Interim Report – Sorry to keep you all waiting!

[Demon6324236]

I determined a while back that thats basically the case with everyone on the same side of this as Eye.

[Ceinwyn]

Probably but endgame in FFXI is just too time consuming and not even that exciting.
I liked FFXI back in the days where u was forced to grind and visit areas like boyada tree to work on ure character progress.
If i want endgame i go to wow, lots of better mechanics, honestly.

[Raksha]

Probably but endgame in FFXI is just too time consuming and not even that exciting.

I liked FFXI back in the days where u was forced to grind and visit areas like boyada tree to work on ure character progress.

10char....

[SpankWustler]

Probably but endgame in FFXI is just too time consuming and not even that exciting.
I liked FFXI back in the days where u was forced to grind and visit areas like boyada tree to work on ure character progress.
If i want endgame i go to wow, lots of better mechanics, honestly.

[Carth]

And funnily enough, you go on to add that it's not only these strict requirements that inhibit progression, but also the community of mongoloids you're forced to play with.

If your only argument is "Mommy, Carth is being a bully! ;-;" , I'm just wasting my time.

Edit: Why did you ever play this game again, either of you? I'm seriously at a loss for understanding.

Because EXP is not 100% of this game.

[Eyeballed]

If your only argument is "Mommy, Carth is being a bully! ;-;" , I'm just wasting my time.


Because EXP is not 100% of this game.

That's not my only argument, and if you'd bothered to read and soak in all that I've said in this thread you'd know that my issue is not 100% EXP, nor endgame, nor anything in between. It's finding the reason MMO's on the whole suck so badly when, at one time, they were good with all the things both you and I liked within. Everyone concedes the genre is changing and "moving on", and I'd really like to see how you can prove this evolution has done any service to these games. I'm honestly astounded nobody has fallen back on the everlasting "If you don't like this game then go play something else!" quip.

And in case you missed it, endgame is not 100% of a game either. And don't give me that horseshit claim that it's still around. It is in its most superficial sense, and that's being generous.

[Arcon]

Till Geomancer/Rune Fencer show up, anyway. But hey, you're hardcore. Grats on the Maat's Cap++ level of dedication. You're effectively done with the game at this point until a new expansion shows up. Everything's old hat to you, you've likely run CoP missions till your eyes bled, fought Alexander enough times that you have your name on the list, could draw Lilith from memory with your off hand, and the words "Shadow Lord" on your screen trigger migraines and the only thing of interest to you at this point is whatever new comes along in the next expansion plus the next iteration of L99 gear.

In other words, you're done with 99% of the content. Now, tell me why it's a good thing that the current system renders a similar amount of the game meaningless to new players, and why new players would even come into a game like that- and in fact, how the game sustains itself without them.

First of all, I never said any of that applied to me, and it doesn't. If I didn't have anything left to experience in this game, I'd quit. Second, every item you mentioned except for EXP I love and I would do again, and I help everyone out with. You are completely off base listing all of that, because none of it I have a problem with, and none of it I want to keep from others (again, EXP being the sole exception).

And even back when I never did any of it at all, I still hated EXP. I already said a few posts ago, there is only one thing I dislike about EXP. I can deal with grinds. I can deal with time sinks. I can deal with slow (or even no) rewards. The only thing I cannot deal with is boredom, and that's what defines EXP to me. You're trying to make it out to be a lot more than it is.

Edit: Why did you ever play this game again, either of you? I'm seriously at a loss for understanding.

I'm not surprised, you don't seem to understand much. If you read and understood any of what we said you wouldn't even be asking that, because we enjoyed the game for the same reasons we still enjoy it now, namely endgame.

You know what, I hate that term. Because it invariably makes people with an IQ lower than their shoe size think that the game is somehow at its end once it gets there, and sadly, as any internet forum, this place abounds with those people. That kind of reasoning is complete bullshit. The game does not end at endgame. Endgame simply refers to the end of the leveling system. The game branches out in a myriad of directions once there. It has tons of events, not just for hardcore players but also for very casual players. Everyone can find some fun in endgame except for the people who think the game only consists of EXP, and more importantly, who think that the game should only consist of EXP. Because those are the people who refuse to be proven wrong and go on and on against the rest of the world thinking they have it all figured out.

