Inventory Increase, New Satchel, Infinite (sortable) Item box in MogHouse

[Shipp]

Just like I'd call you a noob for not using the full extent of your inventory. I'm too good in your eyes, you're too bad in mine. Works out just fine.

Nobody is using 80 pieces of equipment for one single job at one time. I have tons of macro swaps for rdm, blm, sch, and SMN. The most I'm ever at in inventory is 65/80, and that's still usually with extra crap I don't really need, like crystals, logs, etc.

That being said, I could use more space, but I still stand by the fact that nobody has 80 pieces of gear for swapping on one job at the same time. Maybe different sets for different events and different subjobs, but that's what mog sack/satchel is for.

[Shipp]

That's right like the 8 elemental staves, 8 obis, 8 gorgets, 7 spaces of relic currency +various upgrade items, 5 types of forgotten items, 13 mog slips, 8 types of geodes and 8 more avatarites, various seals/+2/empy, the dozens of VW drops that are so rare dropping is nothing short of foolish. (and on the VW note, if they are dropped they cant be used for tickets in the future) Otherwise you have a valid point.

Or you know, don't take up space with things you don't need? Seriously, you have every obi? Why? Thunder, ice, dark, and possibly light or fire are the only ones really "needed." Why do you have an earth obi? You use stone spells THAT much? When the majority of nukes cast are either thunder or blizzard, there's no reason to go get all the obis if you don't feel you have the space for them.

I haven't done gorgets yet, so I can't comment on those. You also don't seem to understand how the porter moogle works since he stores AF, upgraded AF, Relic, upgraded relic, empy, and upgraded empy.

No reason you have to hold on to 8 different types of geodes AND avatarites at the same time.

Also, do you not have a satchel as well as a sack? Boom, 240 inventory spaces from anywhere in the world at once.

[Zinato]

Or you know, don't take up space with things you don't need? Seriously, you have every obi? Why? Thunder, ice, dark, and possibly light or fire are the only ones really "needed." Why do you have an earth obi? You use stone spells THAT much? When the majority of nukes cast are either thunder or blizzard, there's no reason to go get all the obis if you don't feel you have the space for them.

Not only are they planning on leveling elemental dmg (meaning thunder will do the same as stone) But, earth is used for VW proc/abyssea proc/and anytime an enemy has a weakness to earth. Stone is used rather frequently and if im going to cast it I may as well get the dmg boost since between cape/obi/ring/legs it can get ~+20% that's not even day or double weather. Even just to humor you that's still 5/8 obis needed and also I forgot the belt set to go along with gorgets that's 8 more.

I haven't done gorgets yet, so I can't comment on those. You also don't seem to understand how the porter moogle works since he stores AF, upgraded AF, Relic, upgraded relic, empy, and upgraded empy.

I am very well aware of how the porter moogle works as I have well over 100 pieces of gear stored with him. What I refer to is +1 seals (100 types max), +2 items (20 types max), Empyrean weapon items (18 types max) that doesn't even include Forgotten, AF+1, ABC, Dynamis Currency and the various other upgrade items. Everything and its uncle requires some new item to upgrade now and expecting to do nothing but that task until its finished is unreasonable.

No reason you have to hold on to 8 different types of geodes AND avatarites at the same time.

When you have 8 blm staves, 8 summoner staves, and some dozen or so Elemental weapons for various jobs yes there is. Since I don't have millions of gil to outright buy 420 Geodes for +2, 1120 Geodes for +3 and 420 Avatarites for +4. At just 1k apiece that's 1.96m, and some geodes/rites go as high as 30-50x that.

, do you not have a satchel as well as a sack? Boom, 240 inventory spaces from anywhere in the world at once.

Personally, I couldn't care less about world inventory since only the 80 main can be used for macros and 240 pieces on a single job is highly unlikely. A second locker/storage/safe etc. would do just fine.

