Abyssea: Useful jobs and Useless jobs. Your opinions on why.

[Rambus]

I find it sad people still think this way in 2011.

What do you mean? the point is true. I clicked the quote.

What i understnad is that DDs have to hold back a lot or be super gimp to let a PLD tank witch is true.

Maybe if PLD had emp weapons it may not be true, i have no idea. The only time i see PLD in abyssea is in abyssea exp doing really low damage or this comment:

people think PLD can be useful?

I seen a seal group once be PLD, BLM,WHM, BRD.

guess how it went....

hint:

Sure, every job an be in a successful group.

Take a cookie cutter set up. Let's say you have nin blm whm blu for lowmanning a NM. If they win as is, why would adding another job make them lose? So yea, they can be successful, but the point is, remove one of the jobs in the group, replace that job w/ [insert job here], can they still be as successful? If not, they're dead weight.

[Lexin]

Okay this thread explains why I don't play anymore. Because only 2 jobs I enjoy playing and have at a decent level are PLD and DRK. My account is still active but only played the same day the servers came back online but for only an hour and before the servers I got on did my limit break got DRK to 86 and just don't feel like playing.

I agree that both jobs are just horrible unless you have the best gear (which I don't hell I don't even have a single atma). I try to have fun but other players wont accept people in there Linkshell/Parties unless you are well geared.

This game has lost it's touch it use to have back in it's early years.

[Rambus]

Okay this thread explains why I don't play anymore. Because only 2 jobs I enjoy playing and have at a decent level are PLD and DRK. My account is still active but only played the same day the servers came back online but for only an hour and before the servers I got on did my limit break got DRK to 86 and just don't feel like playing.

I agree that both jobs are just horrible unless you have the best gear (which I don't hell I don't even have a single atma). I try to have fun but other players wont accept people in there Linkshell/Parties unless you are well geared.

This game has lost it's touch it use to have back in it's early years.

it is not the people it is the game...

like my exmaple for seal farming you get 4 people, one for each seal.

PLD, BLM, WHM, BLU or brd does not cut it, I seen someoen actally try that on a seal mob and they left in failure in trying to kill the mob

MNK or THF, BLM WHM , BLU gets the job done.

hmm now thinking about it maybe I do not completely understand what you mean by lost tuch, DRK for a very long time was only useful for zergs and even back in the day was on the low end of being wanted. DRK had to resort to DRK/THF for spinning slash to have some type of purpose. I think only drg had a worse stigma.

how was it for you back in the day for DRK? did you fit in that GS requre and such?

[Lexin]

it is not the people it is the game...

like my exmaple for seal farming you get 4 people, one for each seal.

PLD, BLM, WHM, BLU or brd does not cut it, I seen someoen actally try that on a seal mob and they left in failure in trying to kill the mob

MNK or THF, BLM WHM , BLU gets the job done.

hmm now thinking about it maybe I do not completely understand what you mean by lost tuch, DRK for a very long time was only useful for zergs and even back in the day was on the low end of being wanted. DRK had to resort to DRK/THF for spinning slash to have some type of purpose. I think only drg had a worse stigma.

how was it for you back in the day for DRK? did you fit in that GS requre and such?

Getting a party with DRK was good till 60 but even then still got parties I never used a GS and my GS skill can tell you that. Once ToAU was released DRK has been on the back burner since and DRG and SAM have been on the front. Now I don't know much about Abyssea since I really have not played since it's release.

Again I only have DRK and PLD not geared and if I were to go for my Emp armor I would be forced to grind fame/quests for a slight chance of getting my seals. But the way I see it what is even the point of doing that if my jobs are well garbage in Abyssea?

Oh and it's always been the players who determine everything... Because I can't do a certain thing with my job I'm forced to sit out?

[Glamdring]

You might wanna rethink the "useless rng" eval. As groups get more done in Abyssea I'm seeing more people targeting gear drops via blue !! procs. Unless you always wait to be out of the piercing time you will need that rng to proc the ranged skills. In addition, they can do good numbers anyway, and come in handy when you want to keep the damage up on mobs you stay away from to avoid AoE. And there were always critters weak to piercing damage; they're just as weak IN Aby as out so rng can work... if you have a tank with voke and maybe a TA happy thief using conspirator and the like as an example?

Cor seems to be the most shafted job. They can put up good numbers still, but since their rolls are largely superceded by atma people THINK they are useless. Of course, if you get a group intelligent enough to use the cor (or bard) buffs so they can use Atma to boost something else they are right back in the mix. Unfortunately, Atma is chosen with personal uberness, not party efficiency in mind by most players so Cor will have to build their own parties for the most part.

Paladin... noone bothers with primative concepts like hate control anymore (don't believe me? ask a sleeper), so blood tanking is just not happening in Abyssea and good luck getting anyone to go elsewhere where it still works just fine. I love seeing dead monks too stupid to realize that they are not on a meth/roids cocktail outside Aby-as long as they aren't in my party anyway. There's like 40 threads asking for pld to be made useful again so I'll leave it at that.

