Rant About Current End Game - ADL and Voidwatch = Old FFXI, No Thanks

[Monchat]

what exactly are you trying to prove? The mythic GK has 450 delay not 437. and the general concensus is that 6 hit > 5 hit due to over TP I thought. Give me your zanshin rate, your double attack/triple/quadruple rate and I'll give you your average hits till 100 TP (hint: not 4*100/600), its a complicated formula...

[Fupafighter]

K so. http://www.ffxiah.com/members/item-sets?id=244987 thats my tp set for a 5 hit til I get my hands on that new gear. 90 masa. And this http://www.ffxiah.com/members/item-sets?id=124818 is my ws set. Put in tp bonus instead of my centauri, as I am almost done with WOTG. I have mnk and sam both 90 empies, I can guarentee you sam gets tp faster, both /war.

[Fupafighter]

Oh and I forgot to change hands to brego.

[Fupafighter]

what exactly are you trying to prove? The mythic GK has 450 delay not 437. and the general concensus is that 6 hit > 5 hit due to over TP I thought. Give me your zanshin rate, your double attack/triple/quadruple rate and I'll give you your average hits till 100 TP (hint: not 4*100/600), its a complicated formula...

Keep forgetting that. And with 450 delay, i can drop off some store tp for more attack/double attack.

[Karbuncle]

what exactly are you trying to prove? The mythic GK has 450 delay not 437. and the general concensus is that 6 hit > 5 hit due to over TP I thought. Give me your zanshin rate, your double attack/triple/quadruple rate and I'll give you your average hits till 100 TP (hint: not 4*100/600), its a complicated formula...

Well, the General consensus on 6hit > 5hit was due to what gear needed to be sacrificed in order to obtain a 5-hit, But I believe that was around the 90 Cap, Now theres a bit more Store TP Gear available, and its a little easier to 5-hit.

It was never because of TP Over flow. No ones going to pass on something because it might make them "too powerful". TP Overflow doesn't hurt anything, and since most SAM WS's damage varies with TP, it actually helps them in a good way, even if by a small amount.

[Fupafighter]

Well, the General consensus on 6hit > 5hit was due to what gear needed to be sacrificed in order to obtain a 5-hit, But I believe that was around the 90 Cap, Now theres a bit more Store TP Gear available, and its a little easier to 5-hit.

It was never because of TP Over flow. No ones going to pass on something because it might make them "too powerful". TP Overflow doesn't hurt anything, and since most SAM WS's damage varies with TP, it actually helps them in a good way, even if by a small amount.

Yes very true. And new samurai sets in the near future will have a 26% 5 hit If we ever get our hands on neo nyzle gear. Atm, samurai's should have 24% atleast and a 5 hit, or your doing it wrong.

[MarkovChain]

since most SAM WS's damage varies with TP, it actually helps them in a good way, even if by a small amount.

Ws with damage varies with TP are tiered @ 100/200/300 so tp ing at 100 or 120 doesn't change shit and if it did it would be pointless. Th epoint of mdk is that it's not enough to claim that 5 hit > 6 hit. There are way too many factors implied in the comparison. 5 hit leads to gimp WS, slower TP build, and in general 5 hit or 6 build don't mean anything because of the many multiattack gear & zanshin than can happen. What matters is computing the exact #rounds per ws on average, accounting for accuracy, DA/TA/QA, or even OAT, and in the case of SAM znashin (with 2 different consideration from hasso zanshin and normal zanshin). But I don't expect much from him seeing as he already explained that hasso+zanshin procs 25% of the time. One consideration that complicates the computation is that some multuattack are checked first and some last. Also I'm sure motenten spreadsheet does it.

[MarkovChain]

Yes very true. And new samurai sets in the near future will have a 26% 5 hit If we ever get our hands on neo nyzle gear. Atm, samurai's should have 24% atleast and a 5 hit, or your doing it wrong.

Can you math out how much stronger your 5 hit is over you 6 hit or is this just another random claim ? When I did math out 5 hit vs 6 hit back in the days where BG could do math, the difference between 5 hits and 6 hits builds was generally a few % only. Most likely the greatest stat you are sacrificing is attack, which obviously is the main concern for a WS, even at 100% mod. Noone cares about haste anymore because anyone can cap haste it's just a matter of what you are giving up. Finally there this little thing that you systematically avoid in the discussion, aka TP overflow, which is all the mor important than x-build is low. So it's not exagerated to say that a myythic 5-hit is never 2 rounds exactly making the 5 build sacrifices useless.

[hiko]

what exactly are you trying to prove? The mythic GK has 450 delay not 437. and the general concensus is that 6 hit > 5 hit due to over TP I thought

if you use mythic GK 6hit, you dont have 1hit/per round

Give me your zanshin rate, your double attack/triple/quadruple rate and I'll give you your average hits till 100 TP (hint: not 4*100/600), its a complicated formula...

agree on this but why didn't you reply to pchan using 5*100/60 for sam WS speed?

pcahn use number coming from nowhere to show that mnk doesnt TP way slower than sam, i took his number and just changed 6hit to 5hit. if he would have used some calculated round/WS instead of a lol 5 i wouldn't have said anything

[MarkovChain]

I can guarentee you sam gets tp faster, both /war.

Your point ? You said much faster stop trying to save face. Doing math right now.

agree on this but why didn't you reply to pchan using 5*100/60 for sam WS speed?

pcahn use number coming from nowhere to show that mnk doesnt TP way slower than sam, i took his number and just changed 6hit to 5hit. if he would have used some calculated round/WS instead of a lol 5 i wouldn't have said anything

You probably missed the "approximate part". The numbers I gave for monk are not pulled out of my ass, they are the exact ones... Just the SAM one is slightly above reality (or under reality with tp overflow).