Overall, they keep adding more and more R/X gear many of which are such a low drop from an event that's dieing out that dropping it is foolish. On top of that they want to add a system that requires you have the original to create a second item so that it can be sold. Abyssea also had alot of R/X items JSE weapons, Fake Relic, Serpetine and Cousins. Anything that can be better needs an item to be so. There are items for breaking caps for NPC, for learning emotes, breaking caps (if you are one who needs rarab tail) Most of the issue is due to the reliance on Trials/Synergy for anything upgradable.

[FrankReynolds]

stuff.

couldn't have said it better myself.

The main problem is mog house storage. I'm fine with the amount of stuff that I can keep on me but porter moogles and mules are tedious. It's 2012. Lets get a giant mog locker and a few search options ffs. They can bill me for it if they want.

[Arcon]

No, all inventory is stored on the server side.

That's exactly what I said?

Exactly.. This is why the clients limits for items is moot for collectors. It wouldn't solve local inventory for people complaining about not having room with a lot of swapping sets but it would enable a large amount of storage.

Yes, that's possible and they're already doing it. That's what all the different forms of storage do (inv, sack, satchel, safe, locker, storage). And I wouldn't be surprised if they added more things like that. Unlimited won't happen though, since it's still all transferred to the client every time you zone (which is especially important for field storage, such as sack and satchel), which would lead to ridiculously large load times. If you only load inventory every time you zone and only load sack or satchel when you try to open it, that would lead to a 2~3s delay every time you open them, which would be pretty annoying.

The thing is, if you're just looking for storage for hoarders, there's already plenty of options. Armor storage, event item storage, Porter Moogle and muling are enough if you just wanna be a "collector". The problem is for actual users, people who use many jobs and need to swap quickly. and loading times do matter for those. The best thing they could do is add more locations like the safe and the locker (or possibly the sack and satchel), that would already be a great help. If you could equip gear from there, it would make it even better, although that would require more development time and testing than simply adding a new storage location.

Nobody is using 80 pieces of equipment for one single job at one time.

Yes, because we can't. 78 is the max, if you have one slot for a linkshell and one for swapping items from the sack or satchel. I know plenty of people who do use 78 and who would use a lot more if they could (including me). My PLD, for example, has a set for HP, Resting, Refresh, Regen, PDT, MDT (one for Shell up, one for Shell down), Haste, Melee, Attack, DEX, Fast Cast, VIT, Enmity, Shield skill, Enhancing skill, Cure potency and several macro items (Sentinel, Rampart, Cover, Shield Bash, etc.), and that is not counting other sets that I have in storage that I only get out for situational use (elemental resist sets, for example). Now you'll say "you don't need that many items", am I right? Well, in your eyes I don't, I know there's several people who think that. Doesn't change the fact that I wanna play as well as I possibly can, which is currently restricted by the inventory limit.

[SpankWustler]

Nobody is using 80 pieces of equipment for one single job at one time. I have tons of macro swaps for rdm, blm, sch, and SMN. The most I'm ever at in inventory is 65/80, and that's still usually with extra crap I don't really need, like crystals, logs, etc.

That being said, I could use more space, but I still stand by the fact that nobody has 80 pieces of gear for swapping on one job at the same time. Maybe different sets for different events and different subjobs, but that's what mog sack/satchel is for.

If there's any chance at all that I'll use Sanguine Blade and Magic Fruit on Blue Mage, and there always is if somebody is going to lose HP that day, then carrying everything I use puts me at roughly 79/80 depending on if I need echo drops or something. That number is after turning my resting set into "the same Refresh gear I idle in but my character wears it while sitting down" and other things I've done to save space such as using sub-optimal pieces for spells with AGI modifiers.

Similarly, I've rebuilt my resting set, enfeebling set, and Divine Magic damage set on White Mage to use more shared pieces with other sets than they would if optimized. I'm roughly 70/80 right now because I prefer not having to stick something in my Mog Sack every minute to dealing more damage with Holy II, but I could easily go up to the cap if I tried to optimize everything I regularly use.

Irregularly use in the case of the resting sets for both jobs, I suppose, but the cases I'll need it are unpredictable. I can only imagine how much I would hate my inventory if I had to deal with switching around Obis and a Twilight Cape to make my little tarubroro suck less in addition to the sacrifices I already make for inventory reasons.

