No more almost impossible to obtain crap please

[Seriha]

It takes money to make money. Conversely, a lack of money can deprive you of potential profit. The latter is something FFXI has ultimately experienced beginning at some point during the ToAU era, no doubt when work on XIV began on the side. WotG comes grossly incomplete with poorly conceived jobs and hobbles along for a good number of years with shoddy mini-addons slapped on near the end through ACP, ASA, and MKdE.

So, why has content diminished? I highly doubt there are a lack of competent programmers out there. The are plenty of minds out there to pen stories or formulate concepts on new content (Some of this even coming FREE from their players). The unfortunate and obvious solution is one we were recently given privy to in both money and manpower being short.

Figuring most people have their main and 2 mules on average, we're looking at roughly $15 per sub. During the ToAU days, the reported number of players was reportedly around 500k. That's $7,500,000 monthly. While I won't sit here and profess to know how much it cost to power the servers, maintain them, and pay employees to code/fix content, I would be highly surprised if it cost more than one mil a month. Where did the other 6.5m go? It certainly wasn't going into XI.

Upon FFXI's original launch, it fielded about a million subscribers. Back in the day, I'd call that pretty huge. Those numbers declined quickly toward that popular 500k figure, though. Early FFXI wasn't that good, going through the growing pains all new MMOs do. Some probably quit due to bugginess. Some quit due to lack of content. Some may have preferred an old game or found they just didn't have the time for it. Whatever the reason, you can look at 1 million boxes sold at $50 per. Let's halve that for retail purpose, putting 25 mil in SE's pockets on initial box sales alone. At the very least, that put a hefty dent in initial production costs.

Months, then years tick by, the cash rolls in. Profit, profit, profit. Now, SE isn't a one-trick pony. Money for other games has to come from somewhere, and I don't think anyone would be mad knowing part of FFXI's profits went toward the production of such things. However, these games also make their own profits. SE also sponsors manga/anime/music, generating cash from those sources. The problem with FFXI is that the money it generates hasn't gone toward its future first. Of the earlier figure I mentioned, only 13% of FFXI's money would've been returning to it. Imagine if it got 25%, 35%, or even 50%.

That's the difference in expansions being launched largely complete, more frequent updates/fixes, more resources for art in abilities/spells/monsters/areas, more scripts, more cut-scenes, more... everything, including a potential engine overhaul to bring the game up to the times. In kind, when players see their investments being returned to the game for its betterment, they'll notice. They'll tell their friends. Those friends can, in turn, yield more profit, who then go on to tell their friends.

Or you can be minimalistic misers, piss off your customers through various means (like ignoring feedback), watch subscriptions diminish, take back promises, and basically create the current stagnant and socially volatile environment that is today's FFXI. And they'll tell their friends, too. You then get people who want to stay away because of the negative feedback.

I know I've personally been vocal about feedback toward the game over the years, much as some may have come to hate me given my opinions on various matters. Regardless, it's always been because I've had hope of the game's betterment in mind. I still believe FFXI can be better. I can only fantasize about how much better it could've been by now if it got the resources it deserved. Starving the game of cash will do it no good and it's unfortunate some can't grasp that concept, especially hiding behind the logic of "FFXI having had its time in the limelight" or some such drivel.

Frankly, if SE's going to give us 1/4th the effort, I want to pay 1/4th the subscription. The alternative is myself and others who feel similarly just canceling and looking elsewhere. Plenty of other activities out there, and I'm not just talking about MMOs.

[Falseliberty]

Jesus who comes up with these ideas... they are soo bad
you can make a quest hard without it being a boring mindfuck for example click ??? get CS of some shadowy figure "So you wish to truly unlock the power of your -insert weapon here-" kill the Arc boss of each zone 5 times blah blah" at which point your sent to dyna tav to take out some kind of mega Diablos in then which your weapon trial is done and you get a CS of Diablos going "Fool have you realized what you have done!" /insert shadowy figure maniacal laughter.

Anyways I think a quest line with something along this kind of path would be a better fit for 2 reasons, 1 Its long but not super omg kill myself long, 2 it would produce a large amount of different gear VS the static gear drops that come from 1 zone + your not doing the same dam thing over and over

the mythic trials should be something involving the new nyvule isle system NOT the outdated zeni system which no one wants anything from

emp weapons honestly should have had new content fleshed out in abbysea just for the trials that is hard and cant be brewed but i guess manpower is an issue

the trials should be something that you have to ask for help for, but the people helping get something in return. Hence the above ideas. The current set of trials reminds me of AV and PW back in the day... content that only maybe 2% of the playerbase will ever participate on

Sorry if I'm rambling I shoulda been in bed hours ago

[Avina]

I apologize, I haven't read through all the posts so far so forgive me if I am reiterating past responses.

