Back in the good ole days

[Luvbunny]

You... obviously havent actually tried to make a normal EXP party nowadays. If it was that easy I wouldnt be griping on the forums XD. Try doing like you said and make a 6 man PT, mass spamming /sea all like crazy, tell me how long it goes. ^^

You mean getting close to 400-600 xp per kill or more is not a good incentive? in 10 mnts you are getting 400x5 plus 2000 GoV bonus, more with xp bonus ring. It's about the same xp you are getting via GoV 18 people. It's just more works and require 5 other people who knows what they are doing. The reasons it's harder because you have to get the usual set up of tank + healers and do it old school ways

You don't learn your jobs by doing xp party grind these days, you learn your job by going to Abyssea and solo mobs or doing a small set up party fighting NMs for seals. That's a better way to learn anyway, since the mobs are a lot tougher and people need to understand a bit of basic team work to succeed.

[Anapingofness]

I can agree and disagree with you. I was in highschool as well and had a lot more free time. There is no denying that FFXI is much more accesible, and I like that. I just think the shift was far too much, and way too fast.
By flow though, I mean there was a steady sense of progression not just character wise, but internally.
Start out soloing, start partying in dunes. Make a journey to Jeuno and hit up Qufim and Delkfutts. Go on a journey across the three countriess to get those three keys, then fight in Kazham. (And learn SCs and maybe MBs. Almost everyone I know started learning how to SC there.), Crawlers nest, Garliage, Altepa, Kuftal, Wojaom, Aydeewa,(Or Bibiki, I made a few parties there for fun) Bhaflu, Caedarva. Each area was different, had a set of things that made them different from one another.
That's what I meant by flow, you had a steady sense of progression as you not only learned more about the world of FFXI, but more about your job abilities, how other jobs functioned with yours.

FFXI should evolve, but not sacrifice what gave it it's integrity. Speed up the level progression, raise some of the ungodly drop rates, and work with the balance of Risk vs Reward a bit better.
FoV and GoV are great additions, but the way they're used where you have around 18 people mass murdering EP mobs is a terrible, terrible way to balance a game.
Mind you I dont have rose tinted glasses in regards to FFXI of old. I know what it was, but rather than completely abandon ship, SE should have worked better with what -did- work, and try to minimalize what didnt.

I can see where you're coming from. I respect that and in a lot of ways you are right.

[Llana_Virren]

You don't learn your jobs by doing xp party grind these days, you learn your job by going to Abyssea and solo mobs or doing a small set up party fighting NMs for seals. That's a better way to learn anyway, since the mobs are a lot tougher and people need to understand a bit of basic team work to succeed.

Since we're in a "back in the day" thread....

You "got an understanding of your job and party dynamics" -BY- doing EXP parties. The role a THF versus DRG versus COR would play in a party was vastly different, and you learned the nuances of each combination through EXP parties.

To suggest that you need "small parties fighting NMs" as a way to learn a job is a dangerous, but relatively modern mentality. It also means that some NMs are grossly overpowered while others are... well, let's just say they're not notorious.

This is why you see many a Lv99 using sub-70 gear, because the "good gear or get out" requirement for defeating a lot of zones was negated by the raised level cap.

But I digress. EXP parties are dead, and considering the length of time FFXI has been out, and the lack of genuine (new players) joining the game, it's safe to say you can learn your job from your LS mates or FFXIclopedia just as well as EXP parties ever could, with a fraction of the time, too.

This isn't necessarily a bad thing. People nowadays are not inherently "less" of a player because of how much easier it was for them to level up. But some people think that the gear and the EXP makes the player, and that anyone who does it easier is half-a-player.

You know what I miss about the good ol' days? All this shit we're doing used to be NEW and UNKNOWN. That's what we need! Adventure!

[Faustenin]

You know what I miss about the good ol' days? All this shit we're doing used to be NEW and UNKNOWN. That's what we need! Adventure!

EDIT : Here's an idea SE. Make a new expansion. This new expansion will cater to the 99+.
It will be one massive gigantic dungeon, the size of every single CoP zone crammed into one, sprawling, hellish dungeon.
Puzzles. Riddles, Monsters with devilish AI and placement. Booby traps, and give absolutely no information about it. Make stuff random, so wiki is only half-reliable.

[Llana_Virren]

I'd assume you were being sarcastic, but I still find myself liking the idea. :P

Level-capped areas are (hopefully) never to be seen again, as my inventories just can't handle that kind of crap agian.
On the flip-side, however, make magic scrolls (if any new spells are introduced) RareEx so players who want it have to go get it, similar to how Armor/Weapons/WSs are for the rest.