Not only do some people use 80 things at a time, they could use more if the potential were there.

[Sarick]

I said >>

No, all inventory is stored on the server side.

That's exactly what I said?

Actuially, I corrected you for your misunderstanding when you said this >>

Meh, I just read over it again, it seems he thinks inventory/storage data is currently not stored on the server at all, which is false.

All data is stored on the server but not everything is loaded until it's requested by the client. So it's only loaded on the client side. << see the confusion?

Yes, that's possible and they're already doing it. That's what all the different forms of storage do (inv, sack, satchel, safe, locker, storage). And I wouldn't be surprised if they added more things like that. Unlimited won't happen though, since it's still all transferred to the client every time you zone (which is especially important for field storage, such as sack and satchel), which would lead to ridiculously large load times. If you only load inventory every time you zone and only load sack or satchel when you try to open it, that would lead to a 2~3s delay every time you open them, which would be pretty annoying.

Not the system I'm talking about, It's not transferred until you attempt to retrieve it from the mog house moogle or nomad moogle. It's stored as a placeholder in the character data on the server.

The thing is, if you're just looking for storage for hoarders, there's already plenty of options. Armor storage, event item storage, Porter Moogle and muling are enough if you just wanna be a "collector". The problem is for actual users, people who use many jobs and need to swap quickly. and loading times do matter for those. The best thing they could do is add more locations like the safe and the locker (or possibly the sack and satchel), that would already be a great help. If you could equip gear from there, it would make it even better, although that would require more development time and testing than simply adding a new storage location.

All of these take more then 2-3 seconds, you have to go out of your way to a special NPC to get them. It's funny that you make statements about players who use many jobs and need to swap quickly then promote muling. Tell me how running to a mog mail, placing items in the mog mail , logging off, logging on a mule, getting items out of mule, walking to ah, mailing items, logging off mule, and then finally logging back on main to get LOL 8 items as QUICK. It took me more then 8 seconds to write the mule dance.

Extra locations sack would only create more zone lag when zoning and are limited to 80. You still can't easily create swap sets for over 80 items.

Slips use inventory space, they're limited to items the developers allow stored in them, they can only hold one of each item and they also require a trip to special NPCs to utilize them.

Key item storage you need complete sets, they're limited to the sets developers allow stored and they also require a trip to special NPCs to utilize them. Money isn't really an issue with ki storage.

The near unlimited storage I'm talking about would only look up the data if requested. On top of that it would only load the specific section requested. The auction house is split up into categories and sub sections. Think of the unlimited storage like having a personal auction house inside your mog house where everything you own can be stored in it with some exceptions. This could be the easiest manageable inventory with a storage capacity beyond what most players could logically fill.

The system I speak of >>

1. No muling needed.
2. Store all item types with the exception of trials and uniquely augmented items.
3. Would work on all platforms.
4. No storage slips or key items.
5. No extra load times while zoning since items are downloaded as a list at moogle.
6. No special NPC's you could use the nomad, rent a room or mog house moogles.

These are just few of the advantages. This system would obsolete any past mass storage system. The only system that it wouldn't work for is in field transactions. It's just not in the intere$t of the developers to create this system.

Even if this system is not possible a few things could be done by slitting up the inventory. Some items can only be stored in there own section. linkshells, Keys, consumables, Weapons, Armor. At least to keep the main inventory clear.

[Arcon]

All of these take more then 2-3 seconds, you have to go out of your way to a special NPC to get them. It's funny that you make statements about players who use many jobs and need to swap quickly then promote muling. Tell me how running to a mog mail, placing items in the mog mail , logging off, logging on a mule, getting items out of mule, walking to ah, mailing items, logging off mule, and then finally logging back on main to get LOL 8 items as QUICK. It took me more then 8 seconds to write mule dance. The extra locations would only create more zone lagging.

