Can we do away with low spawn chance placeheld NM's?

[vienne]

i've just finished the nm path for h2h myself (tumbling truffle, helldiver, orctrap) and although yes there are more pleasant things to do, its bearable if you combine it with something else (i ironed, cleaned a bit, equal boring stuff) i did find this less frustrating then some of the other trials out there (kill x mobs during x weather or even kill 300 bugards kind of trial) and in the end you're trying to get one of the better weapons out there, its normal you invest time in it.

[NDSI]

Like other NM's trial NM's should be adjusted to a fixed spawn time, like a sure pop after a max of 2 hours, I spend 4+ hours on various NM's to pop and having that a few times in a fow is no fun, sure you can do something else but that is something you do in the time you have killed the NM, and then you return for the next round as PH are 5 min respawn there is not much one can do in a 5 min downtime, not to mention when you are killing for hours, you walk away for a few min to eat, go to the bathroom, or w/e, a random person comes up, kills one PH, the NM pops and you are screwed out of hours that you already had spend in killing.

So yeah... either:
1. have a solid max respawn on the NM so that it spawn garantee,
2. have items introduced to spawn a NM, maybe have it being sold by the magian moogle for 100k each, and/or farmable at the spawn location.

[Umichi]

I read your first post ignored the rest I just want to ask you why you find it necessary to find a nm that you will only need to farm in the short term considering your level of skill need a shorter timed spawn especially since you seem to have a somewhat "accurate" time frame down for how long it takes for an nm to spawn? these aren't catereed exactly to magian trials... SE themselves said they were going to use less used ph nms for trials? the reason? who know's but they were made for the items they drop not for your magian trial... well kinda... don't like it gtfo.... everyone bitches about how tough mythic is and how tough relic is (and despite the fact that it only really requires gil(a lot of it) to build it.... it does take time.) but they still don't understand that these weapons are powerful and desired for a reason.... why does empy weapon have to be any different? your following the system it was built into to get what you desire.

[nyheen]

relic quest atm is fine the way it is. it not as bad now. mythic quest could get a small update but overall is fine. emp at the VNM part + 50/50 item is fine also but the part iam sure most complaining about is the long camping NM that can take up to 10 hours or even more if unlucky and on top of that we got to deal with the placeholders. the abyssea NMs are done right with the time pop. it 2013 we want change! lol throw away that placeholder system! even if it was 1 hour time pop NM could work with the trials o.o

[SNK]

Bugbear Strongman. Longest most suffering pop I ever did for a trial mob. Got the 1st pop pretty quickly. The 2nd one took 23 hours to spawn again. :|

[Horadrim]

beginning to wonder if the OP was around for the old Empy hairpin hunts....or LL...Argus...<insert absurd Random Number Generator Abuse Story>. Plenty of precedence for how the RNG can flat out screw you over.

I've been playing FFXI since 2003. I used greatly enjoy camping mobs and competing to camp them -- there was work and fun in it and often, unless you were camping something below your level, a bit of a challenge.

Dont' get me wrong, I can sympathize with getting impatient on those trials, and a change would be welcomed by pretty much everyone at this point and likely not receive much if any objection if they announced a change (I've made a total of 35 weapons so far myself). But, seriously, it's not like it's something new and not already documented how the lottery system can work against you. A 1 hour window for PH has never translated into you getting the NM in 2 hours. Look at the VE page...it still says 1-8 hour window. Probably a lot of NM's still showing things like that, because that's how they work--in x minutes/hours/days, PH shows up and offers you a chance to roll the dice to see if the NM will respawn. And yes...I put days because some would take a day or longer to repop.

I'm not really impatient. I can find plenty of things to do over the course of 1-2 hours of waiting -- I just think the system is broken and weighed heavily towards wasting your time to give the illusion of work and effort. Its a lazy joke of an objective designed just to keep you playing -- and it sucks.

Random number generation with low odds isn't really something to be defended. As I've expressed -- I understand how it works and that its a chance based system. I don't mind the waiting, I don't mind the chance, I just think its stupid to have dice roll be so unlikely to yield a victory that it multiplies the time.

I knew as soon as I saw the names of old, low level mobs back when the trials first came out what the quests would entail -- my point is that its asinine. It's literally just a time sink scheme they used to make this feel like it takes more effort than it does, and I think its time they tighten up the spawn windows on the mobs. I don't see why that's such a bad suggestion/idea? Why should it take 1-8 hours just for you to have a chance to one shot something that couldn't kill if you AFK'd for the next 6 months?

Not trying to troll or be an @$$, but even if you're in the new generation that didn't go through the camping hell that once was FFXI, there's enough info out there to clue you in on what you were up against when you decided to make the weapon. Not like it isn't laid out on the sites where you can look up all the trial and mob info....that is, if one bothers to research at all these days.

No, you're doing what most people do when someone brings up a nonsensical design flaw in this game: Talk about how much worse it was and how "at least you new school kids don't have to do it the old way." It's the same thing when I talk to other PUPs about problems I have with the job, my favorite job -- apparently taking grievance with legitimate problems in the design means I couldn't possibly have had jobs at level 75 before Abyssea or have tried camping before it was "cool." FYI, I've been playing this game for nearly 10 years and I've had my fair share of all-night camping and 2-5 day ToD tracking binges -- the point is that when we did that stuff there was an actual, immediate chance of reward from the action and, more often or not, a real challenge to be had. At least with Tiamat, for example, you were gearing up for a major challenge -- not just standing around so you could scratch your balls and press enter before doing it all over again. Standing around for hours waiting to 1 shot a level 12 notorious monster has no value -- its just a stupid time sink method SE used to forgo having to come up with a real, viable challenge to start Magian weapons off.

