I think I'm finished; a new player's final thoughts

[Demonjustin]

Are you responding to me? I don't know what we're talking about anymore.

Sorry, I was replying to what Lithera said.

[Obysuca]

Ahh yes true they were. Though I haven't seen one for XIV. But the whole don't neglect your RL wasn't started about XIV but XI. Though seriously you think the same parent company will say don't forget your RL for one of its mmos but not the other two? Would set them up for a lawsuit if they didn't take the same stance.

Returning from XIV back to XI, it's pretty easy to see why they didn't bother putting that message into XIV. You can literally finish all of the week's content in 1 day and have nothing to do the rest of the week so there'd be no point in people staying on for hours and days at a time like we used to on XI.

Semi-off topic but SE made the mistake on XIV of pulling the WoW crap, instead of pulling great ideas from XI, you know, the mmo of theirs that's lasted for over a decade, while all mmos that do the WoW route which they choose for XIV end up dying in a year or so lol Which is another reason they probably didn't add that message when you log on, there's nothing to keep people actually playing, every update XIV's had so far (yeah I know, not much but still) is the same crap you already do for the same gear, just different scenery.

[Lithera]

They had it I guess back in. 1.0 but haven't put it back on. Also I love people complaining about lack of stuff in XIV and thus why they have came back to XI. Right now and even back in 1.23 XIV is what XI was before RoZ was added. Not that how things are progressing in XIV are needed to be hashed out on another games forum.

[Elexia]

Brain dead questing? That'd be FOV, GOV, and ROE.

And FFXIV. Let's be honest. The ironic thing is you even mentioned the systems that are basically what a majority of FFXIV's quests are without the optional dialog. I'm pretty sure fetching laundry then slaying moles definitely gives you the story of the world and why the world had an enhanced 'healing' after Bahamut wrecked it.

Mhm.

XI's devs are not even trying anymore with the quests that actually are worth doing.

Neither are XIV's devs, most quests are copy pasted with terms swapped around. RoE though? Yeah, those I actually don't mind but then again I'm biased since XIV is pretty much x MMO that's been released 100x between 2005-2014, especially on the asian market.

People that complain about lack of stuff to do in XIV is because they artificially extend content you'd be done with in a few hours if they didn't introduce lockouts.

[Camiie]

Do we really expect every quest from every lowly NPC to contain an epic story with a world shattering threat at the end? If I help Grandma make her special snake toenail soup, should I expect the Ultimate Lord of Nightmares to come swooping in to take it? That'd be more than a little absurd, and cheapen the experience a lot more than some perfunctory dialogue.

[Afania]

Do we really expect every quest from every lowly NPC to contain an epic story with a world shattering threat at the end? If I help Grandma make her special snake toenail soup, should I expect the Ultimate Lord of Nightmares to come swooping in to take it? That'd be more than a little absurd, and cheapen the experience a lot more than some perfunctory dialogue.

No, I don't expect every quest from every lowly NPC to be super epic, but I expect something little more than "hey, I need help with delivering a letter, help me do it please!". I expect quests that's related to the world, the lore, and the way every NPC lives....something that's more than delivering a letter. If they want me to help delivering a letter, at least tell me why they need my help, maybe there's a big giant dragon lurking on the way that often attack the travellers or something.

SE didn't put their heart into writing side quests, instead they put all their resource into animation and boss mechanics. That's just not very acceptable IMO, since I value role playing element more than shiny animation and boss mechanics.

I mean, SWTOR and TESO had better quests, even though it's fundamentally the same "kill X and get Y", the dev put a little bit more effort than ARR in the questing aspect. If SWTOR and TESO can do it, why can't ARR?

Oh and btw, FoV or RoE is more acceptable than brain dead questing in ARR. To me FoV and RoE is a game system, FFXI has other side quests that's real side quests and that can tell us about the lore and the way NPC lives, ARR quests is part of the story, and most of them failed.

[Afania]

They had it I guess back in. 1.0 but haven't put it back on. Also I love people complaining about lack of stuff in XIV and thus why they have came back to XI. Right now and even back in 1.23 XIV is what XI was before RoZ was added. Not that how things are progressing in XIV are needed to be hashed out on another games forum.