I said those were options for hoarders and collectors. People who keep their Spelunker's Hat because it's a fun item. I mentioned explicitly that those options are a problem for people who want to swap their gear quickly. See:

[..] Armor storage, event item storage, Porter Moogle and muling are enough if you just wanna be a "collector". The problem is for actual users, people who use many jobs and need to swap quickly. and loading times do matter for those. [..]

[..]

The near unlimited storage I'm talking about would only lockup the data if requested. On top of that it would only load the sub section. The Auction house is split up into categories and sub sections. Think of the unlimited storage like having a personal auction house inside your mog house where everything you own can be stored in it with some exceptions.

So, how would you split it into sections? How would transferring gear from one location to another (like your inventory) work? Try to detail it for me. Would you select "head gear" "level 50~60" "job x" and it would show you the items you have that fit this category? I just don't know how you imagine this to go down. How will the data be stored on the server? A bitfield for every item in the game, which can be 0 or 1? Since you said something about "placeholder in the character data".

I can't think of any way that wouldn't have any other drawbacks attached to them. But I'm still not sure how you'd want to implement this, so I can't comment on any of it until you detail that a bit further.

[Sarick]

I said those were options for hoarders and collectors. People who keep their Spelunker's Hat because it's a fun item. I mentioned explicitly that those options are a problem for people who want to swap their gear quickly. See:

So, how would you split it into sections? How would transferring gear from one location to another (like your inventory) work? Try to detail it for me. Would you select "head gear" "level 50~60" "job x" and it would show you the items you have that fit this category? I just don't know how you imagine this to go down. How will the data be stored on the server? A bitfield for every item in the game, which can be 0 or 1? Since you said something about "placeholder in the character data".

Same way it's stored in the AH. The first placeholder says the player has the item, the second says how many. It doesn't need accessed until the player looks inside the container data. When you look at the AH list its split into categories and sub categories. Each category has items listed no matter what level. When you want an item to go to that category and it loads the list. The level range isn't important unless you sort by level.

The bitfield is how slips store items. The items have a single placeholder bit for each item. When the player retrieves one item the bit for that item is turned off in that slip. The game itself simply translates what bit equals what item. For instance, if the slip type was magically changed to anther slip the items in it would translate the bits into the other slips placeholders.

Say, for example slip 1 had all artifact armors, and slip 2 had all relic armors. If the artifact slip 1 ID was turned into slip 2 ID the bits stored in it as artifact armors would become placeholders for relic armors. The game itself just translates what bit is what item based on what slip it's stored on. Other then being it's own item and what placeholders are active all slips are basically the same.

My statement about slips meant they don't actively relate the items stored as being in your active inventory. Slips process data in them differently then a player active inventory. Technically the items don't exist on your character until they're removed from the slip. They aren't processed as owned items or loaded in memory when you zone. Only the slip itself is loaded.

To be honest this might not be the EXACT method they use but I can assure you it's not far off. It's like compressing. (no need to explain this in detail.)

Processed active inventory a problem for some while inactive storage is a problem for others. With processed inventory the client constantly scans it when you access your inventory. If you make a macro that says /equip head "Black Hat" or when you try to lot on an an item you can only hold one of this is the data that is checked. If the item is stored on a slip it's not processed and inactive so it doesn't exist in on the player to equip or restrict from owning more then one.

The system I'm talking about is for inactive mass storage that is easily accessible and quick. It wouldn't solve the local swap inventory limitations but would allow players to get items they want without muling or running out of actual storage.

As for how, Items in auction have several values such as Item ID, item type and item amount up. I think you know it's possible to do but are thinking to hard about it. It's just a tweaked personal auction house used as a storage medium with the data stored in their data folder.

[Midorikaze]

Wouldn't it be nice if equipped armor did not count against your inventory limit (like in many other MMOs)? Besides, if it's on your body, it shouldn't be counted as being in your "bag", right? Although that would be problematic for swapping if the quantity of gear pieces were different and your inventory were maxed....another can of worms altogether. :\

Could have the "swapped sets of gear" go into a temporary "container" of some sort during the swap so they would be still kept track of...don't know how that would work with memory limitations and all, though...there's those 'limitations' again. $%#@*. -.-;