New idea for Spirits...?

[Dallas]

Mmmkay....

I'm just here to help!

[MakkotoParinne]

Um.. Okay, right.

Why not just post your ideas about the ability? ;3

[Razushu]

Um.. Okay, right.

Why not just post your ideas about the ability? ;3

Because he's not actually here to help, all he wants is SMN to somehow magically be accepted as a melee, wherever a Top tier DD is used.

On topic:

I think a balance issue would arise when it came to merits unless they made this ability so weak, that using it with say Avatar acc + elemental -perp merits only gave the same efficency as full Avatar acc+atk merits would. Which it more than likely wouldn't if implemented would blow the latter combo out the window, which kind of removes the choice when it comes to merits, and that's sort of the point.

A non-MP cost to it would seem easier to balance, or maybe a gear solution to it, would do better. Something like a hidden effect on TotM +2 staves, that they negate the extra -perp from this ability, or a stat/HP drain to the master. Or they could change our merit 1 categories to 3 choices instead of 5. They give the same values as current merits, but choice 1 & 2 at 5/5 would be Avatar acc+15/atk +10, and Avatar MAB+10/Macc+15 respectively, or both accuracies on one and attack bonuses on another.

[MakkotoParinne]

Keep in mind that the ability could still be used while you have merits allocated elsewhere, for an additional 5 mp cost. Those offensive merits would affect the Spirit as well, you see, so the trade-off would be power to longevity. But, I do see your point. I guess I should fine-tune this.

I like the idea of combined merit categories, that would make things sooooo much easier! <3Potency and effectiveness<3 But I doubt they would give us that cookie on a silver platter anytime soon. :/


Edit: On a side note, I do not want this faux-ability-for-fun thread to turn into a Summoner melee war. Please keep that out of here, no one wants to read it. If they did, they would be in a Summoner melee thread somewhere. Thank you.

[Malamasala]

Which it more than likely wouldn't if implemented would blow the latter combo out the window, which kind of removes the choice when it comes to merits, and that's sort of the point.

The merit categories are just pretend choices anyway. It's been tested that the attack merits do nothing. The accuracy merits do nothing for BPs because you are already capped and it only helps DoT from avatar attacks. Macc has never managed to help either. MAB is the only choice. Where you want to waste your last 5 merits is optional. I wasted them in spirits just because that actually does something, even if it makes something useless cost less.

[MakkotoParinne]

To be honest, 10 attack isn't enough, and with capped skill/merits and other Summoning Magic skill gear makes your accuracy pretty high enough as it is. Magic Attack Bonus actually multiplies the damage, so that is a good choice.

For me, though, I merited 3 in attack (Avatar melee ftw), 2 in MaB, and the rest in Spirit cost. My reason? When I was doing my Evoker's Ring quest a while back, Leviathan managed to get a lucky 1.4k Tidal Wave off on poor Carbuncle. Let's just say Earth Spirit seemed pretty attractive with a one second cast time, but the cost to maintain! Ew. Quake, Assault, Stone IV. Dead Levi.

Also, I don't like losing MP on the off chance I don't Siphon before the tick. What is the cost of Spirits now, 19 a tick...? Am I the only one who Siphons at the last minute? lol

But, I ramble... I wouldn't call Spirit merits a waste, Mala! My damage looks exactly the same as other Summoners who are 5/5 Attack and MaB, so Spirit perp. is the only rational thing to do.

[Vortex]

To be honest, 10 attack isn't enough, and with capped skill/merits and other Summoning Magic skill gear makes your accuracy pretty high enough as it is. Magic Attack Bonus actually multiplies the damage, so that is a good choice.

For me, though, I merited 3 in attack (Avatar melee ftw), 2 in MaB, and the rest in Spirit cost. My reason? When I was doing my Evoker's Ring quest a while back, Leviathan managed to get a lucky 1.4k Tidal Wave off on poor Carbuncle. Let's just say Earth Spirit seemed pretty attractive with a one second cast time, but the cost to maintain! Ew. Quake, Assault, Stone IV. Dead Levi.

Also, I don't like losing MP on the off chance I don't Siphon before the tick. What is the cost of Spirits now, 19 a tick...? Am I the only one who Siphons at the last minute? lol

But, I ramble... I wouldn't call Spirit merits a waste, Mala! My damage looks exactly the same as other Summoners who are 5/5 Attack and MaB, so Spirit perp. is the only rational thing to do.

I have actually had times when i would summon a spirit, siphon and get "no effect" because the stupid thing despawned due to loss of MP right as i used the ability...most retarded thing i have ever seen, so i lose not only the timer but the mp that i needed, you can imagine the amount of rage that was ensured after that.. long story short i don't really understand why the cost for them is so high when they are uncontrolable and comepletelty useless outside of siphon.

The damage is pretty random when it comes to physcial attacks, neither attack nor mab will make a huige diffrence but they are definatly better choices then prep cost for spirits..if you are just going to waste the merits you may as well put them in accuracy.

[Malamasala]

But, I ramble... I wouldn't call Spirit merits a waste, Mala! My damage looks exactly the same as other Summoners who are 5/5 Attack and MaB, so Spirit perp. is the only rational thing to do.

Believe me, I just call them a waste to avoid arguments about "They are not superior to attack" all day. If I claim both attack and -perp on spirits are bad choices, less people will bother to argue.

[MakkotoParinne]

I have actually had times when i would summon a spirit, siphon and get "no effect" because the stupid thing despawned due to loss of MP right as i used the ability...most retarded thing i have ever seen, so i lose not only the timer but the mp that i needed, you can imagine the amount of rage that was ensured after that.. long story short i don't really understand why the cost for them is so high when they are uncontrolable and comepletelty useless outside of siphon.

The damage is pretty random when it comes to physcial attacks, neither attack nor mab will make a huige diffrence but they are definatly better choices then prep cost for spirits..if you are just going to waste the merits you may as well put them in accuracy.

My reason for the merits is for attempts to get away without losing enough MP to run out. Also, those merits would make your "No effect" scenario happen very much less, though I can't say that has happened to me.

The damage is indeed random, I often find myself outdamaging other Summoners with 70 BP:Rages and 75 BP:Rages even without full attack or MaB merits. And, as stated above, my accuracy is high enough as it is due to skill. The only thing I miss with is Predator Claws, very rarely, but isn't that programmed to miss occasionally...? I constantly do 1.7-1.9k damage with Rush. (Full TP return!)

But to each their own! I just think it's better utility, especially outside of Abyssea.

[MakkotoParinne]

Believe me, I just call them a waste to avoid arguments about "They are not superior to attack" all day. If I claim both attack and -perp on spirits are bad choices, less people will bother to argue.

I think everyone should have their own opinion depending on their playstyle. It's not like other players are the police.. every merit has its application. Though, the boost to Attack/MaB on Group1 could stand to be a little bit better. Oh well. I like my Spirit merits, lol. Never going to look at them the same after fighting Leviathan.^^;