New enhancing spell for RDM to promote party support.

[saevel]

Cast Blizzard IV. Sleep stuff. Enfeeble stuff. And yeah, even melee when appropriate.

I do agree Red Mage has a lot of overlap with White Mage at the moment, probably even more than Scholar has with either job. I also think there are more far productive ways to differentiate the two than simply making Red Mage more less awful at hitting things with things.

Except with how the above members vision the job you won't be casting Blizzard IV, you'll be casting Cure V, opps I mean Cure IV and three buffs per party member. Anything this would matter on is immune to sleep, gravity, bind, mostly immune to paralyze, and slow is only partially effective. The entire argument boils down to "Play a level 50 WHM with more MP".

For DH's comment about not getting away from "enhancing" I reply, what enhancing. The only buffs people every asked for was haste and refresh, that is the exact limit of "enhancing" two spells. It wasn't until SCH was made that RDM could actually put some of it's enhancing spells on others via the /SCH JA's. And to this day people still aren't answering me when I ask them if they want one of those buffs. And the absolute funniest part is how broke enspell 1's were due to their Mag.acc being on hit, so even if you aoe'd them everyone would be hitting for 1~3. SCH's complained and SE went out and changed Enspell 1s, not for RDM but for SCH.

You guys have this idea that RDM was somehow this party support job when it never was close. It had haste, cure IV and convert, which meant put together you could create a haste-cure-bot out of a player. It made it preferable for non-stop merit party's and nothing else. RDM's one HNM use was it's 2hr + stun, and this is when enfeebles actually landed on big NMs. There was a time when RDM could tank HNMs, but SE ended that. So please tell us exactly how RDM was an "enhancing job" and why we're all crazy for thinking it's not?

[Neisan_Quetz]

Then why the hell were you on Rdm if you weren't supporting the party at least part of the time? No, seriously, what the hell were you doing at 75 cap? Debuffs don't take a long time to apply and reapply. I wasn't a whm, but I sure as hell was helping to support the party. your notion of support only seems to apply to cor/brd buffs.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

For DH's comment about not getting away from "enhancing" I reply, what enhancing. The only buffs people every asked for was haste and refresh, that is the exact limit of "enhancing" two spells. It wasn't until SCH was made that RDM could actually put some of it's enhancing spells on others via the /SCH JA's. And to this day people still aren't answering me when I ask them if they want one of those buffs. And the absolute funniest part is how broke enspell 1's were due to their Mag.acc being on hit, so even if you aoe'd them everyone would be hitting for 1~3. SCH's complained and SE went out and changed Enspell 1s, not for RDM but for SCH.

Two spells that had the biggest impact, Refresh on mages Haste on Melee.

My opinion on RDM's other enhancing spells is clear, they should be able to be put on party members but I don't want Cycles back.

Like it or not it is the RDM's job to Haste and Refresh the party, if SE didn't want that they'd have done them self buffs only. I'm not telling you main heal but if you have a WHM there what is the issue with keeping Haste and Refresh up where needed? Save the WHM a job and help on MP.

As for the enspell thing I never said SE actually used their brain to think logically if they did then they'd just help with RDM keeping up it's (player picked) role while allowing time in between to do what you want, whether that be Melee or Nuking via Aura and longer duration naturally. This image will stay with RDM now, the same as Blink tanking with NIN when it wasn't originally designed that way... So rather than do nothing improve on that while keeping it's other roles possible.

[saevel]

Like it or not it is the RDM's job to Haste and Refresh the party, if SE didn't want that they'd have done them self buffs only. I'm not telling you main heal but if you have a WHM there what is the issue with keeping Haste and Refresh up where needed? Save the WHM a job and help on MP.

A BLU/RDM can now do the same thing, a BLM/RDM, BRD/RDM, WHM/RDM, SCH/RDM, SMN/RDM, even a DRK/RDM can do that just as well. You've fit the job into a sub. And more cycles are exactly what this thread is about, by people who have no intention of actually casting those cycles but instead want to make their mule or PUG player do it.

RDM was put into the "support" category back in 2003. Their "job" was to refresh the WHM, BLM and PLD. We didn't earn the name "refresh whore" for nothing. It wasn't until 2004 when the game was expanding and WHM's were rare that RDM's were asked to main heal. Post 41 a RDM with refresh and convert could keep themselves going almost indefinitely but it wasn't until 50 that a RDM could actually main heal on their own. And even then having just one RDM was too little for XP at that time. Post ToAU is when RDM as a "all in one party support B****" became a standard as players had figured out how important haste was and that march's and haste spells turned DD's into killing machines. It became a game of filling as much offensive power into as few slots as possible, there was no need for the WHM if a RDM could do the healing, and no need for a BLM in a melee TP burn. That was where your, and everyone else's idea of a "RDM's job" came from, ToAU bird parties. The job lacks the fundamental requirements to fit into any specialized roles, sub-par healing, sub-par nuking, sub-par melee and sub-par buffing. Or to put it another way, any "support" you want from a RDM could better be filled by a WHM or BRD. Heck a BRD/RDM can not only give you march's and ballads, they can give you Haste, Refresh and Cure IV.

