Availability of HMPs, Riftcinders, Riftdross

[Pups323]

I finished the 1500hmp stage in February 2015, it took me a few years, but I wasn't buying plates and only did weekly VW with my LS Static VW group, and the occasional PUG.

I don't agree with the required total being reduced from 1500 to 100 or 500, it would not be fair on people who finished 1500 plates under the old system. Especially those who did it pre 119 gear, pre trusts, pre special events etc.

The same goes for cinders and dross, I don't think the number required should be changed.

However I do think HMP/cinders/dross need fixing, either as drops from HMBC, or drops from other events. Or for the VW loot system to have a base minimum 1 hmp per kill, scaling up to to 5 minimum if you have lights. HMP bags, and cinders/dross need to have their drop rates increased too.

So I think it would be good for the drop rates to be increased, minimums applied, and for the items to drop from other events, but I don't agree with changing the total numbers required.

That's like saying you dont agree with salvage being solo because its not fair to people who got their mythics back when you needed 18 people and had no ilevel gear and had to split the alex 18 ways....your logic is faulty. Just because it was stupid back then doesn't mean it has to stay stupid now for the sake of not offending people who did it in the past.

There is 0 difference in increasing the drop rate x18 or cutting the required number by 1/18. It is all effectively the same thing. If you want to be technical alex was 50k, then was dropped to 30k, was that fair to people who had done it before?

Then the drop rate increased x18 when they added salvage 2 and made it soloable, because now you no longer needed 18 people and didnt have to share the loot.

Then it increased x24 when they made it so you could do it 1x per hour.

So they have increased the drop rate, decreased the max required, and surprisingly, everyone was happy.

[Stompa]

That's like saying you dont agree with salvage being solo because its not fair to people who got their mythics back when you needed 18 people and had no ilevel gear and had to split the alex 18 ways....your logic is faulty. Just because it was stupid back then doesn't mean it has to stay stupid now for the sake of not offending people who did it in the past.

There is 0 difference in increasing the drop rate x18 or cutting the required number by 1/18. It is all effectively the same thing. If you want to be technical alex was 50k, then was dropped to 30k, was that fair to people who had done it before?

Then the drop rate increased x18 when they added salvage 2 and made it soloable, because now you no longer needed 18 people and didnt have to share the loot.

Then it increased x24 when they made it so you could do it 1x per hour.

So they have increased the drop rate, decreased the max required, and surprisingly, everyone was happy.

No, I don't think my logic is faulty. It isn't really about 18 man or 1 man. It is about the VW random loot-swoop which is broken and has always been broken.

In my post above I offered a fair solution, 1xhmp per kill minimum, 5xhmp per kill minimum with lights. And increased rate of bags, cinders, dross. This is a fair solution, it would still make your empy way easier than my empy, but I'm happy for you that case. Because you could farm VW and get a steady rate of plates and get 1500/1500 in a fixed timeframe. I was farming 50x Qilin capped lights and getting zero plates. With my suggestion above, 50 capped lights kills would get you minimum 50x5 hmp, plus increased chances of bags. In the same number of kills that I got 0 hmp in.

So my logic is fine thanks. What isn't logical is your idea that a person should go to the AH and buy 100 hmp, which takes ten seconds and very small gil, to complete the hmp stage that other people had to go and farm 1500hmp for. That is bad logic.

I am suggesting an improved farming system, so you can put the effort into farming VW and get decent rewards, and complete 1500 in a realistic timeframe. This is more fair than just saying buy 100hmp from the AH to complete that stage.

[Pups323]

Actually your logic is wrong:

1) Your preferred solution doesn't mean its 'fair'. Mathematically, there is 0 difference between reducing the number needed by 1/18, and increasing the drop rate x18. Overall it will take exactly the same amount of time to complete. So by you preferring one method over the other is faulty logic, when there has been presidence in the past to show that SE is willing and able to do one, the other, or both.

2)Just because you killed 50 mobs with max lights and got 0 HMP doesnt mean its a 0% drop rate. You expect 3/50 fights to drop a pouch. But just because you didnt get 3 pouches in 50 fights doesnt mean its 0%. You could do 50 more and end up with 5 pouches and still be in the realm of acceptable statistics. And if each pouch contains 3~15 HMP, that means on average, every 50 kills your getting ~9 per pouch and about 27 plates per 50 kills.

3) If the increase the drop rate, to 18x its current level, you would be averaging 500 HMP per 50 kills. And would need roughly 150 kills to finish.

4) If they keep the same drop rate, but decrease the number need by ~1/18 to 100, you would need the same 150 kills to finish.

You dont think by increasing the drop rate x18 you wouldnt flood the market to the point where 1500 HMP would cost considerably less? And could be bought in seconds for little gil ?

Did you even think it through or do you just post first?

