Inventory 80 Limitations aren't real, heres why.

[Sarick]

Your really not that computer savy... never taken intro to computer programming i take it.

Your idea can't work, ever. Your memory only has at most 2 sets of inventors, period. Your macro's wouldn't work as your client would have NO IDEA what the item ID was for the item your attempting to equip that wasn't in your inventory. To make the client aware of that item ID it must be in whatever data structure they use, that structure takes up memory space.

You aren't even 100% sure of what your talking about here when you said "Your memory only has at most 2 sets of inventors'" You sure you don't mean integers? Oh wait I see you misspelled inventory!

The awareness is on the server side not the client as you pointed out already. The server just lets the client know you own the objects and it displays them mostly. When you kill a mob that drops an exclusive item before it's presented to the pool the server checks to see if you already have it from all your bags storage etc. If you do it own it then doesn't drop another one.

Like I said the inventory display is the bottleneck. The server already knows if you have the item or not. It's not like when you swap gear it would take 1 minute to access/load and translate the items from each sack.

It would work it just wouldn't be fast enough for quick access because each bag would need checked loaded and unloaded before being processed. We could still have an inventory space that list page by page over 80 for storage.

Exactly how much does each item use in bytes for that data structure. Because on the PS2 they load back to back as soon as I open each bag/sack there is no long wait to download the list from the server.

[saevel]

The awareness is on the server side not the client as you pointed out already. The server just lets the client know you own the objects and it displays them mostly. When you kill a mob that drops an exclusive item before it's presented to the pool the server checks to see if you already have it from all your bags storage etc. If you do it own it then doesn't drop another one.

Like I said the inventory display is the bottleneck. The server already knows if you have the item or not. It's not like when you swap gear it would take 1 minute to access/load and translate the items from each sack.

It would work it just wouldn't be fast enough for quick access because each bag would need checked loaded and unloaded before being processed. We could still have an inventory space that list page by page over 80 for storage.

Seriously you people can't be this stupid, this has to be some sort of trolling.

How the in hell would the client know what to tell the server to equip? It has ZERO idea if the item's ID isn't already inside memory. You have your current inventory and whatever the last "storage" container you opened inside memory, a total of 160 entries. You client can not reference more then 160 items at once, don't know how to make that anymore clear. To be able to reference more they would have to make space by removing something else, the past couple of years it's been the Auto-Translate function that's been canalized to provide space for the 80 item and the temp items. There is a finite size to every list in the game, number of monsters within your target-able range, number of spells, number of zones, number of job abilities, even the number of buffs that your client can display. These lists had their limits hard coded to prevent an exception from happening that could random behavior or possibly crash the game.

As to the poster trying to sound like they took a class or two, stop reading wiki. Instruction and Data pointers have existed since the birth of the first computer, they are not unique to HLL.

Anyhow all the information necessary has been presented. This is the internet and you have zero inclination to learn anything, now your just trying to wriggle out of having to admit you where horribly wrong. There is no conspiracy by SE to lie to it's players about memory limits, their not secretly holding out bigger inventory's from you. It's a very real engineering problem that can not be solved without something else being sacrificed.

[Sarick]

Seriously you people can't be this stupid, this has to be some sort of trolling.

How the in hell would the client know what to tell the server to equip? It has ZERO idea if the item's ID isn't already inside memory. You have your current inventory and whatever the last "storage" container you opened inside memory, a total of 160 entries. You client can not reference more then 160 items at once, don't know how to make that anymore clear. To be able to reference more they would have to make space by removing something else, the past couple of years it's been the Auto-Translate function that's been canalized to provide space for the 80 item and the temp items. There is a finite size to every list in the game, number of monsters within your target-able range, number of spells, number of zones, number of job abilities, even the number of buffs that your client can display. These lists had their limits hard coded to prevent an exception from happening that could random behavior or possibly crash the game..

Anyhow all the information necessary has been presented. This is the internet and you have zero inclination to learn anything, now your just trying to wriggle out of having to admit you where horribly wrong. There is no conspiracy by SE to lie to it's players about memory limits, their not secretly holding out bigger inventory's from you. It's a very real engineering problem that can not be solved without something else being sacrificed.

For the record PS2 has a an hdd and swap files aren't a rocket science. Everything isn't needing loaded at once. If your in White gate you don't need music loaded from Jeuno.

[oliveira]

For the record PS2 has a an hdd and swap files aren't a rocket science. Everything isn't needing loaded at once. If your in White gate you don't need music loaded from Jeuno.

