Is anyone particularly happy with the new gear from New Salvage?

[Jaall]

I'm sure you'll be able to find 3 more people assuming you are one who wants to do salvage. It's really not that hard. And everyone seems to be saying "why choose salvage rewards over NNI" so I can only assume they use full time phorcys/Thaumus.

[saevel]

So yes, I think that the rewards are fine for the event that they made. I wish they had made a more difficult event that was true to the original Salvage, but they didn't.

My only answer to this is NO NO F*CKING HELL NO.

Original Salvage f*cked over most of the server and was an incredibly exclusive event. Obfuscation of event mechanics is known as fake difficulty and is considered bad game design. The stupidly low drop rates that required players to play EVERY SINGLE DAY for a year is fake balance which is part of fake longevity. The boss's were not that hard, the event was not that hard, the only "difficulty / challenge" came in the form of insane randomness and hiding the game mechanics. Once the mechanics were known it become a grind fest of farming the exact same random NM's over and over again hoping for your rare drop.

Original salvage SUCKED and sucked hard. It only served to separate the servers into two categories, those without jobs, social relationships and real life goals vs those with jobs, social relationships and real life goals. The former felt they were somehow *special* because they gave up their social lives, career advancements and goals for a video game. It was the text book definition of bad content and I hope that we NEVER EVER EVER see another event like that again. I hope everyone wanting another "Original Salvage" has their character nuked into oblivion, that or has children and realizes how utterly stupid their request was.

Regardless whether or not it's true to the original Salvage, this is still one of the most intricate and rewarding events SE has released in a long time and I enjoy doing it.

This I can agree with. The event is accessible to everyone, the mechanics are rather straightforward and not overly cryptic. NM pop conditions weren't that hard to figure out. Most importantly, even if the group wipes to the HQ or fails to pop the NQ you still have some progress on getting the gear via plan farming. The nature of the plans lends itself to rotating zones amongst group members so that everyone gets something and works together.

Now does that mean some asshats are going to tri-box the zones? Of course it does, there are people in every game who will seek to maximize their personal gear acquisition. The developers should not let the incredible minority ruin the event for the majority. For every asshat I see trying to tri-box the zones I see four or more groups going in and doing it as a team.

[Jaall]

Exactly Saeval! There are some very nice rewards from salvage II and they really don't take that much to get. Ok, relative to NNI which can only take a day, salvage takes a while but it's really nowhere near as long as it used to take and still requires no sacrifice to real life. Whereas in Salvage I... well that's already been explained. Also NNI is very luck based and less strategy based, I still haven't been successful in my runs because I don't have DRK WAR or SCH lvled and i refuse to lvl them just for that event so I don't get many chances at it. Salvage will guarantee you something every single run. If you have a group that is fair and full of team players then you will split the drops evenly (1 type of plan to 1 person, the other type to another, and split 45's between the last 2. If not then you can always make your own shout run and lock the plans/45 you need.

Salvage is now much more accessible for everyone even if half the population doesn't want anything from it and the rewards are very good, the only reason people don't think they're good is because the time it takes to get 1 piece is longer than NNI. But this is an invalid argument because think about how long NNI has been out, and the nerfs it's had because it was too difficult. If we think about how long it took to get 1 nyzul piece when it was first released it was a lot longer than what salvage is now, but because everybody figured out that you can effectively zerg it, the time to obtain the gear was drastically reduced. So, what im saying is - Salvage gear does take a couple of weeks to get which does put people off, but relative to Salvage I and NNI in the first few weeks of release, it's actually not that bad. And relative to the amount of people required for Salvage I and the difficulty level there, it's very easy and fast to find the amount of people needed and also gives an even distribution of drops. If you are missing out on drops then either you're taking too many people, aren't figuring out the right routes or simply aren't good enough to get to the HQ boss (Which isn't that hard). Overall, as I've mentioned before, Salvage II rewards are nice for the difficulty level. Also they look amazing!

