To: Mr Akihiko Matsui

[Neisan_Quetz]

1. What cheating
2. Midgame never mattered
4. Eco-warrior, diorama, expeditionary force... there's a reason none of these are done
5. Why haven't you applied this to yourself instead of complaining so much

[Eyeballed]

1. What cheating
2. Midgame never mattered
4. Eco-warrior, diorama, expeditionary force... there's a reason none of these are done
5. Why haven't you applied this to yourself instead of complaining so much

Your contributions have been even less valuable than those fueled by pure flames. Blocked.

[FrankReynolds]

I'll field a few.

- Do you agree that cheating should be allowed to persist?

In as far as the cheating we're currently discussing goes: The game maker has acknowledged the "leech" method of leveling as an intended mechanic of the game.

I actually like it. When I shout for PUG now, there is a relatively high chance that everyone will have the jobs we need to get it done. How they got there is none of my concern.

- Do you agree that mid-game doesn't matter in the way that it doesn't matter now?

I feel like the only reason for it to exist was that the level cap used to be "Mid Level", so they made content for that. That is no longer the case, so it is no longer needed.

- I can't deny that you still needed skill-ups after hitting cap at 75 previously. However, it doesn't speak to the degree of skilling-up that would be required when attaining numerous levels (if not all) when participating little-to-none otherwise.

Regardless, it still takes less time to level a job and cap skills now, than it did to just level the job back then.

- "Focusing on endgame content" should in no way mean "negate much of the rest of the game that already existed".

It should. That's what end game means.

- This is true in some respects. I agree that a RDM or BRD could and would get invites without having the party flags up, where a THF or BST could go their entire career without having that happen (with their flags up). Simply because you had the luxury of people fighting over your presence on one job doesn't mean you should expect that to happen on others. And I'll go with my usual defense of, "If you wanted it, you should take the responsibility for going out to get it".

This is exactly the response that you have ignored countless times when told that old school leveling still exists.

[Mirage]

I never did eco warrior, diorama, expeditionary force or garrison during any of the years i played pre-abyssea. So I can't say I felt much of a change in that department. The only parts of the game that made mid-game people feel like they mattered was level capped CoP missions, imo.

But at this time in the game's life, I wouldn't really want CoP level caps back.

[Eyeballed]

I never did eco warrior, diorama, expeditionary force or garrison during any of the years i played pre-abyssea. So I can't say I felt much of a change in that department. The only parts of the game that made mid-game people feel like they mattered was level capped CoP missions, imo.

But at this time in the game's life, I wouldn't really want CoP level caps back.

But why not? Haven't you and the rest of Vanadiel finished them?

[Meyi]

Abyssea, Book & Repeating Book Pages:

- Fosters potential for abuse. (Ability to progress without playing, IE cheating)
- Diminishes value/need for mid-game gears. (Those who still play classic will need)
- Rewards the player with higher EXP/hr. for spamming EP-- mobs. (Diminished need for challenge/engaging battles)
- Player who 'burns' a job from 1-XX loses skill points that would otherwise be gained. (Creating a new and unnecessary need for manually raising these skills; Reference "increased rate of skill-point gain" to supplement this fact.)
- Supplants a general perspective that endgame content is the whole of the content the game intends to provide.
- Caters an equal reward system to all, regardless of time or effort put into a goal.

Thanks.

1. Potential abuse. This is true. However, it happened sometimes in regular parties as well. Not as frequently because a terrible player/afker could be spotted by a slower exp rate, and thus kicked, but it still happened.

2. Mid-game gears. Very true that this is obsolete. Unfortunately it had started to diminish before Abyssea's introduction because many people had finished leveling their desired jobs to 75 and were no longer interested in leveling more. When I wanted to level my Paladin (solo by the way), I was disappointed to see the level 30 CoP introduced gear was not on the auction house. For days. As a result I crafted my smithing up and started making my own pieces of gear. Thankfully anyone can level smithing up to 60 without any consequences on their other crafts if that gear set is desired. It's slow and unfortunate, but possible to do on one's own.