Except XIV's lack of content isn't because it's new, but because it lacks replay value. Comparing with FFXI is pointless, ARR is competing against other recent AAA MMO such as SWTOR, GW2 and soon TESO. It's slightly behind in terms of replay value, sadly.(GW2 doesn't have much staying power either, but at least it has better PVP that made players occassionally go back and PVP)

Returning from XIV back to XI, it's pretty easy to see why they didn't bother putting that message into XIV. You can literally finish all of the week's content in 1 day and have nothing to do the rest of the week so there'd be no point in people staying on for hours and days at a time like we used to on XI.

And that's not a good design for MMO. MMO is supposed to keep players play for months and years, not letting players finish the game in less than 3 months and quit.

If someone want to play 12hr a day because they can't finish a MMO, it's not MMO's fault, it's player's fault. It doesn't justify short lived content.

[Elexia]

Do we really expect every quest from every lowly NPC to contain an epic story with a world shattering threat at the end? If I help Grandma make her special snake toenail soup, should I expect the Ultimate Lord of Nightmares to come swooping in to take it? That'd be more than a little absurd, and cheapen the experience a lot more than some perfunctory dialogue.

As said, you should expect a bit more, especially when SE has told us themselves each quest should give you lore and history on the events post Dalamud, so we should expect a bit more than telling me to give your sentries TEA...and PRETZELS...and fetching laundry....and killing 5 of x....and delivering letters....

No I don't expect there to be a Dynamis Lord type fight for every quest, but I do expect there to be a fair bit more relevance to the actual game's story. Even side quest is single player FF games was relevant to the world or main storyline in some fashion, generic MMORPGs tend to forget to do that. What cheapened the experience was going from relevant quest > filler x 80 > relevant > filler x 80 > FINALLY finishing. This is why RoE is "done right" because it's clear cut to the point that it's there as a mean of progression and not trying to disguise it by shoddy story you can skip through and feel no regret in doing so.

[Camiie]

I can speak more for WoW than for XIV, but if you really pay attention many quests DO tie in at least superficially to the main story. Some of them do so quite directly. And then many are completely out of left field and unrelated to anything. The problem is many players don't pay attention. They just click enter. The storyline is there even if it's not shown in an elaborate cutscene. I guess they need it crammed forcibly down their throats, but then they'll complain about that too.

[Elexia]

I can speak more for WoW than for XIV, but if you really pay attention many quests DO tie in at least superficially to the main story. Some of them do so quite directly. And then many are completely out of left field and unrelated to anything. The problem is many players don't pay attention. .

I've paid attention as I always pay attention to details which is why I still see XI doing much, much more in terms of design than XIV is doing. ARR may be prettier and "new" but it still has a long way to go before it reaches that point where it pays attention to the 'little things' that made XI's world design pretty awesome. Quite a lot of them are unrelated to anything as the whole purpose is to level you, give you money and sometimes a piece of gear or two. It is true that:

They just click enter.

Because even Square did when they showed off the system.

The storyline is there even if it's not shown in an elaborate cutscene.

Same with many of FFXI's quests, at best you can get 'automated' scene or two and not a full blown CS, yet most quests were actually related to something rather than pointless fetch..hell even a snippet of dialog went a long way to make it relevant. It's more like XIV tries a bit 'too hard' but if you've played as many of the 'generic MMORPGs' as I have, ARR really did fall into the 'progression' trap and they lost their way and you can really see it by quest design and can point out exactly when the quests went from relevant to "We needed more or the player would be stuck in levels."

I guess they need it crammed forcibly down their throats

Funnily enough, it would then be a FF game. This is why RoE is pretty much the best quest system, it's pretty obvious in its purpose and it doesn't beat around the bush, want story and lore? Do quests from NPCs...want to progress? RoE is there for ya. It even has the same exact type of quests you're offered in XIV - go collect stuff, go slaughter x of y and so on. Hell I even record every single quest and cutscene from XIV 1.x > ARR so I can have my own personal archive and keep up with the story and mythos and quite frankly, even being reunited by a 1.0 character felt thrown in somehow.