I find it to be a waste of my money to fund a developer that takes my money to design something in a game that they openly admit "Only select few will be able to obtain these trials." With how the trials appear on the test server, and their open admission that this is the strategy they are taking, I am truly clueless as to why they think their playerbase would cheer and be excited about content that SE themselves think so few of us will obtain.

It's a question that deserves answering. Why are you designing content for only a few of us? And realistically the servers could possibly be shut down before any single person accomplishes these trials. Maybe you get five people with truly no lives to pursue these weapons, while the rest of your playerbase falls to the wayside.

I was always someone who liked the challenge of the original game. I advocated for there to be a level cap on Abyssea so that people couldn't Fell Cleave party their way from 30 to whatever. But clearly you favored the casual then and the game has moved on and the old ways aren't coming back. You have to meet the game, and the playerbase where its at. And clearly the FFXI developer team is showing a complete, inability to do so.

If they end up driving XI to die, its going to come back to haunt them. They expect us to naturally move on to FFXIV, just like they expected us to do so a little more than a year ago when they released the game. They were overconfident once, if they are that way again... well, I'm sure their investors won't be too happy.

[Alhanelem]

As of now this discussion is over. Your no longer capable of actual debate and instead are trying to defend SE's decision to pull R&D money from FFXI and put it into FFXIV even though it's already a failed product. FFXIV is a failed product

It's not a failed product until the plug is pulled The fact is they've made great strides and when they re-launch with 2.0 and the PS3, they will get a second chance. They wouldn't be the only ones to bounce back to any degree after a re-launch, because other games have pulled it off.

I'm not seeing what this has to do with adding useless things to this game though.

[Sparthos]

It's not a failed product until the plug is pulled The fact is they've made great strides and when they re-launch with 2.0 and the PS3, they will get a second chance. They wouldn't be the only ones to bounce back to any degree after a re-launch, because other games have pulled it off.

I'm not seeing what this has to do with adding useless things to this game though.

Serious question:

What MMO has pulled off a failed launch of XIVs magnitude and re-released to praise and success?

From what I see SE is in uncharted waters here. They have no choice but to continue down the path to XIV's rebirth because XI has been damaged via neglect and to have two failed MMOs would be a monumental embarrassment. XIV must succeed but that doesn't mean that it will succeed.

Diablo III and GW II are going to be strong competition and this is going to be a path fraught with danger.

SE is going to try everything to make XIV work but with the fans in disarray and people generally bashing for poor decisions on the console side, this is one of those moments that the name "Final Fantasy" really applies with regards to the MMO market. Can SE recapture the base they pushed away? Can they shock the market by bringing a phoenix from the ashes? Can they compete with Blizzard and succeed? Can SE become what Squaresoft once was in the market?

Next time on Dragon. Ball. Z.

[saevel]

Serious question:

What MMO has pulled off a failed launch of XIVs magnitude and re-released to praise and success?

From what I see SE is in uncharted waters here. They have no choice but to continue down the path to XIV's rebirth because XI has been damaged via neglect and to have two failed MMOs would be a monumental embarrassment. XIV must succeed but that doesn't mean that it will succeed.

Diablo III and GW II are going to be strong competition and this is going to be a path fraught with danger.

SE is going to try everything to make XIV work but with the fans in disarray and people generally bashing for poor decisions on the console side, this is one of those moments that the name "Final Fantasy" really applies with regards to the MMO market. Can SE recapture the base they pushed away? Can they shock the market by bringing a phoenix from the ashes? Can they compete with Blizzard and succeed? Can SE become what Squaresoft once was in the market?

Next time on Dragon. Ball. Z.

LMAO at the DBZ reference.

Honestly it's best to view FFXIV 2.0 as a different MMO. It's going to take that much of an overhaul to make the game profitable, several of it's fundamental concepts are flawed and won't work with on a Fantasy MMORPG. Their going to borrow the artwork and some game mechanics from FFXIV, but their going to have to redesign several core elements and the associated R&D involved.

And to answer your question, not a single MMO has comeback after a failure that complete. The only one that comes close is Dungeons and Dragons Online. The original team screwed it up pretty badly and it was on it's way down the toilet. Turbine then started managing it as a F2P game and overhauled 90% of the game. Now it's turning a good profit and has become the standard for how to run a F2P game profitably. Their model involved everything being unlockable with in-game earned fame points. Or you can buy turbine points from their store and use those instead. You can also spend points on various potions for boosting XP / Loot for a 3hr period of time. Again you can earn these in-game with time / effort. Subscribers (people who pay months service fee's) get all content unlocked and a small amount of free monthly turbine points. So it rewards those who pay money but also allows those who don't to achieve the same stuff, no loot or accomplishment is restricted.