3. Higher EXP on Easy Prey monsters. Actually, I believe Square Enix stated at some point they had never expected players to engage incredibly tough monsters in parties of six, but rather smaller parties on even matches, toughs, and very toughs instead (Note: I don't have a link for verification). Even before the EXP addition these monster choices resulted in faster EXP, but players chose to engage the hardest they could.

I wouldn't say they were a challenge... they were just slow and irritating.It was almost always crabs we engaged in. And if it wasn't crabs, it was most likely crawlers. It wasn't until the addition of Chains of Promathia we broke the monotony with dhalmels in Bibiki Bay... and that was only for higher levels. With Treasure of Aht Urgan we experienced a spike in EXP/hr, squishier monsters (colibri and imps), and the highest EXP chains ever (remember EXP chain #307?).

So really, the fall of engaging in difficult monsters began in Chains of Promathia with Treasure of Aht Urgan really kicking it up to gear and Abyssea excelling it exponentially.

The addition to making EXP double outside of Abyssea was nice. I think Square Enix was going to add it regardless of Abyssea. But maybe not. Regardless, just like all things in life, we humans will choose the least resisted path to our destination. Killing smaller monsters quicker for equally strong EXP is going to be chosen over harder monsters by the majority of people. The only times the reverse is true is when someone is needing something specifically from a harder monster or when someone is bored and looking for a challenge.

4. Skill loss. True, but this was already an issue way before Abyssea was even thought of by Square Enix. Skill up parties have been around since I've been playing the game (back in 2003). And this was necessary for everyone; DD leveling up their main or a second choice weapon, tanks leveling up their parry/guard/shield/evasion, mages leveling up their weapons and magic skills, etc. Skill ups have always been a burden on the player base. Now, yes, they are an even bigger burden to us, but really skill ups are easy enough to get in a few days that partying to 99 and then capping is efficient.

Also, way before Abyssea came Level Sync. The benefit of Level Sync was finally having enough of each class to select from but the burden was poor skill ups. Well, and midlevel gear had difficulties staying afloat as well -- people just went from Qufim to merit parties.

5. Strong focus on end game content. Hm, I recall people always being obsessed with end game. I never liked it because it was unpleasant for me so I chose to solo a lot and level up several jobs. But usually the whole point of leveling a job was being able to attend events and be useful for the linkshell.

There was a lot of end game back at 75, such as Dynamis, Sky, Sea, Limbus, Assaults/Nyzul, Salvage, Einherjar, HNM kings, etc. There was so much to do every day that many linkshells had their members running from event to event from the time they logged on to the time they logged off. These members didn't have much time to level up new jobs either.

The only midgame content I can think of would be CoP missions (which have had their caps lifted), some BCNMs, and leveling. Oh and I guess there was Expeditionary Forces and Garrison. Never was a lot to choose from.

There's really two parts to an MMORPG. Part one is getting a job's level maxed. Part two begins at the end of part one and is using said maxed job to slay monsters for the collection of armors and goods. As of 2012, part one is expodentially sped up, but part two is equally important.

6. Equal rewards. I like equality. At the end of the day I don't really care if someone else got something with less effort as me, because it is just a game and their possession of an item does not affect me. I'm much happier to have an easier chance at obtaining my end goals.

~~

Reasons for why I like Abyssea:

1. Faster EXP. I like being able to get my jobs to 99 quicker. I restarted a character, so leveing the jobs I had at 75 again on my new character quickly makes me happy. I know how to play them from the 75 days so I guess I can't say how easy or difficult it is to learn a job without an oldschool party/solo, but as a person who is releveling it's marvelous. I was able to get my skill ups high relatively quick, and it was nice on my pocketbook not having to buy several different sets of armor or wait to level because I couldn't buy that new piece of equipment I really needed.