[detlef]

There is 0 difference in increasing the drop rate x18 or cutting the required number by 1/18. It is all effectively the same thing.

Your solution to scale drops as far as giving a soloer 18x the drop rate would never be acceptable. Should I team up with 1 other player? No, that halves my drop rate I'll just solo it. Guess we'll all just spam the rift to pop because everybody wants to solo. A more reasonable solution might be to scale down drops to 3-5x but not scale down any further than a PT size.

If you want to be technical alex was 50k, then was dropped to 30k, was that fair to people who had done it before?

The people who actually finished 50k were duping and a ton of people got banned.

Then the drop rate increased x18 when they added salvage 2 and made it soloable, because now you no longer needed 18 people and didnt have to share the loot.

Then it increased x24 when they made it so you could do it 1x per hour.

So they have increased the drop rate, decreased the max required, and surprisingly, everyone was happy.

Being able to do Salvage every hour doesn't increase the drop rate by 24x. And being able to solo Salvage meant not sharing drops whereas VW gave you a personal loot pool regardless of group size. So while both the Salvage improvement and your proposal add more currency into the system they do so in vastly different ways and aren't really equivalent.

Also, the demand for HMP is hardly what it was so there's no need for Devs to target a production level equivalent to when VW was in its heyday. I'm all for making it easier but you're going a bit too far and also significantly discouraging group play for the most groupiest of group play events in the game.

[Pups323]

People love to argue for grouping for content, which is great, if people still do that content, but voidwatch is 99999999.9999999999% people soloing or them being solo but bring a second account with them. I havent seen a full group of 6 do voidwatch since they allowed you to do them with trusts.

During the voidwatch event, i was trying to clear them all for the key items and people still wouldnt invite me to their party of them +5 trusts, even though i would take 0 of their loot.

[detlef]

Yeah at the current drop rate it's not really worth doing. You're swinging toward the other extreme where it's too lucrative especially for soloists.

[YosemiteYogorockBlondelle]

Well happy new year's eve and happy new year's to all!!

Now what would say about the drop rate for Pil's Tuille smithing Relics upgrade material? Would you say the drop rate for this upgrade material is way lower and way worse then the HMP's, riftdross's, RiftCinders, etc. ??

[BurnNotice]

Well happy new year's eve and happy new year's to all!!

Now what would say about the drop rate for Pil's Tuille smithing Relics upgrade material? Would you say the drop rate for this upgrade material is way lower and way worse then the HMP's, riftdross's, RiftCinders, etc. ??

Happy New Year 2016 to you and to everyone reading this post!

To answer your question, I believe the drop rate is no different from the drop of single HMPs. I can get about 4 Pil's Tuille in about 10 kills. As for HMPs, maybe 2 out of every 15 kills. Using Bismark as an example, I get up to 2 every 30 kills for riftdross or riftcinders.

In 2016, I am hoping the development team will ease up on the drop rate. The 1500 HMP and 60 Riftcinder/Riftdross system is fine imo, but like Stompa mention in an earlier post, there should be some kind of minimum drop ratio per kill for HMPs. As riftdross/riftcinders, the only realistic solution for that is to increase the drop where you are getting one, the other, or a weapon/armor every fight to keep it a bit balanced. This is based on having capped lights.

[Creelo]

Happy New Year 2016 to you and to everyone reading this post!

To answer your question, I believe the drop rate is no different from the drop of single HMPs. I can get about 4 Pil's Tuille in about 10 kills. As for HMPs, maybe 2 out of every 15 kills. Using Bismark as an example, I get up to 2 every 30 kills for riftdross or riftcinders.

In 2016, I am hoping the development team will ease up on the drop rate. The 1500 HMP and 60 Riftcinder/Riftdross system is fine imo, but like Stompa mention in an earlier post, there should be some kind of minimum drop ratio per kill for HMPs. As riftdross/riftcinders, the only realistic solution for that is to increase the drop where you are getting one, the other, or a weapon/armor every fight to keep it a bit balanced. This is based on having capped lights.

4/10 for Pil's Tuille is extremely lucky. The playerbase has generated a pretty accurate database for VW drops. Here's Pil's: http://ffxidb.com/voidwatch/127

Basically HMP is about 34% and Pil's Tuille is exactly 5%.

[BurnNotice]

4/10 for Pil's Tuille is extremely lucky. The playerbase has generated a pretty accurate database for VW drops. Here's Pil's: http://ffxidb.com/voidwatch/127

Basically HMP is about 34% and Pil's Tuille is exactly 5%.

Thank you. I see that my during that day my luck was high. I just can't seem to have that with HMPs, Riftdross/Riftcinders though. Oddly enough, I was happy to have those 4 Pil's Tuille because it allowed and motivate me to upgrade a couple of relic pieces as well as put a little gil in my pocket.