrier-of-entry to content we've been looking forward to since launch! I, for one, just cancelled my sub...was supposed to renew tomorrow on patch release day, how convenient huh?

I will no longer be throwing my hard earned money away to this idiotic dev team and I suggest everyone else that's unhappy do the same and stop flaming on these forums, especially since we get idle responses like the ones from the team here-in!

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Mad props for voting with your wallet.

Somehow pricing in-game items/housing based off of gil that RMT has generated seems like a HUGE failure. The majority of the server population doesn't purchase gil from RMT. All you are doing by pricing this was is ENCOURAGING people to RMT.

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Originally Posted by Doki

Somehow pricing in-game items/housing based off of gil that RMT has generated seems like a HUGE failure. The majority of the server population doesn't purchase gil from RMT. All you are doing by pricing this was is ENCOURAGING people to RMT.

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But Yoshi-P's crystal ball deciphered what is and is not RMT currency... even though it's still circulating in the game and not being addressed by any Special Task Force or GM... LOL

His stupid comment that is impossible to be true and my sarcasm aside; you are exactly right that RMT gil values will always pollute generic statistics of a server's wealth; as will a minority of extremely wealthy Mercs. If they weren't lazy and actually tried for fair-housing prices; they would of based the decision on the market value of gil on each server; in which there is very little difference between Legacy and the lower population servers.

I think the prices are just fine for Marboro. Knowing the patch was coming we started collecting gil for our housing as sure, we can't get the large plot of land that we wanted to but we can get the best small piece of land and work our way to getting a large one. Gives us all something to work towards in the free company. 100 mil is a lot for 1 person, but for a collective group of up to 512 people its cake.

Even if you had 50 people and each donated 2m you can get the house. If you don't have that kinda gil figure out what you can do to make it.


I do agree that legacy people got screwed though.

Please tell me how being defensive to people upset about the prices is helping the players or the game. I get you want long term goals, I get you're starved for long lasting content because the storyline was so easy. Maybe it's just me but I can see all the possibilities making the base entry content more widely available can bring. I can see people in non crafting FCs saving up the money to buy that cool piece of furniture crafted by someone else, I can see people doing Grand Company content for seals to buy GC furniture which we have to do anyway, I can see people setting a goal to save up to upgrade their base house's size down the road which we can't do at all yet, I can see people doing primals and Coil for their furniture mat drop. All those are things that the high price of the entry barrier won't allow the majority of people to do until pretty much the next patch in early March.

I get they're willing to change it, that's great, a time frame would be nice because we've been told multiple times in the past a fix is incoming but never given a set time frame. Error 3012? A fix is coming sure, it ended getting fixed two weeks after launch. Problems with people in new servers running out of gil from repair and teleport costs? Sure a fix was coming, it ended up getting fixed a month later. I get how you feel you have to say "How is complaining helping the game" while completely ignoring all the well thought and presented points that have been brought up multiple times and you really want to disregard them as "whining".

So please, please do elaborate on your plan to help the game by simply defending it and lashing out at people.

As a Legacy player, quitting 1.0 early on with no gil, 0/10 SE.

All the new players/fcs are really getting screwed here. /disappointed

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Originally Posted by kazin

If you cut all the house prices to 1/10th like this letter is asking you'd see a lot of people forming solo-FCs just to buy themselves a house. {No Thanks.}

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Would you mind explaining why exactly should that be a problem or why even should that personally bother you at all? For me (and not only as crafter) - more FC houses mean more "customers" to buy (not only crafted) housing stuff, more ways to sink the gill etc. I fail to see any negatives in that apart of the cost and maintaining of the additional instances servers which should be well than covered by player's sub anyway.

GREAT SUGGESTION FOLLOWS! (imo!)
Lets see starter houses! Something around a few hundred thousand gil or so...with a few things customizable.
About the equivalent of a van down by the river...Maybe a shack on a hill...Thief's den!
Maybe these could be located in the hamlets scattered around! Kind of like living in the suburbs.


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It's fine to have some high rank housing to work towards! I'd love to see our FC upgrade from a p.o.s. first house to a mansion at some point!

The crappy thing is...these HUGE price tags to even get started is just wrong. If anything, it encourages players to buy gil and get banned in the process. >_< Face it, this isn't the best way to get an FC to work together. SE is kind of assuming everyone in an FC is driven to build the bank....and that's just not true. Only the most hardcore FCs have most of their' members grinding like that. It's just not realistic.

Sadly my rant can't be posted, not even on my blog on lodestone. So I put it all here on tumblr.. lol have a read if you want. It's just my two cent on it.

http://arroh.tumblr.com/post/7024661...ompany-housing

I'm pretty downhearted about housing too but you really have to see it from the developers view point and not just our own. Yea it sucks and yea we looked forward too it but sadly it's just not what we were expecting. I'm pretty sure some people who were like me and all excited about housing but crushed after seeing housing prices can relate with what I said in my rant about why the devs probably have did things the way they did for the time being. Read it, think it over some, or tear it apart piece by piece. I'm not white-knighting the prices or anything, I disagree with them, I am however trying to see things from the devs point of view tho and bring that into a better perspective with the majority of us who can't afford housing prices.