PlayOnline does use a swap file while it's running.

But really currently I am not sure if it's used anyway. It was when the game had a feature to quick jump into POL Viewer while keeping the character logged in.

[RAIST]

For the record PS2 has a an hdd and swap files aren't a rocket science. Everything isn't needing loaded at once. If your in White gate you don't need music loaded from Jeuno.

This may be why some aren't getting it......the PS2 in no way, shape, or form works like the OS's commonly found on a PC.

The PS2 continuously streams the FFXI data...it doesn't take advantage of things like resident memory or virtual memory like a PC does, so you can't load a TSR, save off data to a swap file, and so forth. More or less, EVERYTHING needed for FFXI has to fit within it's available physical memory locations so it can be streamed through it's buses continuously. Because of this requirement, some space is reserved for use even if it isn't currently being displayed/used---because depending on user input or a request/response from the server it may be needed at any given moment.

That is what the issue is with displaying more inventory options---in order to do something so "simple" like adding a tab to the UI for the PS2, they have to FIRST clear a memory space for it within the stream(s). If there is no available space within the targeted stream, then something must first be removed so it can be replaced with the new item. Apparently, they have run up against a serious limit in this area.

[Sarick]

This may be why some aren't getting it......the PS2 in no way, shape, or form works like the OS's commonly found on a PC.

The PS2 continuously streams the FFXI data...it doesn't take advantage of things like resident memory or virtual memory like a PC does, so you can't load a TSR, save off data to a swap file, and so forth. More or less, EVERYTHING needed for FFXI has to fit within it's available physical memory locations so it can be streamed through it's buses continuously. Because of this requirement, some space is reserved for use even if it isn't currently being displayed/used---because depending on user input or a request/response from the server it may be needed at any given moment.

That is what the issue is with displaying more inventory options---in order to do something so "simple" like adding a tab to the UI for the PS2, they have to FIRST clear a memory space for it within the stream(s). If there is no available space within the targeted stream, then something must first be removed so it can be replaced with the new item. Apparently, they have run up against a serious limit in this area.

This is what causes the black screen of death when loading some large cut scenes that SE hasn't fixed or even acknowledges. Thank you for explaining this to everyone. When zoning to a new area it did clear out a lot of data and re-load content from the HDD but, it eventually would cause a lot of memory fragmentation. This in turn appeared to create a few memory leaks that eventually would crash the console.

This would cause some NPCS with large text blocks to stall when chatting with them. Eventually these freezes where to much a hassle. As each expansion was added they became worse. They started when the first Abbysea areas where added. Go figure. Anyway the graphics would slow to a halt after a while do to this streaming.

Also something to note the Japanese client has more available capacity then the US because the English text uses more space to communicate the same information when compared to Japanese. Spells list, items list etc in the menus are sometimes 1/8 to 1/2 the size of English words. This is one of the problems NES and SNES had when they translated the games. They had to find ways to pack the English dialog because it was so much bigger compared to the original Japanese dialogs.

Here are the specs for the PS2..

Apparently it has 32 megabytes of ram, 4 megabytes of VRAM, and 2 megabytes of dedicated sound ram.

[Kristal]

Spells list, items list etc in the menus are sometimes 1/8 to 1/2 the size of English words. This is one of the problems NES and SNES had when they translated the games. They had to find ways to pack the English dialog because it was so much bigger compared to the original Japanese dialogs.

For Seiken Densetsu III, the fan translation team rewrote half the code to get proper English translation (adding their own compression/decompression code), upgraded the fonts to look better AND fixed a dozen bugs from the original.

[Laraul]

This may be why some aren't getting it......the PS2 in no way, shape, or form works like the OS's commonly found on a PC.

You are 100% correct! It's not a PC! Or at least it's not until you obtain the fabulous Linux kit for PS2!

[Arcon]

You are 100% correct! It's not a PC! Or at least it's not until you obtain the fabulous Linux kit for PS2!

And while the operating system then may be similar, the underlying hardware still isn't, neither is communication with the hardware.

[oliveira]

There is no conspiracy by SE to lie to it's players about memory limits, their not secretly holding out bigger inventory's from you. It's a very real engineering problem that can not be solved without something else being sacrificed.

This is a very good point. Basically what I said on my post. But I still think that the real issue is related to the scale of the changes required to break this 80/160 limit thing. So they prefer to add more parallel storages keeping the current structure. If the client was the reason for the limit, they could just change the client coding and be done with it.