The importance of job points

[Stompa]

How many "main jobs" I have and wish to max out should be for me to decide. The devs should really keep their intentions out of it.

Well not really, they made the game and we are playing it, their intentions are part of the bundle. They have to walk a sort of trapeze to make the game appeal to most people, because not everyone thinks the same, so the Devs intentions have to encompass the whole spectrum of players. A lot of players do like challenges and grind and stuff lol.

A lot of players liked the old FFXI a lot, it was an incredibly popular and busy game back then with crowded servers. So you personally hated the old game and now you sneer at people with their "nostalgia goggles" etc. just because those people really liked the old game. You would have to explain to me why the old game had thousands of players on each server, if the game sucked back then. Today, with your easymode game that you wanted so much, we are getting like 300 ppl on our server lol. So obviously the old game you hated, was more busy and therefor more popular.

I like a lot of the updates they've made to the game, which have improved it. Level-synch and homepoint warps, mog gardens, etc. those are very good things. But that doesn't mean that the old game was horrible as you are suggesting.

It is ludicrous to suggest that all players including casual players with fairly small play-time (such as me) should be able to reach the pinnacle of ultimate achievement on all 20+ jobs, ie. capped Jobpoints, and in short time too. If everyone had capped Jobpoints on all jobs, it would no longer be meaningful, it would just be the uniform norm.

I have accepted that I will work on Jobpoints on the two jobs I play most, because I have limited game time and want to do crafting and stuff too. Jobpoints are a specialisation system to really give your favourite jobs some extra sparkle, its not like you need to have max capped Jobpoints on 20 jobs, and if you want to be so special on 20 jobs, then you should work 20x harder than somebody who just wants to make their one main job special. Nobody is stopping you capping Jobpoints on all jobs, it just means you have to grind full-time for absolutely ages, because you want to be the ultimate max power on every job in the game. I'm happy being powerful on a few jobs, and okay on the rest, as I don't play FFXI on extended playtime mode.

[PlumbGame]

Just because it's "working as intended," doesn't necessarily mean that's how it should be. The devs are FAR from infallible in both intent and execution.



How many "main jobs" I have and wish to max out should be for me to decide. The devs should really keep their intentions out of it.



I don't want the past. I never asked for the past to rear it's ugly head again. It was dead and buried and I desperately wanted it to stay that way. The game is more fun to me now than at any point in the past except maybe for Abyssea. But now I have to suffer so that SE can appease a few people who are stuck with nostalgia goggles on. I don't mind the existence of the JP system. Although I think it really should have been an extension of the merit system, which wasn't broken, and no one I know of had any problem with.

So they should also just make all your jobs lvl 99 then by your implications. They should also just give you RMEs. It shouldn't be up to the devs (lol seriously, apparently the devs should keep their intentions of what to put in the game out of it) to decide what I should or shouldn't have. If I choose to have a free mythic, it should be my choice.

Also, GG on ignoring the realistic time frames I give consistently, to support your "ludicrous" ideas of the difficulty to obtain JPs.

[Meyi]

Hmm, the speed of which some people claim to gain Job Points still baffles me, even with explanations. My LS kills monsters quickly, but even then it seems slow, and sometimes dull. And I want to help them gain their Job Points with a job that will kill faster (THF), but I also want to be selfish and progress on my favorite job (BLM). It can be a difficult decision for me sometimes and I can see the appeal that some people are claiming to make Job Points like merits, in which they can be exchanged on any job.

How would people feel about a 2:1 exchange ratio? For people who do get points on one job (like WHM) but really want the points on another job that is less beneficial to the group.

What I would like to see are some ways to get capacity points in original zones*. Especially with level sync. I have friends who want to level, and since Abyssea is pretty much nonexistent anymore, I want to help them level up, but at the same time, I don't want to gain slow merits when I can easily cap out merits in half an hour in Dho Gates. The cap points wouldn't have to be great, but it'd be nice to even get 100 a monster.

(* Edit: when I said original zones, I was thinking something like garrison for higher levels.)

[FrankReynolds]

The game was one of only a handful of MMOs back then, there were even fewer available on consoles which is what most people were playing on and the only one from the Final Fantasy series. That gave it a virtual lock for people who wanted this sort of thing for a very long time. The population began dropping drastically long before any "easy mode" stuff was added to it. I've been through 4 server merges on my various characters. The only one (that I experienced) that happened after the release of abyssea was Hades -> Cerberus and Hades was already hurting long before Abyssea came out. It's also been over ten years. That's a long time for anyone to play the same game with the same graphics regardless of how good the game is. Then there is the fact that a large portion of the populace went from being teenagers to having college / jobs / kids / wives etc that get in the way of games that require the kind of time and attention this game requires.