The downfall to faster EXP is the lack of anticipation. On one hand I get bored and struggle to not fall asleep while partying in Gusgen Mines and Abyssea, but on the other hand I'm impatient and want my levels instantly. I wouldn't mind some oldschool parties, but I'd like to also keep the possibility of leveling fast should I grow tired of people doing stupid things and slowing me down.

2. Equality. I like how in GoV parties and Abyssea parties all jobs are welcome. That's so beautiful. That's the first time in Vana'diel history that all players were treated as equals. Oldschool parties, like I've said in the past, demanded we have specific jobs to party. And even if different camps asked for different jobs, said jobs couldn't get past the levels with the camps they weren't welcome at.

3. Strong armor. Strong, easy to obtain armor that doesn't require hours upon hours of fighting the random number generator system are beautiful. As someone who avoids tougher end game activities, I liked that I finally had a shot at some of the best gear. I could take a few of my friends and get seals and gems, have fun, and walk away at the end of the day without a headache and with something to show for our time. So beautiful.

4. Diversity. Because it's so easy to level jobs now, many people are willing to level appropriate sub jobs and main jobs for events.

5. Fun. I find Abyssea fun. I like proccing yellow for people. I suppose being a black mage makes that biased because I can proc 5/7 of the spells, but I enjoy the simplicity yet alluring mystery the proc system can have. Abyssite of Discernment has made this easier, but even knowing the element a person doesn't know the exact spell until it goes off. Still have to time it so it's not dirty. If you want challenge, try proccing Ancient Magic on Triturators.

6. Not held back by idiots. There's always been a lot of morons in this game... and they still exist to this day. People who can't follow directions, who can't read instructions, or just straight up derp out and forget how to use a keyboard all exist on this game. In large portions. In oldschool parties, our EXP would suffer from people like this guy. In Abyssea, I can solo fast enough to not care what other people are doing. I can solo a lot more in this game and therefore don't have to rely on unreliable fools.

Plus if they leave prematurely I'm not left to suffer because of it.

7. Camps aren't always full. I always hated when we'd take two hours to gather a party, run out to camp, and find it taken by another party who had managed to get there between our "/sea area" and arrival. Or even worse, when a beastmaster would be there or when I was beastmaster and a party would invade on me. People were frequently jerks who would overcamp on other people and destroy the speed of EXP for everyone. Now Abyssea has lots of camps, people can come and go in parties and there are lots of camps to choose from in each zone.

8. The game's a game again. Since starting the game, the message of "don't forget your friends, family, school or work" was always a joke. But with Abyssea, the game finally became a game again. It was easy to log on, get some friends quickly, farm some seals or get some exp, log off an hour or two later and actually have something to show for the hour of work.

[Trisscar]

Your contributions have been even less valuable than those fueled by pure flames. Blocked.

You keep on blocking people who disagree with you as if that makes your arguments that more relevant. But soon, you'll have no one to post to but yourself.

[Luvbunny]

Meyi, thanks for posting such a detailed matter why Abyssea works and did something great to the game. It's great to see someone who appreciate it rather than putting the blame of everything that is wrong with the game to Abyssea

[Demon6324236]

And what makes this RNG system have widespread appeal, do you think? Also, do you not think this RNG system is an even cheaper way to extend content life than even the old grind?

The reason it has widespread appeal is it is accessible, so anyone can do it. The problem is with the best gear which is only a sidegrade in many cases, so for those who want the better gear they must do it much more often and it becomes a very big pain.

[Luvbunny]

Your contributions have been even less valuable than those fueled by pure flames. Blocked.

Why don't you go back baking cookies? Perhaps Miss Brownie here need more "arguments" for her ADD, seems like she-he just cannot face the fact that mid level content has been dead for over 8 years, loooooong gone. Apparently she never get the memo, ToAU pretty much killed it good. Balls-soup, your concern is 6 years late, should have voiced more opinion back then - at the very least SE listened to the player base, killed old school way of doing things, and give us more fun than we can handle at endgame.