Bard, VERY useful if you know what you are doing. Scherzo is godly and Mambo suddenly got useful now that people just evasion tank. Ballad not so much with every mage using refresh atmas. Carols-coupled with a Barspell-make many AoE spamming NMs almost a joke. Finale and Lullaby are both extremely potent. Double March in XP parties is very handy too, since it let's melees concentrate on attack gear (especially coupled with dancers using Haste Samba).

Dark, solid DD, just needs a decent haster. Also useful for !! procs-scythe seems to come up alot, and Dark spells seem to be something Dark can cast most of the time.

Scholar-useful, can take the place of either a blm or whm, just not AS good as either in their primary role. A decent substitute for rdm as well.

Dragoon, handy for piercing procs, wyvern breath for healing or damage, actually solo pretty well if the player has the reflexes to keep their lizard alive. Screwed once they lose it tho.

Pup-just awesome DD. Auto CAN land yellow procs, but it's a matter of luck (too bad Discernment doesn't extend to Autos). There is an issue tho' with the weakness detection where it may simply refuse to cast. The De/Activate trick is awesome tho' for keeping up the damage/healing. The player? if they are well equipped can do decent DD in their own right, but stick with a monk if you want the raw HTH numbers.

Summoner-like the rest of the pet jobs is useful for alot of NMs where you want players to stay off except when proccing !!. If you've farmed to the point of ISL chests dropping they are godly with Astral Flow burns, especially in XP parties. Good puller too.

Beast-good, but expensive. Jugs can take a beating unless you have alot of -PDT gear, and reward will get a workout. My beast at least puts out the highest DPS between me and the pet you will see from any job short of using a brew. Not good if your target is one to avoid feeding TP to, and useless for any !! proc except blue, unless you've also capped scythe (options are nice) or something else. I get good use /brd landing threnodies and my finale usually sticks, too doing NMs with a pt, but solo I /dnc to survive.

Nin, blu, war are all must-haves if you want to be ready to hit multiple !! triggers. Also useful in their own rights.

Rdm, good pt member, but only mediocre for !! procs-you need blm for the full ele spell line, whm for the full Divine spell line. CS Stun is still a viable tactic. Don't expect to be picked up for Refresh much, but you can be very useful refreshing in a pt with a pld or a dark who have better things to use their Atma slots on than refresh usually. /whm you'll get some love for the -na spells.

[Rambus]

Getting a party with DRK was good till 60 but even then still got parties I never used a GS and my GS skill can tell you that. Once ToAU was released DRK has been on the back burner since and DRG and SAM have been on the front. Now I don't know much about Abyssea since I really have not played since it's release.

Again I only have DRK and PLD not geared and if I were to go for my Emp armor I would be forced to grind fame/quests for a slight chance of getting my seals. But the way I see it what is even the point of doing that if my jobs are well garbage in Abyssea?

Oh and it's always been the players who determine everything... Because I can't do a certain thing with my job I'm forced to sit out?

SE made the abyssea this way, and sadly yes unless you have a friend that will invite you as a 5th and 2 people lot on one thing ( I ran into 5 man seal partys but it is rare) but the pt was BLM, MNK, THF, WHM , BLU.

when you have a setup like MNK, BLM, WHM, BLU able to kill something vs PLD, BLM, WHM, BLU cannot ( I was doing something with LS when I saw a PLD in seal farming) they whiped and whiped. that is not the players fault for making PLD sit out because the job cannot perform, it is the game and design. A PLD cannot hold hate, not a chance in hell unless you want a 30 min to 1 hr kill, and even then a PLD takes too much damage. When you have a MNK countering and perfect counter and can get PDT on itself, PLD cannot compete. You really need emp sword or both emp sword and emp shield to warrant the notion of “lets see if so in so with emp sword and shield can do what a MNK can”

regarding rng, you want range damage? get a BLm and use enmity douse, or SCH.

bet you any money a BLM or SCH can do more damage over time due to enmity issues.

using rng would only be for blue procing

[Zumi]

SE has never been good at balancing classes and making adjustments. Shouldn't come as a shock that stuff isn't balanced right now. If they wanted to fix Paladin tanking or tanking in general they could raise the enmity cap and give paladins more moves that generate a greater amount of enmity over a melee. And actual make def and vit do something like actual damage reduction since a paladin takes as much damage if not more then like a monk or ninja, no counter, and good evasion.

[Malamasala]

It is funny how people are always so narrow minded.

A party consists of the following.

1) The current overpowered DDs.
2) Whatever job is a must have.

The only ways you'll ever be invited to parties is if you fill one of these roles. (Being a friend is a third alternative for being invited). So it isn't that PLD is bad, it is that it isn't a must have (or the best DD).

Since people are too dumb to play a video game, you can only really solve the job bias by removing 18 of the 20 jobs and leaving a melee and a healer. It is that, or deal with it.

[Hoshi]

Is it too much to ask for SE to unnerf my job, nerf every other job in the game and then stop making adjustments to the game? Because really I think that's a reasonable request. :3

[Fiarlia]

So it isn't that PLD is bad, it is that it isn't a must have (or the best DD).

Actually no, PLD is just bad.