And those people I ask: Why are you still playing? You are the one discontent with everything the game is about right now. You are the one bitching at every turn, complaining about the state of the game, the state of all MMOGs, the community, the developers, and every aspect related to FFXI I can think of. I honestly see no reason for why you would still be playing.

Probably but endgame in FFXI is just too time consuming and not even that exciting.

You are aware that you are defending old EXP, right? Because you saying that is absurd in every conceivable way.

That's not my only argument, and if you'd bothered to read and soak in all that I've said in this thread you'd know that my issue is not 100% EXP, nor endgame, nor anything in between. It's finding the reason MMO's on the whole suck so badly when, at one time, they were good with all the things both you and I liked within.

If MMOGs suck so badly, why are they one of the most profitable and still heavily growing markets in the entire world, whereas ten years ago they were almost unknown, during a time you proclaimed everything was awesome in?

And in case you missed it, endgame is not 100% of a game either.

Aside from crafting, it very much is.

[FrankReynolds]

they were good with all the things both you and I liked within.

The thing is... Back then I had to do the things that you liked, but you did not have to do the things that I like. I am no longer forced to do things your way and it saddens you because it turns out that most of the people who were doing the things you like, didn't actually like them. They were just a means to an end.


I don't want to go back to doing mid-level material on my maxed out character and even if I had to start over for some terrible reason, I would not want more mid-level crap placed in my path back to where I am now. I feel like a large portion of the population would agree with that statement for a large variety of reasons.

You're like one of those old hippies who became a cut throat yuppie lawyer and then had a midlife crisis and is now trying to recapture the spirit of wood stock by forcing all his friends to do LSD. You just can't recreate the place and time that once existed and you would do better for yourself if you left it the fond memory it is instead of ruining the present trying to bring it back.

[Demon6324236]

Honestly not everything is Endgame at 99 either, Abyssea isn't endgame, leveling in Abyssea, and parties such as worms or Dom Ops are what I would say are earlyish, seals, as well as all of the old 75 content are kinda midgame now, and VW/Prov/NeoLimbus/NeoSalvage/Legion/NeoOdin are all basically Endgame. Not all 99 content is endgame, Abyssea is proof of that.

[Eyeballed]

I'm not surprised, you don't seem to understand much.

Trust me, the feeling's mutual. And the whole point in having a debate/conversation is to gain understanding and unfortunately all I've gathered is exactly what you've said in that the grind is boring and therefore unnecessary. I'm sorry, "It's boring and I hate it because it's boring." will never be a good reason to not do anything.

If MMOGs suck so badly, why are they one of the most profitable and still heavily growing markets in the entire world, whereas ten years ago they were almost unknown, during a time you proclaimed everything was awesome in?

Excuse me sir, what planet do you live on? Because it sure as hell isn't Earth.

Aside from crafting, it very much is.

Yes, and we all learned back in 1985 with Super Mario Bros. that we didn't need to repeatedly jump, evade, get fire flower, shoot fireballs for 85% of the game in order to find it fun and amusing. All we needed was 8 Bowsers to have a complete game. Gee, I wonder what developers were thinking??!

Of course the boss battles are the most fun and engaging part of the game with their drops/rewards the sweetest of all, but you cannot make a game comprised of entirely that! If you DO, then you have NO REASON for an open world, and at the same time a game full of sidegrade/modest upgrade rewards because tossing out more difficult enemies for which to suffice their existence is not something developers just casually do! So instead of the old grind, what you now have is the new grind and a .001 chance of getting that next sidegrade piece of gear! What about this do you NOT understand?!!

You would have to be pretty retarded to think that I hadn't already mentioned to my shell / friends that I was attempting to do the quest and I really don't see how having two people shout for the same thing in the same zone (this was before /yell when everyone stayed in one place). I mean you're really just going on about how much better you are at forming groups and that completely goes against your argument that people who want old school style play can't find groups.

Equating my inability to make classic EXP groups with your inability to organize a mission run would be to say "I couldn't get the mission started because 99% of those who could go with me were already doing it."