SE gave RDM haste at 48 because it was a white magic spell, one WHM got at 40, its the same reason SE gave RDM's Sleep I / II, Tier III & IV nukes. The same reason they gave DRK's Tier II & III nukes. The only other target-able spell that is unique to RDM is refresh & refresh II. Now your "support job" argument is down to two spells that don't stack with each other and only restore MP.

[cidbahamut]

And more cycles are exactly what this thread is about, by people who have no intention of actually casting those cycles but instead want to make their mule or PUG player do it.

Stop saying this. It doesn't add anything to the conversation and isn't true. We know who frequents the Red Mage sub-forum because they actually bother to play Red Mage and these suggestions often come from those people. You know, people who actually play Red Mage. On their main account, and not as a mule. So please, stop tossing about this idea that anyone who suggests something you personally don't like is only doing it to beef up their pocket RDM mule, because let's be honest, those kinds of people all use pocket white mages.

[Zerich]

I've never seen a useful RDM in an aby pt. Even with an Almace, they are a waste of space. Prove. Me. Wrong.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

I've never seen a useful RDM in an aby pt. Even with an Almace, they are a waste of space. Prove. Me. Wrong.

The same is true of SCH, DRK and many other jobs where Abyssea is concerned. Seriously, your post adds little to the topic, same with melee talk.

RDM will forever be ignored when topics on a set subject is always derailed.

Thank you and god bless.

[Zerich]

The same is true of SCH, DRK and many other jobs where Abyssea is concerned. Seriously, your post adds little to the topic, same with melee talk.

RDM will forever be ignored when topics on a set subject is always derailed.

Thank you and god bless.

cool story bro.

i was responding to the original topic, show me one rdm who can 1-2 shot a mob...

and you must be playing with some pretty gimp-tastic SCH's, if that's your POV.

sry i'm not like all the cool-kids, and post from a low level main job. Q_Q

[saevel]

cool story bro.

i was responding to the original topic, show me one rdm who can 1-2 shot a mob...

and you must be playing with some pretty gimp-tastic SCH's, if that's your POV.

sry i'm not like all the cool-kids, and post from a low level main job. Q_Q

I one shot mobs all the time in Abyssea <.< CDC is crit ya know. And depending what the definition of "two shot" is we can do that also with Nukes. Abyssea is kinda the land of big numbers, things work differently.

[Byrth]

RDM was my first 75. I played it for countless hours in stupid birds meripos, Salvage, Dynamis, other LS events etc. It wasn't particularly fun, but there was a certain satisfaction that I got from appropriately managing my MP so that I would finish burning through it exactly as Convert came back up. "Can I Dia III this monster, or should it be Dia II? What does my timer look like?" It was fun, but the kind of fun that I could get burned out on after a few hours.

RDM was also my best melee job for a long time, so I took it out farming stuff when I had to. My BLM was more efficient for chaining high level monsters (like Aura Statues for Diorites or Aw'Aerns for Ix'DRG/DRK), but my RDM was great for stuff like Hakutaku Eyes, scrolls, coffer keys, whatever. I had a pretty respectable melee TP/WS set for it at the time.

Did I waste time sitting there wishing SE would rewrite all the damage formulas or give me incredibly strong JAs/spells to compensate for the fact that my job had no compelling reason to be on the front line in a group? No, I didn't. My job had a use and was desired in a time when FFXI's endgame was very heavily driven by job stigmas and it wasn't nearly as easy to level/gear a new one as it is now.

Fast forwards 24 levels. My RDM is level 91 and I have leveled jobs from 50 to 99 before bringing it to an xp party. Why? Because even if I got it to 99, I wouldn't have a use for it. I don't need a mediocre melee to farm zone drops with anymore. I have Dancer. I don't need any of RDM's party advantages (if they exist). My mule has WHM for lowman and no one would ever ask me to go RDM to a real event because it just isn't very useful.

You want to be some kind of magey-meleey sword-swinging pimphat-wearing hobo that incorporates all of SE's poorly formed/translated ideas from the last 10 years, even though several of them have been assigned to since-created jobs or poorly implemented already? Well, good luck with that. Personally, I'd be happy if SE just gave me justification to level it to 99.