[Faustenin]

I'd assume you were being sarcastic, but I still find myself liking the idea. :P

Level-capped areas are (hopefully) never to be seen again, as my inventories just can't handle that kind of crap agian.
On the flip-side, however, make magic scrolls (if any new spells are introduced) RareEx so players who want it have to go get it, similar to how Armor/Weapons/WSs are for the rest.

No sarcasm at all. I love myself a good dungeon crawl. I still like to try and Solo through Pso Xja, or Delkfutts as a low level and see how high I can climb. Or horutoto before they retarded up the mob levels.
Level capped areas were great when they had level sync.

[Luvbunny]

You "got an understanding of your job and party dynamics" -BY- doing EXP parties. The role a THF versus DRG versus COR would play in a party was vastly different, and you learned the nuances of each combination through EXP parties.

To suggest that you need "small parties fighting NMs" as a way to learn a job is a dangerous, but relatively modern mentality. It also means that some NMs are grossly overpowered while others are... well, let's just say they're not notorious.

This is why you see many a Lv99 using sub-70 gear, because the "good gear or get out" requirement for defeating a lot of zones was negated by the raised level cap.

But I digress. EXP parties are dead, and considering the length of time FFXI has been out, and the lack of genuine (new players) joining the game, it's safe to say you can learn your job from your LS mates or FFXIclopedia just as well as EXP parties ever could, with a fraction of the time, too.

This isn't necessarily a bad thing. People nowadays are not inherently "less" of a player because of how much easier it was for them to level up. But some people think that the gear and the EXP makes the player, and that anyone who does it easier is half-a-player.

You know what I miss about the good ol' days? All this shit we're doing used to be NEW and UNKNOWN. That's what we need! Adventure!

That depends, normal exp party set up is not your way to learn your job since they are "safe" environment. You end up doing the same thing over and over and it is one dimensional. Fighting NM in small party set up or solo-trio in abyssea is way much harder since everyone is doing a double duty - in the case of solo, you are doing triple duty everything. You learn more about your jobs in all the endgame contents since those require you to be "alert" and "awake". 6 people party set up is easy to have your mages fall asleep due to boredom. In any case not to say one way is better than the other, but bad players are still everywhere no matter what.

As for a lot of lvl 99 players wearing pink-pearle-teal gears...well it takes time to "grind" the gears now more than leveling up. Though all gears Af3+1 are very easy to farm in a couple hours a day should these people take some times to do. There is also VW side gears for those with enough gils to burn. The focus today is flexibility and versatility. This is a double edge sword since it takes time to learn some jobs more than others, and skilling up is definitely a problem with the fast leveling.

In the adventuring part - yeah that is kinda gone - unless you are incline to do the missions. Voidwatch in essence is "adventuring" - each one forces you to go to all these different places - and if you have not done your missions, those places are not accessible. Each VW NM also "a mystery" at least for a week or two until people find the strategy how to beat it - which is the case with old game contents as well. This game is a big massive GRIND in one way or another. It used to be about xp grind, now it's gear + weapon grind.

[Llana_Virren]

I think gear grinds are the best. Obviously they suck, but the grinds are (normally) reserved for items of epicness... such as the Relics used to me a multi-year conquest.

Personally, I think that FFXI is going to go one of two ways.

On the one hand, now that we have new grind-gear, SE could introduce more fulfilling storylines in forthcoming installments (read as: they don't necessarily need to be a full-on expansion pack, although it woudl be welcomed) with primary emphasis on content, not equipment.

Or,

FFXI will slowly die off as nothing "dramatically new" is introduced, players continue to level up, acquire everything they want, and quit the game (as we saw happen after people "finally" finished with their Relics).

Considering how long FFXI has been out, I think an overhaul to the graphics would be necessary, but not likely due to the lack of new blood coming to the game. FFXI is turning into the old FF's, in that players start it up to "relive" a game they beat long ago, knowing that everything is the same as it was.

[Ziyyigo-Tipyigo]

FFXI is turning into the old FF's,

Of the "old FF's"

• All three 8-bit titles got graphics updates.
• All the cartridge-based titles got content/storyline additions.
• Final Fantasy IV even got what might even be called an "expansion pack" (released after WotG)

So falling into the "old FF" category isn't much of a bad thing.

[Llana_Virren]

Not bad at all... as long as you accept the fact that there will never be anything "new" to do that you haven't already done... which seems to be the major reason for all this nostalgia: no new content.