[Sparthos]

F2P MMOs, the bane of our era. Can't wait till they hit you with a surcharge for logging in during high server volume periods.

If FFXIV goes F2P that'd be a huge slap to the faces of fans and would probably make things worse than they are at the moment. What's worse is that Wada has considered this in the past.

[svengalis]

I apologize, I haven't read through all the posts so far so forgive me if I am reiterating past responses.

I find it to be a waste of my money to fund a developer that takes my money to design something in a game that they openly admit "Only select few will be able to obtain these trials." With how the trials appear on the test server, and their open admission that this is the strategy they are taking, I am truly clueless as to why they think their playerbase would cheer and be excited about content that SE themselves think so few of us will obtain.

It's a question that deserves answering. Why are you designing content for only a few of us? And realistically the servers could possibly be shut down before any single person accomplishes these trials. Maybe you get five people with truly no lives to pursue these weapons, while the rest of your playerbase falls to the wayside.

I was always someone who liked the challenge of the original game. I advocated for there to be a level cap on Abyssea so that people couldn't Fell Cleave party their way from 30 to whatever. But clearly you favored the casual then and the game has moved on and the old ways aren't coming back. You have to meet the game, and the playerbase where its at. And clearly the FFXI developer team is showing a complete, inability to do so.

If they end up driving XI to die, its going to come back to haunt them. They expect us to naturally move on to FFXIV, just like they expected us to do so a little more than a year ago when they released the game. They were overconfident once, if they are that way again... well, I'm sure their investors won't be too happy.

This and the 95 Empyrean trials is why I won't be resubscribing after this month. I recently restarted in 2010 quit then came back once I realized how easy Abyssea gear was to obtained, tried VW and realized if this the direction the game is going after Abyssea I want no part in it. The bolded part is why I quit in 05. They are going back to the 03-05 game design where only a small player base reaps the high end rewards. It makes absolutely no since to me and I will never understand why they go down this path.

Why am I playing if I can't get the best gear in the game? Back to The Old Republic for me.

[Atomic_Skull]

Aren't the high tier magian trials for relics/mythics/etc already exclusive enough as it is? do we really need to make a single trial at the end of these long, tiresome chains even more exclusive?

Really. Fair question.

PS: "Crap" is to be taken literally, as the new trials are both "impossible" and the result is crap.

[Unleashhell]

So you are daft, thought so.

This pretty much sums up your ignorance



Blizzard has already said no WoW 2, instead they remade the game in Cataclysm. Soon they are doing another major overhaul that is completely discarding the current talent trees and replacing them with an entirely different system.

Instead of trying to create a ~new~ game, they are instead turning their ~old~ game into something new. That is how you make money in MMO's, as proven by Blizzard's WoW being the biggest MMO in the world despite being "old" by gaming standards and having constant competition.



You have no idea how a business works, your just pulling stuff out of your fifth point of contact.

As of now this discussion is over. Your no longer capable of actual debate and instead are trying to defend SE's decision to pull R&D money from FFXI and put it into FFXIV even though it's already a failed product. FFXIV is a failed product, it has failed to pay back it's original development and launch cost and was a huge money sink for it's developer and producer. Their having to create a third MMO from FFXIV just to try to make back their original investment.

/add ignore list.

OMG not the ignore list. FYI Blizzard said they weren't ever going to make Diablo III and quess what.. they did. I love the fact you add everyone to your "ignore list" when you end a debate on your terms. I find it funny how you can play a game like FFXI and have the nerve to come on here and not even know the mobs have jobs. So your credibility is nil and so are your so called business thoughts.

Just for reference:

Defense on monsters has next to nothing to do with VIT. It's based on whatever their template is defined as. Monsters don't wear gear, eat food and rarely have buffs on them (PLD / WHM / RDM notwithstanding).

Just like they don't have ridiculous attack, neither do they have ridiculous defense nor evasion.
And Kirin is not a SMN, he's a "monster", special stats and all. Player community has defined him as a SMN because he astral flows, otherwise we could just as easily of called him a BLM because he use's Stone V / Stonega IV / Quake. Or a MNK because he attacks with two hands. And so forth.

This made me laugh.

If you actually had a clue about running a business you would be making a some huge salary somewhere and not care about some video game. I love when people like you say "I do this for a living" to try and make it look like you know what your talking about. Funny how when someone disagrees with you, you decide to take it as an attack and add them to your /lolignorelist