They were so caught up in trying to avoid making it another Relic currency farm fest or Mythic "Do All The Things!!" fun-run that they gave up and tossed a bunch of old, otherwise useless mobs into a list. The problem was, these NM's were quirky and cool at one point, now they are just a waste of time. Like I said, it already takes more than 16 hours to complete the first few trials even if the spawn rate for the NM's isn't incredibly low. I don't even want it to be 100%, I just don't see the point of me having to bust out games of League of Legends or play Chrono Trigger on my PS Vita while waiting in the obscure spawn location of a random for 8+ hours just to earn the right to do it again on the next trial -- 5 times in a row. None of us pay for this game to sit around in completely empty zones twiddling our thumbs for days at a time.

Just be glad you didn't have to compete with half a zone of people after your same PH.....

There's nothing to be glad about. Even if there was competition on these things -- it wouldn't be competition. It would be us standing around waiting for someone to kill the mob, because we'd all get credit anyway.

[Horadrim]

I read your first post ignored the rest I just want to ask you why you find it necessary to find a nm that you will only need to farm in the short term considering your level of skill need a shorter timed spawn especially since you seem to have a somewhat "accurate" time frame down for how long it takes for an nm to spawn? these aren't catereed exactly to magian trials... SE themselves said they were going to use less used ph nms for trials? the reason? who know's but they were made for the items they drop not for your magian trial... well kinda... don't like it gtfo.... everyone bitches about how tough mythic is and how tough relic is (and despite the fact that it only really requires gil(a lot of it) to build it.... it does take time.) but they still don't understand that these weapons are powerful and desired for a reason.... why does empy weapon have to be any different? your following the system it was built into to get what you desire.

They used obscure NM's to get people to visit zones that no one goes into anymore -- it was to spread people out, that's pretty obvious.

Relic Currency Farming and Mythic Weapon quests are great. You have real goals, you can exert actual, measurable effort and get real rewards and progress.

If I made myself a list of all of the objectives I needed to complete for Mythic, I promise you that playing for 4 hours a day I could check at least 2-5 things off the list. Easily. Assault Missions, ToAU quests, Einherjar, Nyzul Isle, Salvage, ZNMs -- Mythic weapons are anything but difficult, for their power and utility they are actually some of the easiest things to get. The problem people have with it is that it takes effort and work. That's what I want: Work. An actual thing to do, not a glorified fetch quest with an arbitrarily long wait attached to it just to make you FEEL like you're doing something. They could knock the first 5 trials off of the list for my H2H empy and it would still take me weeks to a month to finish the afterglow -- just like it would if I decided today to build a static for my Mythic.

That same four hours for Trial 1~5 of Empy? Standing around with a miniscule chance of even finishing what would, at least, take close to 2-3 hours if the spawn timers were tightened anyway.

Tell me I have to get 18 people together to fight an HNM 150 times? Awesome, let's get this shit done -- I can map out how long it'll take me to progress and finish, and I'll enjoy making the effort. Tell me I have to stand around being subject to the thralls of a random number generator wearing a trollface mask? No thanks.

I don't mind working for the things I want. As a matter of fact, the whole point of this is that I WANT to WORK for something, not be told I'm going to be spending the next X number of days either staring at my screen for hours or having to periodically run back to obscure old spawn points hoping the get a pop. I'll probably end up working on my seals/+2 items between pops, but having to waste time with traveling doesn't make it any more like actual "work" -- it just adds to the novelty of the "We're too lazy to come up with a real task for you." busy work.

[RAIST]

Then you should understand the problem with your complaint....it just like all the other whining out there because people basically think it's unfair that some people go 1/1 or 2/2 on a pop or drop, while some go 1/25. That's how the RNG works....a failed result is not removed the set like playing blackjack, so your probability resets everytime you try (in otherwords, you get a new deck with every hand vs dealing repeatedly from the same deck). The percentage for success could actually already be pretty high, it's just that some people basically get unlucky with the fail rate while others are luckier with it.

Sorry, but the QQ'ing over things that have existed for nigh on a decade in this game from players who obviously should know better (either from in-game experience, or seeing how SE does not respond to the complaints) just makes my pimp-hand twitch sometimes. I just happened to be the schmuck who was first to post what I'm sure a lot of people are already thinking.

[Caketime]

I have to disagree with the above deck of cards analogy. If anything the deck used is full of "Sorry, try again!" and "F U forever!" where the rate of success is determined by how often the player manages to draw the Joker card, which features a photo of Tanaka in his underpants eating egg salad.

[Tsukino_Kaji]

Trial 68: O ~1hr respawn~ O ~1hr respawn~ O (travel time)
Trial 69: O ~1hr respawn~ O ~1hr respawn~ O (travel time)
Trial 70: O ~1hr respawn~ O ~1hr respawn~ O (travel time)

Trial 71: O ~1hr respawn~ O ~1hr respawn~ O ~1hr respawn~ O (travel time)
Trial 72: O ~1.5 hr respawn ~ O ~1.5 hr respawn~ O ~1.5 hr respawn~ O (travel time)
Trial 73: O ~1hr respawn ~ O ~1hr respawn~ O ~1hr respawn~ O (travel time)

Try something that requires 200 slime kills. It's a 13+ hour trial simply due to the respawn times of the regular mobs.