TLDR; a lot of the population problem probably has nothing to do with how easy the game has or hasn't gotten. SE doesn't ask why when you cancel, so there's really no way to know for sure.

So they should also just make all your jobs lvl 99 then by your implications. They should also just give you RMEs. It shouldn't be up to the devs (lol seriously, apparently the devs should keep their intentions of what to put in the game out of it) to decide what I should or shouldn't have. If I choose to have a free mythic, it should be my choice.

That's not at all what was implied. Your hyperbole and twisting of words is really getting out of control.

Also, GG on ignoring the realistic time frames I give consistently, to support your "ludicrous" ideas of the difficulty to obtain JPs.

According to your math I need to farm JP for somewhere between 130 and 375 hours during double CP campaigns to cap JP before they add more categories and expand the current ones which will probably double that.

You use a strange definition of "realistic".

[Protey]

What I would like to see are some ways to get capacity points in original zones. Especially with level sync. I have friends who want to level, and since Abyssea is pretty much nonexistent anymore, I want to help them level up, but at the same time, I don't want to gain slow merits when I can easily cap out merits in half an hour in Dho Gates. The cap points wouldn't have to be great, but it'd be nice to even get 100 a monster.

you can. here is one example: go to Gustav Tunnel. Go kill the turtles and worms that are down there. they are around level 100-102 and give CP. Grab page from book to get more exp too. can do the same thing in boyahda tree with crawlers/flies/crabs. pretty sure there are other places as well.

[Meyi]

you can. here is one example: go to Gustav Tunnel. Go kill the turtles and worms that are down there. they are around level 100-102 and give CP. Grab page from book to get more exp too. can do the same thing in boyahda tree with crawlers/flies/crabs. pretty sure there are other places as well.

Yeah, I thought about that after I hit post. That's why I edited to add I was thinking something like garrison, an instanced event where people can pop monsters and slaughter them. For zones like Qufim, Yuhtunga Jungle, etc.

[PlumbGame]

The game was one of only a handful of MMOs back then, there were even fewer available on consoles which is what most people were playing on and the only one from the Final Fantasy series. That gave it a virtual lock for people who wanted this sort of thing for a very long time. The population began dropping drastically long before any "easy mode" stuff was added to it. I've been through 4 server merges on my various characters. The only one (that I experienced) that happened after the release of abyssea was Hades -> Cerberus and Hades was already hurting long before Abyssea came out. It's also been over ten years. That's a long time for anyone to play the same game with the same graphics regardless of how good the game is. Then there is the fact that a large portion of the populace went from being teenagers to having college / jobs / kids / wives etc that get in the way of games that require the kind of time and attention this game requires.

TLDR; a lot of the population problem probably has nothing to do with how easy the game has or hasn't gotten. SE doesn't ask why when you cancel, so there's really no way to know for sure.



That's not at all what was implied. Your hyperbole and twisting of words is really getting out of control.



According to your math I need to farm JP for somewhere between 130 and 375 hours during double CP campaigns to cap JP before they add more categories and expand the current ones which will probably double that.

You use a strange definition of "realistic".

/comfort

10chars

[Olor]

As for people saying "oh well it used to be like this..."

I quit when it was final grindy XI... and came back when the game became fun. The fact that exping used to take a long time or w/e is completely irrelevant to this conversation, which is about a game that has evolved and has a lot of players who specifically returned when the game got rid of that soul sucking nonsense.

Frankly if you love grinding that much, level a new job without trusts or exp rings or books etc.

[detlef]

A lot of people accepted FFXI for what it was back in the day because MMOs were just like that. When you signed on to play, you knew that was what you were going to get. People have different expectations now, and there are many other options if FFXI can't provide what they are looking for.

People are arguing two extremes right now and it's just silly. No, JP aren't THAT easy to get right now, but you can make real progress if you actually set out to do it seriously. Killing aquans at Biv #2 in Marjami is not doing it seriously. Even solo or in a PT or 2 or something, you should be able to get a couple JP in an hour. As I stated earlier in the thread, when you farm CP you don't just get CP. You get CP, merit, sparks, and accolades. Going out to farm will help you in many ways besides just CP.

With that said, people aren't wrong when they say the process could be easier. I agree with this as well. SE really needs to provide more camps with more reasonable CP rates more of the time (or all the time). This will become more necessary as gifts become more important and more JP categories are introduced.

Also, please don't fill the Gates zones with Dullahans, Craklaws, and Efts. That's just insulting. Nobody wants to fight that crap ever. And the argument that people want things handed to them is stupid and lazy, please come up with something better.

[Olor]

I pretty much agree with everything you said there detlef, even though I know people would probably consider me on one side of that extreme. Really though, I just don't think mob grinding is fun. It's not 2004 anymore. Game devs can do better than that. This is some lazy content.