[saevel]

The time it would take to get one floor 100 piece from original NNI (post floor 80/100 select update) is much longer then get from salvage, assuming your doing it "legit". The event played as designed, with no magic from the land of azure undergarments, has a stupidly low chance of ever seeing floor 100. The sheer number of "f*ck yous" that the RNG can throw at you are what cause's the issue. The event was obviously never designed for the player to actually see floor 100, as evidenced in the original release having people jump PAST floor 100 entirely. You were supposed to do 4~5 runs per week (usually on weekend or scheduled time with your group) and see floor 100 every four to six months. Obviously the people from the land of the azure undergarments are not going to wait four to six months per item and devised various secret ninja techniques that when combined with a very strict strategy resulted in vastly enhanced win conditions. It was a "cheat to win" event which again only served to separate the game population into "have" and "have nots" with the former being the ones who had access to / willing to use those secret ninja techniques.

[Camiie]

It makes me wonder... Did they design this event with cheaters in mind or did the devs not learn anything from the past 10 years? If they make events built on highly limiting systems, players will cheat to win. They will bot timed spawns, buy gil for rare/expensive items, walk through walls, flee hack, bot fishing, etc. Doesn't that sort of negate keeping gear rare and available for only the best players, or is player skill measured solely by how much one is willing to cheat to get results?

[Zagen]

The time it would take to get one floor 100 piece from original NNI (post floor 80/100 select update) is much longer then get from salvage, assuming your doing it "legit". The event played as designed, with no magic from the land of azure undergarments, has a stupidly low chance of ever seeing floor 100. The sheer number of "f*ck yous" that the RNG can throw at you are what cause's the issue. The event was obviously never designed for the player to actually see floor 100, as evidenced in the original release having people jump PAST floor 100 entirely. You were supposed to do 4~5 runs per week (usually on weekend or scheduled time with your group) and see floor 100 every four to six months. Obviously the people from the land of the azure undergarments are not going to wait four to six months per item and devised various secret ninja techniques that when combined with a very strict strategy resulted in vastly enhanced win conditions. It was a "cheat to win" event which again only served to separate the game population into "have" and "have nots" with the former being the ones who had access to / willing to use those secret ninja techniques.

Luck + crappy players = never gonna see 100s in the current NNI. The same would apply with Salavage and any other event except maybe Abyssea due to the ease or VW due to the odds of having 18 crappy players.

When NNI first came out I agree it seemed designed for hacks but as it stands now it's realistically doable even without extra items such as Powder Boots, or even Oils/Powders.

Salvage released 2 items I'm interested in getting... NNI on the other hand had 9 I really wanted and 3 more that would be nice to have when NNI was released. So 12/15 I was interested in vs. the 2/30 from salvage...

At this point it's seems people are happy with the minimal upgrades from Salvage 2, I wasn't because most of it doesn't beat VW, Abyssea or NNI.

[detlef]

There were times when Nyzul was a cheater's paradise. That time is not now however. Right now, any group can hit 100 completely legit. And if you aren't 15/15, you should definitely drop what you're doing and get in there right now.

In terms of reward/effort, Nyzul is presently second only to Abyssea.

[Jaall]

Just gonna add in, there is very little luck needed in salvage II, the only thing luck needed for is some 45 drops but they're no where near rare in comparison to VW. And in regards to it not being as good as Abyssea/VW, it depends what you use alongside it as to whether it is better or not. You have a lot more options with the new pieces and some can produce amazing sets, which exceed all Abyssea and VW standards and make NNI sets shine even more.

[Yenecol]

You're a fan of salvage REWARDS, not salvage.

You don't know me and you are clueless. I do salvage every day because I love it and I keep trying to figure out where I can best use salvage gear. Do not pretend to understand me because you do NOT. I want gear to be better so it is easier to find people to do this with me.

[Yenecol]

You're obtuse.

Without rewards, for most players there is no point in doing an event that another player happens to find fun, since salvage can't be soloed without there being rewards to entice a larger player base the odds of being able to do salvage for those who find it fun are slim to none.

Zagen, you get it too. I am going to do the equivalent of blacklist Jaall and just not read anything she posts. From what I have read already, talking to her is as fruitful as talking to a brick wall.